thx we'll add this to the growing list of subjective personal drama threads. and as a side note angry joe is a complete muppet.

After reading the patchnotes I too decided that this game isnt worth my time. Which breaks my heart, because I want to love it sooo much.

According to some of Angry Joes guildies, he hadn't got much past level 15 when he made that infamous review and had spent most of that time in Cyrodiil.

I don't agree at all that this game is likely to fail, my kin is very active and we all love it.

One member was asking if we were reserving the guild name for Wildstar (guild plays various other mmos too) and the vast vast majority of players said they had no intention of playing it and were more than happy being here for the long haul.

Sure sometimes it feels like we're playing a beta (depending on what we are doing in game) but the sheer amount of pleasure we are all getting from this game, coupled with the fact that Zenimax is fixing numerous bugs on a very regular basis, for us the future looks very bright.

I took an alt through the same areas I took my main, DC starter areas, Glenumbra etc, and it was like playing a different game, didn't have one issue (completed all areas), didn't have to relog once to finish a quest and when I did the dungeons on my alt, I didn't have one bot on any of them (sure there's numerous bots harvesting nodes that needs to be dealt with). My main did the whole of Rivenspire also with zero problems.

If I compare that with when I started my main at early release, it's like playing an entirely different game (in a good way)

I'm now level 42 and am loving PvP as well as PvE, I tend to play PvP with 4 or 5 other guild mates in a group, 2 vet level, the rest around my level and we have enormous fun. The only time we started not enjoying it is before the vamps were nerfed, that nerfing was the best thing for the overall balance of PvP in our opinion, yet thread after thread was raging about it.

Of course I understand if you played a vamp, you would feel aggrieved, my point is that often we see just one side of things that can look bad for us, but for the majority its a good thing.

When polls etc appear on this site saying things like "should Zenimax do a roll back......" they are more often than not started with someone who has a problem with an area of the game. And usualkly most polayers taking part in such a poll will be those having the biggest problems sith the game.

Very few members of my guild ever read these forums, the vast majority are happily playing, and out of those few that do read it, I think I'm the only one that actively takes part here. So, I'll pick a couple of polls a day old,

How long will you subscribe

31% (59 votes) here until the end
10% (20 votes) One year or more
2% (5 votes) nine months to one year
5% (10 votes) six months to nine months
14% (28 votes) three months to six months
15% (29 votes) one month to three months
7% (15 votes) One month or less
12% (23 votes) I'm already unsubbed

That tells us absolutely nothing about what the average player feels, all it tells us is what the few people that frequent this forum feel.

A total of 189 voted. Even is there was only 5000 actual players, 189 is a very small amount, less than 4% (and 23 aren't even playing the game).

Are you happy with the current state of the game?

23% (207 votes) Yes
26% (234 votes) No
42% (372 votes) Could be better
7% (63 votes) unsubbed.

63 people who have decided not to sub, voted that they are unhappy with the state of the game, wow, what a surprise, I thought they would have voted that they loved it

207 players seem very happy with it, obviously playing in areas where quests are working, and bots not affecting them too much.

372 players say could be better. That could mean anything. It could mean there's areas of game play they really dislike and would like changing. Or it could be that they absolutely love the way the games designed, but the bots and some of the bugs are getting in their ways hence could be better.

The 234 that said no, could also fall into exactly the same category, they might not be happy die to the way certain things work, or it may simply be they are tired of broken quests, bots, long Cyrodiil load times etc.

My point being, that doesn't really tell us anything about the future of the game, or in any way how much people like what has been designed. All it shows us is that things need improving, and with the release of the latest patch, it looks like many many many things have been improved.

I've played a few MMOs, sometimes huge patches go smoothly, but sometimes they introduce more bugs. I'm a bot surprised they released this patch at the end of the week (holiday weekend in the UK), I would have thought it better at the beginning of the week, so that they had a few days of full staffing levels to fix any urgent stuff.

I've read a few of the issues people are having with the new patch, And with it, people saying the game is finished etc.

And there's more polls.

Should patch 1.1.2 be rolled back?

30% (81 votes) Yes
24% (66 Votes) No
26% (71 votes) Too much damage has been done regardless of resolution
19% (52 votes) I have no issues with the latest patch.

Again just 270 votes in total out og how many players?

152 would like a roll back or say things are too damaged
118 don't want a rollback (whether the 66 that voted no have any problems, the poll doesn't show this)

Obviously something has gone wrong and a hotfix is urgently needed, but this does happen on huge games like this, and when people log in and find themselves faced with a problem in their area of the game, the natural thing to do is come on here and complain (I know I do when things are wrong)

But once that's sorted, most people will calm down and be happy again.

Any new mmo will get players joining and leaving in the first 3 months, due to the game not living up to what they believed it would be, that does not mean the game is failing at all.

Some players will play unbalanced characters that spoil the game for everyone else, and will quit when the devs make their character work properly as they can no longer totally obliterate the other players (Vamps) yet most players are much happier with the nerf.

Don't forget that while a few players who love the game like me, go to these forums when we can't get near the computer to play (at work etc ), most people come to these forums when there is something they dislike.

Its the same for any forum, a product gets released, 10000 are happy using it, 200 aren't, those 200 go to the forum and it looks like the product is doomed.

I honestly think that in the first 6 months, the negativity will continue a lot, many people will leave, and those like me that believe we have at last found something different that we really love, will be happily playing for years. In a few months, hopefully those no longer playing will have moved on to an mmo they like, and those actually still playing (or those that left due to bugs but really want to come back when they are fixed) can talk here and in other forums about what we love and what we loath in the game.

At the moment, it often feels like (not aimed at all at the OP) almost any thread on here discussing anything, we get told the games doomed to failure etc and to be honest, it gets a little boring to keep reading the same thing by the same posters (many who are no longer playing) over and over again, and when people who are loving the game say so, we get told we are fanbois etc.

I'm not saying the game doesn't need a lot of work, bots, balancing, bugs etc

What I am saying is that the more I play, the more I progress through the PVE areas (and at the same time spend a few evenings a week having fun in Cyrodiil), the more awesome I find this game.

Not going to give any spoilers, some of the quest chains I have done, the stories etc, the amount of work and great design I see, sometimes I wonder if I'm playing the same game as others (I do realise some people aren't interested in PvE) . I honestly find many of the quests simply jaw dropingly awesome, some of the best quests I've seen in an mmo.

Sure this game has a lot of negative press, it had a fair amount before people even got their hands on any beta. A game of this size will have people giving strong opinions one way or another, and it's become trendy to diss heavily hyped games (not saying anyone on here is doing that, just saying that on other gaming sites, I doubt half the people complaining have actually even played further than the beta)