NO CP Cyrodiil, did it lag?

SundarahFr3akinrican · May 7

Did no CP cyrodiil lag just as badly? or badly enough to be detrimental to the experience like CP Cyrodiil?

I feel like removing all the CP calcualtions would help it perform better?

I'd take No CP Cyrodiil over Vengeance. The vengeance campaign just takes everything about this game being an mmo out of the game. Makes it seem pointless.

colossalvoids · May 7

It lagged substantially less in "choke point" situations.

SundarahFr3akinrican · May 7

colossalvoids wrote: »

It lagged substantially less in "choke point" situations.

Why dont they just run with that then? get rid of CP campaign.

BGs already dont have CP. CP also just makes people make ridiculous builds as well.

ADawg · May 7

SundarahFr3akinrican wrote: »

colossalvoids wrote: »

It lagged substantially less in "choke point" situations.

Why dont they just run with that then? get rid of CP campaign.

BGs already dont have CP. CP also just makes people make ridiculous builds as well.

Careful, you'll get the "BUT MUH BUILD" people all over you. You know ,the same ones that also want vengeance that literally takes away your build creativity!

mmtaniac · May 7

Let people enjoy things they like. They just need to release Vengeance and crowd will decide what too play and what is good. Some people need too have both campaigns possible at the same time too decide how they work. Something that are good for me can be boring for you. We will see true popularity of Grey Host after Vengeance release.

Luneca · May 7

I play in 20-50 ping @ primetime either way, so don't think there's any significant difference between CP and no CP.

olsborg · May 7

It lagged less

MincMincMinc · May 8

It definitely lagged less, but we are comparing very different demographics. Nocp never really had the taxing ballgroupers. Much like how we notice during MyM events it seems like all the servers lag less.....because the server is full of noobs who only light attack with half filled out builds.

The lag is likely just from the culmination of all the proc event calls code wise firing off and trying to resolve.

Proc sets obviously
cp proc effects
weapon enchants
poisons
status effects
passives
skill bonus effects

Keep in mind there are obviously worse offenders. Like clever alch is certainly not as impactful as rallyingcry which does multiple effects, timers, aoe, and other calcs. Same goes for things like weapon enchants proc once every 5-10s whereas status effects currently roll the dice off anything.

Then you also have the delivery methods like aoe and over time that help lag singularities build up quickly. Which have their own backend issues like aoe smartheals, damage priority, range checks, buff/debuff timers. We've seen plenty of issues with these over the years.

WaywardArgonian · May 9

Yes, they did. The extremes were less than Gray Host at its worst, but no-CP could still get to a state where it felt similarly unplayable with the amount of skill delay. Even no-proc could lag out pretty bad, but often didn't simply because the population was much lower than in Gray Host or the old Ravenwatch.

WaywardArgonian · May 9

MincMincMinc wrote: »

It definitely lagged less, but we are comparing very different demographics. Nocp never really had the taxing ballgroupers. Much like how we notice during MyM events it seems like all the servers lag less.....because the server is full of noobs who only light attack with half filled out builds.

At least on PC/EU, no-CP did have quite a lot of ballgroups and you would routinely encounter them on the usual raid nights (Mon-Wed-Fri). Most of them migrated overnight when the no-proc change for Ravenwatch was announced.

MYM also lagged less in the past because some change ZOS made to the servers during the event. I'm not sure exactly what they did, but primetime MYM would sometimes have no lag at all, and then a day after the event the skill delay would be back when the server was still mostly empty. MYM performance also got much worse over time though.

xylena · May 9

WaywardArgonian wrote: »

Yes, they did. The extremes were less than Gray Host at its worst, but no-CP could still get to a state where it felt similarly unplayable with the amount of skill delay. Even no-proc could lag out pretty bad, but often didn't simply because the population was much lower than in Gray Host or the old Ravenwatch.

Yeah this, it would still lag badly wherever a dense concentration of players were spamming skills, that just didn't happen as often on a less popular game mode. Ironically it was unpopular for the same reasons Vengeance is now being criticized. Terrible build diversity (mostly Beekeeper hp regen tanks), defense outpacing offense turning it into a player count tank-heal-zerg meta.

