Expiration for tome points and tome point caches?

MoonPile · April 6

Destai wrote: »

16BitForestCat wrote: »

allochthons wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno did acknowledge this on the Reddit thread I linked above:

I was reading the Reddit page where that discussion thread happened (I don't have a Reddit account, so what I'm seeing is whatever is on public display). I almost missed Gina's comment/thread because it was hidden and had to be manually expanded due to having so many downvotes. *LOL+SMDH*

People are NOT happy, and this is absolutely on ZOS.

@ZOS_GinaBruno is there any particular why this wasn't also communicated here? I'm glad you're on Reddit, but there's also multiple threads over here that need information. Is this something you're working on?

Moreover, I wonder why the official Guide doesn't explain:
https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/guides/tamrieltomes

"Caches don't expire" implies that other points do, but that's far from clear. As Tom said, it's true that after a while you come to expect having to look to 3rd-party sources for info on TES games. But surely that can be improved? Why should the ESO-Hub article be so much clearer than the official one?

allochthons wrote: »

ESO-Hub's summary:

JemadarofCaerSalis · April 7

Honestly, the more I read about this, the more it just seems like a huge SNAFU, in that many people didn't realize the points would expire (I think I sort of did, as it didn't surprise me, but I don't know whether it was just a feeling or if I had seen it said somewhere that they would), and I *really* do not like the idea that any 'expiring' points are going to be spent on items that I might not want.

I love the alternative about being able to convert it into various in-game non-premium currency, but an alternative would be to 'extend' the season in a way.

You wouldn't be able to earn points towards the current season, and it would say that in big bold LARGE letters, and it would tell you that in X days these points will expire.

Then, you would be able to choose any rewards you want, if any from that tome. They could even convert the points into a different currency (that would only show up in that one particular area, to try to keep the confusion to the minimum) and remove the 2K that rolls over before doing this. So tome points could become something like Leaflets (to keep with the 'tome' motif) and the only place it would show them would be on this expired season page.

Otherwise, I see this just upsetting a lot of people, not just with the expiring currency, but also the fact that any currency you have extra will be used to buy things you might not want, while not being able to get the things you might *have* wanted.

Marto · April 7

I feel like the most simple solution here is to simply disable the opening of caches when the player reaches enough points to unlock the entire pass.

There is no reason why any player, in any circumstance, would want to get more points after unlocking everything.

It's a similar scenario to event tickets or transmute crystals. If a player reaches the cap, simply disallow them to keep gaining more of that currency.

lillybit · April 7

It's funny how people can interpret things so differently

I've never played a game with battle passes before, but from how they described it I didn't even consider that points might roll over. I just assumed each season would be self contained given It's their main income now with new content being free. I was actually surprised we'll be able to take 2k with us to the next tbh

DenverRalphy · April 7

lillybit wrote: »

It's funny how people can interpret things so differently

I've never played a game with battle passes before, but from how they described it I didn't even consider that points might roll over. I just assumed each season would be self contained given It's their main income now with new content being free. I was actually surprised we'll be able to take 2k with us to the next tbh

That's a pretty accurate assessment of how it's intended to work. I too was surprised they even allow a 2k rollover. What many players don't seem to be aware of is that the primary purpose of tome caches is to allow players to get to the end of the season track faster. Beyond that, they can help a new player who enters the season late into the cycle. There will be enough tome points to go around to purchase everything in both tracks throughout the entire season. There's typically not supposed to be any intrinsic value to leftover tome points outside fo the zone they're acquired in.

BretonMage · April 7

Tome points are currency. Why should anyone assume they expire when none of our other currencies expire?

Looking at the TP calculations now, I guess it makes sense that ZOS wouldn't want us carrying over 20000 TPs to automatically unlock most of the pages of the next season, but that's not something you would normally assume of a currency.

And there IS an intrinsic value to having extra TPs, it's so you have the flexibility to not have to do some challenges if you don't have the time or opportunity.

allochthons · April 7

Rolling Tome Points over into a new season has no effect on whether we choose to buy the new Season or not. Even if I roll into a new Season with 100,000 Tome Points, I can't use them to buy the premium pets and personalities unless I pay. Every Season, we need to pay Real Money to get access to buying the premium rewards.

StackonClown · April 7

At least we need a statement from the team on these - too many of us opened all the caches!
Note this is in the context of the jubilee event where we are opening hundreds of reward boxes NON-STOP - its instinctive!

@ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_GinaBruno - please help

alternatelder · April 8

How has there been no update yet? I thought they were getting better at communicating with us? Lately its been silent for a number of issues. I'd like to know if we get to keep our points when July 8 hits.

JeroenB · April 8

Today I received a response to my Ticket:

The Elder Scrolls Online Team wrote:

[...] I understand you are reaching out about opening your Cache of Tome Points and wish to have them restored. I'll do my best to help get this resolved for you.

In order for us to best assist you, please provide the following information:
How many Cache of Tome Points have you opened?

How many of the opened Cache of Tome Points do you wish to be resotred?

As soon as we have this info, we will investigate this issue for you further and be back in touch as soon as possible. [...]

This suggests they have decided to restore Caches for those who ask (for those affected by the current currency-expiry-not-clearly-communicated-in-game situation at least). That might be reading too much into the response though.

SilverBride · April 8

JeroenB wrote: »

Today I received a response to my Ticket:

The Elder Scrolls Online Team wrote:

[...] I understand you are reaching out about opening your Cache of Tome Points and wish to have them restored. I'll do my best to help get this resolved for you.

In order for us to best assist you, please provide the following information:
How many Cache of Tome Points have you opened?

How many of the opened Cache of Tome Points do you wish to be resotred?

As soon as we have this info, we will investigate this issue for you further and be back in touch as soon as possible. [...]

This suggests they have decided to restore Caches for those who ask (for those affected by the current currency-expiry-not-clearly-communicated-in-game situation at least). That might be reading too much into the response though.

I got an email on 4/2 saying the exact thing. Then I got a new email on 4/4 saying this below, and nothing since.

Greetings!

Thank you for contacting The Elder Scrolls Online Team.

I am escalating your ticket to a specialized team to ensure you receive the best possible resolution of your issue. Thank you for your patience while they review your request, they should be reaching out to you shortly.

If you have any further questions or information regarding this issue, please respond directly to this ticket to ensure the proper team is able to see your response.

Regards,

The Elder Scrolls Online Team

Displaced_Salad · April 8

And to think, all of this could have been avoided if they'd just called this seasons instead of trying to re-invent the wheel and use confusing marketing nomenclature to try and fool people into thinking it's something different than it is. SEASONS. Use your points on useless (or useful) stuff to get to another level or they go *poof* at the end of the season. Use your actual, factual currency to skip the middle man.

alternatelder wrote: »

How has there been no update yet? I thought they were getting better at communicating with us? Lately its been silent for a number of issues. I'd like to know if we get to keep our points when July 8 hits.

Ah yes, some of us are still waiting for responses from the Hearts week event. Two months ago.

Again, I see absolutely nothing but marketing and PR speak for "we're gonna do what we always did with new staff and new shiny names"

grumlins · April 9

This is cheating those of us who pay for membership out of the thousands of tome cache points because no one told us ZOS that these would end not in a single video or live stream. You are basically cheating thousands of players out of their money. What's worse is nothing in the tome is beyond cosmetic, there's nothing there that would require you to do a reset each season.

Why bother ending these points when they could be best served giving the players the points they need to finally get the items they want from seals? It makes 0 sense other than to create a system where the players are forced to play your broken gambling machine with boxes no one wants.

grumlins · April 9

I put in a ticket. We'll see what happens.
I offered a suggestion that we be able to put cache points in the bank inside the game to be saved.

Since these cache Tome points are bought with real money they are subject to real life laws in the country they were purchased in. I don't think there is a judge anywhere who would side with ZOS if this were to end up in court.

SilverBride · April 9

They restored my caches as a one time exception.

daemondamian · April 9

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

SilverBride · April 9

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

Just tell them you don't remember exactly how many you had, but you have this many points and would like to restore this many caches. Each cache holds 2000 points.

daemondamian · April 10

SilverBride wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

Just tell them you don't remember exactly how many you had, but you have this many points and would like to restore this many caches. Each cache holds 2000 points.

Okay, thanks. What are people submitting tickets under - missing item or something else?

SilverBride · April 10

daemondamian wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

Just tell them you don't remember exactly how many you had, but you have this many points and would like to restore this many caches. Each cache holds 2000 points.

Okay, thanks. What are people submitting tickets under - missing item or something else?

Nothing seemed to fit so I think I chose Character issue, then Skills, Abilities and Achievements, then explained the situation.

virtus753 · April 10

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

It counts full months from January 1 of this year. You should have had caches for 4 months (January-April). You can see how many premium tome tokens you have to compare.

daemondamian · April 10

SilverBride wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

Just tell them you don't remember exactly how many you had, but you have this many points and would like to restore this many caches. Each cache holds 2000 points.

