Devotion Skill Lines ("Aedric Champion", "Daedric Servant")

tinythinker

Background

This is something that I thought about when I started playing during beta testing. I recall there was something vaguely similar posted on these forums early on after the game's release. The discussions of upcoming features from The Future of ESO panel at QuakeCon 2014 provoked new thoughts about a pair of mutually exclusive Devotion skills line that I will share here. But first, here is what I submitted as a suggestion during beta for context. Feel free to skip below this to see where it leads:

I've always found the cultural elements to be an intriguing part of the background and atmosphere of Tamriel, especially the religious aspects. But these aren't typically explored as deeply as other elements. For example, while it is common to have single quests/rewards for Daedric Princes in single player Elder Scrolls games, and limited numbers of quests for some of the Aedric powers, devotion doesn't really play into character creation/development and broader interactions with specific individuals or categories of NPCs. None of these though are as deep as the "guild" quest lines, and they have little effect other than gaining certain quest items or the odd active effect. It would be interesting to be able to explore more of these kinds of cultural elements/factions and have increased standing with one official/named or unofficial faction hurt you with another. This was seen to a small degree in Skyrim when possessing Daedric artifacts caused problems with the Vigilantes of Stendarr.

A way to incorporate it into ESO game play and character development would be to have such activities open up additional skill lines which would be mutually exclusive depending on which path you take, such as choosing to either serve the Aedra or the Daedra. Basically this involves limiting character options by choosing one option and the expense of others in a way that is more concrete, consequential, and immersive in the game world. Not only because those two skill lines are mutually exclusive, but because limited skills points per character would make choosing to serve particular powers costly. Perhaps there might even be items particular to each power that give special abilities or attributes that can only be used by those who have chosen to serve one set of powers or another and have progressed sufficiently in the skill line (different bonuses/abilities tacked on the skill line attributes that reflect the flavor of a particular power?). Players who want to have a fuller experience can play through again and pursue different options, just like they might do in order to explore each Alliance or to become a master crafter in a particular discipline.

Notice that at the time I was new to ESO and as I had never made it beyond level the mid-teens with my beta characters, so I had no idea that you would in fact play through each alliance with the same character. But I still think the basic idea for a Devotional skill line would be fun and add some depth to character customization.

How It Might Work

Technically, you can say the Templars are already servants of the Aedra, but so what? Nighblades will eventually see a Thieve's Guild and the Dark Brotherhood. Sorcerers already have the Mages Guild and Dragonknights the Fighters Guild. Having a religious flavored skill line that any class can join doesn't seem unreasonable.

After sharing my additional thoughts, I'd be interested to see how other players might want to set up such a skill line. So here goes an off-the-top-of-my-head sketch:

Aedric Champion

"Aedric Champions have devoted themselves to serving the Eight by upholding their virtues and defending Nirn from the corrupting influence of Daedric assaults and mortal perversion. They are chosen by the Divines for their commitment to dispelling the fear, violence, and indifference to justice plaguing the citizens of Tamriel. Favor with the Eight increases with alms, defending the weak, and completing tasks appointed by the Voices of the Divines."

There are already random opportunities to give to the poor (for an achievement called Golden Palms) as well as places where bandits are threatening travelers. These would be examples of dispelling fear, violence, and indifference to justice. Other opportunities along these lines could be added as well. With the advent of the justice system, for example, bringing criminals to justice would also add to the relevant experience gains for the skill line.

However, like the NPC Guilds, Vampirism, and Lycanthropy, there would need to first be a specific triggering event or some starter quest. Also, additional quests offered by the Voices (ephemeral presences that appear at Aedric Temples and Shrines) would be key for really advancing in the skill lines.

As suggested in my early thoughts, some of these quests could lead to objects associated with a particular Divine, and the object itself would have unique uses fitting that Divine's portfolio. It would be fun if each object -- let's call it a focus -- fit in with one or two of the passive abilities (as yet to be thought up) of the skill line, but that might be too complicated.

