Shattered Paths Signet Is Problematic

Decimus · May 3

Alright, it's time for one of these posts again.

Shattered Paths Signet is a fun mythic conceptually, but unfortunately causes way too many issues currently.

In PvE it has made and continues to make certain builds overperform (pretty much every top parsing build is running it on PTS atleast), and in PvP...

https://youtu.be/zpw3_lScSeg

You've turned a 35m ability that is undodgeable, unreflectable, partially unblockable (the burning tick), has no obvious incoming projectile animation into a spammable, Infinite Archives Focused Efforts style.

And this is just one example of an actual build, you also have pulse gankers and other problematic setups getting enabled by this mythic. These builds are completely ruining PvP currently and are zero fun to play with/against.

At this point I think some hard questions need to be asked, such as can this mythic exist in its current design and is that healthy for the game.

Here's how Shattered Paths could be balanced for healthy PvE/PvP:

Change the status proc damage into proc chance instead, anywhere up to 500-600% chance could be justified with the no ultimate downside present. This devalues builds that already have a lot of guaranteed (such as Elemental Susceptibility) or near guaranteed status procs, but empowers more niche builds like buffing DoT skills/procs (which typically have a super low base proc chance for status effects).
Lower the amount of damage significantly (180%->80% or so), lower or even remove the cooldown of proccing a random status effect with light attack to compensate.

Either one of these changes could fix the problem cases while keeping the mythic relevant, though a bit more niche than it currently is.

Firstmep · May 3

My plar that running the same plaguebreak/maarselok/wretched swaps out my markyn for this ring and suddenly I went from a decent pressure build to melting permablocking dks in seconds.
Stamsorcs desperately trying to streak away just to die to dots.
And the above mentioned ele sus setups are even worse of course.
Once we start seeing more people run this ring pvp will become full on Call of Status out there.
I'm usually not a fan the whole separate stats or nerf it for pvp, but this mythic definitely needs some changes for it.

Edit: 1.8-2k status ticks every 2 seconds is kinda silly, we are talking old dot meta except I can stack these in 2 globals and have 4 different status dots ticking(and diseased everg 2 sec from plague), plus of course maarselok.

LittleLionLeone · May 3

Seeing as this one isn't tied to any paid dlc I'm sure they'll nerf it a lot sooner than monomyth. Probably after the night market is over so that way they juiced engagement as much as possible.

Mattymoo92 · May 3

Meh just disable it if you have battle spirit active 🤷‍♂️

coop500 · May 3

Yeah this ring is cracked, something needs to be done about it and quickly, before everything around it gets nerfed into the dirt before this is.

Lord_Hev · May 3

But now everyone can have focused efforts outside of IA, fun fun.

Ankael07 · May 3

Until they find a fix to this build Im gonna use Esoteric Environment mythic and Sentry set

Esoteric gives you enough time to react + go after the enemy with Sentry's infinite detection range

Edit: Necro's bone armor has a morph that auto-pulls people attacking from range.

ItsNotLiving · May 3

It never should’ve been able to be used in PvP at all but I’m gonna farm infinite archive with it until it gets nerfed

Vaqual · May 4

I was ready to be critical but those suggestions are quite good.

Estin · May 4

I kind of feel bad for ZOS because the concept of this mytic is interesting and is one of the main incentives for doing the night market. They know it's over powered by making some builds do insane damage in PvE and PvP, but they're trying to do everything they can to prevent nerfing the mythic by adding restrictions to how you can use it and nerfs to werewolf.

Urzigurumash · May 4

So people have this? Some Sorc went like 35 and 2 in a 4v4 and the recaps were strictly Crystal Weapon and Status Effects. I was wondering what the heck build this guy came up with that ripped so hard but nobody else was running yet.

Urzigurumash · May 4

I see the answer is yes. I didn't really play this week.

My initial impression is the all time most broken 2 button spam build, just beating out the 2nd most, being current DK.

