My First Experience with the Updated LFG Tool

UrQuan · November 2015

I didn't get a chance yesterday, but I've been eager to try out the newly revamped LFG tool, as all of the changes announced to it sounded great on paper. So today I busted out my second account so I could try it out on a non-vet character and see what the experience was like.

The character I used is my lowest level character: a level 18 Altmer Templar who is mostly a DPS, using a flame staff on her primary bar, and a resto staff on the secondary bar (the idea being that I can heal group content too if needed). All of her gear is crafted blue level 16 stuff (5 piece seducer, 3 piece magnus), a mix of heavy and light (entirely based on what I thought would look cool - if I was min-maxing I would have a max of 2 pieces of heavy instead of 4). Oh, and I don't have a single Champion Point on this account.

Here's what her stats look like normally with no food buff:

I took her to Orsinium quickly to see what her battle leveled stats looked like there:

And then I queued for Banished Cells in the LFG tool as a DPS. Took just over 10 minutes (I want to say it was 10 minutes 16 seconds, but I could be off by a few seconds, as I wasn't looking at the screen right when the group suddenly formed), and a group was formed with 2 DPS, 1 tank, and 1 healer. I'd call that a good sign. I'm sure it would have taken even less time if I had queued as a healer or tank.

The other people in the group were level 13, 14, and 16 IIRC. I didn't pay that much attention to their levels, other than to note that at level 18 I was the highest level in the group. As none of us were vet level, and all were below level 20, I figured that this would be an interesting test to see if the battle leveling works for lowbies. 3 of us were AD, and 1 was EP (the only reason I'm sure of this is because 3 of us were in AD zones and 1 was in an EP zone when the group formed - I didn't notice an indicator that shows what alliance someone is).

I thought that the LFG tool was now supposed to automatically teleport you to the dungeon once the group was formed, but this didn't happen for some reason. I don't know why... So we each made our own way there. The EP group member had some difficulty at first on trying to teleport to a member of the group who was already inside BC - he got an error message about being in a different alliance. Weird, but he was able to use a wayshrine to get into the same instance as us.

So here's how the battle leveling made my stats look once I was inside Banished Cells:

And here's how the stats looked after I ate some level 15 blue magicka/health food:

So I guess not only are your own stats increased to represent you being battle leveled to VR16, but the food you eat is "battle leveled" as if it was VR15 food or something. I'd imagine this works much the same way as the crown store food that levels with you. If I was actually VR16 with good VR16 gear I could get significantly better stats, but these battle leveled stats seem reasonable to me. Makes me wonder about stories I've heard of people battle leveled to VR16 who only have 10K health - do they have no points/enchants in health, and no health buff from food?

Anyway, all of the mobs and bosses were VR16, so away we go. We didn't have teamspeak, and we really didn't spend any time discussing the fights aside from "ready?" Despite that, and despite my concerns about whether the battle leveling would be effective, we slaughtered that dungeon. Not a single death, our tank had no problem tanking, our healer did a great job of keeping us all alive, and our DPS was definitely up to the task. I didn't even use a single potion (which was a bit of a shame, as I had wanted to see if my level 10 tri-pot scaled up - I assume it would have).

Conclusion? The newly upgraded LFG tool and all of the mechanics around it are a vast improvement. I plan on using it more to see if this was just an isolated experience (and also to see if my level 18 can complete a vet dungeon), but it seems very very promising.

One caveat: I know Banished Cells pretty damn well (although I often forget which fight is from non-vet and which fight is from vet), so I knew all of the fight mechanics inside out. I strongly suspect that the other members of my group had all done it at least a couple of times as well, as they all knew what to do in each fight. Some of them probably had some Champion Points on their lowbies too. With an inexperienced group it might be another story entirely.

nine9six · November 2015

I'll read the rest later (loading Gold lol) but I've never been ported to the Dungeon like advertised either.

