AD vs EP vs DC (Overland Toggle)

Radiate77 · 5:43AM

With the announcement of an Overland difficulty toggle opening the door for Overland settings, would it be possible to enable Faction warfare in Overland as an additional opt-in flagging system?

People who do not want to participate, could avoid it entirely, but for those of us who want a more engaging experience, it would be nice to have the setting available to us in while in town.

Right now there wouldn’t be much incentive to toggle it on though, but what if different points of interest became capturable? This could follow the AP route for rewards.

Imagine how many doors this could open up if implemented well, and if it were popular?

Necrotech_Master · 5:49AM

i highly doubt it would work well, considering theres like 30ish zones in the game, and cyro itself is barely filling up 1 campaign

and if 90%+ of people never enable it, there wouldnt be many people to fight, wouldnt be more different than just dueling

ESO_player123 · 5:53AM

No, thank you. Dueling within city limits is annoying. Let's keep special effects galore to dungeons and boss fights during events.

Radiate77 · 5:54AM

ESO_player123 wrote: »

No, thank you. Dueling within city limits is annoying. Let's keep special effects galore to dungeons and boss fights during events.

There’s a toggle coming out to diminish effects.

Radiate77 · 6:08AM

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

i highly doubt it would work well, considering theres like 30ish zones in the game, and cyro itself is barely filling up 1 campaign

and if 90%+ of people never enable it, there wouldnt be many people to fight, wouldnt be more different than just dueling

New World had the perfect version of this with Marauders, Covenant, and Syndicate.

That game has a huge map too, and how it worked was that you would coordinate with your alliance via Alliance Chat to go to specific Outposts, or in ESO it could be Points of Interest, and your progress worked towards a PvP Battle Pass where in ESO, we already have AP incentive as a tool.

The whole map of Tamriel would not see PvP 24/7, as players would funnel to where their Alliance or Guilds were targeting, and good engagements usually lasted anywhere from 30 minutes to an hour. As a player simply leveling my character through the MSQ, I’d often run into warzones outside of Objectives and it was the coolest thing IMO.

I could actually see a near 1-1 replication of their flagging system as quite successful in ESO.

GloatingSwine · 7:49AM

Radiate77 wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

i highly doubt it would work well, considering theres like 30ish zones in the game, and cyro itself is barely filling up 1 campaign

and if 90%+ of people never enable it, there wouldnt be many people to fight, wouldnt be more different than just dueling

New World had the perfect version of this with Marauders, Covenant, and Syndicate.

That game has a huge map too, and how it worked was that you would coordinate with your alliance via Alliance Chat to go to specific Outposts, or in ESO it could be Points of Interest, and your progress worked towards a PvP Battle Pass where in ESO, we already have AP incentive as a tool.

The whole map of Tamriel would not see PvP 24/7, as players would funnel to where their Alliance or Guilds were targeting, and good engagements usually lasted anywhere from 30 minutes to an hour. As a player simply leveling my character through the MSQ, I’d often run into warzones outside of Objectives and it was the coolest thing IMO.

I could actually see a near 1-1 replication of their flagging system as quite successful in ESO.

New World also sank without trace immediately on launch. If you're going to suggest cannibalising systems from other games at least choose games that enough people liked to make them a viable product in the market.

Coordinating in chat to fight at points of interest is what happens in Cyrodiil. If that's the experience you desire good news, you can have it right now!

Radiate77 · 8:05AM

GloatingSwine wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

i highly doubt it would work well, considering theres like 30ish zones in the game, and cyro itself is barely filling up 1 campaign

and if 90%+ of people never enable it, there wouldnt be many people to fight, wouldnt be more different than just dueling

New World had the perfect version of this with Marauders, Covenant, and Syndicate.

That game has a huge map too, and how it worked was that you would coordinate with your alliance via Alliance Chat to go to specific Outposts, or in ESO it could be Points of Interest, and your progress worked towards a PvP Battle Pass where in ESO, we already have AP incentive as a tool.