To show how it might work, let's use Zenithar, patron of wealth, labor, commerce, and communication. Let's say that his focus granted a boon to prices for items bought and sold (better than enchantment glyphs), and perhaps also to how many items you can carry. A passive for this skill line might increase the focus effect by some percentage.

Even better, to me at least, would be to take that previous example and turn it into a permanent effect called a Blessing that shows up on your character sheet screen. The focus would still be a special item that would grant some utility or ability, but that use or power would be more about affecting active changes in the world rather than simply benefiting the character. In this scheme, the one or two amplifying passives mentioned above would work to amplify the Blessing or to allow additional Blessings, up to a maximum of say three or so. That is, you could have active Blessings from more than one Divine.

Either way, whether its a Focus or a Blessing and Focus, the remaining passives would be associated with any active ability/abilities in the skill line.

All of this would requires lots of investment on the part of the player, as with other skill lines, so that not just anyone is going to be walking around with (multiple) Blessings of the Eight. And a focus might need to be activated or charged by some kind of appropriate activity. In the case of Zenithar, perhaps such activity would involve giving up some your hard earned gold coin.

Oh, and, committing crimes, especially murder in the justice system that is being developed, would actually cause you to have some or all blessings to be suspended and advancement in this skill line to be frozen until penance was made.

So if you steal someone's sweet role, getting a blessing from a priest at a temple in a city or town and making a small monetary donation would be adequate. For somewhat more serious offenses, a minor quest to some remote shrine, gathering certain objects to burn at the shrine, and then earning some points for doing good (again, alms to the poor, rescuing travelers, etc) would be sufficient. For murder and extreme blasphemy, a major quest (with multiple parts/sub-quests) and sacrificing very hard to find/valuable items would be required.

(There is no official order of Crusaders implied here, such as the Knights of the Nine, a group founded in the Third Era, or the Vigilants of Stendarr, who appeared in the Fourth Era. If a group affiliation were desired, the Abbey of the Eight and its Knights, located in southwestern Cyrodiil during the time of Molag Bal's invasion of Nirn, might be a suitable starting point.)

Daedric Servant

"Daedric Servants have devoted themselves to exploring the power and potential offered by Daedric Princes by pursuing the unconventional perspectives and secret paths of Oblivion. They prove themselves worthy by demonstrating their commitment to seeking the freedom to circumvent or overturn the arbitrary restrictions and false limitations that bind mortals to a mundane and ineffectual existence. Favor with the Daedric Princes is curried by showing strength of will, acting on a consuming passion for transformation, and completing tasks appointed by the Whispers of the Oblivion."

Essentially, this follows a similar structure in terms of Blessings, Foci, and so on already described for the Aedric Champions. For example, the focus for Mephala might require the murder of NPCs, putting those who would serve her at odds with the enforcers of the game's upcoming justice system.

Clarifications

A few things to make clear:

• Yes, Templars are supposed to serve the Aedra, and yes, they could choose instead to turn to the Daedra in this system. While Templars may choose to be Aedric Champions, this is optional, just as Nightblades may opt out of joining the Dark Brotherhood (when it shows up) or Sorcerers may opt out of being part of the Mages Guild.
  
• Yes, the majority of city-dwelling Dunmer follow what they believe to be the true manifestations of their God-ancestors in the form of the Tribunal, but not all dark elves agree with this practice. Ashlanders, for example, still follow Azura, Boethiah, and Mephala.
  
• Yes, Vampires were created by Molag Bal and Werewolves by Hircine, but that doesn't mean all such creatures venerate or choose to serve those Princes.
  
• No, it isn't assumed that "Aedra = Good" and "Daedra = Evil". The descriptions of each choice for the Devotion skill line, whether going with Aedra or Daedra, allow for the complexity of each group of beings while emphasizing similarities in their character. One could choose, for example, a devotion to Meridia, to Azura, or possibly both (see the sample suggestion for a passive related to this), and still see oneself as doing good in the world and fighting against evil.

Anyway, this is just the start of an idea. Obviously the abilities of the skill lines proposed here are more or less blank, but it's the larger logic/framework of the skill line that was of initial interest. Suitable abilities can be added in to fit the themes.

