Sigh where did all the nodes go?

ArRashid · May 2014

So what the actual heck is going on again?
Today, in 6 hours of exping around half of Alik'r I found just 2 Cottons. ZERO metal nodes, ZERO wood nodes, ZERO runes.

Just.... wth?
Is this another "genius" level anti-bot countermeasure that backfires into regular players instead of being aimed at bots only?

Censorious · May 2014

I think what happened is that so many people at VR have given up trying to quest, they've all gone gathering instead.
I know I did - and I saw an awful lot of people running from node to node too.

reggielee · May 2014

yah, i would see a handful here and there but basically a dead landscape for nodes in most areas of alikr. being lazy, I spent the time just exploring and taking a looksee.

i didnt see anyone else gathering or an increase in players either. In fact, the one spot i did see nodes was full of chaining leveling bots focused on mobs.

whatever

ArRashid · May 2014

Also, finally found 2 Orichalcum nodes this afternoon... None of them were lootable - my character just got closer to it after pushing E, but never attempted to loot, no matter how many times I've pushed E

vyal · May 2014

ArRashid wrote: »

Also, finally found 2 Orichalcum nodes this afternoon... None of them were lootable - my character just got closer to it after pushing E, but never attempted to loot, no matter how many times I've pushed E

That's due to the node being placed too low in the world geometry. Bugged since beta, never fixed.

The larger reason all the nodes are gone is twofold.
1) refining them is the only legit source of gold tempers, aside from the duping exploit during the first weeks of release.
2) bot farmers have mapped all the node locations and use teleporting/speed hacks to harvest all the nodes 24x7 to ... wait for it, go back to point one.

The gold tempers are sold on the gold farmers websites for RL cash.
In other words, the RMT gold farmers are using game hacks/exploits to corner the market on all end game crafting mats.

I have video/pics of bots poking their heads up through ore nodes in Glenumbra. I've reported bots and see them there more than 24 hours later. They've exploit farmed the entire 24+ hours (or days for all I know).

Prior to the bot plague, there were plenty of ore nodes. Now there are pretty much none, unless they're close to water, for whatever reason.

The solution:
All nodes should be personal, instanced-to-you. They should not be shared in the open world with everyone. Their visibility and use should be just like furniture/packs/vases are currently implemented. Why Zenimax thought competitive harvesting would be a good idea in 2014 is a mystery.

izayoi · May 2014

I thinking the same thing. I've only seen one (1!) rune in the last few hours (4-5) gameplay, and maybe 3-4 ores. And this is at around level 30.

ArRashid · May 2014

vyal wrote: »

ArRashid wrote: »

Also, finally found 2 Orichalcum nodes this afternoon... None of them were lootable - my character just got closer to it after pushing E, but never attempted to loot, no matter how many times I've pushed E

That's due to the node being placed too low in the world geometry. Bugged since beta, never fixed.

The larger reason all the nodes are gone is twofold.
1) refining them is the only legit source of gold tempers, aside from the duping exploit during the first weeks of release.
2) bot farmers have mapped all the node locations and use teleporting/speed hacks to harvest all the nodes 24x7 to ... wait for it, go back to point one.

The gold tempers are sold on the gold farmers websites for RL cash.
In other words, the RMT gold farmers are using game hacks/exploits to corner the market on all end game crafting mats.

I have video/pics of bots poking their heads up through ore nodes in Glenumbra. I've reported bots and see them there more than 24 hours later. They've exploit farmed the entire 24+ hours (or days for all I know).

Prior to the bot plague, there were plenty of ore nodes. Now there are pretty much none, unless they're close to water, for whatever reason.

The solution:
All nodes should be personal, instanced-to-you. They should not be shared in the open world with everyone. Their visibility and use should be just like furniture/packs/vases are currently implemented. Why Zenimax thought competitive harvesting would be a good idea in 2014 is a mystery.

Ahem, do you have any idea how much memory would be wasted to instance all crafting nodes between people?

Also, botters were not a problem till Zenimax MADE a problem out of them by extremely short-sighted countermeasures (like this one).
What they wanted:
- bots get less resources
What they got:
- bots don't mind. They have no brains, they just do as they are programmed to. You merely slowed down the farming, at the expense of PLAYERS FINDING ZERO MATERIALS and therefore virtually forcing them to resort to buying from botters.

I think the only thing working against botters would be to make such sites ILLEGAL and so they'd be shut down and blacklisted from every Internet provider for all eternity.

vyal · May 2014

ArRashid wrote: »

...
Ahem, do you have any idea how much memory would be wasted to instance all crafting nodes between people? ...

In the current modern computing environment, cpu, memory, and disk are effectively infinite, if the system is designed correctly.

