is solo play dead? does cyro just suck?

Wing · December 2019

I have only ever played solo in cyro, *original continuation removed for baiting -Wing*

pvp has had its ups and downs but feels particularly down as of late, you can blame the meta (and often it is a contributory factor)

but I feel that just most players have grouped up at this point, whatever the reason, whenever it started, the small man groups that always hated on the zergs BECAME the zergs, and then it kind of rolled downhill, the bad zergs got bigger, the small man groups turned into a zerg, and the solo 1vX crowd turned into small man groups.

and now, nobody can kill anyone really.

I watch a group of 10ish players (bigger than small man, smaller then a zerg) kite, unable to be killed and then ult dump to kill like 1-2 players (literally, im just watching at this point) and then just kind of do it again, the dead respawn and repeat, the group repeats.

if enough people to show up and numbers finally get picked off (this only happens when its a legit zerg chasing them and 1 person gets stuck out of position, and then this repeats till most are dead)

forward camp

and then it continues.

but

watching groups of really good players that are in discord coordinate their ults and dump on players to get like 1-2 kills. . .I just kind of feel like "how am I supposed to kill anyone?" if that's what it takes, then I have no chance, and even if you do kill them, forward camp.

the sheer amount of nothing back and forth that happens until a group either leaves or a faction stack occurs that has enough heals and people to just brute force keeps to the point that nothing can really stop them (other then a faction stack, at that point the server dies)

I feel so darn apathetic in cyro lately.

maybe when they get rid of CP whatever takes its place will be amazing and revitalize pvp, maybe the devs will stop neglecting it and give us cool changes, but. . .

I rather doubt it

whatever.

Lord-Otto · December 2019

Well, the tanky people in zergs are those people who don't cloak or streak away. Rather be a coward than a zerger, eh?
=P

Dalsinthus · December 2019

OP I would say that cyrodiil just isn’t as fun as it used to be. You hate on playstyles you see as cowardly (nb cloak, sorc streak) or boring (tankiness) but these are literally the options we have in this meta. Although sorcs and nightblades are just a shadow of their former selves, and therefore are somewhere between under powered and fine, I otherwise agree with you. As a result, it’s been harder and harder to bring myself to pvp for the past few months. My heart is just not in it anymore. A year ago I was in cydrodiil or bgs every single day.

Wing · December 2019

Lord-Otto wrote: »

Well, the tanky people in zergs are those people who don't cloak or streak away. Rather be a coward than a zerger, eh?
=P

you know that's not true, as soon as the zerg starts to crumble the cowards flee for their own lives.

I did actually kill a cloak spamming NB the other day that tried to jump me (man that spam was something else, like every other skill) and as I tea bagged his cowardly corpse I awaited what I thought for sure was going to be a very salty and bile filled rage tell.

and you know what?

nothing, not a peep

and you know why?

he knew that as a cloak spamming NB he deserved every sack dragged across his dead cowardly face that ever comes his way, he owned it.

TheFM · December 2019

The games connection has become too unstable for me to do anything solo tbh. Its become a luxury if I can even weave properly now adays.

Wing · December 2019

TheFM wrote: »

The games connection has become too unstable for me to do anything solo tbh. Its become a luxury if I can even weave properly now adays.

ugh, that too.

Kel · December 2019

You know, you can play a nightblade and use the healing morph of cloak, right?
If "sneaky" nightblade isn't your thing, use the heal. It's pretty incredible.

Not every nightblade plays cloak/snipe.
If that's what's holding you back, give it a shot. You might like it. And at the least, it might change how you look at the class. Don't let preconceived notions stop you from trying something new.

Edit: As far as Cyrodiil goes, no....its not fun anymore. Especially for solo players.
On PS4, there are "known" solo players now running in groups...some even zerging. The same people who would talk trash about running in groups are now running in groups. At the very least, some are running duo or three mans, but I haven seen a true solo player in awhile.
Sad, but true.

SmukkeHeks · December 2019

I’m soloing Cyrodiil. Bosmer has the detection, so hunting nb is becomming somewhat fun. They clearly panic as I’m drawing them out of their crutch.

The zerg, especially that kind that just loves the tower run, just turns me off. Don’t want to give bullies what they are begging for, so I’ll just leave them to be.

My biggest issue is the loading screen, then dead. It pisses me off to the point I’m getting “the look” from the oldest of the cats. The Queen is not satisfied and neither am I.

Cyrodiil could use an overhaul. Maybe it’s time for the imperials rescue to arrive (can’t remember which daedra it is that’s supposed to end the war?). But the novelty is wearing off. None fights like the good old days...

idk · December 2019

Wing wrote: »

but I feel that just most players have grouped up at this point, whatever the reason, whenever it started, the small man groups that always hated on the zergs BECAME the zergs, and then it kind of rolled downhill, the bad zergs got bigger, the small man groups turned into a zerg, and the solo 1vX crowd turned into small man groups.