The whole map of Tamriel would not see PvP 24/7, as players would funnel to where their Alliance or Guilds were targeting, and good engagements usually lasted anywhere from 30 minutes to an hour. As a player simply leveling my character through the MSQ, I’d often run into warzones outside of Objectives and it was the coolest thing IMO.

I could actually see a near 1-1 replication of their flagging system as quite successful in ESO.

New World also sank without trace immediately on launch. If you're going to suggest cannibalising systems from other games at least choose games that enough people liked to make them a viable product in the market.

Coordinating in chat to fight at points of interest is what happens in Cyrodiil. If that's the experience you desire good news, you can have it right now!

If you followed the game you’d know that systematic changes were made to bring that flag system to the point it was where New World got announced for EoS on a climb in population.

That said, you want a “successful” MMO that offers flag PvP? Look at World of Warcraft, I can log onto Tichondrius and find that gameplay in minutes.

Some of us who’ve been around for a decade, have been fighting at the same keeps and outposts for over 10 years… is it any shock that Cyrodiil and IC have no players? That would be like trying to convince someone with over 5,000 veteran dungeon clears to go run Veteran Fungal Grotto. Good luck!

Emeratis · 8:15AM

I'm not personally a fan of the idea. Maybe it's because I saw a worse version of it implemented in wow way back when that I find overland pvp to be more of a turnoff. I also liked IC and towns in Cyrodiil a lot more before they had capturable points so that just sounds like it would bring a system I already find tedious to areas of the game where I wouldn't want to see it. I also aesthetically do not want to see points of interest, which are often lovely screenshot locations, littered with alliance war flags and the like.

What I would like to see for new pvp stuff, and many of my friends without forum accounts would too, is a type of arenalike battleground gameplay that offers random pvp oriented augments similar to IA's visions and verses system. A lot of players that like gimmick/objective based pvp really don't have a rewarding and fun equivalent in eso yet (battlegrounds are either mindless deathballing or avoiding pvp, cyrodiil is pretty repetitive with not a lot of deviance in strategy these days, etc) and this would scratch that itch for that crowd. I also think it's something both casual and hardcore pvpers could enjoy and deal with one of the problems of getting newer players into pvp.

LunaFlora · 8:30AM

i know some people want a PvP toggle feature in Overland that interacts with the Justice system.
that would not be Alliances versus Alliances though.

Personally i would not enjoy either. i only like PvP in Battlegrounds.

frogthroat · 9:20AM

ESO_player123 wrote: »

No, thank you. Dueling within city limits is annoying. Let's keep special effects galore to dungeons and boss fights during events.

Yeah, if anything, city limits should be "safe zones" where you cannot initiate a duel. Yesterday some people decided to duel and duel again at the Vivec City wayshrine, right next to the guild traders. Very annoying. What's wrong with the Alik'r Desert or Wayrest Undaunted duel spots? No one is bothered if you go there.

Or it could be made so that city guards don't like it and attack if they see someone duelling.

But yeah, I think the Wayrest duel area needs to stay so if there would be some "no duel within cities" or that guards attack, the Wayrest Undaunted Enclave needs to be excluded. But otherwise, why duel right in the middle of a city?

Radiate77 · 9:47AM

@frogthroat in absolute agreement.

Nothing is more annoying than being forced to fight in towns because nobody visits the old dueling spots anymore and getting shot by a guard crossbow for 100k damage when I have a 50,000 gold bounty after a few fights playing as a Necromancer.

Part of my suggestion, was that towns would be safe areas, where you set your setting to flag or not, and I would be a fan of an immunity period when walking out of town or post-wayshrine to prevent grieving.

It’s honestly just so exhausting fighting in the same BG maps on repeat, or fighting over Sejanus and Alessia bridge for the ten-thousandth time. We’ve got so many great environments throughout the game that would work great for tactical gameplay yet only 1/100th of the game is actually PvP.

imPDA · 10:15AM

Overland PvP was discussed many times, but until game stays PvE-oriented, it is not going to happen.

