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Werewolf Heal is OVERBUFFED.
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Dracane✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The problem is not with those 60k health Werewolves. The problem is, that you can still have 25k heals with a normally functioning build of 30k health. Werewolf has insane damage on its own and with 30k health, you will still have enormous offense.
Werewolf really didn't need more survival. 10k resistances is strong enough.
Scrubos can`t do the math that 61k health ( 44k heals ) : /2 is equal to 30k health with 22k Heals NONE CRIT,
and I can easily swap Ironblood for Shacklebreaker and rip arses and still get 20k+ heals.
Not sure how your reach those numbers. But 30k health would result in a 15k non crit heal in pvp, thus roughly 23k crit heal. It depends on your CP and I won't assume anyone's CP at this point or armor type/sets.
I'd say, my math is quite correct.Auri-El is my lord,
Trinimac my ward,
and Magnus my mind.0 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The problem is not with those 60k health Werewolves. The problem is, that you can still have 25k heals with a normally functioning build of 30k health. Werewolf has insane damage on its own and with 30k health, you will still have enormous offense.
Werewolf really didn't need more survival. 10k resistances is strong enough.
Scrubos can`t do the math that 61k health ( 44k heals ) : /2 is equal to 30k health with 22k Heals NONE CRIT,
and I can easily swap Ironblood for Shacklebreaker and rip arses and still get 20k+ heals.
Not sure how your reach those numbers. But 30k health would result in a 15k non crit heal in pvp, thus roughly 23k crit heal. It depends on your CP and I won't assume anyone's CP at this point or armor type/sets.
I'd say, my math is quite correct.
His English is Rocky.
I think it's:
His health is 61k
The Tooltip is 93% of health, which is 56,730
In PvP that's 28,365, non crit.
I think he is saying 44k heal is crit.
"2 is equal to 30k health with 22k heals none crit" I think means just 2 casts will get ya 50k health without crits.0 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »DuskMarine wrote: »Werewolves...…
Oh boy , where do I begin... You know what? I wont even begin to talk , its just pointless.
In 2 sentences : No one should be able to have 40k+ NONE CRIT Burst Heal (IN PVP) I know this is a Pure Tanking setup, however as a tank you need to mitigate damage and have decent healing , but this s**t right here is healing like 3 templars on steroids.
The setup for the demonstration is Chudan+PlagueDoctor+ Ironblood , if I replace the the Ironblood with Sanctuary or the set that gives Major Mending on heavy attacks, I can easily boost my heals to 50k (none crits) at the loss of mitigation.
ZOS PLEASE GET YOUR STS TOGETHER AND REVERT THE CHANGES TO THE HEAL, THIS IS COMPLETELY UNBALANCED AND BROKEN.
VIDEO:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnLIzflSwNE&feature=youtu.be
it was never buffed its been this powerful for the longest time. the bad thing is they have so much into this heal that their damage and survivability is crap. stun them and rip. werewolves still are the easiest thing to fight in the game.
Like, that first half is speaking metaphorically right?
Because before it scaled to Max mag and spell damage, while now it scales to Max health.
Hircine's Rage on live is 60% stronger than breath of life (it's basically the best burst heal in the game), but you have to use Pelinial to really benefit from it.2 -
SquareSausage✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »The problem is not with those 60k health Werewolves. The problem is, that you can still have 25k heals with a normally functioning build of 30k health. Werewolf has insane damage on its own and with 30k health, you will still have enormous offense.
Werewolf really didn't need more survival. 10k resistances is strong enough.
Scrubos can`t do the math that 61k health ( 44k heals ) : /2 is equal to 30k health with 22k Heals NONE CRIT,
and I can easily swap Ironblood for Shacklebreaker and rip arses and still get 20k+ heals.
Not sure how your reach those numbers. But 30k health would result in a 15k non crit heal in pvp, thus roughly 23k crit heal. It depends on your CP and I won't assume anyone's CP at this point or armor type/sets.