Since the day this game launched most players grouped and most of them were in large groups. Heck, Cyrodiil was designed mostly for groups. This has not changed. Nothing new.

Small to medium groups still exist. Solo players still exist. If you are a solo player you are essentially a ganker or hunt those who gank. That playstyle still exists and works for all classes.

Just look at Smukkeheks. They hunt those who gank. That is much more fun than being the ganker. (though gankers that cut off access lines do a service in hindering reinforcements)

MartiniDaniels · December 2019

When population is 1-2 bars there are ton of solo players (PC EU). When population close to pop lock game just turns into "Сircus of cheerful slaughter", amount of loading screens and lag is too big to speak of any skillful play.
As for the groups dumping ultimates at solo players... I am more concerned with some new cancer of this groups when for example 1-2-3 players are standing in open and others are sitting in stealth around... this is just stupid, but I see more and more people doing this. Not smallscale... medium and even big groups do this. ZOS needs to do something with stealth, in terms of detection in front 180 degrees. As for now even if I play in heavy or light armor, nobody can detect me unless they walk right into me in 5-8 meter radius. I guess for khajiits in medium armor that is closer to 3-5 meters..

Kadoin · December 2019

Wing wrote: »

I have only ever played solo in cyro, and on top of that avoided playing a coward class like NB or Sorc that just cloak or streak at the first sign of trouble (yes your cowards, at least own it)

pvp has had its ups and downs but feels particularly down as of late, you can blame the meta (and often it is a contributory factor)

but I feel that just most players have grouped up at this point, whatever the reason, whenever it started, the small man groups that always hated on the zergs BECAME the zergs, and then it kind of rolled downhill, the bad zergs got bigger, the small man groups turned into a zerg, and the solo 1vX crowd turned into small man groups.

and now, nobody can kill anyone really.

I watch a group of 10ish players (bigger than small man, smaller then a zerg) kite, unable to be killed and then ult dump to kill like 1-2 players (literally, im just watching at this point) and then just kind of do it again, the dead respawn and repeat, the group repeats.

if enough people to show up and numbers finally get picked off (this only happens when its a legit zerg chasing them and 1 person gets stuck out of position, and then this repeats till most are dead)

forward camp

and then it continues.

but

watching groups of really good players that are in discord coordinate their ults and dump on players to get like 1-2 kills. . .I just kind of feel like "how am I supposed to kill anyone?" if that's what it takes, then I have no chance, and even if you do kill them, forward camp.

the sheer amount of nothing back and forth that happens until a group either leaves or a faction stack occurs that has enough heals and people to just brute force keeps to the point that nothing can really stop them (other then a faction stack, at that point the server dies)

I feel so darn apathetic in cyro lately.

maybe when they get rid of CP whatever takes its place will be amazing and revitalize pvp, maybe the devs will stop neglecting it and give us cool changes, but. . .

I rather doubt it

whatever.

PC NA explains it all. There are a bunch of tryhards on that server... Don't forget the small mans of 20+

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

When population is 1-2 bars there are ton of solo players (PC EU). When population close to pop lock game just turns into "Сircus of cheerful slaughter", amount of loading screens and lag is too big to speak of any skillful play.
As for the groups dumping ultimates at solo players... I am more concerned with some new cancer of this groups when for example 1-2-3 players are standing in open and others are sitting in stealth around... this is just stupid, but I see more and more people doing this. Not smallscale... medium and even big groups do this. ZOS needs to do something with stealth, in terms of detection in front 180 degrees. As for now even if I play in heavy or light armor, nobody can detect me unless they walk right into me in 5-8 meter radius. I guess for khajiits in medium armor that is closer to 3-5 meters..

But if stealth didn't work in such a broken way, how would I gank people out of stealth on my vampire sorc with ballista?

Lord-Otto · December 2019

SmukkeHeks wrote: »

I’m soloing Cyrodiil. Bosmer has the detection, so hunting nb is becomming somewhat fun. They clearly panic as I’m drawing them out of their crutch.

The zerg, especially that kind that just loves the tower run, just turns me off. Don’t want to give bullies what they are begging for, so I’ll just leave them to be.

My biggest issue is the loading screen, then dead. It pisses me off to the point I’m getting “the look” from the oldest of the cats. The Queen is not satisfied and neither am I.

Cyrodiil could use an overhaul. Maybe it’s time for the imperials rescue to arrive (can’t remember which daedra it is that’s supposed to end the war?). But the novelty is wearing off. None fights like the good old days...

