Nowhere keys ?

CptTekashi · June 23

In the latest stream they mentioned the keys to the knowhere vault are already dropping ? I haven’t had a single one from delve bosses world bosses you name I’ve done plenty and nothing ?

LunaFlora · June 23

i did not find any yet either.
super low drop chance or is it not dropping till season 1 starts?

Arunei · June 23

Yeah I've spent hours in certain Delves and such working on the Seasoned Slayer achieves (on both accounts) and don't have a single one of those Keys on either account. They must be a super low drop rate, but at the same time...why the heck have them drop so rarely if the point is to let people have a handful before the Vault launches? If the drop rate is so low they might as well not be dropping at all, just pull them and re-introduce them when the Vault actually releases.

CptTekashi · June 23

I have reached out to Jason via X for clarification.

Hopefully get an asnwer soon.

Maitsukas · June 23

Arunei wrote: »

Yeah I've spent hours in certain Delves and such working on the Seasoned Slayer achieves (on both accounts) and don't have a single one of those Keys on either account. They must be a super low drop rate, but at the same time...why the heck have them drop so rarely if the point is to let people have a handful before the Vault launches? If they drop rate is so low they might as well not be dropping at all, just pull them and re-introduce them when the Vault actually releases.

Getting flashbacks to low Luminous Ink drop rates after Gold Road launched.

DoofusMax · June 23

I haven't had any drop, either, and have EU characters who are religiously doing guild dailies for scripts. My NA characters have been doing the more "normal" harvesting, group dungeons, treasure chesting (not from maps), scrying, and whatnot. If they've been dropping since U50, then they're either really rare drops or I'm just not doing the stuff where they're supposed to be dropping.

DenverRalphy · June 23

They did say in the Livestream that while they're dropping, they may not be currently recognizable for what they are. Whatever that means, I have no idea.

Arunei · June 23

DoofusMax wrote: »

I haven't had any drop, either, and have EU characters who are religiously doing guild dailies for scripts. My NA characters have been doing the more "normal" harvesting, group dungeons, treasure chesting (not from maps), scrying, and whatnot. If they've been dropping since U50, then they're either really rare drops or I'm just not doing the stuff where they're supposed to be dropping.

I've been spending a LOT of time in Delves, in Public Dungeons, farming mats, opening Chests (also not from Maps), Group Dungeons (at least once a day when Random Daily and Pledge line up, two if not), and on my alt I've been getting Skyshards and unlocking the Master Explorer achieves for the Dyes.

Not a single Key from any of it, and I'm definitely doing at least one of the things that are supposed to be dropping them (namely Delves).

tomofhyrule · June 23

There is a lot of stuff in U50 that won't be activated until Season One starts, including the Favor system and Dynamic Encounters (both of which they said were among the sources for these keys).

I'm sure they're gonna start dropping when the Season switches.

But I will say this "thing [X] is in the patch but it won't be active for like a month yet" is really confusing for a lot of people who aren't hardcore looking everything up. I'm sure we'll even have loads of people confused that they can't find the Sheo quest starter when Season One starts (it starts a few weeks later). It does feel like they're trying to prevent what happened to New World (and what ESO used to be like) where a patch would drop with a lot of new stuff and then there would be a flurry of activity for a week and a half before dropping like a rock until the next content drop, so now we're really on a drip-feed model.

Hope nobody's really waiting for something like the Werewolf recolors to go along with their werewolf update in U50, right?

Arunei · June 23

tomofhyrule wrote: »

There is a lot of stuff in U50 that won't be activated until Season One starts, including the Favor system and Dynamic Encounters (both of which they said were among the sources for these keys).

I'm sure they're gonna start dropping when the Season switches.

But I will say this "thing [X] is in the patch but it won't be active for like a month yet" is really confusing for a lot of people who aren't hardcore looking everything up. I'm sure we'll even have loads of people confused that they can't find the Sheo quest starter when Season One starts (it starts a few weeks later). It does feel like they're trying to prevent what happened to New World (and what ESO used to be like) where a patch would drop with a lot of new stuff and then there would be a flurry of activity for a week and a half before dropping like a rock until the next content drop, so now we're really on a drip-feed model.

Hope nobody's really waiting for something like the Werewolf recolors to go along with their werewolf update in U50, right?

The difference with this is we were literally told the Keys are already dropping from various content, yet it seems none of us have gotten any of the supposedly already-dropping Keys.