Just a couple more and build diversity is back.

coop500 · May 4

Estin wrote: »

I kind of feel bad for ZOS because the concept of this mytic is interesting and is one of the main incentives for doing the night market. They know it's over powered by making some builds do insane damage in PvE and PvP, but they're trying to do everything they can to prevent nerfing the mythic by adding restrictions to how you can use it and nerfs to werewolf.

I don't feel bad, especially if they gut werewolf and leave it behind the dumpster because of this ring.

Dracane · May 4

Let's be honest: this was all by design. We knew for months that this mythical is overpowered and still it came as it is, and will remain so for at least 1 or 2 patch cycles. Seeing how Monomyth is unchanged, just it may even stay as it is.

Urzigurumash · May 4

The current meta couldn't make it more clear that High Damage does NOT equal High Skillfulness.

coop500 · May 4

Yup, I don't feel bad for them at all, they chose to do this crud and completely uprooted the game's balance across the board.

Dracane · May 4

coop500 wrote: »

Yup, I don't feel bad for them at all, they chose to do this crud and completely uprooted the game's balance across the board.

It adds to the perception that ZoS is purposefully constructing metas by intentionally adding or buffings things to be overpowered.

Pinktraining · May 4

Simply nerf the damage dealt by Shattered Paths Signet when affected by Battle Spirit by 50%, and that will suffice. There's no need to nerf it in PvE. However, does this mean we also need to nerf Threads of War with a similar effect?

coop500 · May 4

Nooo honestly, this ring is unhealthy in PvE too. Normally I don't like nerfing things, but this one i make an exception for. It needs to be exterminated.

katorga · May 4

Seems kinda meh to me.

I've been using various varieties of crushing shock pvp builds for years and its always been relatively effective.

Pulse gank build is basically winterborn + 1 other proc set, draugrkin, way of fire were the sets 2-3 years ago. They still work fine today. What supercharges it today is sublcassing acranist and sorc for two more beefy procs on light attack. LA into Crushing nets you six damage sources, two set procs, and a 60% or better chance for 5 status effects in one GCD.

Works great with shattered path, but also just as effective with Monomyth, or even Oakensoul.

Urzigurumash · May 4

This is way stronger than it's ever been though.

But if this thing wasn't busted strong most PvPers wouldn't care about the Nightmarket. I'm looking forward to farming it.

Urzigurumash · May 4

Dracane wrote: »

coop500 wrote: »

Yup, I don't feel bad for them at all, they chose to do this crud and completely uprooted the game's balance across the board.

It adds to the perception that ZoS is purposefully constructing metas by intentionally adding or buffings things to be overpowered.

It's definitely part of the game to keep it moving and keep people grouping for PvE and trading mats and so forth. There's always pool and darts if you want the opposite experience, if you want real skilled PvP that stays the same year after year. Fantasy games aren't the same kind of thing. There just needs to be ways to keep old things viable. Crystal Slab and Asylum SnB and such should be strong enough to come through right now.

Urzigurumash · May 4

For a while I've thought Projectile-appended Damage should be treated as a Projectile, I don't think much of it is? Like I've never fully ascertained whether Enchants or Crushing Weapon are buffed by Eagle Eye, but I think they are not.

CatalinaWineMixer2 · May 4

I wish they would just eliminate mythics all together. Another broken exploit by the same people. Already tired of seeing this everywhere. Brought to you by the same people who drove thousands of our friends off with Subclassing. They need to balance combat. It is completely out of control. The need to establish rules and boundaries and enforce them. If theyre not going to make any efforts to do that, they need to add a flat dps cap. There are armor caps, crit caps, ect. The complete end of metas will come about. Suddenly nearly every set in the game would actually be useful again and a lot of other things.

Lord_Hev · May 4

CatalinaWineMixer2 wrote: »

I wish they would just eliminate mythics all together. Another broken exploit by the same people. Already tired of seeing this everywhere. Brought to you by the same people who drove thousands of our friends off with Subclassing. They need to balance combat. It is completely out of control. The need to establish rules and boundaries and enforce them. If theyre not going to make any efforts to do that, they need to add a flat dps cap. There are armor caps, crit caps, ect. The complete end of metas will come about. Suddenly nearly every set in the game would actually be useful again and a lot of other things.

