Challenge difficulty is so much fun

DrMedBorn · April 16

that I re-enabled my combat music because now the music actually fits as you are fighting tougher enemies.
One cool expirience: there were 2 npcs threatening another npc and I actually planned the way how to attack instead normaly just rushing and killing them in a second. Now I actually sneaked behind one of the guys, used the blade and finished off the other one in combat. Pretty cool.

cant wait for release!

OsUfi · April 17

I'm not sure if I'll have it set to Vestige, but I've returned to the game and levelled a new character just so I can do the stories again without every boss falling over when sneezed on.

I've always felt I don't want Dark Souls in my Elder Scrolls, but Vivecs Care Bear Adventure is equally sad. Be nice to have a little bit of balance in the difficulty.

Displaced_Salad · April 17

That's great (and I mean that sincerely). Now add story mode for those on the opposite side of the spectrum, ZOS, please.

ESO_player123 · April 17

I'm glad that you like it. I might have used it if it was in a separate instance. Unfortunately, ZoS said that it's not technically possible, so I do not see myself actively using it.

spartaxoxo · April 17

ESO_player123 wrote: »

I'm glad that you like it. I might have used it if it was in a separate instance. Unfortunately, ZoS said that it's not technically possible, so I do not see myself actively using it.

Oh, where did they say that? Didn't realize that.

I think that you should still give it a shot once the hype has died down it. It'll probably go better than you think.

ESO_player123 · April 17

spartaxoxo wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

I'm glad that you like it. I might have used it if it was in a separate instance. Unfortunately, ZoS said that it's not technically possible, so I do not see myself actively using it.

Oh, where did they say that? Didn't realize that.

I think that you should still give it a shot once the hype has died down it. It'll probably go better than you think.

In Update 50 PTS - Week 1 Summary:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691351/update-50-pts-week-1-summary#latest

I like to solo WB in DLCs, so they are in a good spot for me. I do bosses in base game only if I'm farming something, so making them damage sponges is counterproductive for farming. As for questing, I already finished all the quests, so I'm doing them again on other toons only if I need a specific reward (like access to the Dragonguard chest) or want to experience the story again/ hear voice actors for favorite characters. Making bosses stronger is not part of what I'm looking for in a rerun.

If it was a separate instance, it would be essentially a new world for me. As is, it is not appealing.

If they start adding special appealing rewards, I might go for it.

Attorneyatlawl · April 17

Displaced_Salad wrote: »

That's great (and I mean that sincerely). Now add story mode for those on the opposite side of the spectrum, ZOS, please.

That is already the normal difficulty.

Nestor · April 18

Displaced_Salad wrote: »

That's great (and I mean that sincerely). Now add story mode for those on the opposite side of the spectrum, ZOS, please.

Story Mode for Group Dungeons. We had it before with Vet System.

spartaxoxo · April 18

ESO_player123 wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

I'm glad that you like it. I might have used it if it was in a separate instance. Unfortunately, ZoS said that it's not technically possible, so I do not see myself actively using it.

Oh, where did they say that? Didn't realize that.

I think that you should still give it a shot once the hype has died down it. It'll probably go better than you think.

In Update 50 PTS - Week 1 Summary:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691351/update-50-pts-week-1-summary#latest

I like to solo WB in DLCs, so they are in a good spot for me. I do bosses in base game only if I'm farming something, so making them damage sponges is counterproductive for farming. As for questing, I already finished all the quests, so I'm doing them again on other toons only if I need a specific reward (like access to the Dragonguard chest) or want to experience the story again/ hear voice actors for favorite characters. Making bosses stronger is not part of what I'm looking for in a rerun.

If it was a separate instance, it would be essentially a new world for me. As is, it is not appealing.

If they start adding special appealing rewards, I might go for it.

Ah, thanks for the link. I missed that. Since it was not possible from a technical standpoint in the first place, I wish they had said that years ago. Would have allowed for way more harmony in player discussions. ~_~ I don't think they'd be damage sponges based off the feedback I've seen so far, but that's totally understandable.

Attorneyatlawl · April 18

spartaxoxo wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

I'm glad that you like it. I might have used it if it was in a separate instance. Unfortunately, ZoS said that it's not technically possible, so I do not see myself actively using it.

