[Bugged Item Set] Scathing Mage

Kwivur

Finally... Some results.

BEZDNA

I just did tests on pts.

With 72,9% crit chance I reached 50 SM procs in 8 min 5 sec. fight with perfect LA+Whip weaving.

That means SM proc was up 300/485=62% of the time.


516*0.62=320.

Yahoo, congratulations, we won 21 spell damage from replacing Julianos with Scathing Mage.

Conclusion: in my usual dps build i have lower crit chance of 65%, 68% if a have a sorc in group which provides me minor spell crip buff, that means i will have even loved up time proc of SM. Also keeping in mind that in dynamic fight i will not be able to repeat such perfect LA+Skill weaving, i see no point in using/farming that set. These is my conclusion for DK specifically.

WillhelmBlack

Ah well, OK. Try again ZOS!

Nifty2g

BEZDNA wrote: »

I just did tests on pts.

With 72,9% crit chance I reached 50 SM procs in 8 min 5 sec. fight with perfect LA+Whip weaving.

That means SM proc was up 300/485=62% of the time.


516*0.62=320.

Yahoo, congratulations, we won 21 spell damage from replacing Julianos with Scathing Mage.

Conclusion: in my usual dps build i have lower crit chance of 65%, 68% if a have a sorc in group which provides me minor spell crip buff, that means i will have even loved up time proc of SM. Also keeping in mind that in dynamic fight i will not be able to repeat such perfect LA+Skill weaving, i see no point in using/farming that set. These is my conclusion for DK specifically.

Yeah I thought that too just from the 10% increase it wouldn't be enough and still no point in running it.I suggest 30% ZOS, you may as well make this gear stronger than Julianos
But it's been looked at, I doubt it will be adjusted further.

hedna123b14_ESO

BEZDNA wrote: »

I just did tests on pts.

With 72,9% crit chance I reached 50 SM procs in 8 min 5 sec. fight with perfect LA+Whip weaving.

That means SM proc was up 300/485=62% of the time.


516*0.62=320.

Yahoo, congratulations, we won 21 spell damage from replacing Julianos with Scathing Mage.

Conclusion: in my usual dps build i have lower crit chance of 65%, 68% if a have a sorc in group which provides me minor spell crip buff, that means i will have even loved up time proc of SM. Also keeping in mind that in dynamic fight i will not be able to repeat such perfect LA+Skill weaving, i see no point in using/farming that set. These is my conclusion for DK specifically.

Nifty2g wrote: »

BEZDNA wrote: »

I just did tests on pts.

With 72,9% crit chance I reached 50 SM procs in 8 min 5 sec. fight with perfect LA+Whip weaving.

That means SM proc was up 300/485=62% of the time.


516*0.62=320.

Yahoo, congratulations, we won 21 spell damage from replacing Julianos with Scathing Mage.

Conclusion: in my usual dps build i have lower crit chance of 65%, 68% if a have a sorc in group which provides me minor spell crip buff, that means i will have even loved up time proc of SM. Also keeping in mind that in dynamic fight i will not be able to repeat such perfect LA+Skill weaving, i see no point in using/farming that set. These is my conclusion for DK specifically.

Yeah I thought that too just from the 10% increase it wouldn't be enough and still no point in running it.I suggest 30% ZOS, you may as well make this gear stronger than Julianos
But it's been looked at, I doubt it will be adjusted further.

It should give good results on a sorc since Crushing Shock/Force Pulse have 3 chances to proc it. Wish I could test it, but I'll let the EU sorcs try it.

Nifty2g

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

BEZDNA wrote: »

I just did tests on pts.

With 72,9% crit chance I reached 50 SM procs in 8 min 5 sec. fight with perfect LA+Whip weaving.

That means SM proc was up 300/485=62% of the time.


516*0.62=320.

Yahoo, congratulations, we won 21 spell damage from replacing Julianos with Scathing Mage.

Conclusion: in my usual dps build i have lower crit chance of 65%, 68% if a have a sorc in group which provides me minor spell crip buff, that means i will have even loved up time proc of SM. Also keeping in mind that in dynamic fight i will not be able to repeat such perfect LA+Skill weaving, i see no point in using/farming that set. These is my conclusion for DK specifically.

