Paid beta testing

tanthil

Blizzard did this too when they released the year pass, it gave you access to the beta for the next xpac.

Zenimax just flat out makes us pay to give em feedback on their beta game.

I thought it was bad before, but no less then i would expect from a new MMO as the industry standard now is to release things 6months early and cash in while finishing it.

But today with the rollback loop and making veteran content unplayable solo (by accident??? lol idk)

WHOLE
NEW
LEVEL

Salsadoom

Great thing about IT, if you apply a change you can roll it back. They will watch for a day or two, if they see they completely messed up they will roll it back, if just minor tweaks they will do tweaks.

Just wait a few days.

tanthil

Salsadoom wrote: »

Great thing about IT, if you apply a change you can roll it back. They will watch for a day or two, if they see they completely messed up they will roll it back, if just minor tweaks they will do tweaks.

Just wait a few days.

Yea they should rollback the change were your character gets rolled back every 10minutes because we heard your rollbacks like rollbacks

The thing about waiting a few days to play the character you are paying them to play is well, i dont think i need to finish this sentence

Iorail

Salsadoom wrote: »

Great thing about IT, if you apply a change you can roll it back. They will watch for a day or two, if they see they completely messed up they will roll it back, if just minor tweaks they will do tweaks.

Just wait a few days.

They can't wait a "couple of days" and do a roll back, that will seal the coffin on ESO. They have to do something right now, not later.

Mortelus

Major issues since launch, Bank items disappearing, Broken classes, and now roll-backs.

Broken classes should not be in a game after launch, unbalanced I get, broken... nope sorry, should not be allowed.

I get the other things though, bugs happen and it's unfortunate. Luckily for me I have not been effected by the bank or roll back bugs.

stevenpotter321b14_ESO

Dont forget they mistakenly deleted an entire pvp campaign today as well.

rawne1980b16_ESO

If I have taken one thing from my years playing MMO's it's that with every big patch you always need to wait for another patch to fix it.




Although, to be fair, we're still waiting for ZOS to fix issues found in beta last year so it may take a while.

Salsadoom

I expect if they messed it up enough it will be done quicker, or at least the change to NB undone.

Can't say anything about the other issues, I do think they should of waited a bit longer before launch.

Zionysus

My armor looks like crap now, there's nothing to loot anymore. The quests are boring. Every little thing I had to cling to they keep cutting out. We ARE paying to play beta. Oh look over there... the fanboys are coming to chop up this thread. Duck!

tanthil

Games unplayable solo right now past level 50 solo unless you don't mind dying every few minutes, and if you progress you will probably just get stuck in the rollback bug and loose all that progress anyways.

So hows that craglorn?

ciannait

Salsadoom wrote: »

Great thing about IT, if you apply a change you can roll it back. They will watch for a day or two, if they see they completely messed up they will roll it back, if just minor tweaks they will do tweaks.

Just wait a few days.

I cut my teeth in IT, and this isn't really anything remotely the same. The sheer amount of moving data in an MMO (especially a large one), character data, etc, is significant. Much of the code probably depends on other pieces of code that can't be rolled back, so the best we can hope for is iterative changes and not a rollback per se.

To be able to roll back would have required an intelligent software design and spec to begin with and... I don't have that much faith in ZOS.

vyndral13preub18_ESO

As much as broken gets thrown around anymore, it must not mean what I thought it meant.

Salsadoom

I assume any company worth anything has a decent disaster recovery plan and anyone that does far reaching updates makes a copy.

Regardless, even if they don't do a full back up you just replace the modules that caused the issues to make the system work. If designed properly it will be setup in modules so you aren't talking about replacing everything just restoring the sections affected and recompiling.

You don't have to move the bulk of the data, why would you? You of course could if just switch to the backup mega server that you stored the previous version to but that would wipe any progress. The quicker solution is to leave the majority of tables intact and only restore the affected tables and reload the modules changed.

That is of course assuming they planned for that....

ciannait

If they were smart enough to do that, they'd have less of an issue with rollbacks than they do.

kaosodin

Im enjoying the game, it has problems, as long as I see progress every few weeks im good.