Darethran · May 11

On PCEU, it was the most popular mode until they botched the no-proc implementation, but it still lagged majorly before and after. Skills not firing, infinite loading screens, everyone stuck in place on your client, random loading screens that lasted minutes when a keep changed sides, etc.

SundarahFr3akinrican · May 11

Darethran wrote: »

On PCEU, it was the most popular mode until they botched the no-proc implementation, but it still lagged majorly before and after. Skills not firing, infinite loading screens, everyone stuck in place on your client, random loading screens that lasted minutes when a keep changed sides, etc.

damn unfortunate that it still lagged.

How'd they botch the no proc implemenation?

xylena · May 11

SundarahFr3akinrican wrote: »

How'd they botch the no proc implemenation?

Dunno if EU handled it different but on NA they never bothered releasing a list of sets that worked with the new rules, nor did the game warn players if their sets were disabled.

Ultimately though it failed because players begged for something they didn't understand, they were given it, and (predictably to the rest of us) it ended up the worst of both worlds.

Darethran · May 11

SundarahFr3akinrican wrote: »

damn unfortunate that it still lagged.

How'd they botch the no proc implemenation?

There's quite a few angles to it:

1. There was no indication which sets would not work, whether that's their proc, their entire full set bonus, or if it was actually working
2. The definitive list they gave was not definitive and some sets were incorrectly listed as not working, when in fact they did work
3. There was no replacing of disabled procs or bonuses (e.g, replace a damage proc with +weapon damage)
4. There was no correction of missing or incorrect information on these sets and bonuses
5. There was no communication of any tests or performance observations

So when you joined no-proc, you'd find your build just doesn't work. Or it half-worked. Without anything to tell you or to give you anything back, so all that gear you farmed was likely useless with no compensation mechanics. So players would join, stuff didn't work and your sets were broken, why bother playing?

And it didn't resolve the performance issues to any real degree, which is why ZoS brought about Vengeance.

I've been playing on/off since a bit before Morrowind was released, and I've been keeping tabs and trying the game every now and again. Despite what the doomers say about Vengeance, no-cp and no-proc were hardly better than full fat CP Cyrodiil.

SundarahFr3akinrican · May 12

Darethran wrote: »

SundarahFr3akinrican wrote: »

damn unfortunate that it still lagged.

How'd they botch the no proc implemenation?

There's quite a few angles to it:

1. There was no indication which sets would not work, whether that's their proc, their entire full set bonus, or if it was actually working
2. The definitive list they gave was not definitive and some sets were incorrectly listed as not working, when in fact they did work
3. There was no replacing of disabled procs or bonuses (e.g, replace a damage proc with +weapon damage)
4. There was no correction if missing or incorrect information on these sets and bonuses
5. There was no communication of any tests or performance observations

So when you joined no-proc, you'd find your build just doesn't work. Or it half-worked. Without anything to tell you or to give you anything back, so all that gear you farmed was likely useless with no compensation mechanics. So players would join, stuff didn't work and your sets were broken, why bother playing?

And it didn't resolve the performance issues to any real degree, which is why ZoS brought about Vengeance.

I've been playing on/off since a bit before Morrowind was released, and I've been keeping tabs and trying the game every now and again. Despite what the doomers say about Vengeance, no-cp and no-proc were hardly better than full fat CP Cyrodiil.

That sounds awful. Hopefully the new team won't do things like that. They have been doing much better than how they handled things in the past.

LadyGP · May 12

Did it lag, yes.

Was it as bad, no.

gariondavey · June 9

It lagged but less than cp pvp
Removing cp from pvp should be such an obvious move to make. It is insane. Idk why the devs don't do it. Fewer server calculations. People are easier to kill. Opens up more build diversity.

JohnG · June 13

The fact that zos went with something like Vengeance instead of trying just disabling CP in GH is beyond my comprehension. I refused to play no proc no cp, the number of sets disabled made that unenjoyable, but you could get large scale fights in the midyear event no cp campaigns, which were not no proc, with little if any lag. Those campaigns were some of the best pvp back when PvP still had enough population to get large fights in them.

Now look where we are, sitting in queue for over an hour with nothing to do because almost noone wants to play Vengeance, people would rather sit afk than play Vengeance while they wait for GH queues.