Rate Season of the Worm Cult on a scale 1-10

Radiate77 · December 26

1

@DoofusMax, exactly.

Subclassing is base game, and a free update with nothing to do with Season of the Worm Cult… which is why I voted the season a 1 instead of a 4 or 5.

DenverRalphy · December 27

3

Solstice gave me some entertainment. But overall I've felt frustrated the entire season thus far.

The memorable good/fun moments came from Solstice side quests moreso than the main storyline which just didn't resonate with me. Try as I might, I just couldn't get into the main storyline mainly because I could not identify with the actions and reactions demonstrated by any of the players. I did enjoy the psuedo-random overland encounters. And unlike as many have lamented, I have no issues with reusing assets from previous zones/chapters. I actually liked the use of Alinor and Murkmire assets in Solstice. I'm of the opinion that assets should be reused when possible, because those old assets contain a significant portion of the charm behind TES as a whole. Going forward I firmly believe the devs could be better utilized not having to design entirely new assets from scratch, thus further diluting the TES styles pool, and instead create new assets with the old asset flavors and styles. And of the group content, I do like Ossein Cage. It added a welcome variation to group mechanics.

However, the bits that I did like about SotWC was completely overshadowed by what I didn't like.

Much of the content I simply just did not enjoy. The group dungeons I just find blah. The delves fell flat for me. Beyond entering them for the skyshard and the boss kill, I had no desire to reenter them. The public dungeons not memorable (while writing this I literally had to stop and concentrate a bit to recall the time I spent in them). The dailies extremely simple. Not that the dailies in previous chapters were complicated before, but one of the Solstice dailies is simply just an overland fetch.

And then the really really really bad.. Deployment and execution riddled with problems. Everything from poor/questionable design, to bugs. Not just quirky eccentric bugs. Showstopper bugs. Bugs appearing at a rate that they'd soared waaaay past the "all software has bugs" deflection. On top of that, we the players had to deal with that while struggling with the chaotic mess created by the introduction of Subclassing. And then, even after that... the Writing Wall event happened. I won't bother rehashing that mess, as I'm relatively confident everyone reading this thread is intimately familiar with the hardships of that portion of the season content.

Today we're still waiting for a lot of the broken pieces to be fixed. And we're rapidly approaching the next season reveal.

I did give a few points for the amount of fun I did have. But that's about all I could bring myself to allow.

[edit] It is not lost on me that the intent of the poll is for the content. But my score holds true for my opinion on the season as a whole, and not Solstice specifically. And not to forget that the Writhing Wall event, while now gone, was part of the season's content.

Evil_Rurouni · December 27

5

heimdall14_9 · December 27

1

i cant say one good thing about this DLC because ALL the bad things over power my thoughts , laggy , buggy , grind for nothing , wait times that killed the fun ( if there was any ) just OVER ALL BAD layout and poor development
i really hope they look at what they done in the passed and what they done here and see that the older layout was better and FUN even if laggy and a few bugs but having both and nothing to make it feel WORTH MY TIME just made it all around no fun and dislike fast

this years EVENT something to bring the year to an end felt like the end to having GREAT EVENTS in eso to having GRINDS FOR NOTHING AND WAIT TIMERS

and lets not get into the half thought out subclassing that came long with it and its an wrap 3-4years of work doing CLASS BALANCE ( 1 class at an time ( another bad idea )making more unbalanced issues with class / subclassing / and NEW PURE DK sur to happen as you cant balance something when the field aint lvl to began with

spartaxoxo · December 27

4

I enjoyed the return of a fan favorite character in the Solstice main story, some of it's side quests, the addition of roleplaying options to the dialogue, and the writhing fortress. Also, Solstice and it's furniture were pretty. A lot of recycling though that was disappointing. Most of the dungeons were pretty good though!

I have mixed feelings about subclassing. I like the freedom it gives but hate the balance and it's unnecessarily grindy implementation.

There was also too many bugs and too little new things to do.

ETA

Also the rest of the Writhing Wall event was way too grindy. Like it sucked all the fun out of it.

Vonnegut2506 · December 27

3

Some parts were good; I really liked some of the side quests. The main quest was not great. The giant crab fight being bugged for so long at the beginning was horrible. The whole writhing wall event was abysmal. Average it all out, and it is not great.