Nifty2g wrote: »

BEZDNA wrote: »

I just did tests on pts.

With 72,9% crit chance I reached 50 SM procs in 8 min 5 sec. fight with perfect LA+Whip weaving.

That means SM proc was up 300/485=62% of the time.


516*0.62=320.

Yahoo, congratulations, we won 21 spell damage from replacing Julianos with Scathing Mage.

Conclusion: in my usual dps build i have lower crit chance of 65%, 68% if a have a sorc in group which provides me minor spell crip buff, that means i will have even loved up time proc of SM. Also keeping in mind that in dynamic fight i will not be able to repeat such perfect LA+Skill weaving, i see no point in using/farming that set. These is my conclusion for DK specifically.

Yeah I thought that too just from the 10% increase it wouldn't be enough and still no point in running it.I suggest 30% ZOS, you may as well make this gear stronger than Julianos
But it's been looked at, I doubt it will be adjusted further.

It should give good results on a sorc since Crushing Shock/Force Pulse have 3 chances to proc it. Wish I could test it, but I'll let the EU sorcs try it.

Hmm didn't think about Sorcs getting to use it, thats pretty good actually

Erraln

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

It should give good results on a sorc since Crushing Shock/Force Pulse have 3 chances to proc it. Wish I could test it, but I'll let the EU sorcs try it.

Have some video to back that up? Last I checked, those skills had one chance to proc it like anything else. I'd check myself but I never obtained a set on live, for reasons stated on page 1. The best way to check is to throw a few hundred pulses at a boss while the set isn't active, recording skills cast and proc amount.

It's nice to see them take some action on this set. I'm not sure how much more they might do or if they need to, but I get the feeling that the reason it was raised at all is Clever Alchemist's existence. There's no point holding back a dropped high-damage proc set for fear of empowering pvp burst builds after you put a crafted one into the game.

hedna123b14_ESO

Erraln wrote: »

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

It should give good results on a sorc since Crushing Shock/Force Pulse have 3 chances to proc it. Wish I could test it, but I'll let the EU sorcs try it.

Have some video to back that up? Last I checked, those skills had one chance to proc it like anything else. I'd check myself but I never obtained a set on live, for reasons stated on page 1. The best way to check is to throw a few hundred pulses at a boss while the set isn't active, recording skills cast and proc amount.

It's nice to see them take some action on this set. I'm not sure how much more they might do or if they need to, but I get the feeling that the reason it was raised at all is Clever Alchemist's existence. There's no point holding back a dropped high-damage proc set for fear of empowering pvp burst builds after you put a crafted one into the game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_bXtYZ3nTg&feature=youtu.be

Didnt have time to test on boss, but here is a video from Live. You can clearly see that in my damage recap Crushing shock is seen hitting the target 33 times (11 crushing shocks) and critting 66.7%. During this the Scathing mage proc occurs exactly twice. My Spell crit at the time is 62.5% meaning that Scathing has a chance to proc 6.25% on each attack. The total number of attacks is 33 thus the scathing proc was supposed to occur 2.06 times and it did occcur twice.

Next we have my destructive reach hitting the target 15 times (4 more casts than crushing shock) and it crits for 86.7% (more than 20% more than crushing shock), yet the buff only procced once. At 6.25% proc chance per each attack and a total of 15 attacks, the scathing proc is supposed to occur .9375 (nearly once), which it did. So as you can clearly see a skill that was used more times and had an overwhelmingly higher crit percentage procced the set less often...

Any more questions?

acw37162

Reading this thread makes me so happy most of the people here don't work at ZOS and that ZOS doesn't agree with their logic.

Like Bosmer dance happy.

beamy93

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

Erraln wrote: »

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

It should give good results on a sorc since Crushing Shock/Force Pulse have 3 chances to proc it. Wish I could test it, but I'll let the EU sorcs try it.

Have some video to back that up? Last I checked, those skills had one chance to proc it like anything else. I'd check myself but I never obtained a set on live, for reasons stated on page 1. The best way to check is to throw a few hundred pulses at a boss while the set isn't active, recording skills cast and proc amount.

