Tamriel Tome Season 1 Challenges question

BearOrK · June 30

Hello! I have a question now that we are approaching the new Season.

Does the challenges from Season 0 Tome reset when we approach Season 1 Tome?

For instance: I have 12 Challenges, then Season 1 Starts. Do the 12 challenges dissapear and 5 new one appears? Or can I claim all 12 challenges when the new tome drops? I would like to know that so as to complete all challenges and do not lose any tamriel tome point. Thanks!

ZOS_Kevin · June 30

Hi @BearOrK. You should finish all of your Season Zero challenges before Season One begins. The challenges will not roll over to Season One.

BearOrK · June 30

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Hi @BearOrK. You should finish all of your Season Zero challenges before Season One begins. The challenges will not roll over to Season One.

Thanks for the answer! That means that when the new 5 challenges drops next Tuesday I have one day to complete them before the new Tome arrives (I know that I don't have to but my mind doesn't think the same XD)

Cheers!

PeacefulAnarchy · June 30

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Hi @BearOrK. You should finish all of your Season Zero challenges before Season One begins. The challenges will not roll over to Season One.

What about rerolls? If I have 12 rerolls going into Season one will I still have 12 or will it reset to 5?

ZOS_Kevin · June 30

That would be correct. And we get it, challenges are there, so you might as well do them if you're able. Just don't grind them out for too long!

Myrnhiel · July 1

So, just to summarize and to be sure that I understand correctly. This is what will happen with the tome next Wednesday:

- ZOS will dump stuff in my collection that I intentionally did not buy because I do not want it...

- ZOS will delete all the challenges I carefully diced for over the last weeks (because I thought this would give me an easy start with the new tome ) and give me five new ones that I probably don't want to do (ZOS has been making a habit of this) and have to roll again to change them into ones that I want to do...

- ZOS will reduce the 12 dice rolls I saved up over the last weeks to five rolls so that I will have to start saving up again...

Well, well, ZOS... I have to give you one thing: you certainly do know how to make me not want to spend one dime on these tomes ever!

Haenk · July 1

Myrnhiel wrote: »

Well, well, ZOS

Maybe this game is just not made for *you*? No one forces you to do any of this stuff. Don't like it? Do something else.
(IMHO for a first try, this went pretty well - other than the excess of points that could go nowhere, and there is no more incentive to gather further points. But that is more an issue of "too much gaming time on my side...)

Myrnhiel · July 1

I did like the tomes in a way. I participated, I slowly opened up all the pages and enjoyed it.
I just do not like how the season is ending.

Haenk wrote: »

Maybe this game is just not made for *you*?

And I really don't see how this makes you think that I don't like the game in general and tell me to do something else. For me the tomes are just a small part of the game, and of this small part I just don't like the ending. I wouldn't play this game for 11 years if I didn't like it.

Danikat · July 1

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Hi @BearOrK. You should finish all of your Season Zero challenges before Season One begins. The challenges will not roll over to Season One.

That's good to know, but as a minor bit of comms feedback it would also have been helpful to know this before now.

This question has come up frequently, pretty much since the whole tome system was announced. I'm glad we have an answer, but it would have helped a lot of people plan better if we had known this at least a few weeks ago.

DragonRacer · July 1

Seems really weird to me that we can actively choose NOT to "buy" rewards we do not want, but they're gonna be auto-forced on us at the end of the season anyway.

Why?

anadandy · July 1

In my opinion only, I think it's because for every 1 player that didn't buy something because they didn't want it, there will be 50 players who forget the season was ending and complain to support that they lost out on rewards when it does.

Myrnhiel · July 1

anadandy wrote: »

In my opinion only, I think it's because for every 1 player that didn't buy something because they didn't want it, there will be 50 players who forget the season was ending and complain to support that they lost out on rewards when it does.

This is why we need to have the possibility to opt-out of this. With such a possibility everybody would be happy and (nearly) nobody would complain.

SeaGtGruff · July 1

I had been wondering about this, but I had sort of assumed that the challenges would just continue unaffected, since Tuesday is the day when the weekly challenges change, but Wednesday is the day when the seasons change.

I can't remember clearly about the beginning of Season Zero, but my recollection is that some things were staggered, such as the beginning and end of the Night Market not coinciding with the beginning and end of Season Zero. I'm not sure whether the weekly challenges started a day before Season Zero began, but if so then I certainly don't remember getting a whole new set of weekly challenges on Wednesday, just 1 day after getting weekly challenges on Tuesday.

