I support this.

Being a vet7 templar , i can say , i wont lvl an alt , that is for sure.

I do realise now that the templar is a healer , and nothing else , dont try to come here and say "I dps" or "i tank", you are subpar at best , so that whole "play the way you want , bla bla bla" is a lie.

I wish i could change my class , chances are i would still play this game after i get
to vet10 , but i dont see it happening :P.

I spent the majority of my free month trying to decide what class to play, I played each sooo many times, in each faction over more than a few races.

I'd still say NO to Class Changing.

We need a Morrowind online with skill attacks
I thought this was going to be it.. yet i got stuck with class choices anyways =(

Also as far as class selection goes, they never should have had classes, nor should they make every class skill tree available all at once. When you go to spend your talents they should have made you select one of the "class" skill trees as your main skill tree, and allowed you to spec into the three sub trees of that "class".

Then If you wanted to use say, Sorc skill lines instead of Nightblade, you would go respec at a shrine and choose a different main skill tree.

Let's face it, with the Vet zones no one is ever going to level an alt.

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

Akuydab14_ESO wrote: »

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

I support this.

Being a vet7 templar , i can say , i wont lvl an alt , that is for sure.

I do realise now that the templar is a healer , and nothing else , dont try to come here and say "I dps" or "i tank", you are subpar at best , so that whole "play the way you want , bla bla bla" is a lie.

I wish i could change my class , chances are i would still play this game after i get
to vet10 , but i dont see it happening :P.

You're an awful player then... I play Templar, and I Heal, Tank, and Damage.

I have Tanked and Dps'd all the V1-V5 dungeons, and had literally 0 problems with any fight in any instance, even though my groups first in any of the V dungeons the first time. We wiped a bit on the second boss in FG but that was mainly due to having two melee who weren't very observant.

Also you must not run Recount or Tactical Combat because you clearly have no idea what DPS is.

I've played DW swords, daggers, 2H, Destro staff, and I'm now leveling as Bowplar which is my favorite as of yet. I can legitimately say that your statements are false, misleading, and utterly devoid of fact.

Please leave the forums and stop posting BS that intentionally misleads players.

Mate , you are subpar.

You can accept the other classes do tank and dps better than you do , or you can be in denial all you want hehe.

In the end of the day , templar only shot for the best in the healer role , they "can" dps and tank , but they are not , the cant even , try for the best dps or tank.

While you are at it , others are doing min/max and showing how things work around here atm , lets pray that 1.1 and craglorn change things.

Sorry, mate, you're bad, and you're wrong, like I said, please leave and stop trying to troll\act like you know what you're talking about. Later.

Akuydab14_ESO wrote: »

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

Akuydab14_ESO wrote: »

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

I support this.

Being a vet7 templar , i can say , i wont lvl an alt , that is for sure.

I do realise now that the templar is a healer , and nothing else , dont try to come here and say "I dps" or "i tank", you are subpar at best , so that whole "play the way you want , bla bla bla" is a lie.

I wish i could change my class , chances are i would still play this game after i get
to vet10 , but i dont see it happening :P.

You're an awful player then... I play Templar, and I Heal, Tank, and Damage.

I have Tanked and Dps'd all the V1-V5 dungeons, and had literally 0 problems with any fight in any instance, even though my groups first in any of the V dungeons the first time. We wiped a bit on the second boss in FG but that was mainly due to having two melee who weren't very observant.

Also you must not run Recount or Tactical Combat because you clearly have no idea what DPS is.

I've played DW swords, daggers, 2H, Destro staff, and I'm now leveling as Bowplar which is my favorite as of yet. I can legitimately say that your statements are false, misleading, and utterly devoid of fact.

Please leave the forums and stop posting BS that intentionally misleads players.

Mate , you are subpar.

You can accept the other classes do tank and dps better than you do , or you can be in denial all you want hehe.

In the end of the day , templar only shot for the best in the healer role , they "can" dps and tank , but they are not , the cant even , try for the best dps or tank.

While you are at it , others are doing min/max and showing how things work around here atm , lets pray that 1.1 and craglorn change things.

Sorry, mate, you're bad, and you're wrong, like I said, please leave and stop trying to troll\act like you know what you're talking about. Later.

Ic , you went for denial , oh well , dont really matter.

And i do hope others see this , might save them a headache later down the line.

How i wish i had listened to people saying this would happen back when i just made my char lols.

But now im vet8 , and i will keep my templar , even if it subpar till vet10 so that i can finish the story , then i will wait for them to balance this game.

Milktray wrote: »

I've never agreed with the 'healer' only etc I had enough of prats going 'Healz ME' in Anarchy Online/SWG yada yada yada .. I've run a few Medics who healed but I also run some who mostly incapacitated the enemy.

I believe in 'run what you enjoy' not the running what everyone else thinks I should be. I have a Templar and he just throws out damage, maybe drive by heals. I don't care if he isn't top dog, it's not what I have him for, he's just to fry people :-)

If you dont mind it , then go for it .

tekhiunb16_ESO wrote: »

So I have been playing my sorc for a while now and I am on Vet 5 with it. I constantly think about creating another toon to try out different classes , however whenever I think that all achievements , lorebooks and skyshards have to be redone on that new toon it really discourages me, specially since i would also have to retrain all the skill lines that i have already on my current toon.

So I was thinking it would be a nice idea to allow us to change class once we hit lvl 50, just like we can reset our skills in game we could perhaps choose a different class and pay a gold fee (perhaps proportional to how many points you have in the skills of your current class). There could also be some sort of cool-down to prevent people from changing class over and over, something like a 15 day period .