However, if that doesn't convince you, many other games already personalize harvesting, and those games work perfectly fine. There are in fact, many many fun and challenging ways to put harvesting into MMO's that completely eliminate the competition consequences we're currently enduring in ESO.
One simple way? Allow players to trade lower level mats for higher level ones, 10:1. That means 10 honing stones = one dwarven oil. 10 dwarven oil = 1 grain solvent, etc. This also has the ancillary benefit of having "green" items maintain value. It could be a function of alchemy, to add some diversity to that tradeskill other than potions.

It is possible. There are no technical hurdles to overcome to implement it, it was a conscious design decision on the part of Zenimax (honestly, a lazy and shortsighted one) and they're now reaping the consequences.

Censorious · May 2014

ArRashid wrote: »

...
Ahem, do you have any idea how much memory would be wasted to instance all crafting nodes between people?

GW2 did this and it worked very well.

ArRashid wrote: »

I think the only thing working against botters would be to make such sites ILLEGAL and so they'd be shut down and blacklisted from every Internet provider for all eternity.

Ah - unfortunately 'illegal' is not a word that applies to the internet. It's a big world out there. I'm sure Kim Jong-Un would explain it to you if you ask him.

Otherwise, I agree with you.

ArRashid · May 2014

Yeah yeah, corps get people arrested for downloading anything, but when someone deliberately *** with your product, you have no legal way of stopping him..

Woolenthreads · May 2014

There's probably just not enough nodes for the number of people playing. I've noticed that there's usually nothing in highly trafficked areas and something in the rest. That being said I'm playing in +8GMT so the general traffic is lower, In USDT it's probably all looted pretty fast making it hard to find.

ArRashid · May 2014

I was in doing Alik'r whole yesterday, and in WHOLE DAY I found maybe 30 raw cottons, 3 raw beech and 3 Orichalcum Ores. 99% ores I've found were unlootable, I guess that's WHY I was able to find them...

Sharee · May 2014

All your nodes are belong to us!!!

Sincerely,

fddasdfffdffj.

SirAndy · May 2014

The bots are still there and more active than ever. But they're now underground, probably to evade the ZOS GMs. If you wait next to a node, you'll see their heads pop up from underground for a second while they harvest the node, then they teleport to the next.

Out of sight, out of mind, i guess ...

ArRashid · May 2014

Doesn't seem to affect all zones - I was able to find about 5 nodes just running from Harborage to Daggerfall.. just Alik'r is REALLY EMPTY.

Calluna · May 2014

I spent about an hour running around Alik'r this morning and got about 35 dwarven ore and 45 orichalum. There were probably 4 nodes I saw in that time that I could not harvest and I didn't see any evidence of bots. I think the nodes are just more rare as you level up and everyone remembers the plethora of quick spawning nodes in the starter areas and expects close to the same in the higher level area. I also found plenty of plants and cotton. What I am missing seeing is runes. They said in the patch notes that they were going to increase the rune nodes but it seems like there are less to me.

jmmonnat_ESO · May 2014

THIS! I was in Auridon for about 4 hours today and my grand harvesting total was: 3 jute, 1 branch, ZERO ore. Yay me! Yay bots!

Laughter Song · May 2014

Bots are now out numbering players!

Not an hour goes by in any zone below level 20 (at least) where the heated subject of bots and the havoc they bring comes up in Zone Chat.

Just today alone in a 30 minute time period, there were over 30 bots cycling in and out of Auridon using the Blacksmith/Tailor/Woodworking tables...zooooming around like busy lil' bees, cycling through extracting precious materials needed for crafting to resell at substantially lower prices to the player base and/or to vendor.

There are numerous Bot Thread because obviously Zenimax does not seem to care...well not that players can actually see...not that is tangible proof anyway.

The point is:

You can no longer Farm mats in most areas. Public dungeons quests are a joke. Bots kill game Immersion & they destroy the in-game economy. The bots are now in VR Zones.

Where will it end?

I paid a lot of money for this game...for what Bots? I can't even gather mats anymore to craft. It is quickly becoming beyond the time of being patient.

Bots finally made it into VR 1- 10 Content because they were not stopped in the lower areas. Guess what happens when bots are not banned? A: They grow up from baby bots into big bad boy VR bots!

And finally a GM took time off of his busy schedule to remove One little bot out of the Thousands...that is right "Thousands" that plague this game.

I reported, filmed and took screen shots of over 30 bots just in the Auridon crafting areas...flying about like they owned the place.

The bots are using the Black Smith/Tailoring/Woodworking stations. Then some "legit" head bot sells the extracted materials dirt cheap to players like you and I.

Bots were localized to lower areas now the flood V1-10 areas.