Does that mean the weekly challenges we will get on Tuesday will be for Season One, and will not go away and be replaced the very next day when Season One begins? Or are they going to be for Season Zero and go away after a single day?

virtus753 · July 1

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

I had been wondering about this, but I had sort of assumed that the challenges would just continue unaffected, since Tuesday is the day when the weekly challenges change, but Wednesday is the day when the seasons change.

I can't remember clearly about the beginning of Season Zero, but my recollection is that some things were staggered, such as the beginning and end of the Night Market not coinciding with the beginning and end of Season Zero. I'm not sure whether the weekly challenges started a day before Season Zero began, but if so then I certainly don't remember getting a whole new set of weekly challenges on Wednesday, just 1 day after getting weekly challenges on Tuesday.

Does that mean the weekly challenges we will get on Tuesday will be for Season One, and will not go away and be replaced the very next day when Season One begins? Or are they going to be for Season Zero and go away after a single day?

Yeah, the timeline as far as I recall:

Season Zero began on a Thursday, the old start day for events. (Season One will begin on a Wednesday, the new start day for events.)

We got the first Tome on Thursday, April 2, with 5 weekly challenges to start. Then we got 5 more weeklies with the next week’s reset on Tuesday, April 7. It took another weekly reset on Tuesday, April 14 to get to the full docket of 12 weekly challenges.

We also had initial seasonal challenges in the form of the daily login and Anniversary Jubilee boxes, with kill 100 bosses and kill 1,000 enemies in Wrothgar/Hew’s Bane/Gold Coast following.

Night Market was indeed staggered and began on Wednesday, April 29. No weekly challenges were directly tied to Night Market, so that didn’t interfere with those. It just allowed ZOS to introduce a new seasonal challenge.

With events moving to Wednesday, we now have challenges being removed and reset one day after the weekly Tuesday reset. But it would have happened after two days instead of just one if they had kept the old start day of Thursday. This didn’t happen with the debut of the Tome system because endeavors had ended weeks before and the current type of weekly challenges exists only within the Tome framework. They just didn’t exist in the days leading up to the debut of Season Zero.

My understanding of Kevin’s posts is that Season Zero challenges reset on Tuesday and go away on Wednesday, when they’re replaced by Season One challenges.

The Tamriel Tomes Guide posted by ZOS notes that some challenges are tied to the Season, so they may need to wipe the extant challenges and replace them. It would also suck to be asked to do the same 5 dungeons, 7–8 world bosses, and 1 trial for another quarter, even if I expect the generic tasks (harvesting, chests, daedra, keep capture, etc.) to stick around in future pools. Maybe they couldn’t keep those while replacing the Season Zero tasks? Additional clarification would be very welcome.

Link to the article: https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/guides/tamrieltomes

wolfie1.0. · July 1

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

That would be correct. And we get it, challenges are there, so you might as well do them if you're able. Just don't grind them out for too long!

As a bit of feedback @ZOS_Kevin can we change the start dates to line up with challenge resets? It would make the most sense to do it this way.

tsaescishoeshiner · July 1

If the extra stuff is mailed, it's a nice courtesy for people who forget or don't realize. I get that it's also a bit of clutter.

Arunei · July 1

anadandy wrote: »

In my opinion only, I think it's because for every 1 player that didn't buy something because they didn't want it, there will be 50 players who forget the season was ending and complain to support that they lost out on rewards when it does.

We know the auto-claimer exists for people who, for whatever reason, can't/don't claim stuff at the end of any given Season. But they should have included an opt-out option for it for everyone else who actually bought what they wanted and avoided what they didn't so those people a) don't have their Points spent on things they didn't want that they could have gotten Gold for instead, and b) people who don't care about the Gold either way and just didn't want their Collections inflated with things they'll never use.

Plus the auto-claimer and effectively ZOS are deciding for us what we should value, since it only gets Collectibles and Currencies but won't grab Consumables, Furniture, and things like the Boxes with Riding Lessons and the Wayshrine Chart. I didn't want the Style Pages but I definitely wanted the Box that had those Rift Furnishing things, and the Box with the Lessons and Wayshrine Chart for an alt and the Box with the random Nirn Gear.

kargen27 · July 1

Myrnhiel wrote: »

anadandy wrote: »

In my opinion only, I think it's because for every 1 player that didn't buy something because they didn't want it, there will be 50 players who forget the season was ending and complain to support that they lost out on rewards when it does.

This is why we need to have the possibility to opt-out of this. With such a possibility everybody would be happy and (nearly) nobody would complain.

I'm guessing there would be just as much complaining or more. The tomes expire so the choice is get nothing for them or get random (sorta) stuff for them.