It's nice to see them take some action on this set. I'm not sure how much more they might do or if they need to, but I get the feeling that the reason it was raised at all is Clever Alchemist's existence. There's no point holding back a dropped high-damage proc set for fear of empowering pvp burst builds after you put a crafted one into the game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_bXtYZ3nTg&feature=youtu.be

Didnt have time to test on boss, but here is a video from Live. You can clearly see that in my damage recap Crushing shock is seen hitting the target 33 times (11 crushing shocks) and critting 66.7%. During this the Scathing mage proc occurs exactly twice. My Spell crit at the time is 62.5% meaning that Scathing has a chance to proc 6.25% on each attack. The total number of attacks is 33 thus the scathing proc was supposed to occur 2.06 times and it did occcur twice.

Next we have my destructive reach hitting the target 15 times (4 more casts than crushing shock) and it crits for 86.7% (more than 20% more than crushing shock), yet the buff only procced once. At 6.25% proc chance per each attack and a total of 15 attacks, the scathing proc is supposed to occur .9375 (nearly once), which it did. So as you can clearly see a skill that was used more times and had an overwhelmingly higher crit percentage procced the set less often...

Any more questions?

Does thundering presence proc it?

hedna123b14_ESO

beamy93 wrote: »

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

Erraln wrote: »

hedna123b14_ESO wrote: »

It should give good results on a sorc since Crushing Shock/Force Pulse have 3 chances to proc it. Wish I could test it, but I'll let the EU sorcs try it.

Have some video to back that up? Last I checked, those skills had one chance to proc it like anything else. I'd check myself but I never obtained a set on live, for reasons stated on page 1. The best way to check is to throw a few hundred pulses at a boss while the set isn't active, recording skills cast and proc amount.

It's nice to see them take some action on this set. I'm not sure how much more they might do or if they need to, but I get the feeling that the reason it was raised at all is Clever Alchemist's existence. There's no point holding back a dropped high-damage proc set for fear of empowering pvp burst builds after you put a crafted one into the game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C_bXtYZ3nTg&feature=youtu.be

Didnt have time to test on boss, but here is a video from Live. You can clearly see that in my damage recap Crushing shock is seen hitting the target 33 times (11 crushing shocks) and critting 66.7%. During this the Scathing mage proc occurs exactly twice. My Spell crit at the time is 62.5% meaning that Scathing has a chance to proc 6.25% on each attack. The total number of attacks is 33 thus the scathing proc was supposed to occur 2.06 times and it did occcur twice.

Next we have my destructive reach hitting the target 15 times (4 more casts than crushing shock) and it crits for 86.7% (more than 20% more than crushing shock), yet the buff only procced once. At 6.25% proc chance per each attack and a total of 15 attacks, the scathing proc is supposed to occur .9375 (nearly once), which it did. So as you can clearly see a skill that was used more times and had an overwhelmingly higher crit percentage procced the set less often...

Any more questions?

Does thundering presence proc it?

Doesn't proc off of DoT's

elium85

What about Twisting Path? Anyone check that? It'll sometimes proc other non-DoT things.

Anhedonie

Scathing Mage: Increased this item set’s proc chance to 20%, and updated its tooltip to indicate it does not proc on damage over time effects.


http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/249957/pts-patch-notes-v2-3-4#latest

oibam

Does it now proc on initial damage of DoT spells?

hedna123b14_ESO

oibam wrote: »

Does it now proc on initial damage of DoT spells?

It should.

andy_s

BEZDNA wrote: »

I just did tests on pts.

With 72,9% crit chance I reached 50 SM procs in 8 min 5 sec. fight with perfect LA+Whip weaving.

That means SM proc was up 300/485=62% of the time.


516*0.62=320.

Yahoo, congratulations, we won 21 spell damage from replacing Julianos with Scathing Mage.

Conclusion: in my usual dps build i have lower crit chance of 65%, 68% if a have a sorc in group which provides me minor spell crip buff, that means i will have even loved up time proc of SM. Also keeping in mind that in dynamic fight i will not be able to repeat such perfect LA+Skill weaving, i see no point in using/farming that set. These is my conclusion for DK specifically.

Could you repeat the test with crushing shock/force pulse, please? Also, do you have all divine parts? And the last question, would it be better to use a precise staff with SM?

