Mist Form 75% DMG mitigation Bugged [Radiant Destruction]

hammayolettuce

Updated with better footage


These clips were recorded 4/20 after the 2.0.6 update. Mist form should mitigate %75 of all incoming damage which it does for every ability accept these two. It also seems apparent that mist form and undeath do not stack as well (unsure if intended). The main [Bug] of discussion is the Radiant channeled execute fully penetrating (not being mitigated the full 75) from mist form and not being mitigated like other attacks and or executes.

Thank you for watching and I hope Zenimax fixes the issues or at least comments on this issue on the forums.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0w9Z0lJuCPo


Posted for Princess Asgari.

Psilent

Watched it a few times; the 2nd Radiant Destruction used looks like you are not in mist form at the tail end of the beam.

hammayolettuce

Psilent wrote: »

Watched it a few times; the 2nd Radiant Oppression used on you looks like you are not in mist form at the tail end of the beam.

Dsync makes it look that way but was actually dead as the mist wore off. At roughly 1500 health Ariana is actually dead and the server keeps the character moving. With 1500 health left it still doesn't add up to the dmg total it does in the kill log. I should add that Ariana is in multiple heavy armor with 30k spell resist taking this much spell damage in mist form.

Huntler

1st clip: a full channel of biting jabs is surprising you that it hits you for 3k? Thats 6 attacks over several seconds while in mistform... what is the shocker here?

2nd clip: as Psilent said, you were out of mist form over a full second with the radiant still hitting you with only 5k life left.... at that much life left radiant will tick anywhere from 10-15k. Case closed on that clip, watch it again and watch it slowly. Its pretty obvious that its not doing extra damage to you when you are in mistform.


Finally as an added point, these aren't exactly test conditions, you want proof, I'd be happy to be test templar dummy to test these at some point. In combat with poor quality, no combat log, or anything and you want us to draw conclusions? Furthermore, the conclusions you drew clearly seem way off.

Huntler

hammayolettuce wrote: »

Psilent wrote: »

Watched it a few times; the 2nd Radiant Oppression used on you looks like you are not in mist form at the tail end of the beam.

Dsync makes it look that way but was actually dead as the mist wore off. At roughly 1500 health Ariana is actually dead and the server keeps the character moving. With 1500 health left it still doesn't add up to the dmg total it does in the kill log. I should add that Ariana is in multiple heavy armor with 30k spell resist taking this much spell damage in mist form.

We disagree on that, frankly I disagree with the conclusion of the video. You want to show proof show proof, combat log, not death recap and in a controlled environment. You "think" its dsync, to me that doesn't look like dsync as the play was clearly out of mist form well about 1500 health. When you go frame by frame, the player is clearly out of mistform somewhere in the 4.5-5k range (hard to tell more exactly than that) upon which case she goes poof.

hammayolettuce

Huntler wrote: »

1st clip: a full channel of biting jabs is surprising you that it hits you for 3k? Thats 6 attacks over several seconds while in mistform... what is the shocker here?

2nd clip: as Psilent said, you were out of mist form over a full second with the radiant still hitting you with only 5k life left.... at that much life left radiant will tick anywhere from 10-15k. Case closed on that clip, watch it again and watch it slowly. Its pretty obvious that its not doing extra damage to you when you are in mistform.


Finally as an added point, these aren't exactly test conditions, you want proof, I'd be happy to be test templar dummy to test these at some point. In combat with poor quality, no combat log, or anything and you want us to draw conclusions? Furthermore, the conclusions you drew clearly seem way off.

message him in game to test. He cant exactly test himeslf... It was two clips he had from today after the update.

hammayolettuce

@Huntler , Video updated with cleaner footage and more consistent testing. Would like your thoughts on it.


@ZOS_GinaBruno , Asgari did notice during testing that removing gear and putting it back on made dmg totals differ. Something that should be looked into along with mist form and the passive. Thank you.

Tripwyr

In every clip Mist Form reduces the damage dealt by Radiant Destruction by close to 50%. At 2:14 you take the following damage: 2005 out of Mist Form, 2809 crit in Mist Form, 3895 crit in Mist Form. As you can see at this point the damage is rapidly scaling up due to your being in execute range. If we increase the first tick -> second tick by the same ratio as the second tick -> third tick (not exactly precise but close enough to make our point), we get 4170 damage for the second tick, much more than the 2809 damage that you ended up taking.