AScarlato · July 1

kargen27 wrote: »

Myrnhiel wrote: »

anadandy wrote: »

In my opinion only, I think it's because for every 1 player that didn't buy something because they didn't want it, there will be 50 players who forget the season was ending and complain to support that they lost out on rewards when it does.

This is why we need to have the possibility to opt-out of this. With such a possibility everybody would be happy and (nearly) nobody would complain.

I'm guessing there would be just as much complaining or more. The tomes expire so the choice is get nothing for them or get random (sorta) stuff for them.

In every game I played with Seasons personally, seasons were discrete things and once they ended they were gone. If you didn't finish something then you just didn't get it, and if you didn't collect something then that was it also. The entire UI would be gone. This also would apply to any season reroll dice or whatever and I don't think people should expect these to carry over to provide more advantages in new seasons than they already get with the 2000 currency.

ESO is the first time I've seen a game monetize a season but letting you pay to make it "permanent". Maybe others saw this elsewhere but I never have.

I think they should keep seasons clean for non-purchasers and not auto-purchase things. Convert it all to gold because most people have had months to decide what they wanted and as many said, if they didn't buy it it's because they didn't want it.

PeacefulAnarchy · July 1

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

That would be correct. And we get it, challenges are there, so you might as well do them if you're able. Just don't grind them out for too long!

As a bit of feedback @ZOS_Kevin can we change the start dates to line up with challenge resets? It would make the most sense to do it this way.

No, doing it this way gives people more challenges. If someone needs a few more challenges at the end they can get a few on the last day, and on the front end you have to wait less for the next batch of challenges. A 4/3 or 5/2 stagger would be better than 6/1 but it's still better than no stagger. Sure, they could solve the issues differently, like by giving us 12 challenges and 12 rerolls to start, but just changing the start date with no other change would only be a detriment.

virtus753 · July 1

Arunei wrote: »

anadandy wrote: »

In my opinion only, I think it's because for every 1 player that didn't buy something because they didn't want it, there will be 50 players who forget the season was ending and complain to support that they lost out on rewards when it does.

We know the auto-claimer exists for people who, for whatever reason, can't/don't claim stuff at the end of any given Season. But they should have included an opt-out option for it for everyone else who actually bought what they wanted and avoided what they didn't so those people a) don't have their Points spent on things they didn't want that they could have gotten Gold for instead, and b) people who don't care about the Gold either way and just didn't want their Collections inflated with things they'll never use.

Plus the auto-claimer and effectively ZOS are deciding for us what we should value, since it only gets Collectibles and Currencies but won't grab Consumables, Furniture, and things like the Boxes with Riding Lessons and the Wayshrine Chart. I didn't want the Style Pages but I definitely wanted the Box that had those Rift Furnishing things, and the Box with the Lessons and Wayshrine Chart for an alt and the Box with the random Nirn Gear.

I don’t read this as ZOS telling us what to value so much as it tells us what ZOS values and sees as in scope for them at this time.

Players will be upset if they get what they don’t want. They will also be upset if they don’t get what they do want. Where’s the balance for ZOS?

How much consumer sentiment will be lost or gained, and how many Support tickets will be filed for each type of reward if it’s not autoclaimed vs. if it is? And how much dev time is required to implement the autoclaim solution? How much could go wrong when bugs are inevitably introduced?

The thing that would make most players most happy is if we get a fully customizable autoclaimer. That’s a lot more dev time, and a lot more could go wrong technically. There are probably thousands of things where custom options have been asked for or would make a lot more people happy, but historically we have not gotten a lot of them. Now everything under the Xbox umbrella is under even more pressure to contribute to that margin they’re missing badly. Very badly. Dev time on additional stuff seems like a luxury we’re likely to lose out on due to expectations from above. (Not an excuse, but a reality neither we nor ZOS can fix.)

If the autoclaimer took everything, people would get mails of stuff they don’t want. It would require more programming, and again more could go wrong. (System mails can include more than 6 attachments, but it’s already confusing when it happens with hireling mails, and it would be even more confusing with these items. Separate mails would probably be required for more than 6 attachments.)

If it autoclaimed nothing, people who missed out on collectibles especially would be more likely to write Support to get them retroactively. These are (for now) limited-time exclusives. While it’s easy to think people will claim it if they want it badly enough, ZOS is in the business of service, and that often means erring on the side of good service, such as having a failsafe when customers don’t get to claim these things for whatever reason. They need to improve consumer sentiment now more than ever.