Okay, thanks. What are people submitting tickets under - missing item or something else?

Nothing seemed to fit so I think I chose Character issue, then Skills, Abilities and Achievements, then explained the situation.

I have these choices under character issue:

I am muted

Character Stuck

Character Stuck in Combat

Deleted characters

virtus753 wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

It counts full months from January 1 of this year. You should have had caches for 4 months (January-April). You can see how many premium tome tokens you have to compare.

I have 12 PTT according to the tome upgrade UI but that would mean I should have had 12 caches or not?

I thought it was three but must have been wrong.

Currently I have 15,117 tome points.

SilverBride · April 10

daemondamian wrote: »

I have these choices under character issue:

I am muted

Character Stuck

Character Stuck in Combat

Deleted characters

I put my ticket in when I was in game.

I chose Ask for Help
Impact: Character Issue
Categories: Skills/Abilities/Achievements
Additional Information: I explained about opening the caches not knowing only 2k tome points carry over and asked to have the caches restored.

virtus753 · April 10

daemondamian wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

Just tell them you don't remember exactly how many you had, but you have this many points and would like to restore this many caches. Each cache holds 2000 points.

Okay, thanks. What are people submitting tickets under - missing item or something else?

Nothing seemed to fit so I think I chose Character issue, then Skills, Abilities and Achievements, then explained the situation.

I have these choices under character issue:

I am muted

Character Stuck

Character Stuck in Combat

Deleted characters

virtus753 wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

It counts full months from January 1 of this year. You should have had caches for 4 months (January-April). You can see how many premium tome tokens you have to compare.

I have 12 PTT according to the tome upgrade UI but that would mean I should have had 12 caches or not?

I thought it was three but must have been wrong.

Currently I have 15,117 tome points.

The Tome upgrade UI shows 12 tokens because that is the price for one upgrade in tokens.

Your actual number of tokens owned is shown in your currency tab.

Alastrine · April 10

I received 3 caches.
Only opened one, to be able to get the endeavor seals and the bar awards on day one, as I had no grasp yet of what it would take to earn enough points to get those.
Now that I've done a bunch of the challenges I won't open more caches unless it gets near the end and I don't intend to earn any more and there are things I still want.
Personally, I never even considered the points earned on those challenges to carry over, I considered that each season would be a capsule in itself. I'm glad the caches carry over and can certainly be sure I don't have more than 2000 pts left at the end of the season.
If I have everything I want and I'm at 2000 or less I'll just not invest any more time in any challenges (shrugs). Might still earn a few, like the login ones, and maybe some will be lost but eh.
To be honest, I'm surprised that anyone that got a bunch of caches would just randomly open them all up unless there was something expensive there they wanted right away but that's just me I guess. I'd still always open them as I wanted to use them.

Alastrine · April 10

virtus753 wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

It counts full months from January 1 of this year. You should have had caches for 4 months (January-April). You can see how many premium tome tokens you have to compare.

No, not 4. Just 3. Jan, Feb, March.
I have been subbed monthly for years. I got 3 caches. One for every FULL month this year I've been subbed. April isn't considered a full month yet.
So you should have 3. Not 4.

Silaf · April 10

grumlins wrote: »

This is cheating those of us who pay for membership out of the thousands of tome cache points because no one told us ZOS that these would end not in a single video or live stream. You are basically cheating thousands of players out of their money. What's worse is nothing in the tome is beyond cosmetic, there's nothing there that would require you to do a reset each season.

Why bother ending these points when they could be best served giving the players the points they need to finally get the items they want from seals? It makes 0 sense other than to create a system where the players are forced to play your broken gambling machine with boxes no one wants.

Zos want people to have tings to do and partecipate in events. A dedicated player can complete a tome with so much eccess points to skip the next season. That's boring because you have nothing to do.

Limiting the points you can inherit from season to season is not a bad design choice the problem was comunication.
I diden't open my caches after renewing eso+ for 12 months but that was sheer luck. I'm an informed player following every stream and the forums and i diden't know. The same is true for my guildmates.

This said is not an easy situation for ZOS because they have to decide how to manage it and find out if they even have the data to distinguish who did the purchase or not.

Recently one of my mounts disappeared and i had to send support proof of purchase with the steam recipit. My point here is that ZOS support had no access to my list of purchases and had to ask me for it.
If this with tome points is a similar scenario maybe they don't know who did purchase them and how to manage the players that did spend part of the opened sachels.