100% agree. The removal of soft-caps in 2015 was one of the single most destructive things they've ever done to this game. It's hard to decide if subclassing was more destructive at #1, also got stiff competition with the "hybridization." Both of which Ironically would be more "balanced" under soft-caps... lol.

Extra bloated effects and rampant power creep is more fun though according to most folk. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Dracane · May 4

katorga wrote: »

Seems kinda meh to me.

I've been using various varieties of crushing shock pvp builds for years and its always been relatively effective.

Pulse gank build is basically winterborn + 1 other proc set, draugrkin, way of fire were the sets 2-3 years ago. They still work fine today. What supercharges it today is sublcassing acranist and sorc for two more beefy procs on light attack. LA into Crushing nets you six damage sources, two set procs, and a 60% or better chance for 5 status effects in one GCD.

Works great with shattered path, but also just as effective with Monomyth, or even Oakensoul.

When you have a build optimized for raw damage, the Signet does not do much in pvp. In my tests it also did not stand out from my favored alternatives; Fete, Malacath and, reluctantly, Monomyth. The problem lies in how it allows ineffective people to become effective, and how it makes low damage (as in raw stats) builds deal a lot of free and easy damage.

Combine this with another overpowered set, Serpent's Disdain, and you have a build that plays itself with no input on your behalf other than staying alive. Not even just Pulse Ganking; any build.

Nothing that adds free damage or does damage for you is healthy for pvp.

Dracane · May 4

Urzigurumash wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

coop500 wrote: »

Yup, I don't feel bad for them at all, they chose to do this crud and completely uprooted the game's balance across the board.

It adds to the perception that ZoS is purposefully constructing metas by intentionally adding or buffings things to be overpowered.

It's definitely part of the game to keep it moving and keep people grouping for PvE and trading mats and so forth. There's always pool and darts if you want the opposite experience, if you want real skilled PvP that stays the same year after year. Fantasy games aren't the same kind of thing. There just needs to be ways to keep old things viable. Crystal Slab and Asylum SnB and such should be strong enough to come through right now.

I did not judge it. I do not want a stale game, and if it was my game, I would also orchestrate some spectacle now and then. Mobas run on the very premise of blatantly overbuffing something that no one could truly believe is balanced.

Even though myself I have ran the same build for 12 years. Always stack magicka and use skills. No procs or any such thing. So for me it would be very convenient if things remained as they are. Raw offensive stat stacking isn't really viable and hasn't been for some years.

Radiate77 · May 4

Or; bare with me…

Elemental Susceptibility is the problem it’s always been; since they added the re-occurring status effect procs to the free skill.

frogthroat · May 4

From what I have heard yeah that needs nerfing in PVP. (So... I guess I'm gonna try pulse ganking before it gets nerfed...)

ZOS has made a whole mechanic, battle spirit, but for some reason refuses to use it. They could leave it for PVE and nerf it in PVP by using something like "when battle spirit is active, these values are halved" or something. But, for some unknown reason, ZOS rarely relies on battle spirit.

Pinktraining · May 4

frogthroat wrote: »

From what I have heard yeah that needs nerfing in PVP. (So... I guess I'm gonna try pulse ganking before it gets nerfed...)

ZOS has made a whole mechanic, battle spirit, but for some reason refuses to use it. They could leave it for PVE and nerf it in PVP by using something like "when battle spirit is active, these values are halved" or something. But, for some unknown reason, ZOS rarely relies on battle spirit.

They did use battle spirit more often as a balancing tool in this PTS, but it was immediately met with opposition and skepticism from some people.

Firstmep · May 4

frogthroat wrote: »

From what I have heard yeah that needs nerfing in PVP. (So... I guess I'm gonna try pulse ganking before it gets nerfed...)

ZOS has made a whole mechanic, battle spirit, but for some reason refuses to use it. They could leave it for PVE and nerf it in PVP by using something like "when battle spirit is active, these values are halved" or something. But, for some unknown reason, ZOS rarely relies on battle spirit.

It already has that. It's ready halved for battle spirit. And even with that it's that busted.