Weesacs · 10:18AM

They have this in WoW. It's brilliant. When you toggle world PvP ON you enter a different zone instance to PvE players so they would never see the PvP players.

You have quests, achievements, titles and items drop into the zone occasionally which you fight over and winner takes all.

Some of the best times I've had in WoW was in world PvP.

However, that aside, some of the current Cyrodiil problems would just migrate over to zone PvP:

- lack of players (however cross play would hopefully help with this)
- Class homogenisation. IMO Cyrodiil sucks because the majority of players just run the assassin / animal companion / storm calling meta which would just migrate over to zone PvP - everyone just runs away lol. Hopefully this will change with class changes over the next year or so.
- Ball groups. Again, current problem in Cyrodiil. You would just have synced up, sweaty groups, on comms dominating zones. I suppose they could implement no teaming up allowed and leave it solo but not sure how that would work in practice.

frogthroat · 10:50AM

Radiate77 wrote: »

Nothing is more annoying than being forced to fight in towns because nobody visits the old dueling spots anymore and getting shot by a guard crossbow for 100k damage when I have a 50,000 gold bounty after a few fights playing as a Necromancer.

Oh right, necros and vampires might have some trouble with these areas.

Radiate77 wrote: »

It’s honestly just so exhausting fighting in the same BG maps on repeat, or fighting over Sejanus and Alessia bridge for the ten-thousandth time.

For sure. I am not even a PVP player. Only do some Cyro casually. And even then, probably 80% of the time it's the Alessia-Sejanus battle.

Radiate77 wrote: »

We’ve got so many great environments throughout the game that would work great for tactical gameplay yet only 1/100th of the game is actually PvP.

Since ZOS has much more limited resources changed from new zones to battle pass and therefore do more content in the existing zones because it's cheaper than creating new zones, maybe they could do official duel areas. Like, you would get a new map marker similar to dolmens, dragons and harrowstorms. And if people are duelling there, you see swords crossed icon.

Maybe a few permanent ones, like next to Bergama wayshrine in Alik'r Desert, but they could also include a monthly moving area. It would help to guide those who want to duel to the area, wouldn't bother those who don't want to see the lightshow while they do their daily crafting writs, and the moving areas would provide new, changing terrain you can use. For example when the golden pursuits reset, or when whatever regularly resets, also the moving area moves. Maybe one moving area for base game and another one for DLC zones.

Would not require any new design. Only that they program a new map marker that triggers from duels. And maybe some goodies you get for joining.

Although I am not a PVPer myself and do not like PVP in city limits, I am not a fond of taking away from other players. This way cities would have less PVP and those who enjoy duels would have better coordination where to meet and would have new terrain periodically.

edit: and I don't mean that duels would not be possible elsewhere. Just that this new icon would be a guide for players. Still, if you choose to meet with someone anywhere else for a duel, you could. There just wouldn't be a map marker pointing you there. But within city limits I would like to see restrictions, just like the sorc seagulls and monkeys or warden's bear.

LunaFlora · 10:53AM

Hammerdeath Arena in Stormhaven should really get some PvP interaction

Lady_Light · 1:38PM

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

i highly doubt it would work well, considering theres like 30ish zones in the game, and cyro itself is barely filling up 1 campaign

and if 90%+ of people never enable it, there wouldnt be many people to fight, wouldnt be more different than just dueling

Cries in 45 queue for GH on a Sunday.

Vulkunne · 3:21PM

Radiate77 wrote: »

With the announcement of an Overland difficulty toggle opening the door for Overland settings, would it be possible to enable Faction warfare in Overland as an additional opt-in flagging system?

People who do not want to participate, could avoid it entirely, but for those of us who want a more engaging experience, it would be nice to have the setting available to us in while in town.

Right now there wouldn’t be much incentive to toggle it on though, but what if different points of interest became capturable? This could follow the AP route for rewards.

Imagine how many doors this could open up if implemented well, and if it were popular?

ROFL. That's awesome. What a surprise when someone leaves Cyrodiil trying to hide in PvE land but forgets they're still flagged.

