I read it was capped at 36 too. This feels like a disappointingly small number for such a full map - if there's a couple of large groups (or a guild running 2 or 3 together) in another zone you have almost no chance of running in to anyone.

A higher cap would've made it feel more alive and tbh a group of 12 irandom players sn't always enough for skirmishes and there's not much of a pool of others to draw from for help.

I think this probably adds a lot to the frustrations of solo players - if there were more people about it would be easier to see the zone more along the lines of a difficult world boss maybe

36 is way too small for this content - especially if that covers the town and all 3 areas at once.

lillybit wrote: »

I read it was capped at 36 too. This feels like a disappointingly small number for such a full map - if there's a couple of large groups (or a guild running 2 or 3 together) in another zone you have almost no chance of running in to anyone.

A higher cap would've made it feel more alive and tbh a group of 12 irandom players sn't always enough for skirmishes and there's not much of a pool of others to draw from for help.

I think this probably adds a lot to the frustrations of solo players - if there were more people about it would be easier to see the zone more along the lines of a difficult world boss maybe

Yeah, if the instances were bigger, that'd be fun.

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

I also have a question related to this.

What exactly is a zone? IE, is each district its own zone? Or are all three districts in one single zone?

AScarlato wrote: »

36 is way too small for this content - especially if that covers the town and all 3 areas at once.

I have been trying to articulate a way to ask this, what DOES it cover.

Because yeah, if it covers all three zones AND the nightmarket, then of course the districts are going to be empty.

It sounds like all of the areas once you enter the Night Market are considered the same zone. I don’t remember seeing a loading screen when you open the door to the Skittering, Parch, or the Sorrow areas.

BretonMage wrote: »

I don't know if it's the low cap/too many instances, but I've been stalking all the active skirmish locations for a day and there's never anyone there.

group finder is the way, its literally the only reason i was able to do anything in the parch which is sad because the district is my fav lol but people only want to do the other two faction related ones.

No love for the Ruckus.

I suspect they will increase the cap. Even with 2 groups of people converging on a boss, it doesn’t topple over like a world boss during an event. There’s room to increase the cap. I understand why it’s all one zone now though… you can see if a skirmish is up on another map, you can see the bosses on other maps, you can move between them without dealing with people having long load screens…

Soarora wrote: »

I suspect they will increase the cap. Even with 2 groups of people converging on a boss, it doesn’t topple over like a world boss during an event. There’s room to increase the cap. I understand why it’s all one zone now though… you can see if a skirmish is up on another map, you can see the bosses on other maps, you can move between them without dealing with people having long load screens…

Is this why I can’t see the bosses on the map sometimes? I thought the game was just being buggy or I had not discovered one yet.

I really think many players are like me and enjoy the more organic way of grouping we have always had. If I needed to do a world boss daily I would just show up at the location and wait for others to arrive. Or, like I mentioned above, doing a puzzle in the NM. It would be easier to have a group to do these things but in a group you are at the mercy of what others want and it doesn’t always match what you want to do. If there were more players I could just move from one puzzle or boss to the next and get more of what is on my to do list accomplished. The funny thing is I thought my trials group would want to do something there but I haven’t heard from them. I’m glad I joined a housing group this week because those guys are eager to get their leads and are running groups. I hope I can get more leads for myself before they are done, they are getting slaughtered in there.

I consider myself both a causal player because I like to do new content by myself on my less than stellar dps (who has done all the other zones) and a more experienced player because I am on a vet trials prog team. I have always got a zone clear for new content and done all of the Golden Pursuits but I may have to scale back my expectations dramatically this time. That bothers me. I don’t think I am going to get the dailies done, I could not finish the puzzle yesterday. I don’t know if I am going to get the leads, I only have one piece of the mythic so far. Yes, there is plenty of time left until the NM closes, but as time goes on people will either get what they want done or will decide this isn’t for them. I now question whether this content is for me at this point. I can do it with a group, but is this really fun? It’s really more frustrating than anything. I feel like I am doing it just to check off boxes and feeling like I am wasting a lot of time trying to meet those goals. I may have to give up on getting the wings of the house unlocked, getting credit for all of the bosses, and unlocking the dungeons and trial. ZOS should consider whether catering to the 0.01% was worth it when players like me, the maybe 1%, are ready to uninstall.