At 2:42 you take 671 damage out of Mist Form, then you take 168 damage upon entering Mist Form. Next you take the following out of Mist Form: 1033 crit, 1200 crit, 1665 crit; then you enter Mist Form and take: 763 hit, 913 hit, 1106 hit, 1374 hit. It seems to me that despite the damage quickly ramping upward, you are still taking substantially reduced damage while in Mist Form.

At 3:07 you take 684 out of Mist, 1284 crit out of Mist, 533 hit in Mist, 955 crit in Mist, 1247 crit in Mist, 1104 hit in Mist, 1343 hit in Mist.

It looks like Mist is reducing the damage of Radiant Destruction by 50% or more. We need significantly better footage to truly analyse this.

Huntler

Watching now, will edit when I've seen it a few times.


Ok after watching it I agree with Trip, its clearly reducing the damage. Once again its hard to do the math because of how groups damage. I think at best you're either having an issue where mist isn't fully reducing the damage by 75% (but is definitely reducing it by a large factor) or a possible bug with undeath as well (as mentioned previously).


It does bear further investigation. I wonder if in mist form, other forms of mitigation are not taken into account, kind of like how they made shields not take mitigation into account.... food for thought.

Psilent

Asgari, if you want, I have no issues bringing my VR14 AD Templar out to help you test.

danno8

Watched the whole thing. Tried to find numbers at the same % health in and out of mist form to work with.

At ~20% health out of mist form, you take about 1980 damage per tick
At ~20% health while in mist form, you take about 1104 damage per tick.

At very low health (under 10%) while out of mist form you take 2958, *3458*
At very low health (under 10%) while in most form you take 1847, 2214 damage


At the 2:15 mark I don't think your mist form actually worked, you were too late in activating it. Which is why you see 3000+ ticks.

Same with the 2:52 mark, the RD channel started just before you mist formed.

Also of note, is the very last tick at death. It seems to tick one last time even after you are dead, and it always seems to be an large hit that ignores mist form. To me this means that when you die, mist for is removed, and the last tick of RD is applied after death. This may lead people to see even more inflated numvers in the recap screen.

Mist form is mitigating the damage, but it seems to only be mitigating around 40% or so.

A way for this to happen would be for mist form to be adding 25% (due to a math error with 1 - .75) to your already 50% mitigation giving a total of 75% mitigation. Then you would see a hit that is normally 4000, going down to 2000 with max spell resist and 1000 with mist form and max spell resist.

Huntler

danno816_ESO wrote: »

Watched the whole thing. Tried to find numbers at the same % health in and out of mist form to work with.

At ~20% health out of mist form, you take about 1980 damage per tick
At ~20% health while in mist form, you take about 1104 damage per tick.

At very low health (under 10%) while out of mist form you take 2958, *3458*
At very low health (under 10%) while in most form you take 1847, 2214 damage


At the 2:15 mark I don't think your mist form actually worked, you were too late in activating it. Which is why you see 3000+ ticks.

Same with the 2:52 mark, the RD channel started just before you mist formed.

Also of note, is the very last tick at death. It seems to tick one last time even after you are dead, and it always seems to be an large hit that ignores mist form. To me this means that when you die, mist for is removed, and the last tick of RD is applied after death. This may lead people to see even more inflated numvers in the recap screen.

Mist form is mitigating the damage, but it seems to only be mitigating around 40% or so.

A way for this to happen would be for mist form to be adding 25% (due to a math error with 1 - .75) to your already 50% mitigation giving a total of 75% mitigation. Then you would see a hit that is normally 4000, going down to 2000 with max spell resist and 1000 with mist form and max spell resist.

ZOS funky math would not shock me in this instance, we've all seen how spell pen math is done

hammayolettuce

Huntler wrote: »

Watching now, will edit when I've seen it a few times.


