is solo play dead? does cyro just suck?

Wing

Cirantille wrote: »

Do you call Wardens cowards with their betties, why they dont sustain like the rest of us?
Do you call Dragon Knights cowards with their wings, because they dont stand like the wingless folks like us?
Do you call Templars cowards, because they dont stand the negative effects without purifying like the rest of us?
Do you call Necros cowards, wait... why aren't they even in Cyrodiil, I have kill 20 necro quest to complete!!!

Imagine blaming classes for using their own abilities

.................................

you mistake me.

sorc meta has literally been hiding behind pets and streaking away at the first sign of trouble, this is by nature, a very cowardly thing to do. I don't care how effective it is or its what the class does, it is what it is.

NB is obvious, cloak, as soon as the get attacked or pressured they cloak and flee, the cloak spam is real. many NB will spam cloak during fights every other skill. this is once again by nature a cowardly skill, it is what it is, and its silly to pretend otherwise.

a stam warden having burst is not cowardly, a DK using wings to reduce ranged damage (those that even still do, that was a bad example on your part, as DK is the predominant fight or die class) and a templar using its cleanse is not cowardly. you had no example for necro, and other then ult harmony grave there really is nothing necro does so. . .

i would say warden is on the cusp but that more its playstyle and less an ability, and it actually has a decent built in major expedition that is most likely going to be on bar, it wants to kite and combo, that's kind of just its thing, but even then it does this without a streak, pets, or invisibility, and the combo itself has a timing skill gap.

the rest (necro, DK, temp) have no good expedition built in class, no streak, no invisibility. you will see them, you will see them coming, moving, attacking, healing. you will have time to fight, time to block, time to move, time to try and counter.

NB and Sorc predominantly don't want that, they want no actual pvp interaction, and flee at the first sign of it, its in their nature. i can understand people wanting that or seeking it out, but don't pretend its some noble or honorable thing, if your going to play like a coward, fight like a coward, run like a coward, then just own it.

ThePhantomThorn

Wing wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

Do you call Wardens cowards with their betties, why they dont sustain like the rest of us?
Do you call Dragon Knights cowards with their wings, because they dont stand like the wingless folks like us?
Do you call Templars cowards, because they dont stand the negative effects without purifying like the rest of us?
Do you call Necros cowards, wait... why aren't they even in Cyrodiil, I have kill 20 necro quest to complete!!!

Imagine blaming classes for using their own abilities

.................................

you mistake me.

sorc meta has literally been hiding behind pets and streaking away at the first sign of trouble, this is by nature, a very cowardly thing to do. I don't care how effective it is or its what the class does, it is what it is.

NB is obvious, cloak, as soon as the get attacked or pressured they cloak and flee, the cloak spam is real. many NB will spam cloak during fights every other skill. this is once again by nature a cowardly skill, it is what it is, and its silly to pretend otherwise.

a stam warden having burst is not cowardly, a DK using wings to reduce ranged damage (those that even still do, that was a bad example on your part, as DK is the predominant fight or die class) and a templar using its cleanse is not cowardly. you had no example for necro, and other then ult harmony grave there really is nothing necro does so. . .

i would say warden is on the cusp but that more its playstyle and less an ability, and it actually has a decent built in major expedition that is most likely going to be on bar, it wants to kite and combo, that's kind of just its thing, but even then it does this without a streak, pets, or invisibility, and the combo itself has a timing skill gap.

the rest (necro, DK, temp) have no good expedition built in class, no streak, no invisibility. you will see them, you will see them coming, moving, attacking, healing. you will have time to fight, time to block, time to move, time to try and counter.

NB and Sorc predominantly don't want that, they want no actual pvp interaction, and flee at the first sign of it, its in their nature. i can understand people wanting that or seeking it out, but don't pretend its some noble or honorable thing, if your going to play like a coward, fight like a coward, run like a coward, then just own it.

ok again lumping all nbs into cloak blades and all sorcs into streakers.
how about you go fight a good nb, or fight a magblade. see how much they cloak. and a few little points.
similar skill on other classes.
dk - fragmented shield. major mending. major mending.
templar - extended ritual. 5 dot purge. strong hot in huge area
warden - netch. free purge. forest ult. permafrost. vines.
necro - goliath ult.

but hate on other classes you have never played for using there only defensive skills.