BretonMage wrote: »

BardokRedSnow wrote: »

BretonMage wrote: »

I don't know if it's the low cap/too many instances, but I've been stalking all the active skirmish locations for a day and there's never anyone there.

group finder is the way, its literally the only reason i was able to do anything in the parch which is sad because the district is my fav lol but people only want to do the other two faction related ones.

No love for the Ruckus.

It's really, really hard to get around the Parch without the relic. I'm trying to get the splinters for it now and it's painful with no one around.

Edit: I've also been wandering around Sorrow and there's no one there either.

As someone who likes night market, a concern I have had is about off-peak population. I can't do anything alone really, and sometimes it's flat out slow and no one to group with.

I'm going to try to unlock my house this weekend in fear this will lose popularity at some point and I won't be able to finish it.

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

AScarlato wrote: »

BretonMage wrote: »

BardokRedSnow wrote: »

BretonMage wrote: »

I don't know if it's the low cap/too many instances, but I've been stalking all the active skirmish locations for a day and there's never anyone there.

group finder is the way, its literally the only reason i was able to do anything in the parch which is sad because the district is my fav lol but people only want to do the other two faction related ones.

No love for the Ruckus.

It's really, really hard to get around the Parch without the relic. I'm trying to get the splinters for it now and it's painful with no one around.

Edit: I've also been wandering around Sorrow and there's no one there either.

As someone who likes night market, a concern I have had is about off-peak population. I can't do anything alone really, and sometimes it's flat out slow and no one to group with.

I'm going to try to unlock my house this weekend in fear this will lose popularity at some point and I won't be able to finish it.

This is exactly what I feared when I first went into it.

As I have said numerous times, I expected to die a lot, because I knew it was meant for groups.

However, I also expected to run into a lot of other people running the same content, that I could tag along with, or find people to group up with in the zones themselves.

That hasn't been my case half the time.

And that was on day one, when everyone was still getting into it the first time (except for any that did it on PTS), it doesn't make me hopeful for the future if it was that empty (seemingly) on day one. Or that hard to find groups.

Yes I think as people get what they want out of it they will probably start phasing out of playing it. Especially if they can't find groups and it becomes impossible to do anything over time.

I was initially not happy this was an event zone instead of permanent content, but this may be the only way to funnel enough people into it for it to be playable in it's current form.

Soarora wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

I suspect they will increase the cap. Even with 2 groups of people converging on a boss, it doesn’t topple over like a world boss during an event. There’s room to increase the cap. I understand why it’s all one zone now though… you can see if a skirmish is up on another map, you can see the bosses on other maps, you can move between them without dealing with people having long load screens…

Is this why I can’t see the bosses on the map sometimes? I thought the game was just being buggy or I had not discovered one yet.

[x]

I consider myself both a causal player because I like to do new content by myself on my less than stellar dps (who has done all the other zones) and a more experienced player because I am on a vet trials prog team. [x] ZOS should consider whether catering to the 0.01% was worth it when players like me, the maybe 1%, are ready to uninstall.

The bosses only appear on the map when they’re alive.

Okay, we need to stop moving the goalposts here. I am not a 1%er, much less a… .01%er… and I have like 75% of the trifectas in the entire game. You are absolutely not a 1%er if you’re progging vet trials. This game isn’t 99% overland casual. Whether it’s mostly casual or not, none of us can say. Maybe ZOS knows, but 99% is an obscene number.