Ok after watching it I agree with Trip, its clearly reducing the damage. Once again its hard to do the math because of how groups damage. I think at best you're either having an issue where mist isn't fully reducing the damage by 75% (but is definitely reducing it by a large factor) or a possible bug with undeath as well (as mentioned previously).


It does bear further investigation. I wonder if in mist form, other forms of mitigation are not taken into account, kind of like how they made shields not take mitigation into account.... food for thought.

Huntler wrote: »

danno816_ESO wrote: »

Watched the whole thing. Tried to find numbers at the same % health in and out of mist form to work with.

At ~20% health out of mist form, you take about 1980 damage per tick
At ~20% health while in mist form, you take about 1104 damage per tick.

At very low health (under 10%) while out of mist form you take 2958, *3458*
At very low health (under 10%) while in most form you take 1847, 2214 damage


At the 2:15 mark I don't think your mist form actually worked, you were too late in activating it. Which is why you see 3000+ ticks.

Same with the 2:52 mark, the RD channel started just before you mist formed.

Also of note, is the very last tick at death. It seems to tick one last time even after you are dead, and it always seems to be an large hit that ignores mist form. To me this means that when you die, mist for is removed, and the last tick of RD is applied after death. This may lead people to see even more inflated numvers in the recap screen.

Mist form is mitigating the damage, but it seems to only be mitigating around 40% or so.

A way for this to happen would be for mist form to be adding 25% (due to a math error with 1 - .75) to your already 50% mitigation giving a total of 75% mitigation. Then you would see a hit that is normally 4000, going down to 2000 with max spell resist and 1000 with mist form and max spell resist.

ZOS funky math would not shock me in this instance, we've all seen how spell pen math is done

From Asgari: "I agree it is mitigating damage which was never my issue with it. My issue is it is not mitigating the full %75 like it states it should and the passive is clearly not working with it either but im not sure if that is intended or not. I wish @ZOS_GinaBruno or @ZOS_BrianWheeler would be able to chime in and put the issue to rest".

Huntler

hammayolettuce wrote: »

Huntler wrote: »

Watching now, will edit when I've seen it a few times.


Ok after watching it I agree with Trip, its clearly reducing the damage. Once again its hard to do the math because of how groups damage. I think at best you're either having an issue where mist isn't fully reducing the damage by 75% (but is definitely reducing it by a large factor) or a possible bug with undeath as well (as mentioned previously).


It does bear further investigation. I wonder if in mist form, other forms of mitigation are not taken into account, kind of like how they made shields not take mitigation into account.... food for thought.

Huntler wrote: »

danno816_ESO wrote: »

Watched the whole thing. Tried to find numbers at the same % health in and out of mist form to work with.

At ~20% health out of mist form, you take about 1980 damage per tick
At ~20% health while in mist form, you take about 1104 damage per tick.

At very low health (under 10%) while out of mist form you take 2958, *3458*
At very low health (under 10%) while in most form you take 1847, 2214 damage


At the 2:15 mark I don't think your mist form actually worked, you were too late in activating it. Which is why you see 3000+ ticks.

Same with the 2:52 mark, the RD channel started just before you mist formed.

Also of note, is the very last tick at death. It seems to tick one last time even after you are dead, and it always seems to be an large hit that ignores mist form. To me this means that when you die, mist for is removed, and the last tick of RD is applied after death. This may lead people to see even more inflated numvers in the recap screen.

Mist form is mitigating the damage, but it seems to only be mitigating around 40% or so.

A way for this to happen would be for mist form to be adding 25% (due to a math error with 1 - .75) to your already 50% mitigation giving a total of 75% mitigation. Then you would see a hit that is normally 4000, going down to 2000 with max spell resist and 1000 with mist form and max spell resist.

ZOS funky math would not shock me in this instance, we've all seen how spell pen math is done

From Asgari: "I agree it is mitigating damage which was never my issue with it. My issue is it is not mitigating the full %75 like it states it should and the passive is clearly not working with it either but im not sure if that is intended or not. I wish @ZOS_GinaBruno or @ZOS_BrianWheeler would be able to chime in and put the issue to rest".