Question: Where are the GMs? Why are they not in force banning?

Why is it Zenimax does not discuss this issue with the player-base?

Why don't they give us exact details of How the plan to eliminate the bots?
What they are doing now is Nothing! ... well nothing that is tangible to the player base that is.

Good job Zenimax for hiring/positioning GMs online - in-game in major towns/cities, in heavily botted gathering areas and in public dungeons.

This game has become the laughing stock of the MMORPG world due to how easily Zenimax (the share holders?) turn a blind eye to how saturated the bots are.

Some reports mention as many as 10 bots for every player & 28% of the player base buys gold. (quoting for MMO online magazines and forum threads).

You cannot stop the Gold Buying per se, however you can attack the severe saturation of bots and the degradation of the game due to bots as well as the loss of player subscriptions by working on IP Protocols, working through legalities, creating software that detects hacking (LUA) through the launcher etc. AND - More Importantly for the Player-Base -

GMs need to be out in Force 24/7 Banning bots especially in specific low level dungeons/gathering/farming zones.

I don't know about you but I am tired of reporting bots daily that I see the very next day and then the next day once again. I have filed over 300...yup "300" - phoned Zenimax 4 times now and have written in 4 separate threads.

I Enjoy this game. I played a Lot for this game. I think we all need to hold Zenimax accountable. What exactly is Zenimax doing to combat this bot problem?

The Fanboyz will hate to read this but it is beginning to look as though Zenimax is behind the botting/gold selling.

It would not be the first time a Money Holder/Investor put collecting (dirty) revenue ahead of game development and the player-base.

Here are links of the bot programs so easily used, bragged about and purchased by players and pros alike:

***WARNING***
***Do NOT download - this software is a Sure Fire Way to have your ESO game Hacked!***

_______________________________

"Experience Flawless Automation"

"Botting The Elder Scrolls Online is now easier than ever. It grinds, it levels, it even farms loot… without you. Welcome to the number one source for ESO automation information. Want to purchase one of our recommended ESO bots? Click here to continue to our purchase page.

(These thieves are actually proud of there product! - it is an odd world we live in today...indeed)

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Spamming]

Woolenthreads · May 2014

Woolenthreads wrote: »

There's probably just not enough nodes for the number of people playing. I've noticed that there's usually nothing in highly trafficked areas and something in the rest. That being said I'm playing in +8GMT so the general traffic is lower, In USDT it's probably all looted pretty fast making it hard to find.

I recant my previous comment. I'm definitely noting a lack of material nodes. Mostly I find out-of-the-way iron, I'm seeing no wood or jute at all in Auridon.

I'm barely seeing any alchemical ingredients either so I'm beginning to wonder if it's just Auridon.

Food4Thought · May 2014

I was in Khan's Roost yesterday and noticed 4 seperate bots running underground. They are semi easy to spot because their head pops up for a split second while they are harvesting the node. And since they travel underground they can get to the next node faster than you can and you simply have to make a decision to put some distance between you and the bot in order to have any chance gaining any resources.

When they were in the starter zones, I could tolerate this behavior. There were so many nodes and lootable chests that I really didn't notice that I was being short changed.

But now people are thinking they have moved on to the upper levels and I have to agree with them that I think this is indeed the case. Although I haven't seen any heads popping up like a game of whack-a-mole in any place but the starter zones, the lack of resources in general in the mid level maps leaves me to believe that they are at work in these areas too. It has gotten to the point where I can no longer craft new armor every two levels because I simply don't have the resources. The bulk of my ore now comes from extraction and not from resource gathering.

SirAndy · May 2014

Food4Thought wrote: »

the lack of resources in general in the mid level maps leaves me to believe that they are at work in these areas too.

Moving underground made them much less visible. Sadly, that doesn't mean they are gone ...

Food4Thought · May 2014

SirAndy wrote: »

Food4Thought wrote: »

the lack of resources in general in the mid level maps leaves me to believe that they are at work in these areas too.

Moving underground made them much less visible. Sadly, that doesn't mean they are gone ...

Yes, and because they can move underground they probably can avoid any dangers from attacking mobs that were put in place to partially guard the resource nodes.

And this is also likely to be from very low level toons too. All it would take is for them to group with a higher level character. That character then transport to a higher level map and the bot can do the same by teleporting to their party member's location. Now you have a level three bot running around in a zone (underground) entended for a character much higher in level. And the legitimate players wonder where all the resource nodes are at.

ArRashid · May 2014

I wish there was a hidden virus in ESO that would delete whole game if it detected the "player" is using bot software (best if it formated whole drive on which ESO was installed and displayed ".!.." over whole screen).. That would show those ***.

MaxBat · May 2014

Woolenthreads wrote: »

...

