Removal of VR

DhuBleidd

There has been a lot of discussion about removal of VR ranks so I wanted to see how many people actually agree or disagree with it. Also please after you vote write the reason why you voted so, would like this to be a constructive thread. nbsp pls

DaveMoeDee

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

I am fine with VR, but making all the v1-v16 gear the same level would simplify things. Since I haven't invested anything substantial in higher level gear, I guess I would benefit greatly.

TalonShina

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

So posted this in another thread in response to the comment "They are removing, they've said so several times"

They have said that. True, but I think they may come to realize doing it now or next year would be a mistake. they can't just send all the V16s back to 50 without backlash and consequences. If they just changed it to level 66 they didn't remove anything. If they want the CPs to take over as the progression that's fine but then they need to just leave the vet ranks alone and keep it at V16 and improve the CP system from here on out

UrQuan

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

As they are now, I like the vet ranks. A year ago I understood the desire to get rid of them. I think the way they are now they're fine.

DaveMoeDee

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

TalonShina wrote: »

So posted this in another thread in response to the comment "They are removing, they've said so several times"

They have said that. True, but I think they may come to realize doing it now or next year would be a mistake. they can't just send all the V16s back to 50 without backlash and consequences. If they just changed it to level 66 they didn't remove anything. If they want the CPs to take over as the progression that's fine but then they need to just leave the vet ranks alone and keep it at V16 and improve the CP system from here on out

Some people suggest tying gear levels to CP, which I find both great and horrible.

Great - You would only have to grind (if you are in a rush and don't like the narrative) to the best gear level on a single character. Future characters get to use the same top gear as soon as they hit level 50 since CP are shared.

Horrible - How many CP would be required for the top tier of armor? If people can reach v16 with less than 100 CP, would the top armor tier be that low? With the first cap being 501, 100 seems quite low. But it would be unacceptable to have a higher cap and to have the armor currently worn by a character end up too high for the character to wear after the change.

NewBlacksmurf

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

I don't like them nor how they correspond to PvE zones.
Champion Levels were originally thought to be the replacement over a year ago

Psychobunni

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Was a close to "I was never bothered by VR ranks" as I could vote

Huxide

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

↑ even though i dont know how they would keep the end-game difficulty like it is now...... that i think is a huge problem for them.......

AshTal

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

VR ranks force me to play through Cadwell Silver and Gold. I want them gone ASAP so any new characters are not forced through that.

TalonShina

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

TalonShina wrote: »

So posted this in another thread in response to the comment "They are removing, they've said so several times"

They have said that. True, but I think they may come to realize doing it now or next year would be a mistake. they can't just send all the V16s back to 50 without backlash and consequences. If they just changed it to level 66 they didn't remove anything. If they want the CPs to take over as the progression that's fine but then they need to just leave the vet ranks alone and keep it at V16 and improve the CP system from here on out

Some people suggest tying gear levels to CP, which I find both great and horrible.

Great - You would only have to grind (if you are in a rush and don't like the narrative) to the best gear level on a single character. Future characters get to use the same top gear as soon as they hit level 50 since CP are shared.

Horrible - How many CP would be required for the top tier of armor? If people can reach v16 with less than 100 CP, would the top armor tier be that low? With the first cap being 501, 100 seems quite low. But it would be unacceptable to have a higher cap and to have the armor currently worn by a character end up too high for the character to wear after the change.

I agree that's a scary thought.

Morimizo

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Ranking/leveling/improving is important, and shouldn't be removed.

If they could scale the whole game like Orsinium, and battle-level lower-powered party members like Cyrodiil, it would just be a new gear issue. I have no problem looking forward to improving my gear with new content.

Egonieser

I want to keep VR ranks but they should be modified somehow.

Got nothing against Veteran ranks as such, however the means of obtaining them is something i hate, mainly Silver and Gold.
I've not done gold on a single character and I have 3 VR16s, i just can't do it, it's boring me to death, so i got my ranks in cyrodiil with a mix of pvp and delves/repeatables.

ADarklore

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

AshTal wrote: »

VR ranks force me to play through Cadwell Silver and Gold. I want them gone ASAP so any new characters are not forced through that.

This has nothing to do with VR ranks, it would remain even if we went to a general leveling system. This is considered CONTENT... and I don't believe you are forced to go through Cadwell's, you can PvP, grind mobs, etc... for XP to level. Most people like being able to play through all the factions, especially those who enjoy questing.

MangoSsk

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

After making 4 Veteran Rank 1's I think it is fair to say that it is too easy to get to Veteran Rank 1 and there should be levels added after 50 like to LvL99 then have them Veteran Rank 1. But thats just me. I ran into a couple VR1-VR10 that don't know what they are doing still.

Kungfu

I want to keep VR ranks but they should be modified somehow.

Morimizo wrote: »

Ranking/leveling/improving is important, and shouldn't be removed.

If they could scale the whole game like Orsinium, and battle-level lower-powered party members like Cyrodiil, it would just be a new gear issue. I have no problem looking forward to improving my gear with new content.

This. This is very interesting.
For such a simple statement, it took me down a whole rabbit-hole.