J2JMC · November 2015

I love how ZOS went from eliminating grinding spots so people who wanted to do endgame content couldn't power level to now making endgame content possible by level 18 lol.

Resipsa131 · November 2015

eagerly anticipating this on console.

Soulshine · November 2015

What kind of XP did this give you?

MissBizz · November 2015

You have ESO Plus on both your accounts?!?

Anyways. Your stats look pretty healthy to me, and I'm excited you had a good time. Although where I hear the issue lies is when VRs are with low level.. But really.. I dunno. Maybe it's only vet dungeons that are the problem? I still don't understand how low levels are suddenly allowed to (and do) queue for vet dungeons? Maybe they can't and I'm misunderstanding

Good post though, love that you included all your stats.

gilbegger · November 2015

Wait... You arent teleported to the dungeon?!

UrQuan · November 2015

J2JMC wrote: »

I love how ZOS went from eliminating grinding spots so people who wanted to do endgame content couldn't power level to now making endgame content possible by level 18 lol.

I hadn't thought of it like that... I will say that I was using a level 18 templar in a magicka DPS role, and coincidentally the only VR16 character that I have (on my main account) is also a templar, who I often use in a magicka DPS role. While this non-vet dungeon scaled to VR16 was very doable on my scaled-up level 18, I definitely wasn't DPSing as effectively as I can on my VR16.

Soulshine wrote: »

What kind of XP did this give you?

Mob XP and quest XP (as I hadn't yet done any group dungeons with that character, so I had the dungeon quest) were about what I would expect if it was scaled to level 18, so I imagine the XP is all scaled to your level.

MissBizz wrote: »

You have ESO Plus on both your accounts?!?

Well, I do at the moment. I cancelled my sub on my second account when ESO went B2P, but I just resubbed on a temporary basis because I wanted to play around a bit with Orsinium.

MissBizz wrote: »

Anyways. Your stats look pretty healthy to me, and I'm excited you had a good time. Although where I hear the issue lies is when VRs are with low level.. But really.. I dunno. Maybe it's only vet dungeons that are the problem? I still don't understand how low levels are suddenly allowed to (and do) queue for vet dungeons? Maybe they can't and I'm misunderstanding

Good post though, love that you included all your stats.

Yeah, I'm curious to try a vet dungeon on a low level too, so I can see if that's an issue. Oh, and I included the stats mostly because I was taking screencaps of them for my own curiosity, so I thought it might be interesting for other people to see an example of how the new scaling works too.

gilbegger wrote: »

Wait... You arent teleported to the dungeon?!

I wasn't, and neither was anyone in my group. I was surprised because I had understood from the patch notes that you were supposed to be teleported to the dungeon you queued for once the group formed.

Lithium Flower · November 2015

My friend and I tried grouping through the LFG tool yesterday and it was a pleasant experience. I was a DK tank and dps and she was also the same. I was DC v15 and she was EP v16. Both times we were grouped fairly quickly after we queued up for a less popular dungeon. We needed to select every role to facilitate. The first time we completed the dungeon with the group that was formed. There was a level 30 something and a veteran 8. We managed to make our way through Volenfell. Next we tried vet and had to queue up again because you cannot switch dungeon mode to veteran if the the group is formed through LFG. I can't imagine what need is there for the restriction. If the same party wants to continue playing other dungeons, why restrict that? So we disbanded and queued up for veteran dungeons. Got into the same party. Since we had crown, we were able to replace the other two players with our friends. After concluding our tests, we invited parked all our guild alts into the group and logged off so we can use the existing group to do pledges together which is what we've wanted most out of this.

I had the crown during our Volenfell run and somehow, we're not sure if it was user error or a glitch but my EP friend was kicked from the group and ported out. I've had this happen accidently before and it was a simple matter to reinvite the removed person to the group. I couldn't invite her back because of different alliances so I requested the only other EP there to help and he obliged. This can be a real unfortunate problem if a player is a different alliance from everyone else.