It's not a matter of waiting for something that wasn't clearly communicated when we can actually get it, though I agree it is...certainly a choice to be adding X or Y thing like achieves for stuff that isn't actually active in the game yet. I don't see why these things aren't just added with the update they're ACTUALLY released in. In this case, though, we didn't expect Keys to be dropping because none of this information was available until we were told it during the livestream.

tomofhyrule · June 23

Arunei wrote: »

tomofhyrule wrote: »

There is a lot of stuff in U50 that won't be activated until Season One starts, including the Favor system and Dynamic Encounters (both of which they said were among the sources for these keys).

I'm sure they're gonna start dropping when the Season switches.

But I will say this "thing [X] is in the patch but it won't be active for like a month yet" is really confusing for a lot of people who aren't hardcore looking everything up. I'm sure we'll even have loads of people confused that they can't find the Sheo quest starter when Season One starts (it starts a few weeks later). It does feel like they're trying to prevent what happened to New World (and what ESO used to be like) where a patch would drop with a lot of new stuff and then there would be a flurry of activity for a week and a half before dropping like a rock until the next content drop, so now we're really on a drip-feed model.

Hope nobody's really waiting for something like the Werewolf recolors to go along with their werewolf update in U50, right?

The difference with this is we were literally told the Keys are already dropping from various content, yet it seems none of us have gotten any of the supposedly already-dropping Keys.

It's not a matter of waiting for something that wasn't clearly communicated when we can actually get it, though I agree it is...certainly a choice to be adding X or Y thing like achieves for stuff that isn't actually active in the game yet. I don't see why these things aren't just added with the update they're ACTUALLY released in. In this case, though, we didn't expect Keys to be dropping because none of this information was available until we were told it during the livestream.

As you note though:

We were told they were dropping
Literally nobody has gotten one

which means that either 1) ZOS was wrong about them dropping now, or 2) every single player is wrong about not having gotten any and we all collectively overlooked them in our respective inventories.

Occam's Razor suggests the former, which means it's most likely that what they meant to say was "They're in the game with U50 and will start dropping when Season One starts on June 9."

Or there is a third option: it is supposed to be already dropping, but it's bugged. In which case it's not dropping until they patch the bug.

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO · June 23

They said they are dropping but with a different name, so it could be that they are repurposing an existing currency / item for this.

My guess would be thieves guild rewards like satchel of laundered goods or related items like Fine Chalk

DenverRalphy · June 23

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

They said they are dropping but with a different name, so it could be that they are repurposing an existing currency / item for this.

My guess would be thieves guild rewards like satchel of laundered goods or related items like Fine Chalk

How cool would it be if it were Polished Shillings. =D

Arunei · June 23

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Arunei wrote: »

tomofhyrule wrote: »

There is a lot of stuff in U50 that won't be activated until Season One starts, including the Favor system and Dynamic Encounters (both of which they said were among the sources for these keys).

I'm sure they're gonna start dropping when the Season switches.

But I will say this "thing [X] is in the patch but it won't be active for like a month yet" is really confusing for a lot of people who aren't hardcore looking everything up. I'm sure we'll even have loads of people confused that they can't find the Sheo quest starter when Season One starts (it starts a few weeks later). It does feel like they're trying to prevent what happened to New World (and what ESO used to be like) where a patch would drop with a lot of new stuff and then there would be a flurry of activity for a week and a half before dropping like a rock until the next content drop, so now we're really on a drip-feed model.

Hope nobody's really waiting for something like the Werewolf recolors to go along with their werewolf update in U50, right?

The difference with this is we were literally told the Keys are already dropping from various content, yet it seems none of us have gotten any of the supposedly already-dropping Keys.

It's not a matter of waiting for something that wasn't clearly communicated when we can actually get it, though I agree it is...certainly a choice to be adding X or Y thing like achieves for stuff that isn't actually active in the game yet. I don't see why these things aren't just added with the update they're ACTUALLY released in. In this case, though, we didn't expect Keys to be dropping because none of this information was available until we were told it during the livestream.

As you note though:
We were told they were dropping

Literally nobody has gotten one

which means that either 1) ZOS was wrong about them dropping now, or 2) every single player is wrong about not having gotten any and we all collectively overlooked them in our respective inventories.

Occam's Razor suggests the former, which means it's most likely that what they meant to say was "They're in the game with U50 and will start dropping when Season One starts on June 9."

Or there is a third option: it is supposed to be already dropping, but it's bugged. In which case it's not dropping until they patch the bug.