It is an idea that would be argued against by many because it is a cultural shift and that threatens people at a level beyond the game.

So, imagine a game where your level only matters when it comes to your skills, abilities, and maybe the solo quests that are available to you. What would be the benefits / detractors here? When your level does not limit what gear you can get, what dungeons you can run, or with whom you can run them...

You would theoretically be able to run the hardest dungeons at any level with any of your friends or any group mate of any other level. Would leveling become unimportant? I say "no, it would still be important." You would still need the skill points and you would still need to level your abilities. It would feel much the same as a level 40 in Cyrodiil going up against a vr16 today. You might have a chance but probably only if you're really good and really geared and he/she is really bad. Each player's personal skill level with their character class / build would become infinitely more important here, I think.

I think it would be an amazing new direction and could be a very freeing feeling.

Could you imagine an environment where you could log onto your level 30 and run content with your vr16 guildies *and* contribute *and* pick up versions of the best gear in the game tweaked to match your current level?

You'd have to run those dungeons all the time as you level up just to replace that gear. This would also have very interesting effects in the marketplace.

It appears that they've started down this path.
But have they? Does ZOS realize the potential? Have they even had this conversation?

Gern_Verkheart

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

I really don't care that much, but if they did remove vet ranks and just made them normal levels, then I would have enough skill points to max out every single skill tree. Then, if I ever wanted to change my build, the only thing I would ever have to change is morphs.

DaveMoeDee

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Egonieser wrote: »

Got nothing against Veteran ranks as such, however the means of obtaining them is something i hate, mainly Silver and Gold.
I've not done gold on a single character and I have 3 VR16s, i just can't do it, it's boring me to death, so i got my ranks in cyrodiil with a mix of pvp and delves/repeatables.

The repeatables give good XP these days. I've been doing them a lot as of late to get those last few levels.

DaveMoeDee

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Kungfu wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

Ranking/leveling/improving is important, and shouldn't be removed.

If they could scale the whole game like Orsinium, and battle-level lower-powered party members like Cyrodiil, it would just be a new gear issue. I have no problem looking forward to improving my gear with new content.

This. This is very interesting.
For such a simple statement, it took me down a whole rabbit-hole.

It is an idea that would be argued against by many because it is a cultural shift and that threatens people at a level beyond the game.

So, imagine a game where your level only matters when it comes to your skills, abilities, and maybe the solo quests that are available to you. What would be the benefits / detractors here? When your level does not limit what gear you can get, what dungeons you can run, or with whom you can run them...

You would theoretically be able to run the hardest dungeons at any level with any of your friends or any group mate of any other level. Would leveling become unimportant? I say "no, it would still be important." You would still need the skill points and you would still need to level your abilities. It would feel much the same as a level 40 in Cyrodiil going up against a vr16 today. You might have a chance but probably only if you're really good and really geared and he/she is really bad. Each player's personal skill level with their character class / build would become infinitely more important here, I think.

I think it would be an amazing new direction and could be a very freeing feeling.

Could you imagine an environment where you could log onto your level 30 and run content with your vr16 guildies *and* contribute *and* pick up versions of the best gear in the game tweaked to match your current level?

You'd have to run those dungeons all the time as you level up just to replace that gear. This would also have very interesting effects in the marketplace.

It appears that they've started down this path.
But have they? Does ZOS realize the potential? Have they even had this conversation?

Should battle leveling level to parity? Or should there be a percentage lost. For a crude example, if stats from gear get 10% more powerful per level, should battle leveling be only 8-9%. In such a case, the benefit of a single level is barely noticeable, but the accumulated effects of leveling would be quite noticeable.

NewBlacksmurf

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

ADarklore wrote: »

AshTal wrote: »

VR ranks force me to play through Cadwell Silver and Gold. I want them gone ASAP so any new characters are not forced through that.

This has nothing to do with VR ranks, it would remain even if we went to a general leveling system. This is considered CONTENT... and I don't believe you are forced to go through Cadwell's, you can PvP, grind mobs, etc... for XP to level. Most people like being able to play through all the factions, especially those who enjoy questing.

Actually silver and gold content is forced unless you're playing gimped of the skill points.

DaveMoeDee

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

MangoSsk wrote: »

After making 4 Veteran Rank 1's I think it is fair to say that it is too easy to get to Veteran Rank 1 and there should be levels added after 50 like to LvL99 then have them Veteran Rank 1. But thats just me. I ran into a couple VR1-VR10 that don't know what they are doing still.

Having levels up to 99 would be a very very very bad design change.

That would mean that after finishing the main story, your character is still horribly underpowered. Vet ranks are far superior to that approach because the difference in power between v1 and v2 is far less than between level 10 and level 20. It cadwell's silver, a v1 could still handle the v2 zone. Not so true for a DC level 8 character handling Shornhelm.

Such a change should not be imposed on everyone just because there are some people who "don't know what they are doing".

Lightninvash

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

grind grind grind wooooo haaaaaa

Geemarc

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

I have no issue with VR levels and see no reason for them to be removed.