Everyone appeared to be Aldmeri Dominion inside the dungeon. Our DK banners had eagles and our character sheet showed AD as well.

I only wish that we could do more than just dungeons together. It would have been so cool to be able to explore Orsinium together. PvE content has so much faction cross over, I can't understand why we can't all be in the same instance. Cyrodiil of course remains war but Craglorn and Orsinium lend themselves naturally to cross faction non hostile interaction.

Ffastyl · November 2015

I would like to comment on your thought about queue times with tanks -- you're right. I got into a group in 0 seconds and then 57 seconds when queueing for the pledges as a tank.

UrQuan · November 2015

Ffastyl wrote: »

I would like to comment on your thought about queue times with tanks -- you're right. I got into a group in 0 seconds and then 57 seconds when queueing for the pledges as a tank.

Funny you should say that. I just got on my VR16 and queued for the gold pledge as a tank. I got put into a group the second I hit the key to search for a group. Like it was literally instantly... It ended up being a group of 3 VR16s and 1 VR14 or VR15 (don't remember - it didn't matter), and it went pretty much exactly how I'd expect a PUG of high level players doing a gold pledge to go. So basically, it didn't go as smoothly as it would have with friends who you're used to playing with and who are on teamspeak with you, but it was smooth enough and we got through it without any real problems - a couple of wipes on the one boss with the waves of adds, circle of death around one player, and triple beams of nastiness (one of the wipes was definitely my fault, as I slipped up), but we got through that fight in the end, and got through all of the others without any real issues.

UrQuan · November 2015

Update: queued with my VR16 as a tank again tonight, this time for the silver pledge dungeon. Again, I got a group the second I hit the search key. The rest of the group was already in the dungeon and ready to start the first boss fight, so I guess they had already formed the group and started to do the dungeon when their tank had to skip out, and the tool found them a replacement (me).

This time it was a mix of VRs - I think the others were VR2, VR6 and VR8. Regardless, we had no problem with the non-vet dungeon being scaled to VR16. Got through the pledge without a death.

I'm definitely still planning on queuing for a vet dungeon on my level 18 to see how that goes...

Miszou · November 2015

Maybe I suck, but you guys should try doing this as an untwinked noob. Instead of wearing two full sets of blue armor at level 18, be realistic and instead try it as though this is your first character...

All of the people in this thread without a problem have multiple VR16 characters in their signatures. Just sayin'...

UrQuan · November 2015

Miszou wrote: »

Maybe I suck, but you guys should try doing this as an untwinked noob. Instead of wearing two full sets of blue armor at level 18, be realistic and instead try it as though this is your first character...

All of the people in this thread without a problem have multiple VR16 characters in their signatures. Just sayin'...

See my reply in your thread

Oh, and if it makes a difference, on my very first character by the time I was about level 16 I was using fully crafted gear - using the sets that only require 2 traits (I don't remember for sure, but I think I went with Death's Wind and Ashen Grip - not that it really matters because all of the set bonuses were different back then, and frankly everything in the game was different then). I'm pretty sure it was only upgraded to green, though.

Miszou · November 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

Miszou wrote: »

Maybe I suck, but you guys should try doing this as an untwinked noob. Instead of wearing two full sets of blue armor at level 18, be realistic and instead try it as though this is your first character...

All of the people in this thread without a problem have multiple VR16 characters in their signatures. Just sayin'...

See my reply in your thread

Oh, and if it makes a difference, on my very first character by the time I was about level 16 I was using fully crafted gear - using the sets that only require 2 traits (I don't remember for sure, but I think I went with Death's Wind and Ashen Grip - not that it really matters because all of the set bonuses were different back then, and frankly everything in the game was different then). I'm pretty sure it was only upgraded to green, though.

Sure... but back then the dungeons didn't scale to VR16 either. They were still a challenge over the open-world stuff, but they also weren't a bunch of noobs chipping away at a VR16 boss with no understanding of the stats actually required to do so.

