bothnutz wrote: »

You have no reason to respec because a passive got nerfed. There is plenty of skill points in ESO and the only reason you should be respecing is if you need different morphs. I currently have 7 points in light armour I wore for half a week and have no intention of using again, and I have 3 fighters guild ability I haven't used since vamp Nerf, 2 of them morphed. Thats 10+ skill points I haven't used for weeks.

If you are changing your entire tanking weapon set because of a nerf to a passive that prevents you from dealing damage.... Im sorry but Im going to have to call you on your ***. The onehand/shield is still the best bet for tanking... like what else are you going to tank with? 2h? c'mon... you have been abusing this in pvp and now want to respec to the new fotm, admit it. Deal with the consequences of being a trend hopping tool, give up some of your imaginary pretend virtual money and quit crying like a ***.

You have no concept AT ALL how nerfed this kind of build took. You're just happy it got *** over because you got tired of getting your ass handed to you in pvp. just another fotm who screams 'l2p!', when all you do is change your skills to whichever is most over powered. No doubt I've seen you running through trying to form sorc aoe grind groups in every map.


The problem is, the whole sword and board skill line is garbage now. It's not because one skill got nerfed. It changes the whole dynamic of how a character plays.


I play a DK. Up until VR3, I played full 2h dps with heavy armor. My focus was in stamina and used a mix of the dk skills and 2h weps, but more points in stamina. Once I got to VR3, and mob groups were often 3-4, it sucked being a 2h dps because I was constantly on the ropes if I didn't get at least one or two mobs killed within a few seconds. I play solo, so this is a big factor. It was also quite disappointing to see a sorc come spamming their aoe *** and just knocking everything down to nothing, while I was having to work my ass off in every fight, even trash mobs.

So I decided I needed a better way to get the mob count down to give me a better chance to live through the fight. I just couldn't charge in like a madman and kill 4 mobs with ease anymore. Since I'm a stamina build, I figure bow is a great choice as a secondary wep, and I can just try and pick one mob off, maybe wear them down a little before I switch to 2h and go in clean up. Bow is a nightmare because of the high stamina cost and such low return, that it just wasn't worth it. I tried, but at VR3, trying to level the bow up was tough. Maybe if I already had it to level 50, I'm sure it'd be better, but there just wasn't enough roi, especially considering the problems with my theory of quick weapon swapping in the midst of the fight. That just doesn't happen.

So had to respec. Being a stamina char, I move on to sword and board. It becomes my primary and 2h is my secondary. I was so pleasantly surprised at how well this build performed, that I wished I had picked it up sooner. On my skill bar I have 3 DK skills and 2 shield skills. Most of my stats are in stam, but I still have enough mag to blast through some dk attacks in between my sheild attacks (primarily Puncture and Bash). Mostly those are DoT skills that don't do much damage up front (especially with low mag...since I'm a stam build focused on the wep lines) but are nice to throw around. I can keep my shield up, throw my DoTs, and puncture and bash. Now I was surviving. I had good dps and could actually be a tank and solo through most of the content.


So then comes the patch. Now bash doesn't do ***. There goes a lot of the dps. because even my dk skills aren't that powerful, especially with low mag. Hell, sometimes my dk attacks would do 60 damage...which now at VR7, doesn't cut it. The more I have to spam my dk skills, the open and susceptible I am to counter attack, basically defeating the purpose of having my shield up to being with. So now I do WAY less dps, block seems to cost more and do a lot less, and take away the ability to use bash effectively, and all of sudden my char is nothing like it used to be. I throw my dk skills all day, but since they barely do any damage, but I keep using them until my mag is going because I have to try and kill off a mob, which means I'm wide open with no blocking, so take a LOT more damage, and the fights last too long because I can't do any dps anymore, whether it be with my low mag dk skills, or with my shield.


So basically, all stamina builds are basically *** in this game. So now what? Do I have to respec again and change my entire build to become a mag char instead of stamina? Wtf should I have to do that? So now I have to start building light armor into my build too? I just spent countless hours trying to get my med armor built up with 5hvy 2med setup to help with my stamina build. So it's not a matter of 'l2p!' - it's basically that all stamina lines just went to *** because that was basically the only one worth a damn. It gave defense, plus the ability to do some damage (and at a very high stamina cost, so wasn't like a freebie). Maybe I should just be like a lot of *** (I'm pointing my finger at you) and just build the next FoTM char and forget the whole 'play as you want' *** I was told I could do.