I recant my previous comment. I'm definitely noting a lack of material nodes. Mostly I find out-of-the-way iron, I'm seeing no wood or jute at all in Auridon.

I'm barely seeing any alchemical ingredients either so I'm beginning to wonder if it's just Auridon.

It's not just Auridon; in fact, last night while I was playing, I spotted - no exaggeration - 5 different bots on Stros M'Kai. Really? A starter zone? They were in the goblin areas and they would pop out the ground and grab the node before I could.

This morning, I saw one in Betnikh. Yeah, you can report them but the seem to have better programming skills than the Zenimax team.

Soulshine · May 2014

One possibe way to combat this would be to implement a change in the crafting system:

1) stop allowing ppl to extract purple and legendary tempers by refining low level mats.
2) add different tempers for each type of mat so that they are level appropriate to the mat and the gear that you can make with it. (Other games have crafting systems that work in this way and you cannot go hunting down end game mats with a low level char in low level mat zones, period).
3) see number ONE

Not saying this would eliminate them but I suspect it would considerably slow the motivation to bot every plant in the game

ArRashid · May 2014

Soulshine wrote: »

One possibe way to combat this would be to implement a change in the crafting system:

1) stop allowing ppl to extract purple and legendary tempers by refining low level mats.
2) add different tempers for each type of mat so that they are level appropriate to the mat and the gear that you can make with it. (Other games have crafting systems that work in this way and you cannot go hunting down end game mats with a low level char in low level mat zones, period).
3) see number ONE

Not saying this would eliminate them but I suspect it would considerably slow the motivation to bot every plant in the game

that would be really unfortunate.. they would have to RAPIDLY increase theor drop rate to compensate.
I'd say let lowest tier material drop none, second tier drop some amd third+ to have full drop rate. but since bots are already everywhere, even this doesn't make sense..

it sends a message, doesn't it? letting bots without punishment to comfortably get to even veteran content..

Stonesthrow · May 2014

They will just send there matts to one high level guy to extract. Not a solution.

Best way in my opinion would be to check everyone who has the achieve for 10,000 nodes or greater… including some of us who do not farm other than for ourselves, we just happen to do it a lot…. oh wait...

PLEASE DO NOT AUTO BAN US AGAIN ZOS!!!! lol

… but they should then check and see the behavior patterns of those people.

Start there and get a whole bunch of em… then they will just start limiting their collecting I guess and making new guys at 9,999 nodes >.<

Pyatra · May 2014

Yeah, didn't see many nodes... I thought they just increased the timer or thinned them out.

Tieberion · May 2014

Bots my dear Watson, Bots... There was 2 in the Natil area of Ban today each leading two groups of 4 (18 in all, including the leaders) power leveling by killing the spiders there, and grabbing all nodes, plants, etc.

Tarukmockto · May 2014

Did you mean the Nilata Ruins of Bangkorai? They were running there last night. I reported them, but it was hard to do. They were moving so fast it was hard to target one and get the report menu up.

Soulshine · May 2014

ArRashid wrote: »

Soulshine wrote: »

One possibe way to combat this would be to implement a change in the crafting system:

1) stop allowing ppl to extract purple and legendary tempers by refining low level mats.
2) add different tempers for each type of mat so that they are level appropriate to the mat and the gear that you can make with it. (Other games have crafting systems that work in this way and you cannot go hunting down end game mats with a low level char in low level mat zones, period).
3) see number ONE

Not saying this would eliminate them but I suspect it would considerably slow the motivation to bot every plant in the game

that would be really unfortunate.. they would have to RAPIDLY increase theor drop rate to compensate.
I'd say let lowest tier material drop none, second tier drop some amd third+ to have full drop rate. but since bots are already everywhere, even this doesn't make sense..

it sends a message, doesn't it? letting bots without punishment to comfortably get to even veteran content..

Why unfortunate? What do low level players need legendary tempers for? You out level gear faster than you can blink. There would not be a need to increase anything other than the types of tempers available to each level. This has always worked successfully in crafting for other games, there is no reason why it wouldn't work here had they planned the crafting charts more practically.

Also, If you require the crafter to have earned enough rank in the craft to decon those items in the first place, bots would have a much more significantly difficult time. If they attempted to use a higher level char to do it, well that would be also be significantly easier to track than what it is right now 100s of bots daily all over the map including the veteran zones as well as low level ones - it is not an issue of them camping out only in lowbie areas. I know as I have repeatedly seen them over the last several weeks of playing veteran content.

Obviously they need to get rid of them but not even considering other solution that have worked against this stuff in other games would not be smart on their part.

*Sigh* where did all the nodes go?

Sigh where did all the nodes go?