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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861

Are All DPS Created Equal

Jeddahwe
Jeddahwe
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Ranged DPS so say Staff in light armor, ranged DD caster/wizard types, are they created equal DPS wise in PvE dungeons?

Now I know DK's may do more DPS as a caster type but its melee and I don't like melee game play, as ranged so the other 3 classes.

Thanks
  • temjiu
    temjiu
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    short and skinny, NO. They can't make all "DPS" the same, as there are no real set DPS specs. all classes can access 90% of the skills in the game, and no one skill is required to access another (with the exception of morphs of course). The rest of this is a long winded explanation of the differences in the classes and weapons.

    The good news is that if you pay attention to skills, their descriptions and the results you get, you can do just fine in most groups. paying attention (a.k.a. avoiding bad stuff, interrupting and blocking at key times) is far more critical in group runs then just doing 5% more DPS then the guy next to you. if that was enough info for you, read no further. but I'm at work and bored, so here ya go!

    I honestly can't tell you how they internally balance skills in this game, but i can tell you for sure that even using the same weapons, different classes will yield different DPS results.

    There are simply too many combinations to say one is different or better then the other. there are a few baselines you can plan on though. here's a brief laymans idea of each weapon and class. keep in mind that you can easily offest a weapons weaknesses with a classes strengths, and vice versa.

    Also, standard disclaimer. these thoughts are the opinion of the writer only, and do not express the opinion of the devs and yada yada....

    Bow - often more control and mobility then other weapon types. it's all about kiting and keeping out of the way. got a few nice high damage openers, but its really more about whittling your opponent down.

    2 handed - burst damage. also high stamina use. IMO has one of the most enjoyable melee combinations in the game. charge - uppercut - charge is a blast.

    1 handed + shield - mitigation and tanking stats. has the only "taunt" skill in the game for weapons (a few classes have some).very solid weapon for play, even if it is a bit slow. hint: shield bash is your friend.

    destro staff - pure damage really. AoE or single target, pick your flavor. it just lights things up.

    Resto staff - the only healing option for non-templar classes. mostly...healing.

    Dual wield - balance of single and AoE skills. effective long term damage output, and manages stamina better then 2h. doesn't have charge and uppercut though, so minor loss there :). on the serious side, it doesn't' have any innate gap closers. a nice ranged ability higher up though.

    Classes are a bit whonky In my opinion at the moment. Even outside of PvP, there needs to be more balance work done in order for all classes to really be on an even playing field. keep in mind that my descriptions below are for the class skills ONLY. any weapon you throw into the mix can balance things.

    Dragonknight - probably the most powerful class at this point. some feel its OP, some feel its the only truly "balanced" class in the game atm. most skills are instant cast, low resources. solid blend of damage and mitigation skills...but mostly melee. very few ranged options. But they're all about fire. fire, and DoT's. if you like fire, and you like being the flavor of the month, roll DK.

    Sorceror - typical mage type class. lots of elemental damage, mostly ranged. But they have some real interesting skills that lend well to melee builds as well, so don't reject them if your not into casting. most of their skills are at a heavy magick cost, but they also have the most magick regen passives in the game (for a class)

    Templar - mix of ranged and melee. caster and physical damage dealer. Also the only class with a tree dedicated to healing. doesn't make them the best healers, but certainly the easiest to heal with. They lack in magick regeneration as a weak point, but have some very nice tanking skills.

    Nightblade - A dark sorceror and a thief got together and had cute little babies. mix of casting, sneak, and some healing. mostly single target, and right now they are struggling with allot of bugs. but it doesn't stop players from completing VR content with them. VERY high single target damage, especially if you use stealth or sneak allot.

    Edited by temjiu on May 21, 2014 9:14PM
  • Thesiren
    Thesiren
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    Temjiu,

    I'd love to work where you work. Before I could even indent the first sentence, my bosses would fire me. :p
  • temjiu
    temjiu
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    Thesiren wrote: »
    Temjiu,

    I'd love to work where you work. Before I could even indent the first sentence, my bosses would fire me. :p

    Hehe it has its advantages. the downside is i have to take it home with me..and get calls at 3am...and do maintenance at odd hours.

