Idea: Improve Class Identity with Subclassing

Luca05 · February 9

Hey,

I just had an idea to improve Class Identity while actively using Subclassing instead of (indirectly) trying to nerf it like with the new DK (which provides buffs for not using other skill lines)

Concept
> The Idea: Class X doesn't simply copy Class Y's skills, but rather learns them through the lense of their own understanding.
> Example: DK doesn't get access to the classic Arcanist beam (that one is reserved ONLY for the Arcanist) but develops its own fiery version of it that deals flame damage and is more red / orange than green.

Advantages
> Class Identity problem is fixed without the use of nerfing / improving something
> Skill variety greatly increases due to every skill having its own version for every class. I know that, technically, the beam (for example) stays the beam, but just changing the name and damage type for different classes (in addition to some minor adjustments if necessary) could make a huge difference for the gameplay.
> The amount of work one would have to invest shouldn't be nearly as great as reworking all classes. As I've said: In order to improve class identity, just changing the name, damage type and optics (even if it's only a colour change) should be more than enough.
> Instead of the boring "subclassing quest", you could create own spots (or even quests?) for each individual class. Example: You are playing Nightblade and want to adapt a Warden ability, so you travel to the secret "Ice Nature's Heart", where the shrine of Wardens bestows some of their wisdom upon you.
> If you want to have an optically clean character in combat, you mostly must not use other classes skill lines. There (hopefully) won't be any drastic dps differences between solo- and subclassing after the class reworks anymore, but the problem remains the same: If I don't care about damage and rather want to use a necro ability because I find skeletons cooler, I cannot do so without breaking with my templar design. I would need holy skeletons with golden eyes which don't exist.
(> How cool would it be to have actual factions within ones class? Imagine the Ice- and Stealth-Sorcerers, the Grave- and Sunlight/Flame-Templars, etc.)
> ...

Disadvantages
> The amount of work to create class-specific abilities would increase exponentially with every new class. (But honestly, I think this wouldn't become problematic until ESO hit like 20 classes or so, which shouldn't happen within the next 10 years).
> ...

What do you think of this idea? I'm new to the forum and couldn't find anyone that posted the same idea as I had, but I'm also not deep enough into this whole topic to say for sure that something like that hadn't been discussed already, considering the simplicity of the idea.
*and btw, English isn't my mother tongue, so please excuse minor mistakes xd

LunaFlora · February 10

that seems unnecessary.
Your base class was also technically learned by your character so why would they not be able to learn another class' magic properly?

Dragonknight is already getting a Fatecarver-like skill with the Engulfing Dragonfire morph becoming a channeled area of effect fire attack.
it is pretty likely every class is getting a similar skill with the Class Refresh.

Class quests have been talked about before, they could be fun. But now seem unnecessary as we have the Subclassing quest which simply unlocks our ability to Subclass.

Colour changes so other class' magic looks like your base class would be odd to me, unless it is via Skill Styling.
We already have a few skill styles with effects like ice, leaves, and lava. We could totally have skill styles for class skills that make them look like another class.
Perhaps special class skill styles could be acquired through quests that involve classes somehow.

i do agree some of the class refresh changes are frustrating for current Subclassing builds, but it seems to make class skill lines more consistent in theme and connect with eachother.
i like that Dragonknight will be really focused on fire and each line is usable for every role.
i am really looking forward to how the refresh will be accomplished for every other class, especially Warden and Necromancer.

Luca05 · February 10

"Your base class was also technically learned by your character so why would they not be able to learn another class' magic properly?"

=> It defies logic that anyone can learn every magic in the universe just by that. I imagine that a Warden has something like an inner bound or affinity to cold stuff and animals, if that wasn't the case, we wouldn't need class identity or classes at all. Then a more skyrim-like combat without classes, in which you just pick up a spell or weapon you find, would be more appropriate. That is not the case and I think no one wants something like that, so why don't let the Warden create his own understanding of a fatecarver if he's already tied to frost instead of arcane magic?

"Dragonknight is already getting a Fatecarver-like skill with the Engulfing Dragonfire morph becoming a channeled area of effect fire attack.
it is pretty likely every class is getting a similar skill with the Class Refresh."

=> Fatecarver and DK-Fire are technically different enough (e.g. by the area they claim), but you have a valid point with that. The devs shouldn't intermingle class-specific skills then (e.g. by getting every class a fatecarver version), but I know that's easier said than done by now

"Class quests have been talked about before, they could be fun. But now seem unnecessary as we have the Subclassing quest which simply unlocks our ability to Subclass."

=> You're right here. Maybe this could be relevant for future players, or we just enjoy something like that as optional quests?

"Colour changes so other class' magic looks like your base class would be odd to me, unless it is via Skill Styling.
We already have a few skill styles with effects like ice, leaves, and lava. We could totally have skill styles for class skills that make them look like another class."

=> That's basically almost the whole idea. I also imagine some skills odd if only the colour is changed, but ig there are also many cases in which a change of colour would be just as fine.

"i like that Dragonknight will be really focused on fire and each line is usable for every role."

=> You're also right here. Maybe make it optional then to apply your class-own version of a skill? So if I'm assassin and I want to use fiery skills, I can decide to use my class-own version of lava whip or I can just pick up the DK-form of the whip. This may defy parts of the logic behind the whole idea, but isn't nearly as arbitrary as the current subclassing system.