Cirantille

Wing wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

Do you call Wardens cowards with their betties, why they dont sustain like the rest of us?
Do you call Dragon Knights cowards with their wings, because they dont stand like the wingless folks like us?
Do you call Templars cowards, because they dont stand the negative effects without purifying like the rest of us?
Do you call Necros cowards, wait... why aren't they even in Cyrodiil, I have kill 20 necro quest to complete!!!

Imagine blaming classes for using their own abilities

.................................

you mistake me.

sorc meta has literally been hiding behind pets and streaking away at the first sign of trouble, this is by nature, a very cowardly thing to do. I don't care how effective it is or its what the class does, it is what it is.

NB is obvious, cloak, as soon as the get attacked or pressured they cloak and flee, the cloak spam is real. many NB will spam cloak during fights every other skill. this is once again by nature a cowardly skill, it is what it is, and its silly to pretend otherwise.

a stam warden having burst is not cowardly, a DK using wings to reduce ranged damage (those that even still do, that was a bad example on your part, as DK is the predominant fight or die class) and a templar using its cleanse is not cowardly. you had no example for necro, and other then ult harmony grave there really is nothing necro does so. . .

i would say warden is on the cusp but that more its playstyle and less an ability, and it actually has a decent built in major expedition that is most likely going to be on bar, it wants to kite and combo, that's kind of just its thing, but even then it does this without a streak, pets, or invisibility, and the combo itself has a timing skill gap.

the rest (necro, DK, temp) have no good expedition built in class, no streak, no invisibility. you will see them, you will see them coming, moving, attacking, healing. you will have time to fight, time to block, time to move, time to try and counter.

NB and Sorc predominantly don't want that, they want no actual pvp interaction, and flee at the first sign of it, its in their nature. i can understand people wanting that or seeking it out, but don't pretend its some noble or honorable thing, if your going to play like a coward, fight like a coward, run like a coward, then just own it.

I wrote this in another thread as well but not every class has the same play style.
And roaring and running at an enemy player =/= strength, courage, intelligence whatever etc

Looking at NB s they are assassins, they are supposed to be sneaky fellas. Their skill lines designed for it. Plus the pitiest thing about this class is they lack burst heal. So it is their only defense.

Looking at magsorc, again if they don't slot two bars matriarch which has the easy demise in pvp area, their heals are not strong. Power surge heals when critically hit in a zone where everyone wears impenetrable armour and dark deal is clunky. (Will tell later on why). So yes they are supposed to be at range to survive.

Also they are both very killable. Here is how:

For NB - Detect pot -> dead

I don't know who wouldn't carry detect pots in cyrodiil. I always have invisibility + detect pots. They are not just useful for NBs but also other classes. I caught dks and templars with it heheh.


For Sorc - Stun - Stun - Stun (usually dont even need the third but) - Out of stamina - Cant sprint, cant break free, cant roll-dodge, cant dark deal, running out of magicka as well - dead

I think variety is cool, I especially like the feeling of catching a NB crouching and still trying to cloak even though they are revealed :P

Jk aside. People tend to hate every skill that they couldn't break down so far and try to insult those. But the best you can do is to find a quick counter for every class/skill.

Try playing their classes, you understand their weaknesses/strengths better that way

iLeftyy

Wing wrote: »

I have only ever played solo in cyro, and on top of that avoided playing a coward class like NB or Sorc that just cloak or streak at the first sign of trouble (yes your cowards, at least own it)

pvp has had its ups and downs but feels particularly down as of late, you can blame the meta (and often it is a contributory factor)

but I feel that just most players have grouped up at this point, whatever the reason, whenever it started, the small man groups that always hated on the zergs BECAME the zergs, and then it kind of rolled downhill, the bad zergs got bigger, the small man groups turned into a zerg, and the solo 1vX crowd turned into small man groups.

and now, nobody can kill anyone really.

