disky wrote: »

I'm excited to try it out!

• Not many notes here on standard or whip. I think it actually kind of makes sense for standard of might to be a buff skill- it's a banner in the ground. In terms of visuals, it makes sense actually. As for shifting standard, I think most dps are going to move away from it. We'll see once it releases, though.
• Searing Claw as a name makes sense given the flame damage. And even though Burning Embers is the original, Claw of Life might be a better idea since it heals. Maybe even Vampiric Claw but probably not thematically appropriate. Siphoning Claw?
• I personally don't like Core of Flame, Soul of Flame, or Heart of Flame. The base ability would sound better as Deep Breaths, with morphs being Inhale and Exhale, since the theme of these seem to be about resource management. Many of these names sound as if they were generated by ChatGPT.
• Ash Cloud/Hearthfire. There's a lot of discussion about this skill rework that I think should be considered. Hearthfire does not make much sense for a cloud of ash that buffs allies with fortitude and heroism. Maybe keep Ash Cloud, with morph names tailored to the benefits given. Like Heroic Cloud for one, and Cloud of Protection for the one that grants major protection. If these are changed back to include the slow effect, I'd consider changing one to Choking Cloud. Maybe even Ash Eruption if one of the morphs becomes damage focused once more.
• Inferno + Incinerate. Given the ability rework, this makes complete sense to me. Flames of Oblivion has nothing to do with oblivion damage, so I can understand the name change here. I would also keep Cauterize if it remains a healing bout of flame.
• Combustion, Traumatic Burns, Fan the Flames, and Soul Ablaze: You're going to be made fun of for the traumatic burns one, but for what the passive grants, it makes sense. I like Combustion and Fan the Flames just fine. Soul Ablaze is a little cheesy. Honestly that or Burning Heart work fine for what they do, name wise.

• Dragon Leap and names- all sound fine. I think knocking enemies up is weird though, and should be reconsidered
• Dragonfire Breath base name should just be Dragonfire, without the breath, in my opinion. Disintegrating and Engulfing are both great morph names for their tooltips.
• I think the base name for Dark Talons should just be Talons, since there's not much that's 'dark' about them. Otherwise, both Burning and Choking continue to make sense. Many would argue that Choking Talons does not offer much to be desired in terms of utility, though.
• Dragon Blood makes sense as a base name, but Green Dragon Blood has never made sense to me, and nor does Blood of the Elder Dragon. Here are my two cents. For the Green morph, I suggest Revitalizing Blood, or Blood of Recovery. Something along that theme. And for the Elder Dragon one, I suggest Empowering Blood or Rallying Blood, since this morph provides an offensive buff to damage.
• Wing Buffet. Heh. Even you guys knew you'd get memed for this one. I'm not keen on any of the three names for these skills. After some brainstorming, what about Wing Surge, Wings of Deflection, Wings of Protection, or Wing Shelter for the base skill? As for 'Fleetstep', what about Unbound Flight (if the immunity to snares/immobilization still exists anyway), and Winged Shroud for the other morph, since it focuses on protecting the group as a whole
• Chains of Flame and morphs- all sound fantastic. Very thematically appropriate for what the skills do
• Ironskin name change- personally Draconic Scales makes more sense here. Or Natural Armor.
• Storm Voice- makes zero sense for the dragonknight class. That seems like a sorcerer passive name. Voice of the Dragon would be better thematically- especially since the passive focuses on casting ultimates

• Magma Armor as a name makes sense. Corrosive does not, especially with the change to poison. I think Explosive Armor would be a better name since it does fire damage now. And perhaps Magma Shield for the other morph since it gives people shields.
• Superheated Ward and Volcanic Ward- they're both okay. I neither like nor dislike them. Magma fist seems out of left field in comparison to the other two since (if I'm understand this correctly) neither ward does damage. It seems like a different skill, basically.
• Molten Weapons, Obsidian Shield, Petrify- no comments on any of the names here or abilities. They all sound great.
• Earthspike Mantle- dragonknights don't seem like an earthy based class (even though the skill line is called Earthen Heart). I personally like Draconic Mantle more as a name for the base skill. Or even Draconic Armor. If the base skill name is Draconic Armor, the Shatterspike Mantle would sound better as Volatile Armor still, and Hardened Armor for the other morph of course. If it's Draconic Mantle, Volatile Mantle and Hardened Mantle for morph names.
• Passives: Heart of Stone actually kind of makes sense for the physical/spell resistance gained.
• Avalanche sounds like it belongs on a warden. Eternal mountain sounds better because it involves duration of abilities. Or even Eternal Fire to keep in line with dragonknight fire flavor.
• Mountain's Blessing sounds way better than the proposed change. Speaking of mountains, renaming Helping Hands to Mountain Giant seems thematically appropriate.

monkiie wrote: »

Faulgor wrote: »

a) Sad to see Poison go. Even if Nightblades or another class takes up the Poison mantle, there's no guarantee we will see similar skills, and that rework is more than a year away. So until then, Poison builds are just deleted from the game?

b) I really, really don't like to see Fire skills still costing Stamina. That makes no sense. It's against the game's own logic that was established over the years. If this continues, and I fully expect it to, what even are Magicka and Stamina? I can't even explain how this itches my brain, where is the magic coming from when I exert Stamina?! It's counter-intuitive, arbitrary, and immersion-smearing.