Destai · December 27

3

This truly was ESO’s worst year.

The last couple years have had increasingly major issues. Writing since High Isle has been quite poor IMO, releases have gotten thinner and thinner. Less and less permanently available rewards; more and more FOMO. It seems like this year was a culmination of that trend.

It started with their pricing, $10 more for lighter release content, offset by the promise of an amazing event. And none of it feels memorable to me. At least not in any positive way.

The only positive thing I can find in this year’s content was the Corelanya quest; and there were some cool styles, but that’s it. Solstice as a zone feels like a jumble of reused assets; the whole Argonian and Altmer mish mash is awkward.

The Writhing Wall event was the biggest blemish in an already blemished year. Oodles of ignored PTS feedback, only offset by a responsive CM team and issue resolution.

For me, this year solidified my deeply negative opinion of ZOS leadership, their decisions, and Microsoft’s influence. TBH, I dread the January 7th show. I worry it’s just going to be them asking for more money and less content, with a lighter-than-expected payload of QOL and issue fixes.

Orbital78 · December 27

Things are still broken for me, I haven't bothered progressing the storyline since the wallbreak issues. I cannot collect skyshards still and for whatever reason I was content locked today even though I preordered the content pass. Lots of issues to get sorted it seems.

Syldras · December 27

3

I see the Corelanya Manor quest coming up quite often here as the one (or one of few) quests that people liked this year (and it was also my favorite quest, as I mentioned before). It shows they do have someone who can write engaging stories on their team still. It makes me wonder why so many other quests get so bland, moralistic, terrible in terms of lore, or just silly/childish then?!

metheglyn · December 27

6

Syldras wrote: »

I see the Corelanya Manor quest coming up quite often here as the one (or one of few) quests that people liked this year (and it was also my favorite quest, as I mentioned before). It shows they do have someone who can write engaging stories on their team still. It makes me wonder why so many other quests get so bland, moralistic, terrible in terms of lore, or just silly/childish then?!

I think, in some cases, it's just a matter of the writers trying to create a variety of quests that will appeal to a variety of players. Take Rigurt, for example. I cannot stand him and I dislike any quest he shows up in. Other people really like him and enjoy seeing him pop up. While I really liked the Corelanya Manor quest, I'm sure there are people who didn't, or thought it wasn't anything special.

Why some quests have contradictory lore is a different matter, I think. That seems to point to some lack of oversight/editing on the part of whoever has the job of keeping quests lore-consistent.

spartaxoxo · December 27

4

metheglyn wrote: »

Syldras wrote: »

I see the Corelanya Manor quest coming up quite often here as the one (or one of few) quests that people liked this year (and it was also my favorite quest, as I mentioned before). It shows they do have someone who can write engaging stories on their team still. It makes me wonder why so many other quests get so bland, moralistic, terrible in terms of lore, or just silly/childish then?!

I think, in some cases, it's just a matter of the writers trying to create a variety of quests that will appeal to a variety of players. Take Rigurt, for example. I cannot stand him and I dislike any quest he shows up in. Other people really like him and enjoy seeing him pop up. While I really liked the Corelanya Manor quest, I'm sure there are people who didn't, or thought it wasn't anything special.

Why some quests have contradictory lore is a different matter, I think. That seems to point to some lack of oversight/editing on the part of whoever has the job of keeping quests lore-consistent.

Yeah. I agree. Like it was inconsistent whether or not the Stirk Fellowship badly needed money or was well funded. But I thought Solstice had a good variety of quests in terms of tone. I actually think the writing for Solstice improved on Gold Road/Necrom, which for me was also an improvement on High Isle and Blackwood. But High Isle was the series low for me and I wouldn't call Necrom/Gold Road good, especially as the 10 year anniversary storyline.

Tendrielle · December 27

5

There have been (much) better years, in terms of systems introduced, "newness", scope and timing of content, promotion of what was delivered throughout the year etc. etc. Unfortunately, for some years now, it looks like a continuous decline. Much hope 7th January will mark a turnaround.