I like this idea. It would also make other places like Alik'r deserts more interesting as well.

AllenaNightWood · 3:23PM

ESO_player123 wrote: »

No, thank you. Dueling within city limits is annoying. Let's keep special effects galore to dungeons and boss fights during events.

there need to be a not dueling buffer within set ranges of wayshrines

frogthroat · 3:36PM

AllenaNightWood wrote: »

ESO_player123 wrote: »

No, thank you. Dueling within city limits is annoying. Let's keep special effects galore to dungeons and boss fights during events.

there need to be a not dueling buffer within set ranges of wayshrines

Nah, one of the most popular duel places is at Bergama wayshrine, Alik'r Desert. A buffer zone around the wayshrine would disrupt that.

Inside a city would be enough. Wherever you see guards, that's where duelling would be a criminal act, or not possible.

Treeshka · 4:24PM

This toggle thing was one of the worst things for me in the other game that is now being shut down.
It ruins immersion, half of the players are not opting in and other half opting in. Either it should be forced for everyone or certain zones should have it. In Elder Scrolls we have the latter, Cyrodiil and Imperial City.

Hapexamendios · 4:30PM

No thanks. I don't want to see it in PVE areas so a toggle is not an option. The only way that is acceptable for me is separate instances. Let the PvP and PV areas remain separate. You want them together, go to the sewers.

kargen27 · 4:45PM

Radiate77 wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

i highly doubt it would work well, considering theres like 30ish zones in the game, and cyro itself is barely filling up 1 campaign

and if 90%+ of people never enable it, there wouldnt be many people to fight, wouldnt be more different than just dueling

New World had the perfect version of this with Marauders, Covenant, and Syndicate.

That game has a huge map too, and how it worked was that you would coordinate with your alliance via Alliance Chat to go to specific Outposts, or in ESO it could be Points of Interest, and your progress worked towards a PvP Battle Pass where in ESO, we already have AP incentive as a tool.

The whole map of Tamriel would not see PvP 24/7, as players would funnel to where their Alliance or Guilds were targeting, and good engagements usually lasted anywhere from 30 minutes to an hour. As a player simply leveling my character through the MSQ, I’d often run into warzones outside of Objectives and it was the coolest thing IMO.

I could actually see a near 1-1 replication of their flagging system as quite successful in ESO.

The New World map was specifically designed with PvP in mind. There are large scale objectives across the map and incentives built in to reward capturing an area. ESO would have to do almost a complete rewrite to get to that point.

wolfie1.0. · 5:18PM

I think the entire concept of PVE/P in eso has sailed. The mechanics of which have been tried already in smaller batches.

IC is the most hated zone of PVEs because PVP players will target you while you are mid pve content or they hit you while you are transitioning through one of the many bottlenecks on the way back to base.

PVP players hate it because after they kill and drive off the players that want to just PVE they have not much to do.

A toggle would either see a set of 3 PVE roaming zergs chasing objectives like cats chasing their tails for exp like dolmens with the occasional clash...

Or it would be dead with PVPers literally dueling for objectives.

AllenaNightWood · 6:06PM

No

katanagirl1 · 7:38PM

So I would have to toggle something every time I left Cyrodiil? That is even worse than the greatly-reduced staff of ESO working on something that appeals to a tiny minority, the players who like to harass others at wayshrines for an easy kill.

I’d prefer them working on something that has a broader appeal and actually brings new content to the game.

Radiate77 · 7:45PM

katanagirl1 wrote: »

So I would have to toggle something every time I left Cyrodiil? That is even worse than the greatly-reduced staff of ESO working on something that appeals to a tiny minority, the players who like to harass others at wayshrines for an easy kill.

I’d prefer them working on something that has a broader appeal and actually brings new content to the game.

Who said you’d have to toggle every time you left Cyrodiil?

Seems like an unnecessary additional step when you could just add a Battle Spirit toggle to settings that greys out every time you queue into a dedicated PvP area.