UrQuan · November 2015

Miszou wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Miszou wrote: »

Maybe I suck, but you guys should try doing this as an untwinked noob. Instead of wearing two full sets of blue armor at level 18, be realistic and instead try it as though this is your first character...

All of the people in this thread without a problem have multiple VR16 characters in their signatures. Just sayin'...

See my reply in your thread

Oh, and if it makes a difference, on my very first character by the time I was about level 16 I was using fully crafted gear - using the sets that only require 2 traits (I don't remember for sure, but I think I went with Death's Wind and Ashen Grip - not that it really matters because all of the set bonuses were different back then, and frankly everything in the game was different then). I'm pretty sure it was only upgraded to green, though.

Sure... but back then the dungeons didn't scale to VR16 either. They were still a challenge over the open-world stuff, but they also weren't a bunch of noobs chipping away at a VR16 boss with no understanding of the stats actually required to do so.

No, I'm just saying it's not unreasonable for your first character to be level 16-20 and have full sets of crafted gear (although most likely not the most optimal sets). Not everyone will have that, not by a long shot, but there will be people who do - whether it's because they decided to start up with crafting right away (like I did), or because they have friends or guildies who help them out with gear.

Dexter411 · November 2015

I need to say this beacuse it is something that pushed me from the game,
I hate new system, why i get buffs? why mobs have 80k hp while(as vr1) i am matched with ~25lvlish players? i make build i have that amount of hp/magicka/stamina period. Not every player has over 500 champion points ready purple sets for every couple of levels. Now the best part. For doing Vr16 scaled dungeon with players on 20-25lvl ive got shocking 5% of veteran rank. For me now it is serious grind fest to reach vr16. Think about new players...

Miszou · November 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

Miszou wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Miszou wrote: »

Maybe I suck, but you guys should try doing this as an untwinked noob. Instead of wearing two full sets of blue armor at level 18, be realistic and instead try it as though this is your first character...

All of the people in this thread without a problem have multiple VR16 characters in their signatures. Just sayin'...

See my reply in your thread

Oh, and if it makes a difference, on my very first character by the time I was about level 16 I was using fully crafted gear - using the sets that only require 2 traits (I don't remember for sure, but I think I went with Death's Wind and Ashen Grip - not that it really matters because all of the set bonuses were different back then, and frankly everything in the game was different then). I'm pretty sure it was only upgraded to green, though.

Sure... but back then the dungeons didn't scale to VR16 either. They were still a challenge over the open-world stuff, but they also weren't a bunch of noobs chipping away at a VR16 boss with no understanding of the stats actually required to do so.

No, I'm just saying it's not unreasonable for your first character to be level 16-20 and have full sets of crafted gear (although most likely not the most optimal sets). Not everyone will have that, not by a long shot, but there will be people who do - whether it's because they decided to start up with crafting right away (like I did), or because they have friends or guildies who help them out with gear.

I was wearing a full set of green deaths wind heavy armor. I have no idea what everyone else was doing, but as the tank I was (usually) the last one standing.

Like I said, it's entirely possible that I suck, or the PUG sucked or whatever. I'm just saying that throwing some extra stats on untwinked noobs and then sending them into a VR16 dungeon is not really the greatest solution. I'd prefer to fight mobs at (or around) my level, where I am familiar with the amount of damage I can absorb or dish out, rather than suddenly finding myself unable to dent even normal mobs, while they pound me into the dirt.

I mean, if all else is equal, will this will be the hardest that this dungeon ever gets? When I reach VR16 with real stats and skills and so on, will this not be laughably easy?

UrQuan · November 2015

Miszou wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Miszou wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Miszou wrote: »

Maybe I suck, but you guys should try doing this as an untwinked noob. Instead of wearing two full sets of blue armor at level 18, be realistic and instead try it as though this is your first character...

All of the people in this thread without a problem have multiple VR16 characters in their signatures. Just sayin'...