Yeah I guess not. Maybe I should just uninstall. There must be many more people who think this kind of zone content is okay than I would have thought. I mean if this is like trials, then just what is the trial content of this zone like? I’ve never liked the word “gatekeeping” used in this game but now I feel like this new content was made just to exclude me. Do the people who can do this content feel better about themselves when others can’t? How am I ever supposed to get better with this mindset?

I think the 36 person limit might be due to concerns about lag if the number were to go much higher. We were fighting the skirmish boss in one zone and with the majority (if not all) of the 36 present we did notice a bit of lag. Not like a hammer fight in Cyrodiil but noticeable.

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

AScarlato wrote: »

JemadarofCaerSalis wrote: »

AScarlato wrote: »

BretonMage wrote: »

BardokRedSnow wrote: »

BretonMage wrote: »

I don't know if it's the low cap/too many instances, but I've been stalking all the active skirmish locations for a day and there's never anyone there.

group finder is the way, its literally the only reason i was able to do anything in the parch which is sad because the district is my fav lol but people only want to do the other two faction related ones.

No love for the Ruckus.

It's really, really hard to get around the Parch without the relic. I'm trying to get the splinters for it now and it's painful with no one around.

Edit: I've also been wandering around Sorrow and there's no one there either.

As someone who likes night market, a concern I have had is about off-peak population. I can't do anything alone really, and sometimes it's flat out slow and no one to group with.

I'm going to try to unlock my house this weekend in fear this will lose popularity at some point and I won't be able to finish it.

This is exactly what I feared when I first went into it.

As I have said numerous times, I expected to die a lot, because I knew it was meant for groups.

However, I also expected to run into a lot of other people running the same content, that I could tag along with, or find people to group up with in the zones themselves.

That hasn't been my case half the time.

And that was on day one, when everyone was still getting into it the first time (except for any that did it on PTS), it doesn't make me hopeful for the future if it was that empty (seemingly) on day one. Or that hard to find groups.

Yes I think as people get what they want out of it they will probably start phasing out of playing it. Especially if they can't find groups and it becomes impossible to do anything over time.

I was initially not happy this was an event zone instead of permanent content, but this may be the only way to funnel enough people into it for it to be playable in it's current form.

That’s exactly why I’m currently thinking its fine for it to be intermittent like MYM is. If it were here all the time then it’ll die out. It’s not really FOMO if they make it consistently the same time every year.

My reasoning for the FOMO is I don't know how they are going to do the rewards. I reasonably expect the same rewards for at least two more times, but after that?

If they don't have fresh rewards, then it will only get harder as the people who already got the rewards from it just don't bother, but if they do have new rewards, are they going to phase out the old ones? Move them to a different mechanic? or just keep it the same but with additional rewards?

I'm hoping they add more rewards and achievements and quests without cycling anything out. I hate FOMO with a passion. Only thing is it could be cool to see different districts come during different Night Markets at some point, but still no FOMO. If things are rotated out, have it consistently come back at a certain time of year.

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

I suspect they will increase the cap. Even with 2 groups of people converging on a boss, it doesn’t topple over like a world boss during an event. There’s room to increase the cap. I understand why it’s all one zone now though… you can see if a skirmish is up on another map, you can see the bosses on other maps, you can move between them without dealing with people having long load screens…

Is this why I can’t see the bosses on the map sometimes? I thought the game was just being buggy or I had not discovered one yet.

[x]

I consider myself both a causal player because I like to do new content by myself on my less than stellar dps (who has done all the other zones) and a more experienced player because I am on a vet trials prog team. [x] ZOS should consider whether catering to the 0.01% was worth it when players like me, the maybe 1%, are ready to uninstall.

The bosses only appear on the map when they’re alive.

Okay, we need to stop moving the goalposts here. I am not a 1%er, much less a… .01%er… and I have like 75% of the trifectas in the entire game. You are absolutely not a 1%er if you’re progging vet trials. This game isn’t 99% overland casual. Whether it’s mostly casual or not, none of us can say. Maybe ZOS knows, but 99% is an obscene number.