Basically what this patch has done for me is take all the fun out of my char. My entire build feels incompetent now. Nerfing bash so drastically causes a cascade effect and destroyed the last of the worthwhile stamina weapon line skill lines. Even for those of us know how to play and didn't use just bash,bash,bash as our only tactic, the sword and board build just got *** on.

And don't even get me started on this *** I have seen with my gf and her templar build. It's worse for her because she is a hvy armor stamina build. She was more support roll/tank style, and now she can't solo more than 1 mob at a time.



My beef is, I don't want to *** build a full on magicka char in light armor just to feel effective, especially in the solo questing play. If I wanted to do that ***, I would've been a mage and put all my time into Cloth instead of Blacksmithing. And since my whole skill line just went to *** because of a patch, at the very least, they could offer me is free respec, because right now, this game is more pissing me off and getting me fired up than being fun like it used to be. I'm so close to just saying *** it and cancelling our subs. Hell, I even just found the Daedric motif, but I'm so annoyed at the game, and the thought that I'm going to have to even respec AGAIN out of necessity, not because I want to try something different, that I got zero excitement from the find.

I would like to see this.

Why should there be any cost in a respec? We have already paid so much for this game and to actually enjoy the options for a character that we have leveled for days and now you want us to pay so much so that we can actually enjoy the options our characters came with?

It should be free, or at least a free for each 50 lvls or at the end of each of Caldwell's almanac timeline at least.

yes if only because the price is absurd.
100 per point on a higher level character, ok, fine.
but when you are in your 10s-20s and trying to learn the game, that *** can be catastrophic

Maverick827 wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

I love that this is a stealthy attempt to just lower the price of respecs.

If your skill was changed, the points were refunded. If your skill wasn't changed, you don't need a refund.

One skill can make or break an entire build. My entire build was broken, and I cannot play my main until I respec. I cannot afford a respec.

Bull.

There is no build in this game that relies entirely on one skill and one skill only.

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Maverick827 wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

I love that this is a stealthy attempt to just lower the price of respecs.

If your skill was changed, the points were refunded. If your skill wasn't changed, you don't need a refund.

One skill can make or break an entire build. My entire build was broken, and I cannot play my main until I respec. I cannot afford a respec.

Bull.

There is no build in this game that relies entirely on one skill and one skill only.

Lolimpulse.

Maverick827 wrote: »

bothnutz wrote: »

You have no reason to respec because a passive got nerfed. There is plenty of skill points in ESO and the only reason you should be respecing is if you need different morphs.

This is just false. I'd need 20+ skill points to be as proficient in another weapon style and another armor style (because heavy armor was only viable with shield bash). You can't just "go get" 20 points easily.

You do not need 20 points into another weapon set for it to be effective. At VR1 I started using dual wielding after using 2handers 1-50. The only reason I started using dual wielding was so that I could use saviours hide set and akaviri dragonguard together to get my WW cost to about 500. I still use dual wield at vr3, infact, its my go to pve weapon set. Do you want to know how many points I have in it? 2, I have 2 points in dual wield, only for blood craze. It is still effective. It would be more effective if I had more points in it but it is not at all necessary.

Maverick827 wrote: »

bothnutz wrote: »

If you are changing your entire tanking weapon set because of a nerf to a passive that prevents you from dealing damage.... Im sorry but Im going to have to call you on your ***. The onehand/shield is still the best bet for tanking... like what else are you going to tank with? 2h? c'mon...

Who said anything about tanking? Solo leveling with 1H/Shield is now essentially impossible. You're also entirely false about tanking; the most optimal tank spec is a DPS spec, because PvE content in this game is so easy that you don't even need a tank.

Easy game? until they nerfed your op *** to be balanced! LOL!

Maverick827 wrote: »

bothnutz wrote: »

you have been abusing this in pvp and now want to respec to the new fotm, admit it.

I don't PvP. Stop assuming things.

so you just walk around playing easy game? and then get mad when it gets hard? lol...

Maverick827 wrote: »

bothnutz wrote: »

Deal with the consequences of being a trend hopping tool, give up some of your imaginary pretend virtual money and quit crying like a ***.

The only "tool" here is you.

Im entirely convinced, buff shield bash and free respecs for all!

EvilEmpire wrote: »

bothnutz wrote: »

You have no reason to respec because a passive got nerfed. There is plenty of skill points in ESO and the only reason you should be respecing is if you need different morphs. I currently have 7 points in light armour I wore for half a week and have no intention of using again, and I have 3 fighters guild ability I haven't used since vamp Nerf, 2 of them morphed. Thats 10+ skill points I haven't used for weeks.