Tariq9898 · December 27

metheglyn wrote: »

Syldras wrote: »

I see the Corelanya Manor quest coming up quite often here as the one (or one of few) quests that people liked this year (and it was also my favorite quest, as I mentioned before). It shows they do have someone who can write engaging stories on their team still. It makes me wonder why so many other quests get so bland, moralistic, terrible in terms of lore, or just silly/childish then?!

I think, in some cases, it's just a matter of the writers trying to create a variety of quests that will appeal to a variety of players. Take Rigurt, for example. I cannot stand him and I dislike any quest he shows up in. Other people really like him and enjoy seeing him pop up. While I really liked the Corelanya Manor quest, I'm sure there are people who didn't, or thought it wasn't anything special.

Why some quests have contradictory lore is a different matter, I think. That seems to point to some lack of oversight/editing on the part of whoever has the job of keeping quests lore-consistent.

This. It’s all very subjective at the end of the day. I’ve seen a huge lore person who writes on the Imperial Library website stating that the main villain from the Greymoor chapter is one of her most favorite characters, up there with Dagoth-Ur. If I recall correctly, she hated Morrowind DLC though, but loved CWC. This was all on the Imperial Library Discord.

Conversely, I’ve seen other Elder Scrolls lore geeks hating on Greymoor but loved Morrowind.

I’ve come to realize that one of the main causes for huge differences in opinion on how ESO tackles lore is simply put: interpretation.

Elder Scrolls lore is very much like reading real history. As such, the accounts are biased, dramatized and/or exaggerated. Much of the cities in ESO have never appeared in any other game (except Arena/Daggerfall, but those are old) but were described in lore books from the mainline games. This can lead people to think ESO cities will or should be a literal illustration and design that adheres to past descriptions. Especially, but not limited to, Alinor.

Fun fact: the natives in Central America actually called Conquistador galleons “moving mountains” upon first sighting. But that was not literally the case. Same goes with Elder Scrolls.

So when people say ESO’s writing or lore has “fallen off,” I think a lot of that reaction comes not just from uneven writing quality, but from wildly different expectations about how literally Elder Scrolls lore should be portrayed.

And this is not even counting the fact that Tamriel is far, far bigger and infinitely more nuanced than what the game can possibly portray. Take the Ebonheart Pact for example, many people hate this alliance as it “doesn’t make sense”. But real history is filled with uneasy alliances. Not every dark elf and argonians and nords hate each other. Not everything is literal, not everything is black and white. Not everyone is stereotypical, as that would make the story and world boring and predictable.

Personally, I started to judge Elder Scrolls lore not based on how accurate or how literally they match previous descriptions by some dead person (significant or not). But rather by quality of the present story, narrative, themes and worldbuilding.

Much like real history, Elder Scrolls lore is not something I interpret literally. And that interpretive flexibility keeps things interesting for me.

But these are just my two cents!

spartaxoxo · December 27

4

Tariq9898 wrote: »

But these are just my two cents!

These are honestly some really great points. It's kind of funny because I would also put Rada al-Saran as one of my favorite Elder Scrolls villains ever. But I found Greymoor lackluster outside of Fennorian. However, I felt that The Reach was one of ESO's best storylines.

If I had to rank my top 3, it would be

1) The Daedric Triad (Vvardenfell -> Clockwork City -> Summerset)

2) Elsweyr

3) Dark Heart of Skyrim/Orsinium (DHOS, as mentioned, has a weak first chapter but then I feel it knocks it out of the park with its back half, even with the feel good ending).

Honorable mentions goes to Murkmire and Thieves Guild.

I also think some of it is just that franchise has been around so long so that my standards might be a bit higher than they should be. I have been playing this game long enough that nostalgia likely colors my opinion of earlier stuff.

Syldras · December 27

3

Tariq9898 wrote: »