Yeah I guess not. Maybe I should just uninstall. There must be many more people who think this kind of zone content is okay than I would have thought. I mean if this is like trials, then just what is the trial content of this zone like? I’ve never liked the word “gatekeeping” used in this game but now I feel like this new content was made just to exclude me. Do the people who can do this content feel better about themselves when others can’t? How am I ever supposed to get better with this mindset?

If you’ve been having fun with the game before Night Market, I don’t see why you should uninstall. But it’s up to you. I remember being scared of trials, I remember thinking I would never get the MoL skin, I remember thinking I’d never get a trifecta. I never want to gatekeep the concept of progression, I did it and I hope others do too. I’m just frustrated over the continuous theme of the forums minimizing endgame players by calling us all 1% of the game as if we don’t deserve nice things either. It didn’t start with Night Market.

I’m more calm now than I was earlier so I re-read your post and I’m sorry to hear you’re having trouble. It is hard to figure out how to lead a group in Night Market. My strategy for my guild was to start with killing every boss, picking up and doing quests along the way, and then ask the group what they need. But it’s going to get even less organized as we go on into next week, where some people still need to explore and others need the trial. And of course, I’m privileged to be able to lead a guild group with people I know. Group finder listings for specific goals may be helpful, but you still need a good tank with sense of direction to lead the group between goals. I’m going to try some loose grouping and pugging as we go into the weekend to get some more perspective.

Edit: I forgot to answer your trial question. From what I hear, the dungeons are on the easy side. I’ve done the trial and it’s mostly coordination between people and then the fight is pretty whatever, there’s like 1 important mechanic and its stand on a circle.

I expressed my frustration to the trials guild about NM and was told I need to be one of the meta classes and not have lesser gear to do NM.

You need to find a new Trials guild. Not trying to throw shade here either. Honest. You can easily work all of the NM without chasing meta builds.

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

I suspect they will increase the cap. Even with 2 groups of people converging on a boss, it doesn’t topple over like a world boss during an event. There’s room to increase the cap. I understand why it’s all one zone now though… you can see if a skirmish is up on another map, you can see the bosses on other maps, you can move between them without dealing with people having long load screens…

Is this why I can’t see the bosses on the map sometimes? I thought the game was just being buggy or I had not discovered one yet.

[x]

I consider myself both a causal player because I like to do new content by myself on my less than stellar dps (who has done all the other zones) and a more experienced player because I am on a vet trials prog team. [x] ZOS should consider whether catering to the 0.01% was worth it when players like me, the maybe 1%, are ready to uninstall.

The bosses only appear on the map when they’re alive.

Okay, we need to stop moving the goalposts here. I am not a 1%er, much less a… .01%er… and I have like 75% of the trifectas in the entire game. You are absolutely not a 1%er if you’re progging vet trials. This game isn’t 99% overland casual. Whether it’s mostly casual or not, none of us can say. Maybe ZOS knows, but 99% is an obscene number.

Yeah I guess not. Maybe I should just uninstall. There must be many more people who think this kind of zone content is okay than I would have thought. I mean if this is like trials, then just what is the trial content of this zone like? I’ve never liked the word “gatekeeping” used in this game but now I feel like this new content was made just to exclude me. Do the people who can do this content feel better about themselves when others can’t? How am I ever supposed to get better with this mindset?

If you’ve been having fun with the game before Night Market, I don’t see why you should uninstall. But it’s up to you. I remember being scared of trials, I remember thinking I would never get the MoL skin, I remember thinking I’d never get a trifecta. I never want to gatekeep the concept of progression, I did it and I hope others do too. I’m just frustrated over the continuous theme of the forums minimizing endgame players by calling us all 1% of the game as if we don’t deserve nice things either. It didn’t start with Night Market.

