Social question.

Blackwidow · June 2014

I saw a chest in the distance, but by the time I got to it, another player started to pick the lock.

It was a master chest to me, so I thought he might mess up and I could try to pick it. As it turns out that is what happened.

I got the chest and started to walk away.

Next thing I know he is giving me a tell that he is going to report me for stealing his chest.

So, I guess the question is, is it a social faux pas to take a chest from another player? I know it is not against the rules and all that, but is it just rude in general?

What do you guys think?

martinhpb16_ESO · June 2014

I would of been mad too. I don't like resource ninjas.

Nothing in the rule book that says you can't ninja but I guess it's down to an individuals perspective on manners and generosity.

If I was in your position I would repent, apologise and give the guy what was in the chest.

david271749 · June 2014

I would have been mad. It's a competitive thing. I wouldn't report you like a lil b though.

nerevarine1138 · June 2014

Well, for starters, it would be a "faux pas" (that's French for "chest ninja").

And what you did is not only not reportable; it's totally fine. The cooldown on lockpicking is specifically there to allow another player a chance at opening the chest. If you don't have the skill to get it open the first time, you risk having someone else take it. It isn't a "ninja," which is impossible in this game, and it isn't even socially unacceptable. You just happened to encounter a player with a shorter fuse than most.

vyndral13preub18_ESO · June 2014

No it is not against the rules, and not rude. I would think the whole reason there is a slight cooldown on your next chance to try after you fail is there for the exact reason. To give other players a shot. Would it be rude to kill a mob after you saw some dude try and die? He was coming right back to kill it!! No.

Now it would be rude to me if there was clearly some sort of line there and you just jumped up past the next guy waiting his shot.

Blackwidow · June 2014

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Well, for starters, it would be a "faux pas" (that's French for "chest ninja").

Fixed it.

Thanks.

babylon · June 2014

Chests belong to everyone, no dramas.

GunemCleric · June 2014

Was there anything else going on, did the other player just kill a mob guarding the chest?

I think it is the height of rudeness to run up and stand next to the chest and spam the 'X' hoping the other person fails. It is even more so if the the other person just killed a mob/mobs to get to the chest.

It is just as rude as angling in a fight with others so that you can immediately grab the chest when fight ends.

A better way is to stand away from the chest and wait. if the other person cannot do it or gets bored of trying they will walk off. Or they may leave something in the chest. Or they may take their well-deserved loot and go. The loot in chests is just not worth being rude over, ever. I have walked up and stopped, well outside the action range, and other person leaves something in chest. On the other side if someone acts like they have manners i give them the entire chest and leave.

I have gotten on to guildmates who have been caught or admitted to stealing chests. I really do not think it is a reportable offense, but I tend to remember people who do this too me.

nerevarine1138 · June 2014

GunemCleric wrote: »

Was there anything else going on, did the other player just kill a mob guarding the chest?

I think it is the height of rudeness to run up and stand next to the chest and spam the 'X' hoping the other person fails. It is even more so if the the other person just killed a mob/mobs to get to the chest.

It is just as rude as angling in a fight with others so that you can immediately grab the chest when fight ends.

A better way is to stand away from the chest and wait. if the other person cannot do it or gets bored of trying they will walk off. Or they may leave something in the chest. Or they may take their well-deserved loot and go. The loot in chests is just not worth being rude over, ever. I have walked up and stopped, well outside the action range, and other person leaves something in chest. On the other side if someone acts like they have manners i give them the entire chest and leave.

I have gotten on to guildmates who have been caught or admitted to stealing chests. I really do not think it is a reportable offense, but I tend to remember people who do this too me.

It's not a reportable offense, and again, if you can't open the chest on your first try, the cooldown timer is there to give others a chance.

Now, someone may choose to be extremely kind and let you have a second crack at it, but they don't have to do that.

gladen5rwb17_ESO · June 2014

It was the wrong thing to do in my opinion. Often it takes a few times to get, especially a Master chest. With so many chests about there is no reason to hang about if another person is there. You can be pretty sure they are going to keep trying till they open it. I am also pretty sure we all have lots of lock picks to do so as well.