Oh, where did they say that? Didn't realize that.

I think that you should still give it a shot once the hype has died down it. It'll probably go better than you think.

In Update 50 PTS - Week 1 Summary:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691351/update-50-pts-week-1-summary#latest

I like to solo WB in DLCs, so they are in a good spot for me. I do bosses in base game only if I'm farming something, so making them damage sponges is counterproductive for farming. As for questing, I already finished all the quests, so I'm doing them again on other toons only if I need a specific reward (like access to the Dragonguard chest) or want to experience the story again/ hear voice actors for favorite characters. Making bosses stronger is not part of what I'm looking for in a rerun.

If it was a separate instance, it would be essentially a new world for me. As is, it is not appealing.

If they start adding special appealing rewards, I might go for it.

Ah, thanks for the link. I missed that. Since it was not possible from a technical standpoint in the first place, I wish they had said that years ago. Would have allowed for way more harmony in player discussions. ~_~ I don't think they'd be damage sponges based off the feedback I've seen so far, but that's totally understandable.

They had 3 instances of the world back at launch, one for each faction to do veteran zones. The game world is bigger now so maybe it's not as feasible...?

spartaxoxo · April 18

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

I'm glad that you like it. I might have used it if it was in a separate instance. Unfortunately, ZoS said that it's not technically possible, so I do not see myself actively using it.

Oh, where did they say that? Didn't realize that.

I think that you should still give it a shot once the hype has died down it. It'll probably go better than you think.

In Update 50 PTS - Week 1 Summary:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691351/update-50-pts-week-1-summary#latest

I like to solo WB in DLCs, so they are in a good spot for me. I do bosses in base game only if I'm farming something, so making them damage sponges is counterproductive for farming. As for questing, I already finished all the quests, so I'm doing them again on other toons only if I need a specific reward (like access to the Dragonguard chest) or want to experience the story again/ hear voice actors for favorite characters. Making bosses stronger is not part of what I'm looking for in a rerun.

If it was a separate instance, it would be essentially a new world for me. As is, it is not appealing.

If they start adding special appealing rewards, I might go for it.

Ah, thanks for the link. I missed that. Since it was not possible from a technical standpoint in the first place, I wish they had said that years ago. Would have allowed for way more harmony in player discussions. ~_~ I don't think they'd be damage sponges based off the feedback I've seen so far, but that's totally understandable.

They had 3 instances of the world back at launch, one for each faction to do veteran zones. The game world is bigger now so maybe it's not as feasible...?

Yeah it is probably the size. Also, I said this back in the day about how I did not think it was plausible because it's not just the scope of the current zone but also they'd have to make it a permanent thing for every new zone thereafter. That's the part that made me skeptical. I had that opinion years ago because they told me during one of their streams that they couldn't fix VDSA's overly long waits without taking away dev time from something else. And I just felt like if that was just a big ask, surely this would be.

I didn't even know they couldn't do it now even they had the time due to tech limits but I guess it's not surprising considering they have to be careful about animations now too.

randconfig · April 18

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

ESO_player123 · April 18

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

And why should the lower difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

Attorneyatlawl · April 18

ESO_player123 wrote: »

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

And why should the lower difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

They could simply avoid the fight if it were marked. Why should the higher difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

Major_Mangle · April 18

I'm not sure if it's the case on PTS, but what difficulty a player is currently using should be clearly displayed for other players as well.

ESO_player123 · April 18

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

And why should the lower difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

They could simply avoid the fight if it were marked. Why should the higher difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

So, if a lower difficulty player arrives at a DLC WB they have to wait while a Vestige is "whittling it down" for 10 min and then wait another 10 min for it to respawn? Does not sound like an MMO.

tohopka_eso · April 18

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

And why should the lower difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

They could simply avoid the fight if it were marked. Why should the higher difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

So, if a lower difficulty player arrives at a DLC WB they have to wait while a Vestige is "whittling it down" for 10 min and then wait another 10 min for it to respawn? Does not sound like an MMO.

Actually it does. I started MMO's with Everquest and if you needed a particular boss in a zone it was customary to do a shout out for Camp check so you either waited or did something else. Sometimes very rarely you could group up but the item you needed for said quest was RNG and only one dropped at a time (brings back memories of camping for an item called flowing black silk sash which I needed for my monk at the time).