And this is a problem with hybridization. I like that they are going all in on the flame fantasy of a dragon knight but the developer decisions from years ago dug them into this hole. Hybridization and subclassing have aged very poorly and unfortunately will never be reverted.

BardokRedSnow wrote: »

As for people saying fire skills using stamina makes no sense, it makes sense when you remember DK skills dont fully derive from magicka, they come from "ki" I believe its called like in DBZ, which is energy from the spirit. That was the case also loosely in Skyrim with the thu'um which is what the akaviri dragon magic is a cousin to, its tonal architecture and has different properties to normal magics.

So since we dont have a ki bar, it being represented as draining physical energy as well as magic is a decent workaround vs Skyrim which used a built in timer that didnt affect your magicka.

TLDR its lore accurate for what we know about dragon knights

The power of a Nord can be articulated into a shout, like the kiai of an Akaviri swordsman.

Darrell9090 wrote: »

I just read the changes to the dk as a dk tank main I got some concerns for some of the tool changes and some suggestions. My biggest concern is the standard ultimate and its morphs.

Engulfing Dragonfire (originally Engulfing Flames): This morph is now the rework morph, which costs Magicka instead of Stamina. This morph now channels the flame attack in front of you over 4.8 seconds and deals 20% increased damage when it hits an enemy, up to once every second, and up to a maximum of 80%. While Take Flight is active, this deals maximum damage. The damage is considered direct damage.

Cobble123 wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

Might be now.

The best tanks provide damage to their groups, and the new Standard is a LOT of damage.

Until they change the new buff to Major Courage in 3 months time, like they eventually do with every other un-named buff.

Desiato wrote: »

Engulfing Dragonfire (originally Engulfing Flames): This morph is now the rework morph, which costs Magicka instead of Stamina. This morph now channels the flame attack in front of you over 4.8 seconds and deals 20% increased damage when it hits an enemy, up to once every second, and up to a maximum of 80%. While Take Flight is active, this deals maximum damage. The damage is considered direct damage.

To me, this ability and the others it synergizes with could represent a new Arcanist-like play style for DK.

This was actually my biggest fear about the class rework: That every class would be given its themed version of Fatecarver.

I guess we'll see how it is implemented on PTS, but it seems it could be the case.

MXVIIDREAM wrote: »

Desiato wrote: »

Engulfing Dragonfire (originally Engulfing Flames): This morph is now the rework morph, which costs Magicka instead of Stamina. This morph now channels the flame attack in front of you over 4.8 seconds and deals 20% increased damage when it hits an enemy, up to once every second, and up to a maximum of 80%. While Take Flight is active, this deals maximum damage. The damage is considered direct damage.

To me, this ability and the others it synergizes with could represent a new Arcanist-like play style for DK.

This was actually my biggest fear about the class rework: That every class would be given its themed version of Fatecarver.

I guess we'll see how it is implemented on PTS, but it seems it could be the case.

I really hope they change the other morph at least to magicka costing so much more have a choice to run it because channeled skill are something I hate but I love fire breath

BardokRedSnow wrote: »

MXVIIDREAM wrote: »

Desiato wrote: »

Engulfing Dragonfire (originally Engulfing Flames): This morph is now the rework morph, which costs Magicka instead of Stamina. This morph now channels the flame attack in front of you over 4.8 seconds and deals 20% increased damage when it hits an enemy, up to once every second, and up to a maximum of 80%. While Take Flight is active, this deals maximum damage. The damage is considered direct damage.

To me, this ability and the others it synergizes with could represent a new Arcanist-like play style for DK.

This was actually my biggest fear about the class rework: That every class would be given its themed version of Fatecarver.

I guess we'll see how it is implemented on PTS, but it seems it could be the case.

I really hope they change the other morph at least to magicka costing so much more have a choice to run it because channeled skill are something I hate but I love fire breath

Wretched Vitality is your friend if you are having sustain issues. Work around your limitations.

Roksa monster set also, orzoga bear haunch, etc etc.

Tyrobag wrote: »

#1 Problem:
"Attrition - a wearing down or weakening of resistance, especially as a result of continuous pressure or harassment"
The word attrition carries the implication of occurring over a longer period of time. Logically, this would correspond to LONGER DoTs, not shorter ones. It has already been established that people prefer longer DoTs for a more comfortable rotation (You'll notice that when given a choice between a power increase and a duration increase, most builds take the duration). With these facts in front of you, and claiming that your intention is for DK's damage to be based on attrition, how do you possibly justify knocking down all of DK's dots to just 10 seconds?