I'd say, my math is quite correct.
His English is Rocky.
I think it's:
His health is 61k
The Tooltip is 93% of health, which is 56,730
In PvP that's 28,365, non crit.
I think he is saying 44k heal is crit.
"2 is equal to 30k health with 22k heals none crit" I think means just 2 casts will get ya 50k health without crits.
Does the tooltip say 93% of health on base or is that with Blessed CP passive added on?
If its base it could quite easily be 40k non crit with CP passives in blessed and quick recovery he could have effectively over 100% heal. Half that for PvP then 40k seems very doable.
Even more if getting major vitality from a lingering health pot.Edited by SquareSausage on August 12, 2018 8:43AMBreakfast KingPS4 EU0 -
RouDeR✭✭✭✭✭
✭Waffennacht wrote: »The problem is not with those 60k health Werewolves. The problem is, that you can still have 25k heals with a normally functioning build of 30k health. Werewolf has insane damage on its own and with 30k health, you will still have enormous offense.
Werewolf really didn't need more survival. 10k resistances is strong enough.
Scrubos can`t do the math that 61k health ( 44k heals ) : /2 is equal to 30k health with 22k Heals NONE CRIT,
and I can easily swap Ironblood for Shacklebreaker and rip arses and still get 20k+ heals.
Not sure how your reach those numbers. But 30k health would result in a 15k non crit heal in pvp, thus roughly 23k crit heal. It depends on your CP and I won't assume anyone's CP at this point or armor type/sets.
I'd say, my math is quite correct.
His English is Rocky.
I think it's:
His health is 61k
The Tooltip is 93% of health, which is 56,730
In PvP that's 28,365, non crit.
I think he is saying 44k heal is crit.
"2 is equal to 30k health with 22k heals none crit" I think means just 2 casts will get ya 50k health without crits.
Take a look at the screenshot or the video .
44k is the none crit heal,
Argonian+ Heavy armor + some points in the Healing recieve CP do the magick trick.1 -
TheUndeadAmulet✭✭✭✭✭What seems crazy to me is that people seem to think that a werewolf, that is purpose built for tanking, that can heal a lot in CP Cyrodiil, is op. It's like people completely forgot about Defile and befoul like they don't exist.
Really though, all that build is gonna do is just annoy people, and maybe give them a little tickle, not kill them.
Oh! And I forgot to mention this amazing skill that deals massive poison damage from long range that also defiles, that would pretty much nullify any werewolf if they don't kill 'em quick enough.
LETHAL ARROWXBOX NA 1000+ CP
PC NA 400+ CP
nerf ping please2 -
RouDeR✭✭✭✭✭
✭TheUndeadAmulet wrote: »What seems crazy to me is that people seem to think that a werewolf, that is purpose built for tanking, that can heal a lot in CP Cyrodiil, is op. It's like people completely forgot about Defile and befoul like they don't exist.
Really though, all that build is gonna do is just annoy people, and maybe give them a little tickle, not kill them.
Oh! And I forgot to mention this amazing skill that deals massive poison damage from long range that also defiles, that would pretty much nullify any werewolf if they don't kill 'em quick enough.
LETHAL ARROW
Dude , i will give you an example :
This is one of my old Werewolves build with 8-12k heals(after defile) , so my current build after 45%defile will heal for like 23-24k none crit heals which is Double thr amount compared to my old build. As you see properly build Werewolf has no problem taking damage while being defiled and bring chaos amongst the enemy groups.
https://youtu.be/F7wmR5HL-ro 0 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭CatchMeTrolling wrote: »Does this stack with cp trees ?
You don´t get those numbers without CP1 -
Inarre✭✭✭✭✭
✭Only role you can be with that build is a target skeleton in peoples houses. Hell even my target skeleton has better offense and sustain than that
This. Last I checked to kill things you need to invest in stam as a werewolf which makes your mag pool/spell power lower without sacrifices. Werewolf gets only so many chances to heal based off those stats. It's needfully strong when you do more than build for survival.