Daedra? It's Timber Septim who waltzes in and conquers Tamriel, ending the Three Banner War.

TimeDazzler · December 2019

Solo is dead mostly due to the lag. When youre playing solo fighting multiple people one mistake can get you killed and while its lagging where it takes you 2-3 seconds to cast vigor there is no point. Group play allows you to play in lag whereas solo does not, simple as that. But I still do think that groups should be limited to 12.

MartiniDaniels · December 2019

Kadoin wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

I have only ever played solo in cyro, and on top of that avoided playing a coward class like NB or Sorc that just cloak or streak at the first sign of trouble (yes your cowards, at least own it)

pvp has had its ups and downs but feels particularly down as of late, you can blame the meta (and often it is a contributory factor)

but I feel that just most players have grouped up at this point, whatever the reason, whenever it started, the small man groups that always hated on the zergs BECAME the zergs, and then it kind of rolled downhill, the bad zergs got bigger, the small man groups turned into a zerg, and the solo 1vX crowd turned into small man groups.

and now, nobody can kill anyone really.

I watch a group of 10ish players (bigger than small man, smaller then a zerg) kite, unable to be killed and then ult dump to kill like 1-2 players (literally, im just watching at this point) and then just kind of do it again, the dead respawn and repeat, the group repeats.

if enough people to show up and numbers finally get picked off (this only happens when its a legit zerg chasing them and 1 person gets stuck out of position, and then this repeats till most are dead)

forward camp

and then it continues.

but

watching groups of really good players that are in discord coordinate their ults and dump on players to get like 1-2 kills. . .I just kind of feel like "how am I supposed to kill anyone?" if that's what it takes, then I have no chance, and even if you do kill them, forward camp.

the sheer amount of nothing back and forth that happens until a group either leaves or a faction stack occurs that has enough heals and people to just brute force keeps to the point that nothing can really stop them (other then a faction stack, at that point the server dies)

I feel so darn apathetic in cyro lately.

maybe when they get rid of CP whatever takes its place will be amazing and revitalize pvp, maybe the devs will stop neglecting it and give us cool changes, but. . .

I rather doubt it

whatever.

PC NA explains it all. There are a bunch of tryhards on that server... Don't forget the small mans of 20+

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

When population is 1-2 bars there are ton of solo players (PC EU). When population close to pop lock game just turns into "Сircus of cheerful slaughter", amount of loading screens and lag is too big to speak of any skillful play.
As for the groups dumping ultimates at solo players... I am more concerned with some new cancer of this groups when for example 1-2-3 players are standing in open and others are sitting in stealth around... this is just stupid, but I see more and more people doing this. Not smallscale... medium and even big groups do this. ZOS needs to do something with stealth, in terms of detection in front 180 degrees. As for now even if I play in heavy or light armor, nobody can detect me unless they walk right into me in 5-8 meter radius. I guess for khajiits in medium armor that is closer to 3-5 meters..

But if stealth didn't work in such a broken way, how would I gank people out of stealth on my vampire sorc with ballista?

Man, it doesn't require much effort to make cheezy builds which will delete people.. I bet removal of OP stealth won't hurt them much

but such builds become boring in couple of hours.. yeah, and ballista is broken, I use it quite often and it is imo most reliable ultimate (in comparison to onslaught for example). You can dodge onslaught, but what you will do to properly buffed ballista into fear + executioner spam? or even better in no-CP - zaan -> fear -> ballista -> executioner?

Kel · December 2019

Cries wrote: »

But I still do think that groups should be limited to 12.

I see a lot of suggestions saying the same thing...but ultimately what good will that do when you have three 12-man groups just running together?

Changing group size will literally do nothing.

TimeDazzler · December 2019

I think it will. Someone who leads zergs/ball groups knows how hard it is to coordinate a single raid. Having to coordinate multiple raids will be more difficult. Some ball groups will adapt others won’t and that is where the change comes into play.

ChimpyChumpy · December 2019

I thought cyro was just meant for transmute crystal farming?

Trade keeps, run around rocks and into towers. That's about it. I played quite a bit for a week or two a couple of months ago. Now my plan is to log in and get minimum ap for crystals at the end of campaign.

technohic · December 2019

I run in a multitude of difference size groups. Usually, its a 6-8 man, with once or twice a week zerg, some times in between it might be solo-3 and thats gotten to be more rare but I do find most of it boring. The most fun I have had lately was late night this past Thursday when we were running 3 and had some good luck running around with tough fights agains some good players, and so LOL blow some people up moments, but the condition had been abnormally perfect.

See a couple of solo guys get run over and only a small few I see do decent.

ThePhantomThorn · December 2019

op.
do you think all nbs are cloakblades?

i only use cloak to heal.
and alot of magnbs run dark cloak.

but cyro is worse than it used to be.
its because of the tank meta.
players shouldnt be able to build tanky and still kill, but they can.