See my reply in your thread

Oh, and if it makes a difference, on my very first character by the time I was about level 16 I was using fully crafted gear - using the sets that only require 2 traits (I don't remember for sure, but I think I went with Death's Wind and Ashen Grip - not that it really matters because all of the set bonuses were different back then, and frankly everything in the game was different then). I'm pretty sure it was only upgraded to green, though.

Sure... but back then the dungeons didn't scale to VR16 either. They were still a challenge over the open-world stuff, but they also weren't a bunch of noobs chipping away at a VR16 boss with no understanding of the stats actually required to do so.

No, I'm just saying it's not unreasonable for your first character to be level 16-20 and have full sets of crafted gear (although most likely not the most optimal sets). Not everyone will have that, not by a long shot, but there will be people who do - whether it's because they decided to start up with crafting right away (like I did), or because they have friends or guildies who help them out with gear.

I was wearing a full set of green deaths wind heavy armor. I have no idea what everyone else was doing, but as the tank I was (usually) the last one standing.

Like I said, it's entirely possible that I suck, or the PUG sucked or whatever. I'm just saying that throwing some extra stats on untwinked noobs and then sending them into a VR16 dungeon is not really the greatest solution. I'd prefer to fight mobs at (or around) my level, where I am familiar with the amount of damage I can absorb or dish out, rather than suddenly finding myself unable to dent even normal mobs, while they pound me into the dirt.

I mean, if all else is equal, will this will be the hardest that this dungeon ever gets? When I reach VR16 with real stats and skills and so on, will this not be laughably easy?

If you were usually the last one standing, then odds are you were personally doing pretty decently, and probably the other members of the group were unprepared for the difficulty.

And yes, this probably will be the hardest this dungeon ever gets for you. An actual VR16 with real stats and gear and skills will absolutely have an easier time of the normal-mode dungeons than a scaled-up low level.

I don't think throwing out the idea of battle-leveling everyone in the group finder is a good idea, though. That's a huge part of what makes it much faster to find a group now. Maybe it would make sense to maintain a separation between vet and non-vet characters, though. Maybe non-vets should be facing a dungeon scaled to level 50 while being battle-leveled to 50, while vets can stick with everything scaled to VR16.

KewaG · November 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

Maybe non-vets should be facing a dungeon scaled to level 50 while being battle-leveled to 50, while vets can stick with everything scaled to VR16.

Totally agree with this.

So I must have missed something in the patch notes when I skimmed through. Am I correct in saying that all dungeons now scaled to V16 and anyone under that mark are battle leveled? If so, I must have skimmed through the Patch Notes too quickly...

MissBizz · November 2015

This post is so famous its in the dev tracker!! Lol @ZOS_GinaBruno Did Urquan get a job there

MissBizz · November 2015

KewaG wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Maybe non-vets should be facing a dungeon scaled to level 50 while being battle-leveled to 50, while vets can stick with everything scaled to VR16.

Totally agree with this.

So I must have missed something in the patch notes when I skimmed through. Am I correct in saying that all dungeons now scaled to V16 and anyone under that mark are battle leveled? If so, I must have skimmed through the Patch Notes too quickly...

Yup @KewaG , you skimmed a little fast

Open up this spoiler for the patch notes about the grouping tool. Although, the patch notes did say it would scale the people to V15 - and didn't specify EXACTLY the dungeon would be V16.

Grouping Tool Improvements
We have performed a significant mechanical overhaul of the Grouping Tool. It will now find groups more rapidly and reliably when looking for any available group. Below are the first steps on the road to making the Grouping Tool an adventurer’s best friend – look for additional improvements in a future update.
•Groups formed for dungeons will always be teleported directly to the dungeon once formed, and will always be scaled to a level ceiling.
•After a group is formed, you can either teleport immediately, or wait up to 30 seconds before you are sent to the dungeon so you can complete your current activity.