Edit; is this comment for live patch? I see people talking about health scaling the heal but i didnt see a live patch for that. Either way I was using werewolf yesterday and it definitely took magicka to use it.Edited by Inarre on August 12, 2018 2:02PM0 -
CatchMeTrolling✭✭✭✭✭
✭CatchMeTrolling wrote: »Does this stack with cp trees ?
You don´t get those numbers without CP
Doesn’t answer my question. Is it a 93 tooltip automatically or is that what it comes to with cp?
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Chrlynsch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »Does this stack with cp trees ?
You don´t get those numbers without CP
Doesn’t answer my question. Is it a 93 tooltip automatically or is that what it comes to with cp?
Didn't he though?Caius
Pack Leader of Scourge Alliance- First Fang of Hircine, The Beast of Bruma
PC NA0 -
RouDeR✭✭✭✭✭
✭If they don't wanna revert the heal changes, at least reduce the effectiveness and the cost of the heal by 50%, so you loose the insane burst heal but in the same time you will be able to heal for longer in battles even with 10k magicka pool.0 -
CatchMeTrolling✭✭✭✭✭
✭CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »Does this stack with cp trees ?
You don´t get those numbers without CP
Doesn’t answer my question. Is it a 93 tooltip automatically or is that what it comes to with cp?
Didn't he though?
No clearly it doesn’t . There’s base tooltips and then there’s tooltips that get increased with cp. saying you don’t get those type of numbers isn’t a concise answer, it’s vague. What numbers ?
The question is the base tooltip 93 percent or is that after cp???............
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Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »Does this stack with cp trees ?
You don´t get those numbers without CP
Doesn’t answer my question. Is it a 93 tooltip automatically or is that what it comes to with cp?
Didn't he though?
No clearly it doesn’t . There’s base tooltips and then there’s tooltips that get increased with cp. saying you don’t get those type of numbers isn’t a concise answer, it’s vague. What numbers ?
The question is the base tooltip 93 percent or is that after cp???............
Base healing is 60% of Max HP (if I recall correctly from PTS) without any CP, heavy armor or racial bonuses
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CatchMeTrolling✭✭✭✭✭
✭CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »Does this stack with cp trees ?
You don´t get those numbers without CP
Doesn’t answer my question. Is it a 93 tooltip automatically or is that what it comes to with cp?
Didn't he though?
No clearly it doesn’t . There’s base tooltips and then there’s tooltips that get increased with cp. saying you don’t get those type of numbers isn’t a concise answer, it’s vague. What numbers ?
The question is the base tooltip 93 percent or is that after cp???............
Base healing is 60% of Max HP (if I recall correctly from PTS) without any CP, heavy armor or racial bonuses
Thank you. I wasn't sure if 93 was the base + cp increasing the heal. 60 is still pretty high.0 -
Chrlynsch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »Does this stack with cp trees ?
You don´t get those numbers without CP
Doesn’t answer my question. Is it a 93 tooltip automatically or is that what it comes to with cp?
Didn't he though?
No clearly it doesn’t . There’s base tooltips and then there’s tooltips that get increased with cp. saying you don’t get those type of numbers isn’t a concise answer, it’s vague. What numbers ?
The question is the base tooltip 93 percent or is that after cp???............
You don't get 93% without CPCaius
Pack Leader of Scourge Alliance- First Fang of Hircine, The Beast of Bruma
PC NA0 -
Drako_Ei✭✭✭✭✭61k health, you sacrificed all your damage to get a ridiculous heal, with 18k max stamina, and 1.8k weapon damage you wont kill anyone, its exactly the same thing with healbots, holding block with an ultimate generator and then hit rite of passage for a reset, and the same solution: ignore them and kill other people3
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Kadoin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭61k health, you sacrificed all your damage to get a ridiculous heal, with 18k max stamina, and 1.8k weapon damage you wont kill anyone, its exactly the same thing with healbots, holding block with an ultimate generator and then hit rite of passage for a reset, and the same solution: ignore them and kill other people
That's what you guys think, but that won't be the case when it reaches live...0 -
Doctordarkspawn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭People keep saying this. But when you have sloads, what are you complaining about?