Zabalah · June 2014

Actually, I read somewhere that you take turns opening chests... if you fail to open, the guy standing next to you is entitled to a turn. Even if it isn't an 'official rule', wouldn't it be great to play nice and take turns? What a thought!

Mordria · June 2014

It's pretty rude I think. I've opened several chests then noticed there was someone else standing there waiting to see if I couldn't beat the timer. Do I do that? No. I'm more of a courteous person than that. The only way I would go after it is if I see the person walking away from it. There's plenty of chests scattered about Tamriel.

Blackwidow · June 2014

GunemCleric wrote: »

Was there anything else going on, did the other player just kill a mob guarding the chest?

No, it was on the shore. No monsters around.

You think if a player kills a monster he has 100% right to it, even if he fails the chest over and over?

Fairydragon3 · June 2014

No he failed his attempt, even if he does report you, Zos will know this and leave you alone. If he was in Cyrodiil he would be dead before he finished picking the lock. That's why I always pick locks like someone where right behind me trying to get it if I fail, chests are not even worth all that much, but I haven't found a master yet

JessieColt · June 2014

I do not need what is in a chest so badly that I will slip in and open it while another user is trying to do that.

If there was rare loot, like Racials, or Legendary items that are in the chests, maybe, but probably not.

I will stand there and wait to see if the player manages to get the chest open. If they do not, and they give up and walk away, I will take the chest, but as long as they are actively trying to open it, even if they get a cooldown, I will leave them to it.

nerevarine1138 · June 2014

gladen5rwb17_ESO wrote: »

It was the wrong thing to do in my opinion. Often it takes a few times to get, especially a Master chest. With so many chests about there is no reason to hang about if another person is there. You can be pretty sure they are going to keep trying till they open it. I am also pretty sure we all have lots of lock picks to do so as well.

I haven't needed multiple attempts on a chest since early access.

Now, maybe I'm just absurdly talented and smart and handsome and witty, or maybe I've worked my lockpicking skills so that I get chests on the first try. If I don't get it on the first try and someone else is there, I accept that they now have a crack at it, because I failed in my attempt.

Sallakat · June 2014

Making a report about things like this is nasty. I would've probably fumed a bit if someone took a chest I screwed up with, I always have loads of lockpicks in my bag, you get them everywhere, so I can always go again if it don't work. But no amount of nerd rage about things like this is worthy of a report.

Blackwidow · June 2014

Fairydragon3 wrote: »

I haven't found a master yet

The level of difficulty is based on your level compared to the chest.

So, if at a low level you were to travel to a high level area, most would be master or impossible for you to pick.

Just FYI.

Fairydragon3 · June 2014

I was sitting here thing maybe thats why I havent, thanks for the clarification Widow

Cybrdroyd · June 2014

I think if you waited for him to take his turn to open the chest, and he failed, then you have every right to try yourself. He doesn't own the chest, he just found it, just like you did. I can understand why it would feel ***, but such is life.

Sallakat · June 2014

Just started to think of it, that I have not seen anything but simple chests in last week or two :O Both of my girls are veteran level (9 and 2) but still happen to bump into simples wherever I've been to, either questing or dungeons in craglorn. I used to see Masters too at times (never impossibles tho) but not even an intermediate lately :O

Stratti · June 2014

That's not rude it's perfectly fine and certainly not reportable.

What is very rude is taking a chest from someone while they kill a mob guarding it. You know bypassing the fight to loot the chest. Not reportable just rude.

Estridde · June 2014

What a little brat. Making a report for something like that is ridiculous. I'd be plenty irritated too. It's just not something that's reportable really.

It's just something that happens, if you fail at opening a chest, someone else can open it. If someone gets to a chest before me, it sucks, but whatever. It's an MMO. That means, shockingly, there are other players doing their thing as well.

babylon · June 2014

Stratti wrote: »

What is very rude is taking a chest from someone while they kill a mob guarding it. You know bypassing the fight to loot the chest. Not reportable just rude.

Yeah that would be a social bad, any time someone charges in to loot something while the other guy is busy clearing the area is just wrong.

Otherwise it's fair game.