I was commenting on the, well, comment, about there being stuff in U50 that isn't active yet and players being confused why they can't get/access it. I doubt they were wrong about the Keys supposed to be dropping already considering what was said:

"These are actually already dropping when U50 went live. They may have a different name that's a little mysterious, and you will find them all throughout the world doing different types of activities, including various Thieves'-related things, Delve Bosses, other things like that. They're gonna start dropping. Once Update 51 goes live, that's gonna open up even more. You're gonna see more ways to get them, including the Dynamic Encounters, Rumors, Favors, things like that."

So the wording makes it sound like either a) no one who's gotten any have noticed them, which would be unlikely as they aren't Currency but are Items that go directly into the inventory, or b) it's bugged and they aren't dropping like they're supposed to be.

Stream
It's about 1:09:00 where he starts to talk about the Keys.

ESO_player123 · June 23

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

They said they are dropping but with a different name, so it could be that they are repurposing an existing currency / item for this.

My guess would be thieves guild rewards like satchel of laundered goods or related items like Fine Chalk

And, since we are currently not being able to recognize for what they are, we are collectively deleting them from our inventories.

Arunei · June 23

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

They said they are dropping but with a different name, so it could be that they are repurposing an existing currency / item for this.

My guess would be thieves guild rewards like satchel of laundered goods or related items like Fine Chalk

And, since we are currently not being able to recognize for what they are, we are collectively deleting them from our inventories.

I highly doubt it's an item that already exists that would be converted exactly because of that, and also because James basically said they have a different name that's "a little mysterious", so I imagine it's prooooobably called "Mysterious X" or something.

It's also probably a lot more work to completely convert an already existing item and then need to potentially replace it, like with Fine Chalk, than it is to just create a new item that is named something currently and then only the name needs updating when U51 comes.

rockDokRock · June 23

CptTekashi wrote: »

In the latest stream they mentioned the keys to the knowhere vault are already dropping ? I haven’t had a single one from delve bosses world bosses you name I’ve done plenty and nothing ?

My question is... who has the keys to all the random chests I open in the middle of nowhere?

ESO_player123 · June 23

Arunei wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

They said they are dropping but with a different name, so it could be that they are repurposing an existing currency / item for this.

My guess would be thieves guild rewards like satchel of laundered goods or related items like Fine Chalk

And, since we are currently not being able to recognize for what they are, we are collectively deleting them from our inventories.

I highly doubt it's an item that already exists that would be converted exactly because of that, and also because James basically said they have a different name that's "a little mysterious", so I imagine it's prooooobably called "Mysterious X" or something.

It's also probably a lot more work to completely convert an already existing item and then need to potentially replace it, like with Fine Chalk, than it is to just create a new item that is named something currently and then only the name needs updating when U51 comes.

I was a bit sarcastic in my response. Most likely it's bugged or the drop rate is lower than that of the new Summerset furnishings.

DoofusMax · 4:14AM

Keep in mind that I haven't had a key drop, but I'm pretty darned sure that it's not something which can go into the craft bag (Fine Chalk or something being renamed isn't going to happen). They would necessarily be stackable, but not sellable since they are quasi quest objects (so no tooltip saying "sell to a merchant for gold"). They would not be deconnable, so they definitely aren't sitting under weapons, armor, or jewelry. There is currently no new category under currencies, so they aren't going into "hidden" stacks like those.

Once I put all of that together, then I'm pretty much left with the conclusion that none of my characters have picked up any because there is nothing in their Pack inventory which I don't recognize immediately. This means I'm either not doing the stuff where they would drop (possible, but not extremely likely considering the variety of stuff all my toons are doing), they just haven't dropped for me (RNG can be a real beast), or the drops are bugged (like that never happens). One potential qualifier is that although my EU toons have unlocked the Thieves Guild, they haven't progressed the story beyond the mission where we get Velsa back to the Den, so if there is a guild rank requirement, it's possible that they haven't met that and the NA toons who have the rank aren't doing the stuff where the keys can drop.

Arunei · 4:44AM

DoofusMax wrote: »

Keep in mind that I haven't had a key drop, but I'm pretty darned sure that it's not something which can go into the craft bag (Fine Chalk or something being renamed isn't going to happen). They would necessarily be stackable, but not sellable since they are quasi quest objects (so no tooltip saying "sell to a merchant for gold"). They would not be deconnable, so they definitely aren't sitting under weapons, armor, or jewelry. There is currently no new category under currencies, so they aren't going into "hidden" stacks like those.