And it got done this way because werewolf was useless.2 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It's ok in OW Cyrodiil. You can simply ignore it. It's not so easy in any of the objective focused BGs (other than Deathmatch). Granted, these are noCP and thus the healing isn't as amped. Still these ultra tank builds are stupid in objective based gameplay.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.0 -
ZOS_MikaadminWe have removed some baiting and bashing commentary. Please keep this discussion civil and constructive. Thank you for your understanding.The Elder Scrolls Online: Tamriel Unlimited - ZeniMax Online Studios
Forum Rules | Code of Conduct | Terms of Service | Home Page | Help Site0 -
OneKhajiitCrimeWave✭✭✭✭✭
✭In PvP werewolves mostly have been somewhat balanced in their gameplay (maybe not compared to other classes but more within themselves)
You could go pure glass cannon but your heal was weak, or you could run a Pelinal's setup and get strong burst heals but your burst damage or your sustain suffered some (almost a somewhat hybrid spec).
Now it seems that the scale may have been tipped a little too far to one side. I'll not see until console release but from what i can see it's like the OP has set out to see just how much they can break it (pushing boundaries is good).
I've already been looking through what Werewolf players from glass cannon specs and pelinal's specs think and many of them have reported that having around 31-32k health will give about the same heals as a Pelinal's build on current live.
Tankier specs will find themselves with stronger heals but to stack that high in to health makes them suffer elsewhere (recoveries/other stat pools etc).Dark Flare is the Beginning, Radiant is the End. Hail the Light Bringers!0 -
Amdar_Godkiller✭✭✭✭✭CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »Does this stack with cp trees ?
You don´t get those numbers without CP
Doesn’t answer my question. Is it a 93 tooltip automatically or is that what it comes to with cp?
Didn't he though?
No clearly it doesn’t . There’s base tooltips and then there’s tooltips that get increased with cp. saying you don’t get those type of numbers isn’t a concise answer, it’s vague. What numbers ?
The question is the base tooltip 93 percent or is that after cp???............
Base healing is 60% of Max HP (if I recall correctly from PTS) without any CP, heavy armor or racial bonuses
Thank you. I wasn't sure if 93 was the base + cp increasing the heal. 60 is still pretty high.
They are also using the "PVE morph" of the heal, as most PVP wolves will opt for the one that gives major brutality and heals for 45% of max health. Weapon power potions just aren't very effective for WWs because we are highly susceptible to roots and CCs. Health, Magic (or Stam), and immovability pots are ideal for survivability, and anyone who doesn't use them is easy to focus down.
The only build that would be able to do this well would be Dreugh King Slayer + Sanctuary + Troll King with 5 heavy on an argonian with lots of CP in blessed and quick recovery, the ritual mundus, and a powered/infused DW setup.
12% healing received (sanctuary)
5% healing received (argonian)
15% healing received (quick recovery)
8% healing received (heavy armor)
140% healing received
4% healing taken (Sanctuary 3 piece bonus)
104% healing taken
15% (Blessed CP)
11.5% (Ritual with 2 divines)
4.5% (Powered)
5% (Argonian)
2% (Troll King)
138% healing done
healing done x healing received x healing taken = Heal for 120.6% of max health
Even here though, you're just negating battle spirit, so the actual heal in PVP would be 60% of max health, which would likely be around 35K, so a 21K heal. Fully defiled that heal would drop to 6400. At this point, you won't he able to use it more than a couple of times before your magicka pool dries up and you die.1 -
RouDeR✭✭✭✭✭
✭Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »CatchMeTrolling wrote: »Does this stack with cp trees ?
You don´t get those numbers without CP
Doesn’t answer my question. Is it a 93 tooltip automatically or is that what it comes to with cp?
