The moment they announced that ESO content would be free going forward and the tome thing with cometics i knew something would go bad. Like for real thing about it for a second, they just got rid of a certain income 3-4 times a year for cosmetics, from a business stand point this is madness.

Its not like i want to be throwing money at a game for no reason, but thats what pays the bill in the end.

Unfortunately, there are going to be a number of people (large or small, is too early to tell) who won't be aware that this is the case and will complain if the layoffs result in things being delayed or just taking longer in general now.

Hell, there will be people who ARE aware and will complain anyway, because some people have unrealistic expectations.

Soarora wrote: »

I see two paths: people who stay need to be patient and people who are impatient should vote with their absence. Both are valid paths but as a community, we shouldn’t let people bite those already hurting.

People will leave and I get it. I may leave myself I'll wait for info on the roadmap.

I just don't want the players who stay to give the team a hard time

They could and might wait longer for updates, or they will do something else more likely: move elsewhere where there is content flowing. Then maybe return.

See, this is the exact cycle that caused the game to decline in the first place. In a strange twist the game is circling back and pushing towards the same exact strategy that placed it in the predicament that it is currently in.

Let's just think about it clearly. What happened in the past 10 years that made the game start declining?

A lot of things happened, but the biggest and most egregious, and I am sure everyone will agree, was when ZOS simply did not listen or even communicate with the player base properly.

There was a time in the game when, during the PTS commenting on a graphics issue and poor performance actually got a response from the graphics development team. Do that now, and see if you ever get a response? It's ignored or seemingly ignored.

That lack of communication is a very bad thing because it makes whoever posted eventually believe that they don't matter. That they do not have a voice. That they don't have the power to effect change.

^ And that up there is when the game started declining. When less and less people bothered to even go to the PTS and provide feedback.

Used to be hundreds of names on the PTS forum. And the PTS server even had 100s of people or even 1000s actually logged in on it at one point, to the point that you can go to a random zone and go "anyone hereeeeeeeeee?" to troll and someone responded. On the PTS you might even duel someone that said "yah that seems pretty strong and probably needs a nerf" and then see your exact build get nerfed (even if you didn't agree and didn't like that result).

Compare the recent PTS over the past years after Greymoor. Nothing like the PTS before it. But you could still experience the same thing and see people on the PTS.

When it really started declining was the patches AFTER Oakensoul. And I'm not going to be extremely critical beyond to say this: silencing the people that didn't like the changes using various reasoning to stop them from saying it was a terrible change was not a wise strategy. Not in a business sense, and not in a professional customer-relations sense either.

And we saw the pushback. After that patch these forums declined, but the PTS turned literally dead. The testers that were all there before that gave input realized that none of it mattered. And the idea that power would be pushed (through mythics) at any cost for a sale became the general consensus of the community.

And that caused a large amount of players to simply step up and leave. I had over 90 friends with over 30 that would be on at various points of the day consistently. Today that number is 4. But most of them disappeared during Oakensoul, and then the decline continued from there and of course accelerated with subclassing and scribing.

And the thing is that most of them also participated in the PTS previously.

A lot of them are on my Discord, and even one that I met in another game said "wow, ESO is still around?"

And I said "yes"

And they said "Did it improve?"

And I asked them what they meant. They said " did the devs actually start taking what people were saying about the game seriously?" and they expounded on difficulty modes , better progression, and of course: balance.

They last played when Arcanist was released and said the game sucked when one class was simply outdoing everyone else. The said that ESO was a game where you just pay for power or fall behind. And they still believe it to be so and refuse to return to the game.

So, when I told them about the changes, they did log in. They went to PvP, saw DK, saw WW (they play an NB). Got destroyed and asked a very simple question: how is what they did with the rework any different than what happened with Arcanists' release and why should I play a game that is balanced so poorly when I can just go play another game?

And of course I could not answer them. Because even I think it is bad. I'm not going to run a noise screen for a change I don't agree with. They laughed and logged off. And they haven't logged back into the game.

The game will most likely end up like swtor, not technically in maintenance mode but will feel like it due to how long it will take for updates to come out compared to the past.

I'm sure we will still get stuff like class reworks, but it will take a lot longer and may not be to the level that dk and maybe warden was.

Game will be dead in a year especially PvP if things are left unchecked like they are now I for one will be done at the drop of update 51 if there are not any serious balancing changes because its look the class refresh is definitely going to take a major hit

Major_Soulless wrote: »

I just wanted to say my heart goes out to those laid off today. You put a lot of time into making ESO enjoyable for us as players and you are all appreciated.

Now back on topic with these layoffs obviously content will be slower in being released and it's understandable, I'm just hoping the community is understanding that there's now half the staff working on the game and don't start complaining when content is slower being released.