ADarklore · April 18

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

I'm sorry, but this isn't a single-player game... and if you're not buying my game, then you shouldn't get to dictate how I play. I should be able to enjoy all content and no other player should be dictating the terms on how I play. Just because YOU want to solo a world boss, doesn't mean you get to dictate to others who also want to fight the world boss.

Palumtra · April 18

I think Earthen Heart from DK will be a popular subclassing choice for Vestige. Ult is practically god mode, Major Sorc/Brutality + lengthy stun /immob (Fossilize).

SeaGtGruff · April 18

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

How about the flip side of that? When average-powered or newbie players are fighting a boss and some massively-OP vet players come along and melt the boss, denying the lesser-powered players from receiving any loot privileges due to the OP vets doing the majority of the damage, punish the OP vets? Because that scenario has been going on for years, and caused much grief (as expressed in these forums) to those players who couldn't receive any event coffers from a boss. How is it griefing only if OP vet players on Vestige difficulty are suddenly treated to the same scenario they've been griefing lowbie players with for years?

You can't have it both ways. If OP vets have been griefing lowbie players for years and not being punished for it, then lowbie players should not be punished for supposedly "griefing" vet players on Vestige difficulty. How about let's be fair, not entitled.

zaria · April 18

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

I'm glad that you like it. I might have used it if it was in a separate instance. Unfortunately, ZoS said that it's not technically possible, so I do not see myself actively using it.

Oh, where did they say that? Didn't realize that.

I think that you should still give it a shot once the hype has died down it. It'll probably go better than you think.

In Update 50 PTS - Week 1 Summary:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691351/update-50-pts-week-1-summary#latest

I like to solo WB in DLCs, so they are in a good spot for me. I do bosses in base game only if I'm farming something, so making them damage sponges is counterproductive for farming. As for questing, I already finished all the quests, so I'm doing them again on other toons only if I need a specific reward (like access to the Dragonguard chest) or want to experience the story again/ hear voice actors for favorite characters. Making bosses stronger is not part of what I'm looking for in a rerun.

If it was a separate instance, it would be essentially a new world for me. As is, it is not appealing.

If they start adding special appealing rewards, I might go for it.

Ah, thanks for the link. I missed that. Since it was not possible from a technical standpoint in the first place, I wish they had said that years ago. Would have allowed for way more harmony in player discussions. ~_~ I don't think they'd be damage sponges based off the feedback I've seen so far, but that's totally understandable.

They had 3 instances of the world back at launch, one for each faction to do veteran zones. The game world is bigger now so maybe it's not as feasible...?

They use multiple instances if one zone get too populated who they will be during launch or zone event already, but not sure how they empty them so it could be lots of challenge zones with just one player in them.

AzuraFan · April 18

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

Nope. Any difficulty other than adventurer is opt-in. Nobody can be forced into a higher difficulty.

JimT722 · April 18

I am really enjoying it but the world should only have players on the same difficulty in it. It isn't a big problem on pts but i'm sure it will be on live.

ESO_player123 · April 18

tohopka_eso wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

And why should the lower difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

They could simply avoid the fight if it were marked. Why should the higher difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

So, if a lower difficulty player arrives at a DLC WB they have to wait while a Vestige is "whittling it down" for 10 min and then wait another 10 min for it to respawn? Does not sound like an MMO.

Actually it does. I started MMO's with Everquest and if you needed a particular boss in a zone it was customary to do a shout out for Camp check so you either waited or did something else. Sometimes very rarely you could group up but the item you needed for said quest was RNG and only one dropped at a time (brings back memories of camping for an item called flowing black silk sash which I needed for my monk at the time).

ESO is not Everquest, and it has never had any mechanics like that or any mob tagging (at least to my knowledge). So, what was proposed would be a drastic change for ESO.

tohopka_eso · April 18

ESO_player123 wrote: »

tohopka_eso wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

And why should the lower difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

They could simply avoid the fight if it were marked. Why should the higher difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

So, if a lower difficulty player arrives at a DLC WB they have to wait while a Vestige is "whittling it down" for 10 min and then wait another 10 min for it to respawn? Does not sound like an MMO.