An autoclaimer that takes only collectibles and currencies splits the baby. It takes only things that do not occupy inventory space, saving any headaches about mass mailings or item clutter. It takes the things unique to the Season, namely the collectibles, so fewer people are likely to feel they missed out on something special. My thought is that they included currencies because they also take no space and I think very few people are likely to say no thank you to a money truck, especially when it isn’t costing them anything in most cases. (The autoclaimer cannot go below 2k TP to carry over, so the worst that happens is it skips a collectible to grab a currency instead if there’s not enough TP to get them all.)

I think ZOS chose this as the compromise between what dev time they could spend and overall player utility (in the philosophical sense). I genuinely think a fully customizable autoclaimer was out of scope for them and seems in line with how many times we’ve asked for toggles or options to no avail. Maybe they’ll improve the autoclaimer down the line if it comes into scope. That would be great to see! But I’m not holding my breath with the massive reset happening right now that’s closing whole studios and taking chunks out of what’s left.

BetweenMidgets · July 1

Haenk wrote: »

Maybe this game is just not made for *you*? No one forces you to do any of this stuff. Don't like it? Do something else.
(IMHO for a first try, this went pretty well - other than the excess of points that could go nowhere, and there is no more incentive to gather further points. But that is more an issue of "too much gaming time on my side...)

Players voicing their concerns and giving ZoS feedback shouldn't be something other players speak condescending to them about. You also admit that it went "pretty well" for the first time. There is room for improvement, and another member of the community was giving feedback.

LootAllTheStuff · July 1

I am disappointed that the incomplete weeklies and re-roll tokens will not roll over with the new season. That seems a bit harsh, and not really in keeping with the spirit of attempting to make things less grindy,

@ZOS_Kevin - I know it is way too late for this changeover, but please reconsider this aspect for the next one.

Diebesgut · July 1

Take it or leave it.

If, in the next season, everything I didn't want gets bought automatically...

...and if all dice—even the ones I bought—and the tasks I earned via dice rolls get reset to zero...

...then I'll know exactly how much less time I'll be investing in the next season.

learning by doing.

Danikat · July 1

I'm one of the people with limited and unpredictable time to play, even when I'm online I don't always know how long I'll have but even for me I think the auto-claimer has limited value. It's hard to imagine a situation where a player would have unlocked a page and earned enough points to buy a reward they want but wouldn't have been able to buy it.

You obviously have to be online to complete challenges, and unless you're using an addon to automate it you need to go into the tome menu to claim the points, so if you've got enough to buy a reward you want it's only a few extra clicks to swap back to the main tome and claim it. I suppose if you're in a real rush you might forget to do that, but considering you'd be making the effort to complete challenges and collect the points it seems unlikely.

I'm not sure how the numbers work out with the paid version but with the free version it cost far more to unlock access to a page than to buy everything on it, so I quickly got into the habit of doing exactly that, and on days I didn't unlock permission to buy stuff I'd still check quickly just to confirm that was the case. I think there's 3 or 4 items I didn't get, but that's because I don't want them (thankfully they're all consumables which even ZOS don't consider worth picking up, so they're not included in the auto-claiming).

I suppose hypothetically someone might forget all about the system, and keep completing challenges purely by chance because they line up with what they're doing anyway, meaning they accumulate points they're not spending, but I think they'd have to first install an addon to automatically claim the points, otherwise they'd just be lost. Also if they're in that situation it doesn't sound like they want any of the rewards from it anyway.

PeacefulAnarchy · July 1

Danikat wrote: »

I'm one of the people with limited and unpredictable time to play, even when I'm online I don't always know how long I'll have but even for me I think the auto-claimer has limited value. It's hard to imagine a situation where a player would have unlocked a page and earned enough points to buy a reward they want but wouldn't have been able to buy it.

You obviously have to be online to complete challenges, and unless you're using an addon to automate it you need to go into the tome menu to claim the points, so if you've got enough to buy a reward you want it's only a few extra clicks to swap back to the main tome and claim it. I suppose if you're in a real rush you might forget to do that, but considering you'd be making the effort to complete challenges and collect the points it seems unlikely.

I'm not sure how the numbers work out with the paid version but with the free version it cost far more to unlock access to a page than to buy everything on it, so I quickly got into the habit of doing exactly that, and on days I didn't unlock permission to buy stuff I'd still check quickly just to confirm that was the case. I think there's 3 or 4 items I didn't get, but that's because I don't want them (thankfully they're all consumables which even ZOS don't consider worth picking up, so they're not included in the auto-claiming).

I suppose hypothetically someone might forget all about the system, and keep completing challenges purely by chance because they line up with what they're doing anyway, meaning they accumulate points they're not spending, but I think they'd have to first install an addon to automatically claim the points, otherwise they'd just be lost. Also if they're in that situation it doesn't sound like they want any of the rewards from it anyway.