I watch a group of 10ish players (bigger than small man, smaller then a zerg) kite, unable to be killed and then ult dump to kill like 1-2 players (literally, im just watching at this point) and then just kind of do it again, the dead respawn and repeat, the group repeats.

if enough people to show up and numbers finally get picked off (this only happens when its a legit zerg chasing them and 1 person gets stuck out of position, and then this repeats till most are dead)

forward camp

and then it continues.

but

watching groups of really good players that are in discord coordinate their ults and dump on players to get like 1-2 kills. . .I just kind of feel like "how am I supposed to kill anyone?" if that's what it takes, then I have no chance, and even if you do kill them, forward camp.

the sheer amount of nothing back and forth that happens until a group either leaves or a faction stack occurs that has enough heals and people to just brute force keeps to the point that nothing can really stop them (other then a faction stack, at that point the server dies)

I feel so darn apathetic in cyro lately.

maybe when they get rid of CP whatever takes its place will be amazing and revitalize pvp, maybe the devs will stop neglecting it and give us cool changes, but. . .

I rather doubt it

whatever.

Cyro has been like this for a bit now and honestly I’ve come to accept it. It makes sense not to pay attention to solo players because there are so little of them. That’s why I stick to bgs. Cp is bad for the game and people actually die inside bgs

Iskiab

I usually play large group and tried soloing with some alts to learn the class. It was a good exercise, but no idea why someone would play solo a lot.

Basicly Id take a resource or town and wait to see who shows up. If it was any more than two players I was toast, and there were lots of small groups running around.

CompM4s

There are some solo players still, but its better to run at least 2-4 especially if you plan on kiting zergs.

Trancestor

You said it yourself, majority of cyrodil now are cowardly sorcs that streak away as soon as you look at them but then come back streaking at you with that undodgeable unblockable stun when their friends come, cloak spamming rollerblades and magplar healbots that don't need to do anything but block cast BoL and keep everyone alive, that and the worse than ever lag and fps drops. It's masochism except you don't enjoy it, but i still do it once a week or so after i watch some video or stream and tell myself it would be better this time. It never is.

Waffennacht

BGs>Cyrodiil

Cathexis

@Wing in essence that's the problem with regard to groups for sure. I jumped on cyro once recently, went to stop a scroll push and just mathematically it was impossible to counter because the decay rate of both zergs was like 1 player per 1-2 minutes. Both sides were getting reinforcement and resurections faster than it was possible to defeat opposition. Yes it's true, cyro exists that way, and I'm sure someone is pooping a brick in lurk mode ready to play their l2p forum token, but with competition being redundant, there's no real reason to show up.

Cathexis

khajiitNPC wrote: »

I’m not sure I follow your question? Outside of 1vXing noobs/potatoes has it ever thrived? (Not counting when proc sets could crit).

Solo PvP has always been niche, and you’ll still get lucky and find some uncoordinated group to bang on.

But there’s also the fact the game has been out of a long time and a lot of those noobs have gotten relatively better, and Cyrodiil is more geared to group play. Not to mention the amount of healing and heavy armor.

Yes I realize solo players can solo there and some do so exceptionally well. But if you’re just looking for solo play why not just go duel? Or better yet I find the easiest way to 1vX is typically BG (if not going up against premades).

I think the appeal of 1vX was prime in the dark ages. The faction caps were three times as high and strategic active engagement was the deciding factor. Forward camps were also wayshrines for bloodports. Although I think a component of tankierness came along with the advancement of player comprehension, potato status meant nothing, you could drop players with a purple weapon and be underlevelled because it had more to do with playing it right.

technohic

I played my sNB seriously for the first time in ages yesterday and I can say you have to cloak and shade away. They are not as good of brawlers as the others, and outside of snipers who really are the cowards, you're in melee. Its obnoxious but that's what they have, and in the same token, it would be broken if they were as good at brawling and still could cloak and shade.