GunemCleric · June 2014

Blackwidow wrote: »

GunemCleric wrote: »

Was there anything else going on, did the other player just kill a mob guarding the chest?

No, it was on the shore. No monsters around.

You think if a player kills a monster he has 100% right to it, even if he fails the chest over and over?

I would not put it in those terms, but I have gone through a dungeon spotted a chest near the boss (no one around), killed the boss, then go to get the chest and find someone who obviously walked around me and the boss and got the chest. I had one recently where I killed either 3 mobs or a troll (do not remember which was more recent) and go for the chest that i was fighting for and some ass was picking the lock.

In both cases I really wanted to rip their guts out and string them around the cave/forest as an object lessen. If it was in Cyro and an enemy player ganked me and got the chest (even if i fought for it) i would be irritated, but it would make sense.

Another one happened where I turned off autoloot, picked a lock, left an item in chest and someone who had nothing to do with the fight run up and loot the chest and run away. Ripping his/her guts out would have been too gentle.

Blackwidow · June 2014

Fairydragon3 wrote: »

I was sitting here thing maybe thats why I havent, thanks for the clarification Widow

Np. that is what the insightful button is for.

kewl · June 2014

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

The cooldown on lockpicking is specifically there to allow another player a chance at opening the chest. If you don't have the skill to get it open the first time, you risk having someone else take it. It isn't a "ninja."

Could not agree more. I've had it done it to me many times. The only person I get upset with is myself.

Have no qualms about doing it to others either. Get better at lock picking or leave empty handed.

kewl · June 2014

Stratti wrote: »

What is very rude is taking a chest from someone while they kill a mob guarding it.

Agree. I make sure to have the fight right next to or on top of a chest. That way, it can't be picked till the fight is over or I die.

Krovax · June 2014

Blackwidow wrote: »

GunemCleric wrote: »

Was there anything else going on, did the other player just kill a mob guarding the chest?

No, it was on the shore. No monsters around.

You think if a player kills a monster he has 100% right to it, even if he fails the chest over and over?

One simply cannot fail a chest over and over. Even master chests should be doable by complete simpletons within 3 tries. Otherwise I would suspect drunk gaming, which is not a punishable offense, yet. xD

Apart from that, if the murder of a culprit was involved in attaining access to a chest, I too would find it rude if someone else took the chest (or heave sack/chest) from me even I were to fail the first try. Being a templar, doing the killing actually involves some patience.

I also would never stop to wait for someone to fail at a chest, too many around, usually in the same remote spots.

Blackwidow · June 2014

Krovax wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

GunemCleric wrote: »

Was there anything else going on, did the other player just kill a mob guarding the chest?

No, it was on the shore. No monsters around.

You think if a player kills a monster he has 100% right to it, even if he fails the chest over and over?

One simply cannot fail a chest over and over. Even master chests should be doable by complete simpletons within 3 tries. Otherwise I would suspect drunk gaming, which is not a punishable offense, yet. xD

Not to be that guy, but three tries means he failed it over and over.

danreckerpreub18_ESO · June 2014

I view this as quite rude, myself. I have not, and will not ever intentionally chest-ninja someone like this. Given that it's not against the rules, reporting someone for doing this will gain you nothing, and only serve to waste time. This appears to be lazy game design, it's the easiest (and one of the more frustrating) options they could have gone with.

No single node or chest is worth blowing a gasket over, but it's things like this that discourage cooperative play.

[Ramble]
Personally, I think that engaging a pack of monsters guarding a chest, or resource node should lock it to you for 20 seconds or so after combat ends (with a maximum lock period that cannot recur, to avoid griefing / exploitation) In a PVE environment, allowing players to 'steal' from one another, while allowing no retaliation, is just frustrating.

If this game had open world PVP, sure - if someone wants to yoink a chest / node i've been fighting for, I should be able to inform them of my displeasure with violence visited on something other then my keyboard. If they attack me while I'm going for the node... ok, they are a butt, but at least I've had the chance to defend myself.

It even introduces a sort of minigame. If they manage to take me out - once I respawn, i'm going hunting.

[/Ramble]