This. It’s all very subjective at the end of the day. I’ve seen a huge lore person who writes on the Imperial Library website stating that the main villain from the Greymoor chapter is one of her most favorite characters, up there with Dagoth-Ur. If I recall correctly, she hated Morrowind DLC though, but loved CWC. This was all on the Imperial Library Discord.
Conversely, I’ve seen other Elder Scrolls lore geeks hating on Greymoor but loved Morrowind.
I’ve come to realize that one of the main causes for huge differences in opinion on how ESO tackles lore is simply put: interpretation.
Elder Scrolls lore is very much like reading real history. As such, the accounts are biased, dramatized and/or exaggerated. Much of the cities in ESO have never appeared in any other game (except Arena/Daggerfall, but those are old) but were described in lore books from the mainline games. This can lead people to think ESO cities will or should be a literal illustration and design that adheres to past descriptions. Especially, but not limited to, Alinor.
Fun fact: the natives in Central America actually called Conquistador galleons “moving mountains” upon first sighting. But that was not literally the case. Same goes with Elder Scrolls.
So when people say ESO’s writing or lore has “fallen off,” I think a lot of that reaction comes not just from uneven writing quality, but from wildly different expectations about how literally Elder Scrolls lore should be portrayed.

As a real-life historian, I'm aware of this. I read lorebooks as nothing else but unreliable sources, subjective accounts and sometimes metaphoric or symbolistic descriptions. What bothers me are lore inconsistencies about things our player character sees with their own eyes - often even within the same story. And when it comes to that, things have gotten worse since High Isle - where we got ToT, the both "brand-new" and "ages-old, traditional" card game. The same year also introduced the Zenithar event where the player character had to congratulate Naryu on saving the Tribunal. This year both lorebooks as well as npcs' accounts (from Regent Carinwe, for example) that told us that no one from West Solstice has set foot into East Solstice since about 40 years - then, with the second part of the story, we suddenly find the College of Sea and Sword there, which is a branch of the Collegium Praxis, whose students regularly and casually walk over to Sunport in West Solstice (or at least they did before the accursed Wall appeared, they say). Also, the island is so unknown it's not found on any map (based on people's supersticious beliefs that it was cursed), which is also given as a reasoning for why the Stirk Fellowship needs months to locate the place, but still its inhabitants have friends on mainland Tamriel. And don't get me started on Mannimarco's sarcaphagus randomly showing up where ever it is needed for the story.

I found Rada al-Saran to be a well-written antagonist, by the way. Definitely one of the more interesting ones.

Rohamad_Ali · December 27

1

You cut me deep ZoS.

tomofhyrule · December 27

2

Syldras wrote: »

Tariq9898 wrote: »

This. It’s all very subjective at the end of the day. I’ve seen a huge lore person who writes on the Imperial Library website stating that the main villain from the Greymoor chapter is one of her most favorite characters, up there with Dagoth-Ur. If I recall correctly, she hated Morrowind DLC though, but loved CWC. This was all on the Imperial Library Discord.
Conversely, I’ve seen other Elder Scrolls lore geeks hating on Greymoor but loved Morrowind.
I’ve come to realize that one of the main causes for huge differences in opinion on how ESO tackles lore is simply put: interpretation.
Elder Scrolls lore is very much like reading real history. As such, the accounts are biased, dramatized and/or exaggerated. Much of the cities in ESO have never appeared in any other game (except Arena/Daggerfall, but those are old) but were described in lore books from the mainline games. This can lead people to think ESO cities will or should be a literal illustration and design that adheres to past descriptions. Especially, but not limited to, Alinor.
Fun fact: the natives in Central America actually called Conquistador galleons “moving mountains” upon first sighting. But that was not literally the case. Same goes with Elder Scrolls.
So when people say ESO’s writing or lore has “fallen off,” I think a lot of that reaction comes not just from uneven writing quality, but from wildly different expectations about how literally Elder Scrolls lore should be portrayed.

As a real-life historian, I'm aware of this. I read lorebooks as nothing else but unreliable sources, subjective accounts and sometimes metaphoric or symbolistic descriptions. What bothers me are lore inconsistencies about things our player character sees with their own eyes - often even within the same story. And when it comes to that, things have gotten worse since High Isle - where we got ToT, the both "brand-new" and "ages-old, traditional" card game. The same year also introduced the Zenithar event where the player character had to congratulate Naryu on saving the Tribunal. This year both lorebooks as well as npcs' accounts (from Regent Carinwe, for example) that told us that no one from West Solstice has set foot into East Solstice since about 40 years - then, with the second part of the story, we suddenly find the College of Sea and Sword there, which is a branch of the Collegium Praxis, whose students regularly and casually walk over to Sunport in West Solstice (or at least they did before the accursed Wall appeared, they say). Also, the island is so unknown it's not found on any map (based on people's supersticious beliefs that it was cursed), which is also given as a reasoning for why the Stirk Fellowship needs months to locate the place, but still its inhabitants have friends on mainland Tamriel. And don't get me started on Mannimarco's sarcaphagus randomly showing up where ever it is needed for the story.