Sorcs? Well it's their tool to kite. Devs just happened to overload it. I did run from a fight the other day on my stamplar where I wound up the last 1 left of my group. There were 4 or 5 and i had no idea when it became just the mag sorc chasing me until i got from Vlastrus up to right between Brindle and Nickel and a buddy was to the side. When he said "Just the mag sorc" i stopped and turned around and started fighting. We killed him and i did laugh that i made a sorc chase me half across the map for a change.

Iskiab

technohic wrote: »

I played my sNB seriously for the first time in ages yesterday and I can say you have to cloak and shade away. They are not as good of brawlers as the others, and outside of snipers who really are the cowards, you're in melee. Its obnoxious but that's what they have, and in the same token, it would be broken if they were as good at brawling and still could cloak and shade.

Sorcs? Well it's their tool to kite. Devs just happened to overload it. I did run from a fight the other day on my stamplar where I wound up the last 1 left of my group. There were 4 or 5 and i had no idea when it became just the mag sorc chasing me until i got from Vlastrus up to right between Brindle and Nickel and a buddy was to the side. When he said "Just the mag sorc" i stopped and turned around and started fighting. We killed him and i did laugh that i made a sorc chase me half across the map for a change.

You’re lucky. Sorcs were my bane as a magplar.

Streak is overloaded as heck, they could keep me at range and streak through me to stun me for their buddies.

I think streak is still one of the cheapest stuns, and great defense too. It’s no wonder most solo players are Magsorcs.

Langeston

@Wing:
"Anyone who plays the squishiest class in the game with no burst heal and below average damage is a coward if they use the only real defensive skill available to them."

That's a real galaxy-brain take there, guy. How about you actually try playing the weakest class before insulting the people that do play it? Otherwise you just come across as ignorant.

Let's try something: take your burst heals & class damage shields off your bars while only using single-target abilities. While you're at it, only use purple or worse tiered gear so as to mimic how much weaker NB skills are right now. (Don't worry, your skills are still stronger because ZOS hasn't stripped out all of their buffs & debuffs.) Congratulations: you now know what it's like to hit like a glass-noodle. Now try playing like that for a while & post some videos — I'd love to see how well it works out for you.

FYI: playing a tanky AF class that can outheal pretty much any damage that happens to get through your high resists/shields, while also being able to put out insane damage is not as "brave" as you seem to think it is.

Pauls

Troll thread and/or smug *** attention seeker

Cathexis

Langeston wrote: »

FYI: playing a tanky AF class that can outheal pretty much any damage that happens to get through your high resists/shields, while also being able to put out insane damage is not as "brave" as you seem to think it is.

This is a perspective I definitely have to agree with, I think there are lot of players who preference melee builds and that is why the play style meta slants so heavily towards it, and why build diversity has diminished in some regard and combat has flattened over time.

technohic

Iskiab wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

I played my sNB seriously for the first time in ages yesterday and I can say you have to cloak and shade away. They are not as good of brawlers as the others, and outside of snipers who really are the cowards, you're in melee. Its obnoxious but that's what they have, and in the same token, it would be broken if they were as good at brawling and still could cloak and shade.

Sorcs? Well it's their tool to kite. Devs just happened to overload it. I did run from a fight the other day on my stamplar where I wound up the last 1 left of my group. There were 4 or 5 and i had no idea when it became just the mag sorc chasing me until i got from Vlastrus up to right between Brindle and Nickel and a buddy was to the side. When he said "Just the mag sorc" i stopped and turned around and started fighting. We killed him and i did laugh that i made a sorc chase me half across the map for a change.

You’re lucky. Sorcs were my bane as a magplar.

Streak is overloaded as heck, they could keep me at range and streak through me to stun me for their buddies.

I think streak is still one of the cheapest stuns, and great defense too. It’s no wonder most solo players are Magsorcs.

Have fought this sorc before. Full pet sorc and has not been much of a threat, but you get to him, get him low, and he streaks, heals to full, refreshes shields and starts over. Have to purposely eat the first one when you know its coming, so then you have break free and the immunity from that, to close and start beating on him again, then pop a potion when it wears out. A better sorc with more damage though? You cant eat that first streak usually. Or if they are at a disadvantage, they take 2 streaks and reset.