I do however think that they should remove the restrictions of Cadwell Silver and Gold and open up other alliance areas after the completion of the main story quest.

SleepyTroll

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

I like vet rank progression more then CP. CP system *** blows. At least vet ranks make sense.

Kungfu

I want to keep VR ranks but they should be modified somehow.

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

Kungfu wrote: »

Morimizo wrote: »

Ranking/leveling/improving is important, and shouldn't be removed.

If they could scale the whole game like Orsinium, and battle-level lower-powered party members like Cyrodiil, it would just be a new gear issue. I have no problem looking forward to improving my gear with new content.

This. This is very interesting.
For such a simple statement, it took me down a whole rabbit-hole.

It is an idea that would be argued against by many because it is a cultural shift and that threatens people at a level beyond the game.

So, imagine a game where your level only matters when it comes to your skills, abilities, and maybe the solo quests that are available to you. What would be the benefits / detractors here? When your level does not limit what gear you can get, what dungeons you can run, or with whom you can run them...

You would theoretically be able to run the hardest dungeons at any level with any of your friends or any group mate of any other level. Would leveling become unimportant? I say "no, it would still be important." You would still need the skill points and you would still need to level your abilities. It would feel much the same as a level 40 in Cyrodiil going up against a vr16 today. You might have a chance but probably only if you're really good and really geared and he/she is really bad. Each player's personal skill level with their character class / build would become infinitely more important here, I think.

I think it would be an amazing new direction and could be a very freeing feeling.

Could you imagine an environment where you could log onto your level 30 and run content with your vr16 guildies *and* contribute *and* pick up versions of the best gear in the game tweaked to match your current level?

You'd have to run those dungeons all the time as you level up just to replace that gear. This would also have very interesting effects in the marketplace.

It appears that they've started down this path.
But have they? Does ZOS realize the potential? Have they even had this conversation?

Should battle leveling level to parity? Or should there be a percentage lost. For a crude example, if stats from gear get 10% more powerful per level, should battle leveling be only 8-9%. In such a case, the benefit of a single level is barely noticeable, but the accumulated effects of leveling would be quite noticeable.

Makes sense. The player who has leveled completely should be rewarded for having done so.

nimander99

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

Besides this game being a Scrolls game, it was the continued addition of a couple Vet Ranks every couple months that was a big enticement for me. I continue to love them.

NativeJoe

I want to keep VR ranks but they should be modified somehow.

Keep the veteran rank levels. Just update ALL THE GEAR so all the sets and build types remain viable or AT LEAST make it possible to VR up rank items at "gold sinkhole" levels. <.< I want a vr 16 necropotence set lol

Anyway... Idc about the grind to vr 16, vr 16 and vr 1... not much difference statistically, but between the two lots of expired useless sets. I just want variety.

Shadesofkin

I agree with removing VR ranks and replacing them with something else.

I like gear progression post 50 and I think it could do well with the Champion System backing it up.

dodgehopper_ESO

There was no option for what I wanted. I want them to remove VR ranks, and I don't want them replaced with anything. I don't see the point, when there is a champion system that clearly replaces them. It doesn't really effect me that much though, so if VR's make people happy, it doesn't really bother me. I just find it a bit odd that Ebony has so many higher grades of stone above it. Ebony has always been the creme de la creme of armors in TES games, only exceeded by dragonbone or daedric which are extremely exotic (and Daedric is actually made using a daedra blood/Ebony 'alloy' I might add). All these new materials such as galatite, rubedium, etc... what the hell are those? I'm personally getting tired of the material progression both for the sake of annoyance as well as lore reasons. I'd rather they found a more interesting way of handling the issue (like creating alloys or something).

phbell

I like VR ranks as they are and want to keep them.

The only people that I see complaining are those that do not want to do the work to earn them.

Stranglehands

I want to keep VR ranks but they should be modified somehow.

The ideal scenario is that when you beat the 1-50 zones you get a nice variety of options (cyrodiil, craglorn, imperial city, orsinium, cadwell's silver/gold) that you can just dip into however you want. The simplest way to go about that would be to have a level cap at 50 but can't help but think that that would get incredibly boring. I'm not sure how to fix it but one thing I do know is I don't feel like levelling any more characters up through cadwell's silver and gold

dodgehopper_ESO

phbell wrote: »

The only people that I see complaining are those that do not want to do the work to earn them.

I wasn't complaining, although I'd like to point out I have 8 vets (4 of which are v15 plus) on my main account, plus vets on an alternate account. It has nothing to do with the work to earn them, but I just think its a bad system. I don't like the way we keep getting new gear types, particularly for lore reasons but also because it does stupid things with storage for a crafter in this game. If it were like skyrim and I could just pile cheesewheels on the floor til they're bouncing around in the rafters that would be something else. Even with maxed out inventory/bank I'm very limited for space for the purpose of dedicated crafting. This is actually why a second account was purchased. I COULD unload all mats, but then that kills my ability to craft for the needs of other players. The more style motifs they pile on us the harder this gets. The more 'mission drop materials' they drop on us, the worse this will get. I'd rather they came up with a purify/alloy type system, instead of continuing to add more magical metals to the game.