I think the game will survive I really do but it will survive in a better state if people are patient going forward

I completely disagree with the idea that players should just "be patient." Understanding the situation doesn't mean we have to pretend it's acceptable. I don't wanna wait until my hands are wrinkly and shaky before I can enjoy the nightblade rework. Its outright disrespectful if not straight up entitled behavior to expect players to simply absorb the consequences of a company's internal decisions and continue to play like nothing happened.

The whole "just be patient" idea feels like going to a restaurant and being expected to leave a bigger tip because the place is understaffed and the waiters are overworked. I can sympathize with the employees and still be unhappy that I'm waiting twice as long for the same meal at the same price. Those aren't contradictory positions.

The same applies here. If the team has been reduced and updates become slower or less ambitious, that's unfortunate. I don't blame the developers who are left, and I certainly don't blame the ones who were laid off. They're simply working with the situation they've been given. What annoys me the most is seeing other players enforcing the idea that suddenly lowering your expectations is a good and healthy thing for the game, which is also a behavior I expect to see in official communications moving onward, and rather soon. Players still invest their time and money into ESO. ESO+ doesn't suddenly become 50% cheaper because the next class rework takes six months instead of three, or because major content updates arrive less frequently.

Being disappointed with slower / lower quality development isn't the same as lacking empathy. You can feel sorry for the people affected while also expecting the product you're paying for to maintain the level of quality and support you've come to expect. Those two positions can coexist.

The layoffs aren't the players' fault, so I don't think it's reasonable to expect the community to "deal with it". Empathy for the people affected and dissatisfaction with the outcome are not mutually exclusive.

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

My plan is to continue playing the game I enjoy and look forward to its updates. I just had a great time at Tamriel Pride, have had fun in Battlegrounds and around town, and even found new amazing housing builds.

I think it's way too early for people to be acting like the game is going away within a year or two, though that's always possible with any business as it considers its bottom line. I think people's eagerness to "call it" early isn't going to make anyone have more fun or help anyone in any way. I'm going to enjoy the game, make new builds, and spend time in the zones and social circles that I enjoy whether the game makes it past 20 years or not.

I haven’t caught up with all of threads here about it, but I think this probably means no more updates for us. I assume the class rework will be halted and we will be stuck with what we have now. That would be terribly unfortunate, but it seems the only realistic expectation at this point, unless someone official comes on here to say otherwise. They all seem to be under a gag order about it right now from what I have seen.

I will still be here as long as there are enough in my faction in GH to PvP and I can still do housing. If they want to keep the lights on, they need to start working on making ESO+ a worthwhile investment as well. I will sub for housing, but there is not much reason otherwise to do so.

No, the community will NOT have to learn to wait longer for content updates. We don't have to just accept whatever is thrown at us. We have options, and for me passive acceptance isn't one of them.

Ardriel wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

No, the community will NOT have to learn to wait longer for content updates. We don't have to just accept whatever is thrown at us. We have options, and for me passive acceptance isn't one of them.

What do you suggest? Stop playing? Cancel eso+ sub? Or keep playing but stop paying?

I think cancelling subs may be helpful. It would be very inconvenient to play without it but I don't want to monetarily support what has been done.

I very rarely spend crowns for anything, beyond the free ones I get with subbing. But then those would be gone, too.

But I think expressing our distaste to Microsoft themselves is also something we can do. Whether or not it would do any good is doubtful but being heard is important in my opinion.

No longer playing would be a tough call to make. I have put so many hours into this game and my characters and my houses, and made some good friends. That is a tough one to consider.

So we do have options. None of them are easy choices but we don't have to just learn to live with bad situations.

Major_Soulless wrote: »

I just wanted to say my heart goes out to those laid off today. You put a lot of time into making ESO enjoyable for us as players and you are all appreciated.

Now back on topic with these layoffs obviously content will be slower in being released and it's understandable, I'm just hoping the community is understanding that there's now half the staff working on the game and don't start complaining when content is slower being released.

I think the game will survive I really do but it will survive in a better state if people are patient going forward

We knew this before yesterdays events.

SilverBride wrote: »

Ardriel wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

No, the community will NOT have to learn to wait longer for content updates. We don't have to just accept whatever is thrown at us. We have options, and for me passive acceptance isn't one of them.

What do you suggest? Stop playing? Cancel eso+ sub? Or keep playing but stop paying?

I think cancelling subs may be helpful. It would be very inconvenient to play without it but I don't want to monetarily support what has been done.

I very rarely spend crowns for anything, beyond the free ones I get with subbing. But then those would be gone, too.

But I think expressing our distaste to Microsoft themselves is also something we can do. Whether or not it would do any good is doubtful but being heard is important in my opinion.

No longer playing would be a tough call to make. I have put so many hours into this game and my characters and my houses, and made some good friends. That is a tough one to consider.

So we do have options. None of them are easy choices but we don't have to just learn to live with bad situations.

Unfortunately if we unsub to show our distaste to MS we also hurt the employees at ZOS. I don’t think it would result in the outcome you want either.