Spartabunny08

Coward class lmao. You don't like getting your kills shutdown is all that is. Too many counters to stealth. You may or may not have a zerg, but most of the time most NB won't make it through a zerg. Mine will, you see I don't play in zerg, 2 to 3 and turn around and run over by a zerg. Even on my tanks and everything else but a NB 2 to 3 players are not gonna stand against 50 players. So I made a medium armor tank stamblade with the speed of light. Coward no, alive yep. 1 or 3 against 50 not happening. My stamblade on the hand will make them look stupid lol. You should really get off your high horse, if wasn't for blue screens constantly I'd love to be in there laughing my ass off.

Spartabunny08

Fur_like_snow wrote: »

Reduce group size then limit cross healing to only within group. Cap max health at 30k. Reduce the base healing of magicka skills or reintroduce major defile back into spammables.

I would delete the game if they did this.

Parasaurolophus

I think we have only one problem - eye of the storm and permafrost.

Fur_like_snow

Spartabunny08 wrote: »

Fur_like_snow wrote: »

Reduce group size then limit cross healing to only within group. Cap max health at 30k. Reduce the base healing of magicka skills or reintroduce major defile back into spammables.

I would delete the game if they did this.

What part of that is a deal breaker for you?

fred4

Langeston wrote: »

FYI: playing a tanky AF class that can outheal pretty much any damage that happens to get through your high resists/shields, while also being able to put out insane damage is not as "brave" as you seem to think it is.

Couldn't agree more. I main a perma-cloaking (when she wants to) magblade, one of the classes Wing is hating on. It's the character I had to make the most compromises for. Magplar sustain and damage, for example, is through the roof by comparison.

What works best and is most fun for me, on magblade, is a squishy build with good sustain - including stamina sustain - and half-decent damage. There is no room to get the tankiness you'd need for a more standup playstyle in my build, nor do I see that as the point of playing magblade. Shadowy Disguise and Shadow Image are the two skills that define the unique playstyle I'm interested in when playing that class.

If and when you cloak away is a matter of judgment, but it's absolutely necessary throughout the fight, because it's all you have (or Shadow Image). If you have much of an issue with that, you really haven't learnt how to counter NBs or you're being obstinate. As a melee magblade, templars are particularly dangerous to me, but any character with a detection potion is. There are multitude of other methods, but detection potions are the worst. BTW not complaining: Detect + Immov is my own default potion.

The offensive window on magblade - mine at least - is extremely short. If I don't anticipate your counter and, ideally, cloak (or shade) away just before it, I'm dead. There is no room for error. I play a variety of other classes from time to time. Among those my DK sits at the other end of the spectrum. It's just a standard Fury, Seventh Legion, Blood Spawn build. You can play that build like a bumbling idiot, which I am, since I don't play her very often. Her tankiness against two, three ... five half-decent players is ridiculous. You can't beat her down. At the same time it's Fury. You do kill people with that setup.

I'd hesitate to say which build requires more skill, but the DK is certainly more forgiving. If you don't have ultra-fast reactions and you don't understand the limits of the nightblade outside of cloak, you'll die much more easily on that class. Then again, of course I find it the better class for solo play. Can it be played cowardly? Sure, but there is a fine line between being a coward and knowing your limitations.

Iskiab

fred4 wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

FYI: playing a tanky AF class that can outheal pretty much any damage that happens to get through your high resists/shields, while also being able to put out insane damage is not as "brave" as you seem to think it is.

Couldn't agree more. I main a perma-cloaking (when she wants to) magblade, one of the classes Wing is hating on. It's the character I had to make the most compromises for. Magplar sustain and damage, for example, is through the roof by comparison.

What works best and is most fun for me, on magblade, is a squishy build with good sustain - including stamina sustain - and half-decent damage. There is no room to get the tankiness you'd need for a more standup playstyle in my build, nor do I see that as the point of playing magblade. Shadowy Disguise and Shadow Image are the two skills that define the unique playstyle I'm interested in when playing that class.