If you are changing your entire tanking weapon set because of a nerf to a passive that prevents you from dealing damage.... Im sorry but Im going to have to call you on your ***. The onehand/shield is still the best bet for tanking... like what else are you going to tank with? 2h? c'mon... you have been abusing this in pvp and now want to respec to the new fotm, admit it. Deal with the consequences of being a trend hopping tool, give up some of your imaginary pretend virtual money and quit crying like a ***.

You have no concept AT ALL how nerfed this kind of build took. You're just happy it got *** over because you got tired of getting your ass handed to you in pvp. just another fotm who screams 'l2p!', when all you do is change your skills to whichever is most over powered. No doubt I've seen you running through trying to form sorc aoe grind groups in every map.

No flavour of the month here m8.
I play a 2handed orc nightblade werewolf. My entire build is a a Roleplay of this.

http://classic.battle.net/war3/orc/units/blademaster.shtml

I have made this type of character in both oblivion and skyrim, and am having a great time playing it in ESO. Unlike most MMO players I acknowledge that this is a role playing game, and play it as such. Basing most of my characters/builds off of some sort of them or archetype. In doing this I acknowledge I will not be the most effective in pvp, but I would like to play this game semi competitively without hearing a WHOOOOOOOOOOOSH followed by some *** grunting away as he shoves his shield into my ass for the next 10 seconds dealing more damage than any other weapon set and perma blocking at the same time.

EvilEmpire wrote: »

The problem is, the whole sword and board skill line is garbage now. It's not because one skill got nerfed. It changes the whole dynamic of how a character plays.

It is not garbage... ive played it without any points invested, it is still the most stamina efficient weapon set when it comes to blocking. Not only that, You get addition armour for having a shield equipped and one more peice of equipment for +stats from enchanting.

EvilEmpire wrote: »

I play a DK. Up until VR3, I played full 2h dps with heavy armor. My focus was in stamina and used a mix of the dk skills and 2h weps, but more points in stamina. Once I got to VR3, and mob groups were often 3-4, it sucked being a 2h dps because I was constantly on the ropes if I didn't get at least one or two mobs killed within a few seconds. I play solo, so this is a big factor. It was also quite disappointing to see a sorc come spamming their aoe *** and just knocking everything down to nothing, while I was having to work my ass off in every fight, even trash mobs.

So I decided I needed a better way to get the mob count down to give me a better chance to live through the fight. I just couldn't charge in like a madman and kill 4 mobs with ease anymore. Since I'm a stamina build, I figure bow is a great choice as a secondary wep, and I can just try and pick one mob off, maybe wear them down a little before I switch to 2h and go in clean up. Bow is a nightmare because of the high stamina cost and such low return, that it just wasn't worth it. I tried, but at VR3, trying to level the bow up was tough. Maybe if I already had it to level 50, I'm sure it'd be better, but there just wasn't enough roi, especially considering the problems with my theory of quick weapon swapping in the midst of the fight. That just doesn't happen.

So had to respec. Being a stamina char, I move on to sword and board. It becomes my primary and 2h is my secondary. I was so pleasantly surprised at how well this build performed, that I wished I had picked it up sooner. On my skill bar I have 3 DK skills and 2 shield skills. Most of my stats are in stam, but I still have enough mag to through some dk attacks. Mostly those are DoT skills that don't do much damage up front (especially with low mag...since I'm a stam build focused on the wep lines) but are nice to through around. I can keep my shield up, through my DoTs, and puncture and bash. Now I was surviving. I had good dps and could actually be a tank and solo through most of the content.


So then comes the patch. Now bash doesn't do ***. There goes a lot of the dps. because even my dk skills aren't that powerful, especially with low mag. Hell, sometimes my dk attacks would do 60 damage...which now at VR7, doesn't cut it. The more I have to spam my dk skills, the open and susceptible I am to counter attack, basically defeating the purpose of having my shield up to being with. So now I do WAY less dps, block seems to cost more and do a lot less, and take away the ability to use bash effectively, and all of sudden my char is nothing like it used to be. I through my dk skills all day, but since they barely do any damage, but I keep using them until my mag is going because I have to try and kill off a mob, which means I'm wide open with no blocking, so take a LOT more damage, and the fights last too long because I can't do any dps anymore, whether it be with my low mag dk skills, or with my shield.