#2 Problem:
For what possible reason did you remove eruption? Its DK's only ground DoT, and it was the morph that actually did what the ability was intended to do. The replacement isn't even anything interesting, so why remove one of DK's staple abilities? This makes me honestly want to stop playing at all until you guys are done changing all of the classes. Why would I work on a build that I know is going completely loose core abilities that it relies on?


Every time you've had low duration DoTs like this, the feedback has been the same: It makes the game feel clunky and spammy. People don't want 10 second rotations.

That said, there are a lot of good things here. If you guys actually listen to feedback this time and fix the DoT durations, as well as return at least eruption (preferably the base morph too, since the whole "healing ash" thing is not intuitive) this could be really good. Otherwise its unlikely that I'd use DK skills when there are other options that actually have almost reasonable durations.

Tyrobag wrote: »

Wup_sa wrote: »

Tyrobag wrote: »

#1 Problem:
"Attrition - a wearing down or weakening of resistance, especially as a result of continuous pressure or harassment"
The word attrition carries the implication of occurring over a longer period of time. Logically, this would correspond to LONGER DoTs, not shorter ones. It has already been established that people prefer longer DoTs for a more comfortable rotation (You'll notice that when given a choice between a power increase and a duration increase, most builds take the duration). With these facts in front of you, and claiming that your intention is for DK's damage to be based on attrition, how do you possibly justify knocking down all of DK's dots to just 10 seconds?

#2 Problem:
For what possible reason did you remove eruption? Its DK's only ground DoT, and it was the morph that actually did what the ability was intended to do. The replacement isn't even anything interesting, so why remove one of DK's staple abilities? This makes me honestly want to stop playing at all until you guys are done changing all of the classes. Why would I work on a build that I know is going completely loose core abilities that it relies on?


Every time you've had low duration DoTs like this, the feedback has been the same: It makes the game feel clunky and spammy. People don't want 10 second rotations.

That said, there are a lot of good things here. If you guys actually listen to feedback this time and fix the DoT durations, as well as return at least eruption (preferably the base morph too, since the whole "healing ash" thing is not intuitive) this could be really good. Otherwise its unlikely that I'd use DK skills when there are other options that actually have almost reasonable durations.

The reason for shorter DOTs is because of PvP. Long DOTs don't do damage, so they shorten the time and make the damage proc every second instead of every 2 seconds (might become as problematic as relequeen is in duels).

So we should Make DK a pure PvP class? Also, nowhere in the article did they say they were making DoTs tick every second. That is a change I would absolutely agree with, but it wouldn't change the fact that a 10 second duration is way too short.

MXVIIDREAM wrote: »

Tyrobag wrote: »

#1 Problem:
"Attrition - a wearing down or weakening of resistance, especially as a result of continuous pressure or harassment"
The word attrition carries the implication of occurring over a longer period of time. Logically, this would correspond to LONGER DoTs, not shorter ones. It has already been established that people prefer longer DoTs for a more comfortable rotation (You'll notice that when given a choice between a power increase and a duration increase, most builds take the duration). With these facts in front of you, and claiming that your intention is for DK's damage to be based on attrition, how do you possibly justify knocking down all of DK's dots to just 10 seconds?

#2 Problem:
For what possible reason did you remove eruption? Its DK's only ground DoT, and it was the morph that actually did what the ability was intended to do. The replacement isn't even anything interesting, so why remove one of DK's staple abilities? This makes me honestly want to stop playing at all until you guys are done changing all of the classes. Why would I work on a build that I know is going completely loose core abilities that it relies on?


Every time you've had low duration DoTs like this, the feedback has been the same: It makes the game feel clunky and spammy. People don't want 10 second rotations.

That said, there are a lot of good things here. If you guys actually listen to feedback this time and fix the DoT durations, as well as return at least eruption (preferably the base morph too, since the whole "healing ash" thing is not intuitive) this could be really good. Otherwise its unlikely that I'd use DK skills when there are other options that actually have almost reasonable durations.

Changing dots to shorter timers and increasing damage was absolutely the right move anyone who has played the class will tell you that also results in a significant dps increase for pve PvP and most overload content
This is a dot class and every other class has harder hitting dots for less cost even specs have a harder hitting dot this change was absolutely necessary and the right call they’ve nailed this one

Really? Because I've played the class, and I'm telling you the opposite. Increasing the damage by 50% increases the damage, yes. That's beside the point. Cutting the durations in half makes it feel incredibly clunky, which is why DoT times were increased in the first place. "This is a dot class and every other class has harder hitting dots for less cost even specs have a harder hitting dot " You started with correct observations, but somehow came to a completely backwards conclusion. A DoT class should have long duration DoTs that they can feel comfortable using, they shouldn't be forced to run a 10 second rotation. You want a power increase. That doesn't have to be at odds with also having a comfortable 20 second rotation.