If and when you cloak away is a matter of judgment, but it's absolutely necessary throughout the fight, because it's all you have (or Shadow Image). If you have much of an issue with that, you really haven't learnt how to counter NBs or you're being obstinate. As a melee magblade, templars are particularly dangerous to me, but any character with a detection potion is. There are multitude of other methods, but detection potions are the worst. BTW not complaining: Detect + Immov is my own default potion.

The offensive window on magblade - mine at least - is extremely short. If I don't anticipate your counter and, ideally, cloak (or shade) away just before it, I'm dead. There is no room for error. I play a variety of other classes from time to time. Among those my DK sits at the other end of the spectrum. It's just a standard Fury, Seventh Legion, Blood Spawn build. You can play that build like a bumbling idiot, which I am, since I don't play her very often. Her tankiness against two, three ... five half-decent players is ridiculous. You can't beat her down. At the same time it's Fury. You do kill people with that setup.

I'd hesitate to say which build requires more skill, but the DK is certainly more forgiving. If you don't have ultra-fast reactions and you don't understand the limits of the nightblade outside of cloak, you'll die much more easily on that class. Then again, of course I find it the better class for solo play. Can it be played cowardly? Sure, but there is a fine line between being a coward and knowing your limitations.

So true. A big mistake a lot of players make is they only try to not die.

That’s where BGs come in handy, dying doesn’t really matter much so you can test your limitations. You’ll never learn unless you push so you can find out your limit.

Wing

Lord-Otto wrote: »

@ZOS_FelipeF
The very first original post includes the same kind of baiting which the deleted posts had. And some of OP's following posts do, as well. I mean this in a very respectful way: Your reasoning is a bit selective here. No big deal, though.

you know what I do agree with that, I will self mod my original and leave a note that I did it, I was trolling NB's and Sorcs (I always will) but yeah not sure why that was changed.

Wing

Iskiab wrote: »

So true. A big mistake a lot of players make is they only try to not die.

That’s where BGs come in handy, dying doesn’t really matter much so you can test your limitations. You’ll never learn unless you push so you can find out your limit.

its just much more easy to not die then it is to kill people, especially with so many heals just going through walls and being thrown around with no effort required.

you can spec for 7k+ wpn damage and what is functionally infinite pen on ults, and STILL not get kills, because if they have a second to recover they are back to full.

so why not just slot tank and sustain and just never die while keeping those around you alive as well, much more easy.

Lord-Otto

Wing wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

@ZOS_FelipeF
The very first original post includes the same kind of baiting which the deleted posts had. And some of OP's following posts do, as well. I mean this in a very respectful way: Your reasoning is a bit selective here. No big deal, though.

you know what I do agree with that, I will self mod my original and leave a note that I did it, I was trolling NB's and Sorcs (I always will) but yeah not sure why that was changed.

Huh. That is actually incredibly fair. Without the deleted part, your original post carries a lot more weight and I can't help but... agree.

Spartabunny08

Spartabunny08 wrote: »

Fur_like_snow wrote: »

Reduce group size then limit cross healing to only within group. Cap max health at 30k. Reduce the base healing of magicka skills or reintroduce major defile back into spammables.

I would delete the game if they did this.

All of it. Play as you want dies based on this concept.

Langeston

fred4 wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

FYI: playing a tanky AF class that can outheal pretty much any damage that happens to get through your high resists/shields, while also being able to put out insane damage is not as "brave" as you seem to think it is.

Couldn't agree more. I main a perma-cloaking (when she wants to) magblade, one of the classes Wing is hating on. It's the character I had to make the most compromises for. Magplar sustain and damage, for example, is through the roof by comparison.

What works best and is most fun for me, on magblade, is a squishy build with good sustain - including stamina sustain - and half-decent damage. There is no room to get the tankiness you'd need for a more standup playstyle in my build, nor do I see that as the point of playing magblade. Shadowy Disguise and Shadow Image are the two skills that define the unique playstyle I'm interested in when playing that class.

If and when you cloak away is a matter of judgment, but it's absolutely necessary throughout the fight, because it's all you have (or Shadow Image). If you have much of an issue with that, you really haven't learnt how to counter NBs or you're being obstinate. As a melee magblade, templars are particularly dangerous to me, but any character with a detection potion is. There are multitude of other methods, but detection potions are the worst. BTW not complaining: Detect + Immov is my own default potion.