Didn't he though?
No clearly it doesn’t . There’s base tooltips and then there’s tooltips that get increased with cp. saying you don’t get those type of numbers isn’t a concise answer, it’s vague. What numbers ?
The question is the base tooltip 93 percent or is that after cp???............
Base healing is 60% of Max HP (if I recall correctly from PTS) without any CP, heavy armor or racial bonuses
Thank you. I wasn't sure if 93 was the base + cp increasing the heal. 60 is still pretty high.
They are also using the "PVE morph" of the heal, as most PVP wolves will opt for the one that gives major brutality and heals for 45% of max health. Weapon power potions just aren't very effective for WWs because we are highly susceptible to roots and CCs. Health, Magic (or Stam), and immovability pots are ideal for survivability, and anyone who doesn't use them is easy to focus down.
The only build that would be able to do this well would be Dreugh King Slayer + Sanctuary + Troll King with 5 heavy on an argonian with lots of CP in blessed and quick recovery, the ritual mundus, and a powered/infused DW setup.
12% healing received (sanctuary)
5% healing received (argonian)
15% healing received (quick recovery)
8% healing received (heavy armor)
140% healing received
4% healing taken (Sanctuary 3 piece bonus)
104% healing taken
15% (Blessed CP)
11.5% (Ritual with 2 divines)
4.5% (Powered)
5% (Argonian)
2% (Troll King)
138% healing done
healing done x healing received x healing taken = Heal for 120.6% of max health
Even here though, you're just negating battle spirit, so the actual heal in PVP would be 60% of max health, which would likely be around 35K, so a 21K heal. Fully defiled that heal would drop to 6400. At this point, you won't he able to use it more than a couple of times before your magicka pool dries up and you die.
Only an idiot will run Sanctuary this patch instead of Plague Doctor or Green Pact,
Your math is wrong , argonians cannot be fully defiled because of the disease resistances ( Unless they use Pirate Skeleton or encounter enemy with Fesala)
So the maximum defile% they will be getting 90% of the time is from Incap or Lethal arrow (45% with cp ) which leaves them wih 12k Heal
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Aznox✭✭✭✭✭Argonian passive only protects against getting Major Defile procced from a disease damage or glyph, which is very rarely used anyway.
For now i'm sticking to the 45% heal because i want to keep my speed+lingering pots.Edited by Aznox on August 16, 2018 12:11PMAznox
PC EU
Khajiit Orc Bosmer Stamina Sorcerer and Werewolf Stage 3 Vampire
I live in Battlegrounds
Theorycrafting enthusiast
Official Cheese Lord
CP1500+ club0 -
RouDeR✭✭✭✭✭
✭Anyway , 2 days of playing with my 50k health Werewolf in BGs i can say it is OP asf.
Wearing Shacklebreaker+Sloads and Skoria with infused weapon with Oblivion glyph . I can rip trough peoples flesh and heal for 21k at the same time (14k after defile).
Bravo ZoS, Bravo0 -
Mr_Wolfe✭✭✭Anyway , 2 days of playing with my 50k health Werewolf in BGs i can say it is OP asf.
Wearing Shacklebreaker+Sloads and Skoria with infused weapon with Oblivion glyph . I can rip trough peoples flesh and heal for 21k at the same time (14k after defile).
Bravo ZoS, Bravo
That's the gear, not werewolf. And you'd still only get a handful of those heals before you run out of magicka.1 -
RouDeR✭✭✭✭✭
✭Anyway , 2 days of playing with my 50k health Werewolf in BGs i can say it is OP asf.
Wearing Shacklebreaker+Sloads and Skoria with infused weapon with Oblivion glyph . I can rip trough peoples flesh and heal for 21k at the same time (14k after defile).
Bravo ZoS, Bravo
That's the gear, not werewolf. And you'd still only get a handful of those heals before you run out of magicka.
Tell that to my Argonian Werewolf with 1600 Magicka Recovery.0