There is the bad ui to consider as well, though. I went through my pages the other day to make sure I didn't miss anything and there was a reward I accidentally missed, I guess because I was going to quickly and didn't hold the button down long enough.

DoofusMax · July 1

Honestly? I'm not especially put out over the last "week" of the season being about a day. That was a known quantity when Season Zero started, although the change from Thursday to Wednesday shortened that "week" by one day. That information was out there for anyone who wanted to pay attention.

I'm also not particularly put out over losing rerolls or challenges going into the new Tome. My understanding was that the start of Season One would be pretty much exactly like the start of Season Zero, except that some players would start the season with 2K Tome Points (and some autopurchased stuff). So start the next season with five challenges, five rerolls, and proceed from there. Completely expected stuff.

The only thing I'm planning on doing differently is to make sure my alt account has collected all the Tome Points on the challenges which they can progress and not worry about any which can't be completed. They probably won't have 2K points to carry over because of autobuy, but I didn't buy Premium because the end of the season was going to happen quickly and free-tier is free-tier. My main account is getting gold on Wednesday, and I'm not going to sweat the few hundred for the points I might earn over that day or two. I'm going to gripe a bit over being stuck with 5K gold worth of Werewolf skill style that I'll never use (500 points is 5K gold that could have been paid out) but 5K gold is one day's crafting writs on one character and I'm not going to lose a second of sleep over it.

The part which has my hackles raised (and no, @ZOS_Kevin, I don't think the team "gets it") is that we are now two full PTS cycles and two full updates into the Tomes and the message that "no means no" has either not been received or has been largely ignored. I have lost count of the rerolls I have used up because "Complete 1 Trial" repeatedly shows up in the weekly challenges. It not only shows up, it shows up when rerolling a different challenge after successfully getting rid of the first one that showed up. I don't do Trials (including Sanctum Ophidia). There are many reasons why, but the short version is simply that I don't do them. I also don't do PvP outside of maybe stuff like Whitestrake's. So no capturing keeps, no capturing districts, no Battlegrounds... none of that. I don't chase specific dungeon bosses, but will happily play beat-down if they happen to show up as a random daily. The rest are generally palatable challenges, although strikingly specific types of activities (why public dungeons or world bosses in Wrothgar rather than just a public dungeon or World Boss?).

TBF, the five weekly challenges usually don't show up with any duplicated. So the gripe is not that a particular challenge shows up, as much as it's a complaint that a rejected challenge can and and often does show up after using a reroll on something else. Since giving the option to remove entire types of challenges from the pool does not seem likely, at least don't charge us a reroll for something already rejected for the week. This still does not address "no means no," but it does treat "no" as meaning something closer to "not this week." You're expecting me to open my wallet for the Premium Tome, so at least have the courtesy to let me play the way I want rather than "play the way we tell you to or be penalized for not playing that way."

Balibe · July 2

We will see when we switch to Season 1. On Xbox I did not upgrade premium (did on PC and selected all).

Was only interested in the 75 writs on Xbox, but did not think was worth the upgrade cost and selected all the available free selections. So what will happen, am I getting all gold or are they going to select premium items for me.

After selecting all the free ones, I am at 30k+ with a week to go with a 2k roll-over ......

gresiac · July 2

I have over 20k tome points so useless to get barely any gold for it, they need to change it.

AzuraFan · July 2

gresiac wrote: »

I have over 20k tome points so useless to get barely any gold for it, they need to change it.

Yeah, I usually feel compelled to do the challenges, but even I've given up on doing them now until the season flips over. The conversion rate to gold is so bad that none of them are worth the time.

wolfie1.0. · July 2

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: »

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

That would be correct. And we get it, challenges are there, so you might as well do them if you're able. Just don't grind them out for too long!

As a bit of feedback @ZOS_Kevin can we change the start dates to line up with challenge resets? It would make the most sense to do it this way.

No, doing it this way gives people more challenges. If someone needs a few more challenges at the end they can get a few on the last day, and on the front end you have to wait less for the next batch of challenges. A 4/3 or 5/2 stagger would be better than 6/1 but it's still better than no stagger. Sure, they could solve the issues differently, like by giving us 12 challenges and 12 rerolls to start, but just changing the start date with no other change would only be a detriment.

Do you really need that many? Most players on the free route have gotten everything with tons to spare. Even on accounts that I only played on weekends I got em all. And on premium accounts the need is far far less.

It makes a lot more sense to sync things up long term than it does to not do so.

But knowing Zos they will ignore my request