BEZDNA

andy.s wrote: »

BEZDNA wrote: »

I just did tests on pts.

With 72,9% crit chance I reached 50 SM procs in 8 min 5 sec. fight with perfect LA+Whip weaving.

That means SM proc was up 300/485=62% of the time.


516*0.62=320.

Yahoo, congratulations, we won 21 spell damage from replacing Julianos with Scathing Mage.

Conclusion: in my usual dps build i have lower crit chance of 65%, 68% if a have a sorc in group which provides me minor spell crip buff, that means i will have even loved up time proc of SM. Also keeping in mind that in dynamic fight i will not be able to repeat such perfect LA+Skill weaving, i see no point in using/farming that set. These is my conclusion for DK specifically.

Could you repeat the test with crushing shock/force pulse, please? Also, do you have all divine parts? And the last question, would it be better to use a precise staff with SM?

I'll thy when i'll find time for that. No i don't, i'm 4 pieces away from being able to use SM in my dps build, but that doesn't afect testing results, since 72% crit chance is max you can get (if you use 2 part of mosnter set and don't have a sorc in group to provide minor spell crti buff). I don't think that SM worth using at all, at list for dk. And it's kinda same result for NB and Templars. Sorci's in theory can benefit from SM more, if FP+LA considered by game as 4 hits, but on the other hand SM is even worse for overload, that means as a sorc you'll benefit more on normal rotation, but lose dps on overload.

andy_s

Probably the best scenario for SM is AoE, and when bosses have some adds around. Pure single target looks unreliable, nobody loves RNG

hayaschwarz

It is nice that @ZOS finally responded, and did something with the Set. That’s why my first thing to do was to test Scathing on PTS and see the proc chance for myself 

1drv.ms/1Qqa6oQ

Sorry that I don’t use YouTube, but I think uploading the test on OneDrive does the trick.
Obviously you can see at the beginning of the fight, the set had about 2secs down time, which makes the Set an improvement over Julianos. But at the end of the video the set had about 10 secs down time, which makes me want to just go and decon the hell out of the set!

Even considering how the change works, the set with 20% proc chance is optimal useful for NBs (high crit values due top class passives and fast weaving). For DKs as the test shows, it is kinda put the set close to julianos! For Templars (DPS) the set is obviously complete and utter crap because of the channeling or casting time. As for Sorcs Julianos or TBS wins over Scathing, as obviously scathing won’t provide enough proc while using overload.

While ZOS improved the spell power cure even if it wasn’t necessary, and provided stamina builds with briarheart (equivalent to Julianos, procs on DoTs and have jewelry). So I think magicka builds deserve a Set that is hard to collect, but equally give nice worthwhile boost!

The way I can see the Set working for all classes is, either by increasing the proc chance to 33%-50% and the bonus time to 8-10secs on direct damage (no DoTs), or make it work with DoTs while keeping the old 10% and increasing the time to 8-10secs.

So again please @ZOS, @ZOS_Finn @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_RyanRuzich fix/improve scathing mage set, we appreciate the effort you did to improve the Set, but that doesn’t even make any noticeable difference!

asneakybanana

BEZDNA wrote: »

I just did tests on pts.

With 72,9% crit chance I reached 50 SM procs in 8 min 5 sec. fight with perfect LA+Whip weaving.

That means SM proc was up 300/485=62% of the time.


516*0.62=320.

Yahoo, congratulations, we won 21 spell damage from replacing Julianos with Scathing Mage.

Conclusion: in my usual dps build i have lower crit chance of 65%, 68% if a have a sorc in group which provides me minor spell crip buff, that means i will have even loved up time proc of SM. Also keeping in mind that in dynamic fight i will not be able to repeat such perfect LA+Skill weaving, i see no point in using/farming that set. These is my conclusion for DK specifically.

So it seems that it has a 6s icd as I feared. Proc chance definitely needs to be raised if zos wants to leave the icd. Assuming 65% crit and getting 2 attacks per second it will take 4.5 seconds on average to rpoc scathing so that's going to be slightly less than 60% up time which makes it worse than julianos. With a 30% proc chance it will take about 3s on average to proc giving it a 67% up time resulting in an average spell damage of 343!!!