Nestor

I miss the Temple and Imperial Cult factions from Morrowind, they went away and have never come back. Those factions had some politics and intrigue, but were mostly helping someone out somewhere in the game world.

While we have a few Help a Person out quests in this game, most of them involve killing at some point. It would be nice to have a faction or quest line that has incidental combat in it for most or at least some of the quests. I would hope they were not all Fetch quests like the IC line was mostly made up of. I know ESO and being passive are kind of mutually exclusive in this iteration, but it would be a nice change of pace. Perhaps limit the violence to being against bad people doing bad things to nice people.

tinythinker

Yeah, that was the idea for Aedric Champions. Lots of bandits, refugees, and impoverished people in Tamriel during the Interregnum. From an RP perspective, the Champions are selected in order to restore hope and remind people that the Divines have not abandoned them.

On the the other hand, this is a prime opportunity for those ambitious and competent enough to serve the Daedra.

Tekalynn

For that matter, why shouldn't a Dunmer Templar have the chance to RP as a devout Tribunal worshipper? I know, it's not 2002 and we're not in Vvardenfell, but I would *so* play that questline.

tinythinker

If the basics of a Devotion skill line were worked out, it could be used for anything, really. I gave two versions based on Aedra and Daedra as they are widely venerated across Tamriel, but, technically, you could take the same concept and open it up to any divinity that has the power to grant a Blessing and a Focus.

The potential drawbacks to doing the Tribunal are that they are already an active part of the Ebonheart Pact storyline and that they aren't worshiped outside of Morrowind. The latter is more of an issue than the former, I suppose, but then if we add the Tribunal we could also ask about the variations of the Khajiit pantheon or the Argonian rituals involving Sithis and the Hist. I figured the Eight Divines would be simpler, and threw in the Daedric Princes for those who might want a subversive or counter-culture alternative.

Magnys

I love ideas like this where a person should be able to expand past or add on to their current class choice. I still like the idea of the Champions system at VR but wish(ed) they would have, instead, added a further class expansion when leveling VR.

So say if you are a NB you can advance to Burglar, Rogue, Bard...Templar: Crusader, Monk, Witchhunter.....DK: Ranger, Barbarian, Warrior....Sorcerer: Battlemage, Spellsword, Necromancer.....Things on that wave length. Just something where you can truly set your character apart from others after VR level and make it more unique if you will.

With how vast the Elder Scrolls universe is as far as story, characters, etc, Zeni could honestly blow people out of the water if they look at things such as this, what Tinythinker mentioned, and what folks have been saying about adding things like becoming a Lich and such. Love this game and think it has vast potential. Just wish a few of my friends and I could sit in a room with Zeni game designers and throw more ideas at them.

Have a Fine Navy Day good people.

Sotha_Sil

More skills and trees options will be interesting and needed I guess to add gameplay diversity. However, I believe it is maybe too early as far as balance is concerned.

But your idea sounds nice.

By the way,

tinythinker wrote: »

[*] Yes, the majority of city-dwelling Dunmer follow what they believe to be the true manifestations of their God-ancestors in the form of the Tribunal, but not all dark elves agree with this practice.

All those fools follow me ! I'm evil muhahahaha.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

I would happily serve the Daedra. Any daedric prince really, I like them all.

I have preferences for Nocturnal and Mehrunes Dagon tho.

Gasgiant

Ive also noticed that each race seems to have its own versions of the divines. The eight, are not universally the eight across all of Tamriel, as well as many specific cultural beliefs as noted above. However since these are cultural, there could be race specific options to this. Redguards who get the blessing of Tall Papa, Kajit with blessings from their spirits, Dunmer with blessings of the Tribunal, Nords with Kyne or Shor, the Argonians with the Hist and Sithis, and the Orcs with Mulloch (Which is not a Daedra ). Im sure that there could be examples of the four races I didn't mention, but its is waaayyy too late/early for me to think of or remember them.

gimpdrb14_ESO

i like the idea of having a daedra worshiping skill tree and a divines skill tree. you could only pick one tree or the other to advance in.