Actually it does. I started MMO's with Everquest and if you needed a particular boss in a zone it was customary to do a shout out for Camp check so you either waited or did something else. Sometimes very rarely you could group up but the item you needed for said quest was RNG and only one dropped at a time (brings back memories of camping for an item called flowing black silk sash which I needed for my monk at the time).

ESO is not Everquest, and it has never had any mechanics like that or any mob tagging (at least to my knowledge). So, what was proposed would be a drastic change for ESO.

I was just answering your "does not sound like an MMO" comment was all. I never mentioned mechanics or similar. I just reflected from past experience of coming across something with a timer. that was all.

Forget I said anything then. /sigh

spartaxoxo · April 18

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

And why should the lower difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

They could simply avoid the fight if it were marked. Why should the higher difficulty players be punished by being forced into a difficulty they did not sign up for?

They aren't being punished. They chose to enable the toggle knowing that they'd be mixed in with lower difficulty players on occasion. Lower difficulty aren't griefing by continuing to play the game the way always have.

With a toggle, you just have to understand that if it's really going to get to you that bad that other people are around in an MMO, that you'll have to play a time when the area isn't busy. I already accept that I won't get much benefit from it every time I play but that most of the time I will. And that is good enough for me. So I won't be yelling at anyone.

spartaxoxo · April 18

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

How about the flip side of that? When average-powered or newbie players are fighting a boss and some massively-OP vet players come along and melt the boss, denying the lesser-powered players from receiving any loot privileges due to the OP vets doing the majority of the damage, punish the OP vets? Because that scenario has been going on for years, and caused much grief (as expressed in these forums) to those players who couldn't receive any event coffers from a boss. How is it griefing only if OP vet players on Vestige difficulty are suddenly treated to the same scenario they've been griefing lowbie players with for years?

You can't have it both ways. If OP vets have been griefing lowbie players for years and not being punished for it, then lowbie players should not be punished for supposedly "griefing" vet players on Vestige difficulty. How about let's be fair, not entitled.

Neither of these groups are or would be griefing. Vets have not been griefing casuals for years by getting stuff they need from world bosses. The problem there is not giving out loot to everyone who do damage like they do at dragons

SkaiFaith · April 18

I'm not arguing or anything but I'll throw this thought in here: I often accept requests of low level players that need help to farm a lead from a WB. They'd be dead, and they entrust the fact I'll be alive and finish the WB if they die. Now imagine if when they see me join I am on Vestige and get oneshotted by a light attack - "JUST, WHY??? You aren't of any help!" XD

This hypothetical situation just made me laugh.

Attorneyatlawl · April 18

AzuraFan wrote: »

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

Nope. Any difficulty other than adventurer is opt-in. Nobody can be forced into a higher difficulty.

They wouldn't be. It would be their choice to engage (or not) with a clear icon tag.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · April 18

Why do you enjoy Damage Sponges? having to hit an enemy 100 times is not engaging combat, I get the enemies dealing more damage to you so you have to dodge attacks and move around but why do we do less damage to them? why not make all fights as realistic as can be and make it so being stabbed once = death regardless of if you're the player or an NPC.

AzuraFan · April 19

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

AzuraFan wrote: »

randconfig wrote: »

Honestly, there is only one way this challenge difficulty thing is going to work without separate instances:
Mark players and foes in vestige difficulty with an icon, and force any lower difficulty player into that difficulty the moment they join the combat. Do not let them grief and ruin my experience or the experience of my friends.

Otherwise, at least give us a pass on violating the ToS when we inevitably get into verbal fights with griefing players lol.

Nope. Any difficulty other than adventurer is opt-in. Nobody can be forced into a higher difficulty.

They wouldn't be. It would be their choice to engage (or not) with a clear icon tag.

So they'd have to stand around and wait until the vestige person finished whatever they were doing, and then wait for whatever it was they killed to respawn? But those on vestige would be fine running around and engaging whatever was in adventurer mode, and killing it in two hits? Not a good experience. When I'm playing in adventurer mode, I'll expect the same experience I have today. I should be able to run around and engage with anything and it'll feel the same as if I was engaging with it today.

Tagging is always open to abuse, which is why I've always been glad that ESO doesn't work that way.

I think different instances would maybe work better, but I guess we'll see how it works in practice.