The offensive window on magblade - mine at least - is extremely short. If I don't anticipate your counter and, ideally, cloak (or shade) away just before it, I'm dead. There is no room for error. I play a variety of other classes from time to time. Among those my DK sits at the other end of the spectrum. It's just a standard Fury, Seventh Legion, Blood Spawn build. You can play that build like a bumbling idiot, which I am, since I don't play her very often. Her tankiness against two, three ... five half-decent players is ridiculous. You can't beat her down. At the same time it's Fury. You do kill people with that setup.

I'd hesitate to say which build requires more skill, but the DK is certainly more forgiving. If you don't have ultra-fast reactions and you don't understand the limits of the nightblade outside of cloak, you'll die much more easily on that class. Then again, of course I find it the better class for solo play. Can it be played cowardly? Sure, but there is a fine line between being a coward and knowing your limitations.

Couldn't agree more, especially re: the small window of opportunity with regard to securing a kill. That, paired with the weaknesses inherent to the NB toolkit is a frustrating combination & it makes the class very challenging indeed.

Dojohoda

Yes, for all the reasons stated, a small scale group might be a better plan this patch or join in on skirmishes as an un-grouped player. Like you said, it is much harder to kill in this patch.

RedGirl41

I’ve been playing everyday since day one, have three 5 stars all from “solo/ xing “ game play but recently I can barely pvp. Obviously people generally get better so it will get harder but even in a 1v2 or 1v1 it gets harder to kill them.

On ps4 NA everyone is a tank. Dk tank, Templar tank, warden aids. You get ulti dumped instantly, heal debuffed and just killed all while you do 3-4K damage to them. Ps4 has actual 10 man groups of all stam dks with healers just running around 10v1ing people.

Personally I can’t let go of the old school mind set of open world and I don’t get why people 10v1 then act like they gods.

Cyrodiil is terrible cuz everyone is a tank. Point blank. Nobody wants to die because they want their next free 6k so o tic at a castle. If they never die they never have to miss ap that u hand out.

Don’t even get me started in siege too. 9k oils ticks, 10k meat bags plus the healing defile (more than major? ) tanks just sieging you to death from inside of a keep. The zone is player vs player and nobody wants to fight unless it’s 10v1. Zos encourages Zergs hates solo/small scale players. Bgs is a joke that’s just filled with non cp proc builds to compensate for the fact that they don’t have cp. plus they all bomb in there anyway.

Also everyone just roll dodges everything. One roll dodge and 4+ abilities miss. That’s crazy

This year of pvp is just getting worse and worse. Everyone is a tank.

Gatdangmayne

Solo is definitely on life support. I roll solo like always, tho I do zerg surf sometimes and end up in plenty of different sizes fights.

It's rare to find anyone you can actually 1vX. Most that are that bad, are in huge groups. And even if it's 1v2, one terrible player and one healbot - yeah good luck. And 60%+ of cyro is or can function as a healbot.

The only thing close that happens is if you have another good player or two and the stars align you might kill idk, 5? Before getting zerged or sieged.

There's been many times I literally run somewhere solo, and 5+ ppl start countersieging me as I ya know, don't siege at all.

Idk what the fix is (burn it down n try again), but add the abysmal performance of cyro and the general toxicity of the eso pvp community...and yeah it's not nearly as fun.

Also, side note, I agree both permacloakers, streakers, and people sneaking in heavy armor or whatever is a bit dumb.

I can sneak on my heavy armor vamp stamplar literally right after getting dotted up and spammed at.

However, there are counters to those 3 things.

Only things I can honestly say 100% need some fix-

Vamp drain. Seriously, *** this skill and everyone who spams it.

Snipe, kind of. Usually its trash, fix the desync tho.

Also also, my dark cloak blade in light armor has the same survivability as my stam toons in heavy - with higher single target dmg, and still strong aoe dmg.

Nightblades are not weak. Most nightblade players are.