So basically, all stamina builds are basically *** in this game. So now what? Do I have to respec again and change my entire build to become a mag char instead of stamina? Wtf should I have to do that? So now I have to start building light armor into my build too? I just spent countless hours trying to get my med armor built up with 5hvy 2med setup to help with my stamina build. So it's not a matter of 'l2p!' - it's basically that all stamina lines just went to *** because that was basically the only one worth a damn. It gave defense, plus the ability to do some damage (and at a very high stamina cost, so wasn't like a freebie). Maybe I should just be like a lot of *** (I'm pointing my finger at you) and just build the next FoTM char and forget the whole 'play as you want' *** I was told I could do.

Basically what this patch has done for me is take all the fun out of my char. My entire build feels incompetent now. Nerfing bash so drastically causes a cascade effect and destroyed the last of the worthwhile stamina weapon line skill lines. Even for those of us know how to play and didn't use just bash,bash,bash as our only tactic, the sword and board build just got *** on.

And don't even get me started on this *** I have seen with my gf and her templar build. It's worse for her because she is a hvy armor stamina build. She was more support roll/tank style, and now she can't solo more than 1 mob at a time.



My beef is, I don't want to *** build a full on magicka char in light armor just to feel effective, especially in the solo questing play. If I wanted to do that ***, I would've been a mage and put all my time into Cloth instead of Blacksmithing. And since my whole skill line just went to *** because of a patch, at the very least, they could offer me is free respec, because right now, this game is more pissing me off and getting me fired up than being fun like it used to be. I'm so close to just saying *** it and cancelling our subs. Hell, I even just found the Daedric motif, but I'm so annoyed at the game, and the thought that I'm going to have to even respec AGAIN out of necessity, not because I want to try something different, that I got zero excitement from the find.

8*)

subecsanur wrote: »

Why should there be any cost in a respec? We have already paid so much for this game and to actually enjoy the options for a character that we have leveled for days and now you want us to pay so much so that we can actually enjoy the options our characters came with?

It should be free, or at least a free for each 50 lvls or at the end of each of Caldwell's almanac timeline at least.

Some people pay money for this game expecting it not to be easy mode and pander to little kids that want everything for free. Should we have free legendary mats/gear mailed to you every time you resub?

Why is paying for a respec so out of the question for you? at vr3 I've bought a basic horse, 2 horses for friends, respeced at least 3 times, reset attributes 5 times, I'm still sitting on 50k I don't know what to do with (the funny thing is I want to respec but I find it really annoying and time consuming). Every time I go questing for an hour I come back to town with 2k worth of *** in my bags. It's imaginary money, its not real, get over it.

No, however I'd like to see a reduction in the cost of respecing.

In SWTOR, whenever they do a balance change, they refund all ability points. ESO should do the same.

Maverick827 wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

If only you could get more magicka through gear or attribute points...

What you're describing is a self-induced problem.

Attribute points, which require another expensive respec, and gear, which won't even give enough magicka to cover the cost of 1 DK spell.

4900 gold at VR is expensive? I think you have other problems...

And math is for everyone. Your DK abilities do not cost over 2k magicka.

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Maverick827 wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

If only you could get more magicka through gear or attribute points...

What you're describing is a self-induced problem.

Attribute points, which require another expensive respec, and gear, which won't even give enough magicka to cover the cost of 1 DK spell.

4900 gold at VR is expensive? I think you have other problems...

And math is for everyone. Your DK abilities do not cost over 2k magicka.

5k is about 5k more than anyone should spend to respec because Zenimax didn't refund all skills when they deliberately nerfed one of the most popular builds in the game.

As far as magicka is concerned, we're talking about re-enchanting gear. White VR1 magicka glyphs don't give more than 400 magicka across 7 pieces of armor, even Infused, whereas most DK abilities cost more than that. Unless you're saying I should spend even more gold and buy blue+ glyphs from players? To use just for leveling?

How about just lowering the cost of respecs so that the game's tagline of "play how you want to play" isn't nearly as ironic as it is now.

Sakiri wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Maverick827 wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

I love that this is a stealthy attempt to just lower the price of respecs.

If your skill was changed, the points were refunded. If your skill wasn't changed, you don't need a refund.

One skill can make or break an entire build. My entire build was broken, and I cannot play my main until I respec. I cannot afford a respec.

Bull.

There is no build in this game that relies entirely on one skill and one skill only.

Lolimpulse.

Bull again. I play an impulse build for PvE. Still working perfectly after the increase in magicka cost.

Also there is no way at all respec could cost 40k+. 100g for each skill point. The maximum number for skillpoints per character is 300. Obviously it cannot cost more than 30k. Let alone characters in their 20s with not even 100 skillpoints.