    But i certainly get my downtime!
  • Jeddahwe
    Jeddahwe
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    Thanks for that write up! I am leveling a NB with double destruction staff and having lots of fun...I was surprised to hear from someone that if I wanted to play ranged caster DD I should not continue with NB as they will never do the same DPS as a DK or Sorcerer with staff/light armor and casting!

    PS: I wish Bow was more than just for kiting, I wish it could DPS just as well as Destruction Staff...I don't see why not staff also has a KD/KB!
    Edited by Jeddahwe on May 22, 2014 4:53AM
  • temjiu
    temjiu
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    Jeddahwe wrote: »
    Thanks for that write up! I am leveling a NB with double destruction staff and having lots of fun...I was surprised to hear from someone that if I wanted to play ranged caster DD I should not continue with NB as they will never do the same DPS as a DK or Sorcerer with staff/light armor and casting!

    PS: I wish Bow was more than just for kiting, I wish it could DPS just as well as Destruction Staff...I don't see why not staff also has a KD/KB!

    If it makes you feel any better Jedda, I'm currently using a Bow on my templar and really enjoying it.

    It's not as much the weapon you choose as how you integrate the weapon with your class. as an example, a nightblade with a destro staff is a pretty enjoyable combo. the destro gives you some needed ranged and AoE skills, and you still have stealth and some really high damage single target skills from the NB trees...and put a resto staff in an NB's hands, and they become pretty potent healers. Even without the resto staff, and NB has enough heals to keep themselves going. a pretty survivable class.

    The guidelines I put above give you an idea of what each category is ONLY if you took them individually. This is rarely the case (as my above example with the NB destro staff user shows).

    Example: my current build for my templar in VR content is bow, with 2h on switch. bow provides some much needed kiting ability, and the 2h provides some high burst damage up front. the Templar class allows for healing that I otherwise wouldn't have from the 2 weapons I chose..and some nice ranged alternatives as well.

    And your no stuck with just 2 weapons. I've actually leveled 4 so far on my templar...I only have skills in 3 of them atm, and only use 2....but there are enough skill points in the game that you have some flexibility later on. so feel free to try out a few, and see what works for you.
  • Hawke
    Hawke
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    @temjiu‌ put it well as far as descriptions for the weapons.

    Basically everyone can be exactly the same, no matter the class if they only invest points into and use the same weapon/armor skills. DPS is then only a matter of how you use it, AKA your skill.

    Not even touching class skills, you have world (Soul Magic and Vampire/Werewolf) skills, and Guild Skills, which everyone has access to.

    So again everyone is on equal footing no matter their class.

    Remember, you only get 6 slots for abilities, to include the Ultimate. So out of all those choices, now you have to figure out, "is this skill worthwhile to take" and "Does this skill mesh well with how I want to fight". One skill might be better to take with another, but not work well with other skills.

    Basically, if you have all skills that work within 5 meters of someone and you are using a melee weapon... you really should take a closure skill. You dont have to, but it might help you out. Or if all your abilities are ranged, but you really want that extra defense and you use shield, you dont need a closure skill.

    It's all about what you want.

    To your original question... DPS... You want your skills to be focused with whichever ability scores you have been investing in (Magicka or Stamina or both) But you do want at least one stamina based attack to help bolster your DPS (you are attacking, not defending) to launch that alpha attack. Or if you are using all stamina based skills (weapons except for the staves) then you want at least one magicka based skill for the same reason.

    Hope that helps a little bit.
  • AngersRevenge
    AngersRevenge
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    From my experience, for single target damage melee out weighs ranged by a long shot. I play a Nighblade and have destro staff, bow, 2 hander, and dual wield skills maxed out (yes. all of them). While I enjoy ranged combat more, for a pure DPS go with dual wield for single target. Regardless of what gear I had on it always out DPS'd any of the other weapons. If you are looking for AoE DPS damage you can't beat impulse from the destro staff. But for impulse you be in melee range.

    While any class can "fill" any role or play style they aren't equal IMO. ZOS might say tehy are all good at everything. In actual play they are not. In the current state of the game there is a reason you see more Dragon Knights and Sorcerers than any other class, because they are not equal as it stand right now.
    Edited by AngersRevenge on May 22, 2014 6:25PM
    A true warrior never reveals his heart. Until the axe rips it from his chest.
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