So what do you guys think about this ?

check my post and see if you like the idea of "Class unlocking"

To the OP, never going to happen. However, there is still "spellcrafting" coming up. So, depending on what it actually is and how well designed it is, this might allow us to further customize our characters so that actual class skills become pretty meaningless.

I think that would be the best solution. And a far more interesting one.

Well, the biggest reason would be FOTM bandwagons. If everyone can change their classes, then you will lose a lot of the diversity in the game because most people will just be running whatever is considered OP right then.

Doing away with classes altogether and designing a classless, well balanced system would be better. We don't have that here, so I'd go with a "no" for class changes. Even though sometimes I'd like to toss lighting around.

I really think the best thing for devs would be to design a well thought out "do it yourself" spellcrafting and abilitycrafting system, where players can design their own abilities within a self-balancing framework. That way everyone can really play what they want and there is little bandwagoning outside of the minmaxer crowd.

Sandhya wrote: »

I enjoyed the little read. Now fire up Recount and compare your outgoing single target DPS to a NB, Sorc or DK.

You managed to completely miss my point. Those numbers are completely meaningless. I do not care that a DK, Sorc or a NB can kill something a few seconds faster than I can by stat dumping on a mob.

So what? If you have a templar tank in the group, will you wipe repeatedly? Of course not. If you have a templar DPS in the group, will it take you forever to kill stuff compared to other classes? No it will not.

If you solo veteran content with a templar, will you be faced with an impossible mission? Nope.

Will you suck at PvP? You can guess the answer (hint: it starts with an "n").

In actual gameplay the differences are negligible, broken mechanics aside (and never roll characters based on broken stuff, it'll get fixed before you get to abuse it properly). It only becomes apparent when you take apart actual gameplay and start looking at things through metrics and statistics.

Well guess what, if I want to do math instead of killing fantasy monsters I can just turn off the game, get back to work and get paid for my trouble.

Gaudrath wrote: »

OmniDo wrote: »

THIS is human nature, and ought to be encouraged.
Who wants to be mediocre and sub-par?

Well considering we're talking about a game where any and all results are virtual only, I guess I'd put pretty much anything before being "optimal".

Hell, sometimes I whip out a one-hander WITHOUT shield and play like that. Guess what, even that can be done. Why? Because I feel like it, because it's a game and nothing we do in the game matters one bit.

Well, except having fun, that's the only real purpose isn't it. As for human nature, it should be to think, first and foremost. Not to behave like automated rats in a maze, chasing imaginary rewards all optimal-like.

But you are right, it isn't. Sadly. I don't think that should be encouraged though, but if there is money to be made from it, I am sure it will be.

So you are also a "no" to the gift kind of person.
Why shouldnt we be able to get the fun of having access to everything..? if you dont like class changing then dont change your class yet let the rest of us that wants a bigger world get it.. please

Gaudrath wrote: »

Even when it's F2P, they won't allow people to change classes, because it keeps the players playing and a large playerbase means more income via various cash shops. Themeparks are like that, they have a very finite amount of content, so the only way to "freshen things up" is to play through that same content from a different angle. And if you allow players to change their classes, or skills as they see fit, you remove an important mechanism from the system: the "grass is always greener on the other side of the fence" one. If players can freely change their classes, they will not reroll, they will exhaust the "available" content that much sooner, and they will stop playing your game.

Except in this game players aren't rerolling. Unless you like zerg pvp once you hit v10 you've done everything there is to do. One of the strangest game designs I've seen to date is the vet ranks. It's so pointless and so boring it not only discourages rerolling or making alts, it discourages you from even continuing to the level cap. I can't imagine there's anything Zenimax can do that will cause their game to empty out faster, including allowing a class change.

Apricot wrote: »

Gaudrath wrote: »

Even when it's F2P, they won't allow people to change classes, because it keeps the players playing and a large playerbase means more income via various cash shops. Themeparks are like that, they have a very finite amount of content, so the only way to "freshen things up" is to play through that same content from a different angle. And if you allow players to change their classes, or skills as they see fit, you remove an important mechanism from the system: the "grass is always greener on the other side of the fence" one. If players can freely change their classes, they will not reroll, they will exhaust the "available" content that much sooner, and they will stop playing your game.

Except in this game players aren't rerolling. Unless you like zerg pvp once you hit v10 you've done everything there is to do. One of the strangest game designs I've seen to date is the vet ranks. It's so pointless and so boring it not only discourages rerolling or making alts, it discourages you from even continuing to the level cap. I can't imagine there's anything Zenimax can do that will cause their game to empty out faster, including allowing a class change.

You are mistaken. Players ARE rerolling. Read the forums a bit, you will see tons of posts from people who have multiple characters and complaining about the veteran grind.

I agree that tacking on vet content was done poorly, personally mostly because of how it messes with the story and character progression. This game suffers from trying to sit in two chairs at once. There is always a danger of falling on your arse if you do that.

They should have ditched the themepark classes and just designed a system where players can mix and match every single skill to their hearts content. It has been done before by some classic titles. But as I said, that's not considered profitable these days.

It is a difficult problem for game designers. On one hand, history shows us that sandbox games have a higher retention rate when it comes to players. On the other hand, times have changed and the crowd is different. People want to be handheld, they want instant gratification, online guides, they don't want to experiment, explore and work for their virtual achievements - they even get frustrated and unsub when they hit a difficult quest or encounter - something you didn't have back in the old days of Ultima and the like.

So it is a question whether an AAA title could be made as a sandbox - these days such games attract very loyal, but very niche gaming communities and it is hard to build a successful big business on that. So most companies choose the tried and true themepark route. ESO is actually more sandbox than most - and if they bring in spellcrafting as not just a fancy word for making quickslot items, I will be genuinely pleased.

But class changes? Won't happen. If this were a full sandbox game, that would be normal, but not in a themepark one.