I found Rada al-Saran to be a well-written antagonist, by the way. Definitely one of the more interesting ones.

This is my biggest issue with the writing as of late.

I actually really like the "unreliable narrator" idea in the TES series. But when they're coming out and showing things that directly contradict other things that were shown to us, particularly when it is done in the same storyline is when it just looks sloppy and really like the writers don't care in the slightest.

Syldras · 12:02AM

3

metheglyn wrote: »

I think, in some cases, it's just a matter of the writers trying to create a variety of quests that will appeal to a variety of players.

Is this a good idea, though? Let's, very simplified, assume there were 15 different styles people could like - so they do a quest each in one of those styles, so there's "something for everyone". Wouldn't that mean, if the whole chapter only has 15 side quests, that there's only 1 or 2 quests each person could like, which in the end just means disappointment for everyone?

I think it might be wiser to concentrate on the unique "TES style". No matter if a quest is serious, funny, sad or heroic in tone, I think there was once a certain aspect to it that made it "typical TES". This disctinctiveness in style was, from my experience, one of the things that attracted many TES-interested players in the first place (at least of those who came here for stories and lore). Seeing this being watered down to more generic and less lore-specific quests/themes is one aspects that reduces interest.

I understand very well that not everything in a game will be according to my taste. I don't PvP and don't play ToT, still I don't mind at all if things are added to these "systems". I can also live with a small percentage of quests not meeting my personal interest much. Fine with me, I know I'm not the center of the universe. But still, there's a certain minimum that must be met to keep me interested, or more precisely: willing to pay money for it. With the decreasing number of quests per release altogether it gets even more problematic if quests are "off" for me because each single one already makes up a bigger percentage of the whole content. 5 not too interesting side quests aren't a problem if there are 40 in total. If there are only 15 in total though, it becomes a problem.

metheglyn · 1:34AM

6

Syldras wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

I think, in some cases, it's just a matter of the writers trying to create a variety of quests that will appeal to a variety of players.

Is this a good idea, though? Let's, very simplified, assume there were 15 different styles people could like - so they do a quest each in one of those styles, so there's "something for everyone". Wouldn't that mean, if the whole chapter only has 15 side quests, that there's only 1 or 2 quests each person could like, which in the end just means disappointment for everyone?

I think it might be wiser to concentrate on the unique "TES style". No matter if a quest is serious, funny, sad or heroic in tone, I think there was once a certain aspect to it that made it "typical TES". This disctinctiveness in style was, from my experience, one of the things that attracted many TES-interested players in the first place (at least of those who came here for stories and lore). Seeing this being watered down to more generic and less lore-specific quests/themes is one aspects that reduces interest.

I understand very well that not everything in a game will be according to my taste. I don't PvP and don't play ToT, still I don't mind at all if things are added to these "systems". I can also live with a small percentage of quests not meeting my personal interest much. Fine with me, I know I'm not the center of the universe. But still, there's a certain minimum that must be met to keep me interested, or more precisely: willing to pay money for it. With the decreasing number of quests per release altogether it gets even more problematic if quests are "off" for me because each single one already makes up a bigger percentage of the whole content. 5 not too interesting side quests aren't a problem if there are 40 in total. If there are only 15 in total though, it becomes a problem.

So is it more they style of the writing than the content of the quests themselves that you'd like to be more cohesive/consistent? If they had written the Nord Village quest in a different tone, would you have liked it better? For me, having it associated with the Nord Cultural Exchange and Rigurt's sister was what bothered me--the Nord Cultural Exchange lends itself to a silliness I don't care for. Could they have written the 'magic hat' story in a way you would have liked it? (Not trying to sound combative, so apologies if I come across that way).

spartaxoxo wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

Syldras wrote: »

I see the Corelanya Manor quest coming up quite often here as the one (or one of few) quests that people liked this year (and it was also my favorite quest, as I mentioned before). It shows they do have someone who can write engaging stories on their team still. It makes me wonder why so many other quests get so bland, moralistic, terrible in terms of lore, or just silly/childish then?!