Old school mmo gamer. Growing pains, give it 6 months

ciannait

kaosodin wrote: »

Im enjoying the game, it has problems, as long as I see progress every few weeks im good.

Old school mmo gamer. Growing pains, give it 6 months

EQ was my first MMO and I've played them on and off ever since, but at some point it's not unreasonable to ask a company making a new MMO to learn from the mistakes of previous MMOs. If it was going to take them another six months to polish the game, they should've released in six months and not when they did.

kaosodin

Lol im reading these responces, all you arm chair coders. If you dont do it as a living, stfu. Guys working at dunken donuts talking aboit how dumb these programmers are.

Human nature is terrible.

ciannait

kaosodin wrote: »

Lol im reading these responces, all you arm chair coders. If you dont do it as a living, stfu. Guys working at dunken donuts talking aboit how dumb these programmers are.

Human nature is terrible.

I work for a software company, but thanks anyway...

One Two

Salsadoom wrote: »

Great thing about IT, if you apply a change you can roll it back. They will watch for a day or two, if they see they completely messed up they will roll it back, if just minor tweaks they will do tweaks.

Just wait a few days.

Will i get these days back? NO.!..

so yeah, pay for beta testing...good stuff ZOS, good stuff

aeroch

I don't think it's unfair to ask ZOS to review their PTS and internal testing procedures. It's incredible how they've neglected Nightblades so far considering the base class system is a cornerstone of the game, not to mention several other issues that PTS players have claimed to have been reported during beta or during test cycles. I'm not going to jump on them for making mistakes, but releasing new content before fixing beta issues is pretty ridiculous.

ciannait

aeroch wrote: »

I don't think it's unfair to ask ZOS to review their PTS and internal testing procedures. It's incredible how they've neglected Nightblades so far considering the base class system is a cornerstone of the game, not to mention several other issues that PTS players have claimed to have been reported during beta or during test cycles. I'm not going to jump on them for making mistakes, but releasing new content before fixing beta issues is pretty ridiculous.

I'm willing to bet these were all known issues and developers wanted to fix them, but the bugs got "triaged" and prioritized at a higher stuffed-shirt level - executives decided what was worth it to them (getting it shipped! getting Craglorn out the door! damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!) and that leaves everyone feeling crappy at the end of the day...

Farham

Salsadoom wrote: »

Great thing about IT, if you apply a change you can roll it back. They will watch for a day or two, if they see they completely messed up they will roll it back, if just minor tweaks they will do tweaks.

Just wait a few days.

What IT world do you live in? If we ever roll out software, updates or modifications that break something...a process that begins by the formation of what is called "A War Room" starts and at least one IT Director leads it. The people responsible for the change (as logged in the Change management meeting) are either in the room or on the conference call explaining exactly how it will be fixed in the next hour, how it got passed our testing and certification process (those people are in the room and asses on the line too) and when it is fixed detailed documentation and Post Mortem explanations are required in 72 hours.

Find yourself in a War Room more than once in a year and you will be part of a Red Pen meeting where you are escorted out the door by security with all of your belongings.

This kind of Mickey Mouse stuff would get most real IT people fired in a heart beat. I would love to watch our directors stroke out when someone said "Just wait a few days and we will do some tweaks".

ciannait

o/~ 99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs... Take one down, pass it around... 127 little bugs in the code... o/~

tanthil

Farham wrote: »

Salsadoom wrote: »

Great thing about IT, if you apply a change you can roll it back. They will watch for a day or two, if they see they completely messed up they will roll it back, if just minor tweaks they will do tweaks.

Just wait a few days.

What IT world do you live in? If we ever roll out software, updates or modifications that break something...a process that begins by the formation of what is called "A War Room" starts and at least one IT Director leads it. The people responsible for the change (as logged in the Change management meeting) are either in the room or on the conference call explaining exactly how it will be fixed in the next hour, how it got passed our testing and certification process (those people are in the room and asses on the line too) and when it is fixed detailed documentation and Post Mortem explanations are required in 72 hours.