•Dungeon groups formed through the Grouping Tool will receive a moderate buff to their stats while inside that dungeon.
•Loot will be contextualized to your level.
•While everyone will be scaled up to VR15, you will always get loot drops appropriate for your level. For example, if you are VR2, you will still get VR2 loot drops.

•Groups can now be formed across all three alliances. It is entirely possible for two Aldmeri characters to team up with an Ebonheart and Daggerfall duo through the Grouping Tool to complete a dungeon.
•In order to form a group for Cyrodiil or the Imperial City, you must queue from within that location.
•To help consolidate the tool, we’ve removed the ability to queue for individual quests. That said, we do still want to encourage you to work together to defeat difficult world bosses and quests!
•Groups may still be formed as normal. If any group formed normally within the game world enters a dungeon, it will follow normal dungeon rules. Groups formed via the Grouping Tool operate differently to ensure a rapid cadence of group formation.
•For example, if you walk into a dungeon with three VR16 player characters and the group leader is VR2, all monsters will be VR2.

lonewolf26 · November 2015

I have to echo the OPs praise for the lfg and battle leveling updates. I've used lfg over the past several days as V16 and haven't had any signifcant issues. The scaling seems to be working really well. I'm looking forward to trying this out with my lower level toons soon.

There appears to be an issue when queuing for a non-Vet dungeon when you're below VR1. A few I've grouped with said they weren't getting loot from kills. They were level 20 and 36. I think this might be related to the rule that limits loot dropping for those who are 5 or more levels away from the dungeon scale. Since all VRs are effective level 50, it seems anyone level 44 and below might not get loot. I'm guessing this is a bug.

NateAssassin · November 2015

Is there some secret to getting the new LFG to work or not, because I still can't find a group for anything with it.

KewaG · November 2015

Lol, yep, there it is. I skipped right passed it. I did read the, "Groups can now be formed across all three aliiances." part and thought to myself, 'Oh cool!'. My co-worker and I then had a long conversation about it...lol

Thank you @MissBizz

In my defense, is was in the morning when I read the notes and I hadn't had my morning coffee yet. Plus, it was a lot off reading...

usmcjdking · November 2015

Ressurecting also seems to be hit/miss with soul gems. Sometimes the lowbies can rez me, other times they can not. Some times they cannot even rez themselves. Whatever the case, it needs to be addressed.

KewaG · November 2015

usmcjdking wrote: »

Ressurecting also seems to be hit/miss with soul gems. Sometimes the lowbies can rez me, other times they can not. Some times they cannot even rez themselves. Whatever the case, it needs to be addressed.

Agreed, and I was wondering if that would be an issue now that I know about the battle leveling...

Dedhed · November 2015

Thanks for the detailed account of your experience

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Victus · November 2015

With everyone battle leveled I imagine one would need Grand Soul gems for rezzes. Therefore not everyone may have some

UrQuan · November 2015

KewaG wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Maybe non-vets should be facing a dungeon scaled to level 50 while being battle-leveled to 50, while vets can stick with everything scaled to VR16.

Totally agree with this.

So I must have missed something in the patch notes when I skimmed through. Am I correct in saying that all dungeons now scaled to V16 and anyone under that mark are battle leveled? If so, I must have skimmed through the Patch Notes too quickly...

No, not exactly. All dungeon groups formed using the LFG tool will be scaled and battle-leveled to VR16. Dungeon groups formed with manual invites are unchanged.

MissBizz wrote: »

This post is so famous its in the dev tracker!! Lol @ZOS_GinaBruno Did Urquan get a job there

Huh. That's weird...

UrQuan · November 2015

usmcjdking wrote: »

Ressurecting also seems to be hit/miss with soul gems. Sometimes the lowbies can rez me, other times they can not. Some times they cannot even rez themselves. Whatever the case, it needs to be addressed.

I didn't even think of that... And of course it didn't ever come up in my experience, as nobody died.