It's not an easy senario to manage if you put yourself in their shoes.

daemondamian · April 10

virtus753 wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

Just tell them you don't remember exactly how many you had, but you have this many points and would like to restore this many caches. Each cache holds 2000 points.

Okay, thanks. What are people submitting tickets under - missing item or something else?

Nothing seemed to fit so I think I chose Character issue, then Skills, Abilities and Achievements, then explained the situation.

I have these choices under character issue:

I am muted

Character Stuck

Character Stuck in Combat

Deleted characters

virtus753 wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

It counts full months from January 1 of this year. You should have had caches for 4 months (January-April). You can see how many premium tome tokens you have to compare.

I have 12 PTT according to the tome upgrade UI but that would mean I should have had 12 caches or not?

I thought it was three but must have been wrong.

Currently I have 15,117 tome points.

The Tome upgrade UI shows 12 tokens because that is the price for one upgrade in tokens.

Your actual number of tokens owned is shown in your currency tab.

Oh okay thanks I have 4 in my currency tab, so now I know to ask to have 4 restored.

Alastrine wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

It counts full months from January 1 of this year. You should have had caches for 4 months (January-April). You can see how many premium tome tokens you have to compare.

No, not 4. Just 3. Jan, Feb, March.
I have been subbed monthly for years. I got 3 caches. One for every FULL month this year I've been subbed. April isn't considered a full month yet.
So you should have 3. Not 4.

I have 4 Premium Tome Tokens so I must have opened 4 as you get one per month of membership?

SilverBride wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I have these choices under character issue:

I am muted

Character Stuck

Character Stuck in Combat

Deleted characters

I put my ticket in when I was in game.

I chose Ask for Help
Impact: Character Issue
Categories: Skills/Abilities/Achievements
Additional Information: I explained about opening the caches not knowing only 2k tome points carry over and asked to have the caches restored.

Thanks, I'll try doing it in game.

ElysaDjinn · April 10

I have had a reply, with a helpful resolution:

As a one-time exception I have been able to remove 10000 Tome Points from your account and restore 5 Caches of Tome Points at this time. Please note that we may not be able to perform exceptions of this nature in the future.

I'm very happy with this - @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin I'd like to thank you for your team's sensible approach to a bit of an awkward issue.

SkaiFaith · April 10

I am totally ok with not bringing all my Tome Points to the next season BUT WHY can't those in surplus remain spendable on the past season???

You may wonder why this matters. Well, there are rewards like Transmute Crystals, that have a cap, and maybe I am now at that cap but I have earned the right to claim those Transmutes Crystals with my Tome points, I just want to claim them when I actually need them!

This smells of [snip]. Doesn't seem fair.
[edited for profanity bypass]

virtus753 · April 10

Alastrine wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

daemondamian wrote: »

I want to submit a ticket but I don't remember for sure if I opened 3 caches or not.

I've had a recurring ESO + Membership for several years that is set to renew (180 days) on the 15th May.

According to ESO HUB, ESO Plus membership gives you One cache per month but I don't know if that's retroactive or how to determine how many caches I should have gotten to request to be restored?

It counts full months from January 1 of this year. You should have had caches for 4 months (January-April). You can see how many premium tome tokens you have to compare.

No, not 4. Just 3. Jan, Feb, March.
I have been subbed monthly for years. I got 3 caches. One for every FULL month this year I've been subbed. April isn't considered a full month yet.
So you should have 3. Not 4.

You are in a very different situation than the poster who asked above. If you’ve only subbed monthly, you should have 3. You’ll get your fourth when your sub renews in April. This person subbed for 6 months, a single 6-month sub which expires in May. That’s four full months of 2026 paid, including April. They got 4 credits accordingly.

Credits aren’t issued as each month completes. Credits are issued at two moments:

-The retroactive credit was issued at the end of March for subs already extant prior to March 9. This poster’s sub was bought last year, so retroactive credit had to be given for every full month already paid starting in January. That’s 4 months, as the sub expires mid-May.

-From now on, the only way to get new credits is at the moment a sub is renewed or bought. So when you renew in April, you get your fourth credit. When the person who asked above renews on May 15, there will be as many credits granted as months are bought then (6 for them, unless something is changed about the sub).

If they got 3 credits instead of 4 now, April would then be skipped despite having been paid. They are paid through April and thus got the April token/cache.

And yes, that means May 1-14 won’t ever count here, despite being paid. The retroactive credit counted full calendar months; the new credits count months of subs from the moment of purchase, regardless of calendar date.