Once I put all of that together, then I'm pretty much left with the conclusion that none of my characters have picked up any because there is nothing in their Pack inventory which I don't recognize immediately. This means I'm either not doing the stuff where they would drop (possible, but not extremely likely considering the variety of stuff all my toons are doing), they just haven't dropped for me (RNG can be a real beast), or the drops are bugged (like that never happens). One potential qualifier is that although my EU toons have unlocked the Thieves Guild, they haven't progressed the story beyond the mission where we get Velsa back to the Den, so if there is a guild rank requirement, it's possible that they haven't met that and the NA toons who have the rank aren't doing the stuff where the keys can drop.

They aren't a Currency; in the livestream they're shown to be in Jason's Misc section.

Sorry for the low quality, the quality wasn't the best in the stream ahah >__>. At any rate, even if they aren't going by Wondrous Nowhere Key right now, I doubt they'd be reclassified to a different item type between now and U51, so they should still be going into the Misc section regardless of what they're currently called. I have not seen a single thing I don't recognize the name of in my bags since U51 dropped and I've been clearing them every day since I've been doing killing SO many things on both accounts for those Seasoned Slayer Dyes.

spartaxoxo · 4:45AM

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

They said they are dropping but with a different name, so it could be that they are repurposing an existing currency / item for this.

My guess would be thieves guild rewards like satchel of laundered goods or related items like Fine Chalk

I hope it's not anything we'd automatically junk lol

umagon · 1:16PM

I think these keys will replace the current blue and purple vendor junk items you sometimes get from clearing bosses, events, etc. The ones you can currently sell for 1k gold or whatever the amount is assigned to it is.

ZOS_JasonBarnes · 3:01PM

Hey all!

I wanted to clarify my statement from yesterday's stream because I misspoke and apologize. The keys will begin dropping once Season 1 begins with the Thieves Guild launch. I got my dates mixed up with Update 50 Dropping but Season 1 not starting yet and wanted to clarify.

So keep an eye out once that hits! We are going to monitor the drop rate as well and adjust as needed as we shift closer to the actual vault opening later in the Season. The hope is these are common enough that you can acquire a decent amount and then go do some rooms in the Vault as a reward, but not so common it becomes a "why do these even exist" sort of thing which is obviously a very fine balance.

CptTekashi · 3:13PM

ZOS_JasonBarnes wrote: »

Hey all!

I wanted to clarify my statement from yesterday's stream because I misspoke and apologize. The keys will begin dropping once Season 1 begins with the Thieves Guild launch. I got my dates mixed up with Update 50 Dropping but Season 1 not starting yet and wanted to clarify.

So keep an eye out once that hits! We are going to monitor the drop rate as well and adjust as needed as we shift closer to the actual vault opening later in the Season. The hope is these are common enough that you can acquire a decent amount and then go do some rooms in the Vault as a reward, but not so common it becomes a "why do these even exist" sort of thing which is obviously a very fine balance.

Thank you Jason.. saved me another 5 hours of farming for nothing xD

LunaFlora · 4:04PM

ZOS_JasonBarnes wrote: »

Hey all!

I wanted to clarify my statement from yesterday's stream because I misspoke and apologize. The keys will begin dropping once Season 1 begins with the Thieves Guild launch. I got my dates mixed up with Update 50 Dropping but Season 1 not starting yet and wanted to clarify.

So keep an eye out once that hits! We are going to monitor the drop rate as well and adjust as needed as we shift closer to the actual vault opening later in the Season. The hope is these are common enough that you can acquire a decent amount and then go do some rooms in the Vault as a reward, but not so common it becomes a "why do these even exist" sort of thing which is obviously a very fine balance.

thank you for the clarification, i thought that would be the case.

AScarlato · 4:08PM

Good to know! Sounds like even the devs are starting to get confused as to what exactly is released on what day.

DoofusMax · 5:25PM

And here I thought it was just my memory playing tricks on me. It could still be, but it's nice to know that even those who know what's happening are having problems keeping stuff straight.

Arunei · 8:21PM

DoofusMax wrote: »

And here I thought it was just my memory playing tricks on me. It could still be, but it's nice to know that even those who know what's happening are having problems keeping stuff straight.

I was JUST gonna comment something along those lines lol. I think it was either Gina or Jessica who did something similar for U50. They've mentioned it can be confusing knowing what feature goes with what release.

Which is why they REALLY need to reconsider this trend of putting X thing that's not actually releasing in Y Update in Y Update. Dynamic Encounters aren't a thing yet; none of the Achieves tied to them should be in the game yet. Rumors aren't a part of the game yet; the Rumor Boards shouldn't be in the game yet. These are things that should have been added once the Update they're actually released in launches.

I feel like there's going to keep being a lot of needless confusion, for us and the devs, if they keep trying to "get ahead" of things by putting stuff in the game that's NOT actually in the game yet >__>.