I agree it seems like full mitigation might not be happening. I'm trying to think of scenarios in which why it might not be. It seems to only happen when in execute range, I wonder if one of our bonus damages gets applied after the damage reduction or something. Like an order of operations issue. Like maybe the 300% execute bonus is getting reduced, but then after that we are getting a 40% boost from the RO morph or vice versa.

Tripwyr

Huntler wrote: »

hammayolettuce wrote: »

Huntler wrote: »

Watching now, will edit when I've seen it a few times.


Ok after watching it I agree with Trip, its clearly reducing the damage. Once again its hard to do the math because of how groups damage. I think at best you're either having an issue where mist isn't fully reducing the damage by 75% (but is definitely reducing it by a large factor) or a possible bug with undeath as well (as mentioned previously).


It does bear further investigation. I wonder if in mist form, other forms of mitigation are not taken into account, kind of like how they made shields not take mitigation into account.... food for thought.

Huntler wrote: »

danno816_ESO wrote: »

Watched the whole thing. Tried to find numbers at the same % health in and out of mist form to work with.

At ~20% health out of mist form, you take about 1980 damage per tick
At ~20% health while in mist form, you take about 1104 damage per tick.

At very low health (under 10%) while out of mist form you take 2958, *3458*
At very low health (under 10%) while in most form you take 1847, 2214 damage


At the 2:15 mark I don't think your mist form actually worked, you were too late in activating it. Which is why you see 3000+ ticks.

Same with the 2:52 mark, the RD channel started just before you mist formed.

Also of note, is the very last tick at death. It seems to tick one last time even after you are dead, and it always seems to be an large hit that ignores mist form. To me this means that when you die, mist for is removed, and the last tick of RD is applied after death. This may lead people to see even more inflated numvers in the recap screen.

Mist form is mitigating the damage, but it seems to only be mitigating around 40% or so.

A way for this to happen would be for mist form to be adding 25% (due to a math error with 1 - .75) to your already 50% mitigation giving a total of 75% mitigation. Then you would see a hit that is normally 4000, going down to 2000 with max spell resist and 1000 with mist form and max spell resist.

ZOS funky math would not shock me in this instance, we've all seen how spell pen math is done

From Asgari: "I agree it is mitigating damage which was never my issue with it. My issue is it is not mitigating the full %75 like it states it should and the passive is clearly not working with it either but im not sure if that is intended or not. I wish @ZOS_GinaBruno or @ZOS_BrianWheeler would be able to chime in and put the issue to rest".

I agree it seems like full mitigation might not be happening. I'm trying to think of scenarios in which why it might not be. It seems to only happen when in execute range, I wonder if one of our bonus damages gets applied after the damage reduction or something. Like an order of operations issue. Like maybe the 300% execute bonus is getting reduced, but then after that we are getting a 40% boost from the RO morph or vice versa.

I doubt this is the case, I believe it is much more likely that the either normal damage reduction is bypassed while in Mist Form, or Mist Form's damage reduction is being unintentionally capped by some other mechanic.

Huntler

Tripwyr wrote: »

Huntler wrote: »

hammayolettuce wrote: »

Huntler wrote: »

Watching now, will edit when I've seen it a few times.


Ok after watching it I agree with Trip, its clearly reducing the damage. Once again its hard to do the math because of how groups damage. I think at best you're either having an issue where mist isn't fully reducing the damage by 75% (but is definitely reducing it by a large factor) or a possible bug with undeath as well (as mentioned previously).


It does bear further investigation. I wonder if in mist form, other forms of mitigation are not taken into account, kind of like how they made shields not take mitigation into account.... food for thought.

Huntler wrote: »

danno816_ESO wrote: »

Watched the whole thing. Tried to find numbers at the same % health in and out of mist form to work with.

At ~20% health out of mist form, you take about 1980 damage per tick
At ~20% health while in mist form, you take about 1104 damage per tick.

At very low health (under 10%) while out of mist form you take 2958, *3458*
At very low health (under 10%) while in most form you take 1847, 2214 damage


At the 2:15 mark I don't think your mist form actually worked, you were too late in activating it. Which is why you see 3000+ ticks.

Same with the 2:52 mark, the RD channel started just before you mist formed.

