Official Discussion Thread for "Leaping Into the Dragonknight Class Refresh"

ZOS_GinaBruno · January 9

This is the official discussion thread for the web article "Leaping Into the Dragonknight Class Refresh". ESO’s Combat Team has returned to provide an update on the ongoing Class Refresh work. Specifically, they’re taking you through the Dragonknight changes you can expect to find in Update 49, going live for all platforms on March 9. Part patch notes, part developer deep dive, this breakdown delves into the team’s thought processes behind almost every change to the Dragonknight. Be warned, this is a long read!

Faulgor · January 9

Sad about the loss of poison damage (that will kill all my poison builds).

But what I'm really confused about is the rationale for Fire element skills costing Stamina. We've had some instances of things like that before, but if this continues to be part of a larger class rework, the resources will feel completely arbitrary. That's not really conducive to immersion, IMO.

tsaescishoeshiner · January 9

So happy to see the focus on fire damage, new Fiery Breath, and a much-needed rework to Stonefist!

I hope the new Dragonblood doesn't make you invisible like the current visuals do. I get it was to show the heart growing, but it seemed weird to see and didn't fit with the dragonknight visuals to go invisible when you become hardier.

axan22 · January 9

Faulgor wrote: »

Sad about the loss of poison damage (that will kill all my poison builds).

But what I'm really confused about is the rationale for Fire element skills costing Stamina. We've had some instances of things like that before, but if this continues to be part of a larger class rework, the resources will feel completely arbitrary. That's not really conducive to immersion, IMO.

I think stamina for fire skills for dragon knight seem fine, its like dragon knights draw on the dracoinic nature so its something physical stamina related, rather than a fire ball which would be magik.

Plus it seems most skills have a morph choice between stamina and magik.

Justosay · January 10

Dragonknight already had problem with replenishing resources (magicka and stamina). Now the situation will worsen even more - it will be necessary to use heavy attacks (with all its cons) or utilize the skill lines of other classes.

Justosay · January 10

axan22 wrote: »

I think stamina for fire skills for dragon knight seem fine, its like dragon knights draw on the dracoinic nature so its something physical stamina related, rather than a fire ball which would be magik.

In fact, Dragon abilities in most games related to magic, not endure (i.e., stamina).
The problems with stamina-based builds in ESO are: 1) most weapons use stamina, while most class skills use magicka; 2) stamina-based builds use the same resource for both core abilities and skills; 3) refilling stamina is harder than magicka

adamsmith42 · January 10

Is it really necessary to rename all of the skills?

Tallon_IV · January 10

adamsmith42 wrote: »

Is it really necessary to rename all of the skills?

Yeah, I'm not a fan of some of these new names.

LootAllTheStuff · January 10

I feel a little bad that the team had to spell this out:

On the other hand, now I want a wing buffet (buff-ey)!

Back on-topic: Reading through the notes, that's a lot to take in. Overall, I can see the rationale behind removing poison so it can be placed on a different character - it really felt like a forced fit for the sake of having something different.

What's a little off-putting is that I had recently started a new DK character, more for the earth-themed skills. Now I don't know whether or not to continue levelling them up. On one hand, I don't like wasting effort; on the other, they're going to need the skill points anyway.

Djiku · January 11

So many changes. Probably not all for the better but we will get the chance to test them out soon. Personally I don't care much that poison will be removed from the toolkit. I know there are poison dragons but fire is just more fitting, in my opinion. I could imagine nightblade getting poison instead then.
The animations that were shown look very good. I don't mind them being updatet as long as they play good and don't feel clunky.
I will defintely try out the new DK on PTS next week.

Ryder45790 · January 11

I think the changes are refreshing, I've played DK a lot and it is nice to see the push towards fire damage like when fossilize and dark talons were changed to fire damage. My concern is power creep...again, I know everyone loves more and more damage but I'm assuming the added power is so the class can compete with subclassing builds in terms of damage? The other concern that comes to mind is the changes to passives, will they be too powerful with subclassing? will they be hindered if subclassing? From experience classes that struggle with subclassing are Necro and Arcanist due to the unique way they build power through corpses and crux, most of their skill lines become difficult to use subclassed without a way to build power (generator skills). Getting to the point, are the passive changes to DK going to work in a similar manner? I'm excited for PTS but also have my eyebrow raised to see what changes come out.

LordSkruff · January 13

So after a little dive into the newly released toolkit on PTS i can say all you will achieve is furthering the delayed burst meta options in subclassing PvP,

most of the changes i view as positive,

shorter stronger dots, increased sustain sources, useful buffs, group utility.

One major negative i draw from this is first and foremost the draw essence / deep breath

part 1)

being on a 4 second timer,

most likely will just be used with other delayed burst sources bad for the meta when usable together,

deep fissure,
Proximity detonation,
flames of oblivion,
ulfsilds,
blastbones,
null arca,
this new bash set??? glittering road? lmao.

and now deep breath to add to the list of skills that should never work together.

elder AOE oneshots online.

Part 2)

Removal of the heal from draw essence / deep breath,

for me this is a staple skill for allowing the DK to get in the face of a larger foe and actually play that DOMINANT front line role in PvP

giving it time and space to cast skills like talons standard, make use of these shorter dot durations etc. and actually do the thing it was supposed to do. play on the front line. and change it. not die on it wishing you played something else.

I think the rework of this skill in particular is pretty negative as DKs wont really be able to use it to play the way you expect.

I guaranteed it will just be used to align it other oneshot skills from other skill lines with it and kiting around obstacles, or pushing from the back lines like a warden.

Fix?

put it on a 3 second timer,
remove second subs on deep fissure, just make other skills do damage in the warden tool kit to make warden relevant in PvE
but leave subs the hell alone its so overtuned for PvP.
same for blastbones,
or ANY other delayed burst option moving forward.

revert the heal removal on these skills. for sustain change. cool idea, but just wont do it.

in fact put as much of this stuff on a 3 second timer as possible. or 4 second timer universally. as long as it is universal.

then players arent building full tank oneshot builds anymore, cause that really needs to go. like 7 years ago.

oneshot should be risk reward, glass cannons, bombers, gankers, SQUISHY not tanky.

risk reward.

please consider this zenimax.

Regards,

LordSktuff.

Vaelithra_Sundergale · January 13

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