Find yourself in a War Room more than once in a year and you will be part of a Red Pen meeting where you are escorted out the door by security with all of your belongings.

This kind of Mickey Mouse stuff would get most real IT people fired in a heart beat. I would love to watch our directors stroke out when someone said "Just wait a few days and we will do some tweaks".

Zenimax needs to hire a lot more security

coryevans_3b14_ESO

Farham wrote: »

Salsadoom wrote: »

Great thing about IT, if you apply a change you can roll it back. They will watch for a day or two, if they see they completely messed up they will roll it back, if just minor tweaks they will do tweaks.

Just wait a few days.

What IT world do you live in? If we ever roll out software, updates or modifications that break something...a process that begins by the formation of what is called "A War Room" starts and at least one IT Director leads it. The people responsible for the change (as logged in the Change management meeting) are either in the room or on the conference call explaining exactly how it will be fixed in the next hour, how it got passed our testing and certification process (those people are in the room and asses on the line too) and when it is fixed detailed documentation and Post Mortem explanations are required in 72 hours.

Find yourself in a War Room more than once in a year and you will be part of a Red Pen meeting where you are escorted out the door by security with all of your belongings.

This kind of Mickey Mouse stuff would get most real IT people fired in a heart beat. I would love to watch our directors stroke out when someone said "Just wait a few days and we will do some tweaks".

This a thousand times. I'm on the networking side and believe me if a server drops for even 2 seconds because of some failure in redundancy, there is hell to pay immediately. But this is a game, and game developers are allowed to get a way with a lot more then other networking/programmers are.

temjiu

Farham wrote: »

What IT world do you live in? If we ever roll out software, updates or modifications that break something...a process that begins by the formation of what is called "A War Room" starts and at least one IT Director leads it. The people responsible for the change (as logged in the Change management meeting) are either in the room or on the conference call explaining exactly how it will be fixed in the next hour, how it got passed our testing and certification process (those people are in the room and asses on the line too) and when it is fixed detailed documentation and Post Mortem explanations are required in 72 hours.

Find yourself in a War Room more than once in a year and you will be part of a Red Pen meeting where you are escorted out the door by security with all of your belongings.

This kind of Mickey Mouse stuff would get most real IT people fired in a heart beat. I would love to watch our directors stroke out when someone said "Just wait a few days and we will do some tweaks".

QFT. now...it really depends on the maintenance you do. some are smaller and based on the technology your working on, its straightforward. drop in a new config into a router...oh what? your port channel isn't working? aight, we back out and check it out.

this isn't a small patch. servers like this probably needed dozens of changes and updates. this kind of stuff doesn't roll back. At least in my job, if something this size breaks, you stay on the bridge till its fixed. I've had a few 72 hour days, let me tell ya.

On the Topic...

This is ... wow....pretty big. I never thought a designer like zeni would drop the ball this bad. from the borked classes and glitches to the bugs (and bots taking advantage of the bugs), now this patch...

wow...Im really speechless. if i didn't have a brand new toon i just started, I'd probably be playing something else right now. and if I don't see the appropriate fixes down the pipeline soon...well, wildstar is on the horizon.

And I can tell ya from experience that not even 1/4 of the issues we are seeing in this game during its actual release and first patch are in that one, even during beta.

this companies gotta get its head on straight and figure out how its going to save it's player base. This is the first time in a decade + half of playing MMO's that im really not sure if a game will make it. And this is after playing games that have had some shaky releases (SWtOR as an example).

We'll see. I usually prefer to give the dev's the benefit of the doubt (im in the field myself, albeit different aspect). My gut feeling on this one isn't good though.

tanthil

just a quick recap of the patch.

nerfed most underpowered class

increased difficulty of vr quest zones to make solo play unplayable while forgetting to address the many issues the that stop players from being able to quest in groups

patch created a rollback bug affecting many and once you get stuck in it,theres no way out and game is unplayable

craglorn