I’m more calm now than I was earlier so I re-read your post and I’m sorry to hear you’re having trouble. It is hard to figure out how to lead a group in Night Market. My strategy for my guild was to start with killing every boss, picking up and doing quests along the way, and then ask the group what they need. But it’s going to get even less organized as we go on into next week, where some people still need to explore and others need the trial. And of course, I’m privileged to be able to lead a guild group with people I know. Group finder listings for specific goals may be helpful, but you still need a good tank with sense of direction to lead the group between goals. I’m going to try some loose grouping and pugging as we go into the weekend to get some more perspective.

Edit: I forgot to answer your trial question. From what I hear, the dungeons are on the easy side. I’ve done the trial and it’s mostly coordination between people and then the fight is pretty whatever, there’s like 1 important mechanic and its stand on a circle.

I didn’t mean to take it out on you, I am both angry and depressed at this point. I am seeing more high levels players coming out of the woodwork in my guilds now asking for roles in the NM group dungeons but I don’t have any of the relics at this point. Our trials team doesn’t have these players, we are all new to vet trials and watching videos and trying to make it through them. Our lead is trying to form a prog group with dps over 65k but we don’t have enough signing up, we back fill with what we can get, and usually fail to clear. I have my dro-m’Athra Destroyer title from another group but it seems the Craglorn trials are considered to be nothing nowadays. It’s just disheartening to hear I am not any better than the common rabble for signing up for what I thought were end game activities.

I expressed my frustration to the trials guild about NM and was told I need to be one of the meta classes and not have lesser gear to do NM. My housing guild was happy to let me join and we just helped rez each other over and over while we did stuff. Maybe I’ll just stick to the casual groups from now on.

It’s alright, I’m doing my fair share of taking things out on people oops. I was worried about the pre-gameplay loop into gameplay loop and how that will separate people. Aedra, a large pc/na trial guild, launched their Night Market initiatives today. So I’m hopeful more guilds will pop up with runs, including for the relics, for people who weren’t around day 1. Good news is the relic shards seem to be 100% drop rate from bosses.

I didn’t mean to diminish you. I think a lot more people are doing veteran trials than people think, but that doesn’t make you “common rabble”. I would consider progging veteran trials to be mid-game, which is honestly a good thing to hear that veteran trial progs still exist because I hear mid-game has been dying… which is really bad. We need mid-game to bridge the gap between normal and hard mode. But I also remember feeling upset because I didn’t really feel like an endgamer at an earlier time in my eso journey so I empathize with you.
My perspective is the 1% are people who have all the trifectas, some multiple times over, the people making waves with their theorycrafting, and scorepushers. Maybe I am 1% and just can’t see that because I’m not at the same skill level as scorepushers.

And I’m seconding that you should find another guild because that’s just not right. Night Market absolutely doesn’t need meta sets and gear. Not even the trial. The difficulty of the trial comes from understanding like three mechanics and that’s it. There are things that need to die technically on a timer but the minimum damage isn’t like a 200k parse hurdle. I hear even random groups are clearing it. I’m making an attempt to not require certain gear and classes for my trial roster since I know a drawing point of dungeon endgame is not having as much pressure to wear certain sets and be a certain class. I wish I could help you but I’m on pc/na .

The instances definitely feel too small. Until I saw this thread, I just wondered if eso was actually dead in primetime yesterday.

I really miss the organic way of grouping, where you run into others and run together forming pseudo groups or someone starts a proper group and start inviting the people they run into (I enjoy doing that in lots of cases). But it's just not possible with 36 people instances, and it seems depressingly abandoned.

I did join a 12 person group in group finder, but the bosses still took a good while, and it felt a bit like a boring grind because it was so hard to leave that group to go complete other objectives - there weren't really others around to go with. What a bother.

I'll postpone playing anymore, and hope they increase the instance size. If they don't, maybe I'll be fine without the content, it feels like a chore now, not the fun, vibrant active content I was hoping for.