Also of note, is the very last tick at death. It seems to tick one last time even after you are dead, and it always seems to be an large hit that ignores mist form. To me this means that when you die, mist for is removed, and the last tick of RD is applied after death. This may lead people to see even more inflated numvers in the recap screen.

Mist form is mitigating the damage, but it seems to only be mitigating around 40% or so.

A way for this to happen would be for mist form to be adding 25% (due to a math error with 1 - .75) to your already 50% mitigation giving a total of 75% mitigation. Then you would see a hit that is normally 4000, going down to 2000 with max spell resist and 1000 with mist form and max spell resist.

ZOS funky math would not shock me in this instance, we've all seen how spell pen math is done

From Asgari: "I agree it is mitigating damage which was never my issue with it. My issue is it is not mitigating the full %75 like it states it should and the passive is clearly not working with it either but im not sure if that is intended or not. I wish @ZOS_GinaBruno or @ZOS_BrianWheeler would be able to chime in and put the issue to rest".

I agree it seems like full mitigation might not be happening. I'm trying to think of scenarios in which why it might not be. It seems to only happen when in execute range, I wonder if one of our bonus damages gets applied after the damage reduction or something. Like an order of operations issue. Like maybe the 300% execute bonus is getting reduced, but then after that we are getting a 40% boost from the RO morph or vice versa.

I doubt this is the case, I believe it is much more likely that the either normal damage reduction is bypassed while in Mist Form, or Mist Form's damage reduction is being unintentionally capped by some other mechanic.

Fair point, probably more likely.

Mumyo

Next time make sure u can also see the equip of the templar and make sure that he is not suddenly starting to use innerlight, just for accuracy... this is no proper testing.
But everything is imaginable in this game anyway^^ thx for ur effort.

hammayolettuce

Mumyo wrote: »

Next time make sure u can also see the equip of the templar and make sure that he is not suddenly starting to use innerlight, just for accuracy... this is no proper testing.
But everything is imaginable in this game anyway^^ thx for ur effort.

Only 1 time was inner light used and they are a healing templar so the damage is a consistent as possible. I dont think the testing could be any more consistent than it was.

Mist form is obviously bugged and not working as intended which was the goal by Asgari to prove.

Mumyo

hammayolettuce wrote: »

Mumyo wrote: »

Next time make sure u can also see the equip of the templar and make sure that he is not suddenly starting to use innerlight, just for accuracy... this is no proper testing.
But everything is imaginable in this game anyway^^ thx for ur effort.

Only 1 time was inner light used and they are a healing templar so the damage is a consistent as possible. I dont think the testing could be any more consistent than it was.

Mist form is obviously bugged and not working as intended which was the goal by Asgari to prove.

Or the Templarskills are not working as intended. Many of their abilities are seriously bugged and since radiant is new i think this causes many issues...it got fixed so often by now and there is still a way to go.

danno8

hammayolettuce wrote: »

From Asgari: "I agree it is mitigating damage which was never my issue with it. My issue is it is not mitigating the full %75 like it states it should and the passive is clearly not working with it either but im not sure if that is intended or not. I wish @ZOS_GinaBruno or @ZOS_BrianWheeler would be able to chime in and put the issue to rest".

In the video it states "RD execute fully penetrating mist form" which may be confusing some people and seemingly contradicting your (Asgari's) statement here.

Are you guys sure that other forms are being mitigated properly? Or are they also doing some strange math? RD can stand out due to the stacking nature of the recap screen and is complicated due to the 2 ticks/second nature of the skill so I was just wondering if maybe other executes were tested also.

hammayolettuce

danno816_ESO wrote: »

hammayolettuce wrote: »

From Asgari: "I agree it is mitigating damage which was never my issue with it. My issue is it is not mitigating the full %75 like it states it should and the passive is clearly not working with it either but im not sure if that is intended or not. I wish @ZOS_GinaBruno or @ZOS_BrianWheeler would be able to chime in and put the issue to rest".

In the video it states "RD execute fully penetrating mist form" which may be confusing some people and seemingly contradicting your (Asgari's) statement here.

