Tbagging should not be a bannable offense

frogthroat · August 14

Northwold wrote: »

Am I missing something? This thread seems to be a rolling jamboree of replies that can be summarised to "I don't think it's toxic therefore I demand that I be able to do it because my view is logical" (without any actual logical argument) in response to every suggestion that the existing position is both more nuanced and more sensible than described.

It's hard to see why the people who don't have a problem with the existing policy -- relating to literally ONE player behaviour in specific circumstances -- are the "oversensitive" ones here?

It would help if people (like me) who don't think it's an issue would be told why it is such an issue to others. I genuinely don't understand why it upsets people.

In my headcanon it is currently "they killed me so at least I get back at them by reporting them for tbagging." I would like to revise my headcanon, but I have not seen any explanation why people take it so bad. I've seen many apples to oranges comparisons to irl stuff, but not why people actually feel... anything when they get tbagged in a video game.

I don't do it myself since that does not give me anything, but I am not against it either since that doesn't make me feel any strong emotions either.

Valkanos · August 14

Luneca wrote: »

Well, I once got reported for rolling and hitting the CTRL key once for "t-bagging" even though it was in Vengeance and the only way to reveal NBs at the time was to enter stealth and search like that. The person got irate and said I t-bagged them because their body happened to be there.

Yeah, someone is t-babbing when 3 NBs are attacking them in Vengeance? Person instablocked me and said they would report me. But I did not have action taken against me.

But it shows how subjective it can be to determine what is and is not t-bagging which is why the rule is a bad one. Any rule subject to interpretation many ways will always be a problem.

When hitting CTRL is a valid part of combat to enter stealth, you cannot even argue hitting it more than once is always t-bagging because sometimes the game does not register input (esp. this current patch with the client lagging and freezing once things starts heating up in Cyro).

So then we have to consider what' plausible and what's intentional, and at that point what good is a rule when it's not applied equally in the first place and subject to abuse or a situation can be misinterpreted?

It's similar to the dumb rule about stream sniping. I got warned before for firing siege defending a keep for stream sniping. If an AD scroll is at KC, guess where I am going to be to fire siege? I don't need to watch a stream to know AD will be coming, esp. when they always do after getting Sej/Drake. In fact, they should be expecting me and slotting siege. And siege shields. They really are allergic to that for some reason.

Rules like this do not actually add anything to the player experience. I don't really care if someone t-bags me in the game...and you know what? No one really has. Though they have placed a bunch of oils around my dead body and fired siege at it. I still don't get it to be honest.

"They placed a bunch of oils around my dead body."
And this is where the whole thing starts.... I really want to reply to this, but I’ll keep it simple.
I’m fully aware that what I see on my screen is just a virtual avatar, pixels, not my real self... So I won’t comment further on the tbagging rule.

7 pages, 211+ comments about tbagging…
It’s wild how much energy goes into something that doesn’t even exist outside the screen.

Pixiepumpkin · August 14

T-Baggin was not meant or even used as a form of sexual harassment contrary to what many believe.

T-Bagging is a taunt, a way to tell the other player "I gotcha!". Its a way to tell the try-hard player, the revenge player, that you recoginze who they are and that you "got em". Its rubbing salt into a wound, especially against those who keep coming for you. It can be used to taunt the player to keep gunning for you (this is actually a tactical approach in team play, I have used it many times).

T-bagging did not originate with the idea of resting a males private parts onto the other player, it originated with the crouching animation being the way to nonverbally communicate to the enemy player that again, "I got ya". Let me say this again, the crouching animation was used to NONVERBALLY COMMUNICATE to the enemy player that you "owned them/got them). The label "T-bagging" came later. It could have just as easily been labeled something differently but T-Bagging is what we got.

THEN later on, many years later the animation was weaponized by folks who could not handle that they "lost" the engagement.

Its an amazing animation. Even knowing full well what it does, what its designed for, even I can fall to emotion and get "bent out of shape" from being T-bagged. All that it means is that it's working as intended.

So much disinformation and misinformation around this topic its nauseating.

And frankly, people who want it banned, should not be PVPing in the first place, I say this from a mental health perspective.

Pixiepumpkin · August 14

frogthroat wrote: »

Northwold wrote: »

Am I missing something? This thread seems to be a rolling jamboree of replies that can be summarised to "I don't think it's toxic therefore I demand that I be able to do it because my view is logical" (without any actual logical argument) in response to every suggestion that the existing position is both more nuanced and more sensible than described.

It's hard to see why the people who don't have a problem with the existing policy -- relating to literally ONE player behaviour in specific circumstances -- are the "oversensitive" ones here?

It would help if people (like me) who don't think it's an issue would be told why it is such an issue to others. I genuinely don't understand why it upsets people.

If you break it down to the core, down to brass tax it essentially means "you got schooled".

IF there is anything I have learned in this world is that no one (unless they are in class) wants to be educated on any given topic, people think they know everything and would rather maintain that mindset vs learning, or learning to get better.

When someone is T-bagged, it means they are dead and got outplayed, and they simply can't handle it. This is why if you kill someone a few times in a match, they will start coming for you out of revenge. They feel that they need to "prove" to the enemy player that they are not bad at playing their class.

This is why there will always be an outcry for "balance" in PVP. Even when things are close to balanced, someone will always get outplayed and they will always want to blame it on someone else/refuse to acknowlege that someone is better than them.

T-Bagging works because players perfectly on human psychology.

Nemesis7884 · August 14

Just use an ingame emote then...
Seems really weird to me that this would be important to anyone but hey...

YffresTrill · August 14

Directing insults at someone because they lost to you is the height of cringe and frankly pathetic, embarrassing behaviour.

That said, I would not report someone for doing it personally, because I do not like censorship or nannying (but I also do not PVP because I do not enjoy PVP or any competitive activity).

I do not believe it should be bannable. I do think it is inherently disrespectful and says a lot about the person doing it, and trying to defend it is baffling to me.

(Edit for clarity).

aetherix8 · August 14

This topic just keeps coming back. I remember reading another bagging thread some years ago, and one user posted about their friend who was a SA survivor, and who refused to ever try PvP in any game because they knew that bagging would trigger their trauma. I wish I could find this post, but life is too short to browse vanilla forums. Just to say that although tbag has nothing to do with SA, it still has the potential to trigger some people in a very painful way. That's why if someone ask tbagger to stop, they should just stop.

ZOS_Icy · August 14

Greetings,

After review, we have decided it is best to close this thread to prevent further derailment and off-topic posts. When making threads, we ask that they be civil, constructive, and kept within the Community Guidelines. If there may be any questions in regards to the rules, please feel free to review them here.

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