ChunkyCat · December 2019

Wing wrote: »

as soon as the zerg starts to crumble the cowards flee for their own lives.

it’s a video game

uc?id=1F0F6pDNKMWS9JWbzghdMs_1sv9OdaLRc

xylena · December 2019

ChunkyCat wrote: »

it’s a video game

It's okay to care about your hobbies.

There's still a handful of things solo players (or small groups) bring to the table in Cyro large scale, more effectively than large groups. Siege operation, siege burning, dropping FCs, burning enemy FCs, ganking doors or breaches, stealth repairing breaches, scouting back keeps, troll sieging enemy keeps. Unfortunately, actually fighting other players is usually futile as a solo. It hasn't always felt this bad.

ZOS_FalcoYamaoka · December 2019

Greetings,

Some posts have been removed as they violated our community rules around baiting. Please refer to our community rules when posting discussions.

Lord-Otto · December 2019

@ZOS_FelipeF
The very first original post includes the same kind of baiting which the deleted posts had. And some of OP's following posts do, as well. I mean this in a very respectful way: Your reasoning is a bit selective here. No big deal, though.

Fur_like_snow · December 2019

Reduce group size then limit cross healing to only within group. Cap max health at 30k. Reduce the base healing of magicka skills or reintroduce major defile back into spammables.

Lord-Otto · December 2019

Fur_like_snow wrote: »

Reduce group size then limit cross healing to only within group. Cap max health at 30k. Reduce the base healing of magicka skills or reintroduce major defile back into spammables.

And Vigor remains untouched?
xD
Defiles were made rare for good reasons. If you re-introduce them now, ball groups will just purge them. But you, the single player, will be constantly defiled with no chance of getting rid of it.

Fur_like_snow · December 2019

Vigor is already in a weird place. If I wanna play solo there is only one obvious morph. If I wanna do group stuff the other morph is the only chose. But without an easy way to swap between them it’s just a headache.

And yes, the upcoming nerf to healing should mostly be directed towards magicka skills.

I’m fine with other players using defile against me that is to be expected.

While we are at it. Remove major expedition from RaT magicka guys in light armor shouldn’t be out pacing someone in medium.

Lord-Otto · December 2019

Fur_like_snow wrote: »

Vigor is already in a weird place. If I wanna play solo there is only one obvious morph. If I wanna do group stuff the other morph is the only chose. But without an easy way to swap between them it’s just a headache.

And yes, the upcoming nerf to healing should mostly be directed towards magicka skills.

I’m fine with other players using defile against me that is to be expected.

While we are at it. Remove major expedition from RaT magicka guys in light armor shouldn’t be out pacing someone in medium.

I disagree. Let's leave it at that.
(^_^)'

NBrookus · December 2019

Fur_like_snow wrote: »

While we are at it. Remove major expedition from RaT magicka guys in light armor shouldn’t be out pacing someone in medium.

*group adds rapids monkey if they didn't already have one*
*solo magicka players screwed*
*medium armor players still get zerged*

Cirantille · December 2019

Do you call Wardens cowards with their betties, why they dont sustain like the rest of us?
Do you call Dragon Knights cowards with their wings, because they dont stand like the wingless folks like us?
Do you call Templars cowards, because they dont stand the negative effects without purifying like the rest of us?
Do you call Necros cowards, wait... why aren't they even in Cyrodiil, I have kill 20 necro quest to complete!!!

Imagine blaming classes for using their own abilities

.................................

Fur_like_snow · December 2019

NBrookus wrote: »

Fur_like_snow wrote: »

While we are at it. Remove major expedition from RaT magicka guys in light armor shouldn’t be out pacing someone in medium.

*group adds rapids monkey if they didn't already have one*
*solo magicka players screwed*
*medium armor players still get zerged*

And how is any different than previous patches? I don’t mind magicka guys having access to snare removal but the major expedition on top of snare removal and minor force is to much. If I wind up a D swing and a magicka guy hits RaT and moves outta my range just by moving in a straight line is ridiculous.

khajiitNPC · December 2019

I’m not sure I follow your question? Outside of 1vXing noobs/potatoes has it ever thrived? (Not counting when proc sets could crit).

Solo PvP has always been niche, and you’ll still get lucky and find some uncoordinated group to bang on.

But there’s also the fact the game has been out of a long time and a lot of those noobs have gotten relatively better, and Cyrodiil is more geared to group play. Not to mention the amount of healing and heavy armor.

Yes I realize solo players can solo there and some do so exceptionally well. But if you’re just looking for solo play why not just go duel? Or better yet I find the easiest way to 1vX is typically BG (if not going up against premades).