Are you guys sure that other forms are being mitigated properly? Or are they also doing some strange math? RD can stand out due to the stacking nature of the recap screen and is complicated due to the 2 ticks/second nature of the skill so I was just wondering if maybe other executes were tested also.

execute wise it is only Radiant having this issue. Since day one it has been nothing but trouble and continues to be for the devs who created it.

Suru

Burn an enemy with a ray of holy fire, dealing X Magic Damage over 2.5 seconds.
Low health targets take up to additional damage.

Yea I know it says magic damge, but if it was fire, would that 50%~ mitigation make sense with 40% increased damage with fire if it was fire?

Winnamine

Mumyo wrote: »

Next time make sure u can also see the equip of the templar and make sure that he is not suddenly starting to use innerlight, just for accuracy... this is no proper testing.
But everything is imaginable in this game anyway^^ thx for ur effort.

If you need to know my equip for this, you can ask me.
I'm not sure it matters, since I didn't change anything between tests.

ZOS_GinaBruno

Thanks for the video! We'll take a look and see if we can clear this up for you all. Stand by for answers...

Huntler

Winnamine wrote: »

Mumyo wrote: »

Next time make sure u can also see the equip of the templar and make sure that he is not suddenly starting to use innerlight, just for accuracy... this is no proper testing.
But everything is imaginable in this game anyway^^ thx for ur effort.

If you need to know my equip for this, you can ask me.
I'm not sure it matters, since I didn't change anything between tests.

More importantly, why weren't you naked for this testing? ERP to the max.

hammayolettuce

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the video! We'll take a look and see if we can clear this up for you all. Stand by for answers...

Thank you! look forward to what you all find

Garbrac

The issue I see is that Mist Form isn't negating damage that is already being performed when you initialize mist form. I do not know if this is intended or not, As Mist Form is suppose to negate damage taken after it's been initialized. In your testing I see you hitting Mist Form AFTER the Jesus Beam has been started, thus making Mist Form null and void since Jesus Beam is a continuous attack and not a DoT (damage is constant whereas a DoT has timed ticks and allows for recalculation).

That being said, and just to nitpick, your video appears to have been recorded over three days at least. At the begining of your video you stated the clips were recorded on Apr 20th, which isn't the case as that was yesterday, and the clock on your video shows 11:34pm, 11:32pm, 11:15pm, 11:25pm, 11:27pm, and 11:39pm. So unless you're a Time Lord, the video was over at least 3 days.

Attorneyatlawl

Also worth noting is that the Templar would gain a 20% damage boost on the first tick of Radiant I think, from the Might of the Guild passive if he had recently refreshed Inner Light (Mage Guild skill). Someone correct me if I'm wrong on it being consumed by Radiant but I recall someone saying it is.

hammayolettuce

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

Also worth noting is that the Templar would gain a 20% damage boost on the first tick of Radiant I think, from the Might of the Guild passive if he had recently refreshed Inner Light (Mage Guild skill). Someone correct me if I'm wrong on it being consumed by Radiant but I recall someone saying it is.

Inner light was only cast once on accident, all of the others it was not used. but in theory it should

KarshtheWraith

Radiant destruction OP #JESUSBEAMFTW

sorry had to

Tripwyr

Garbrac wrote: »

The issue I see is that Mist Form isn't negating damage that is already being performed when you initialize mist form. I do not know if this is intended or not, As Mist Form is suppose to negate damage taken after it's been initialized. In your testing I see you hitting Mist Form AFTER the Jesus Beam has been started, thus making Mist Form null and void since Jesus Beam is a continuous attack and not a DoT (damage is constant whereas a DoT has timed ticks and allows for recalculation).

That being said, and just to nitpick, your video appears to have been recorded over three days at least. At the begining of your video you stated the clips were recorded on Apr 20th, which isn't the case as that was yesterday, and the clock on your video shows 11:34pm, 11:32pm, 11:15pm, 11:25pm, 11:27pm, and 11:39pm. So unless you're a Time Lord, the video was over at least 3 days.

Or the videos are not sequential.

Watching the video a single time you can clearly see that Mist Form mitigates the ticks after it begins. In every clip the first 1-2 ticks are unmitigated, then Mist Form takes effect and the rest are mitigated.

There is far too much random speculation in this thread from people who clearly did not watch the video closely.