I think, in some cases, it's just a matter of the writers trying to create a variety of quests that will appeal to a variety of players. Take Rigurt, for example. I cannot stand him and I dislike any quest he shows up in. Other people really like him and enjoy seeing him pop up. While I really liked the Corelanya Manor quest, I'm sure there are people who didn't, or thought it wasn't anything special.

Why some quests have contradictory lore is a different matter, I think. That seems to point to some lack of oversight/editing on the part of whoever has the job of keeping quests lore-consistent.

Yeah. I agree. Like it was inconsistent whether or not the Stirk Fellowship badly needed money or was well funded. But I thought Solstice had a good variety of quests in terms of tone. I actually think the writing for Solstice improved on Gold Road/Necrom, which for me was also an improvement on High Isle and Blackwood. But High Isle was the series low for me and I wouldn't call Necrom/Gold Road good, especially as the 10 year anniversary storyline.

Honestly, I couldn't really say why we needed the Stirk Fellowship at all. They didn't have much of a presence anywhere. People mentioned them, and we came across some scouts here and there, but they didn't really show up in force. Also, I was never really clear on whether or not I was actually a member of the Fellowship. There were times in quests where the dialogue would mention the Fellowship as if I wasn't part of it or didn't know about it. That's a kind of inconsistency that gets stuck in my head because there never seems to be a good answer for why.

Turtle_Bot · 1:43AM

Results are fairly telling on this, 0 votes for 9 or 10 and the overwhelming number of votes (80%) being 5 or less.

On a side note, this poll could have used an "other" option. As my vote is "didn't buy it/10", due to the price jump that also gave significantly less content and the content given was just a buggy mess anyway with almost zero balancing done.

Don't get me wrong, the ideas behind things like sub-classing and the writhing wall were great ideas in theory, just executed very poorly (even by ZOS standards, which they themselves have admitted).

Syldras · 2:53AM

3

metheglyn wrote: »

So is it more they style of the writing than the content of the quests themselves that you'd like to be more cohesive/consistent?

It's different things that bother me. The worst problem for me are the inconsistencies - the clear lore mistakes (things that can't be explained with unreliable sources or different interpretations). Then, I'm bothered by quests becoming more generic in themes, not making much of the unique fictional world we have here. Not adding to the lore, immersion or atmosphere of the world also makes a quest less interesting for me. Also the tone matters. As I said, there was some specific "TES style", which, for me, borders on all these things - a specific lore/world background that needs to be considered (including the peculiarities of the different fictional cultures), certain themes typical for this world, a certain language style, a certain depth that might not be Shakespearean but still more than we see in many quests recently. I'm personally rather open to what topic gets presented to us in a quest - as long as the story fits this fictional world and its cultures and the established lore.

metheglyn wrote: »

If they had written the Nord Village quest in a different tone, would you have liked it better? For me, having it associated with the Nord Cultural Exchange and Rigurt's sister was what bothered me--the Nord Cultural Exchange lends itself to a silliness I don't care for.

The thing is that the Rigurt quests also became more silly from year to year. The first one in the base game wasn't that silly. Sure, Rigurt was never smart, but it wasn't just a joke but a story about cultural differences based on the lore background how difficult it is to unify the different nations that now were supposed to fight together as the Ebonheart Pact - people with very different cultures, beliefs, habits, values, morals, and, on top of that, former enemies. The main problem for me with the Rigurt quests is that it became less about showing us the differences of these cultures (and adding a bit to lore with that) with a bit of humour, but about Rigurt acting clownish (and dumber every year until it became nothing more but silly). Also, too much repetition makes a thing bland, especially if there's not much of a new story to tell. "Clumsy ambassador makes horrible mistakes" might be a more or less amusing story once, or maybe twice, but not seven or eightt times, or how often it was now.

metheglyn wrote: »

Could they have written the 'magic hat' story in a way you would have liked it? (Not trying to sound combative, so apologies if I come across that way).

Just the theme of "People of a town are horrified by some spooky creature and it turns out in the end that it was just something harmless"? In principle I think there would have been ways to write it in a less silly way, yes. And that other topic about the village speaker not believing his adult offspring was able to be a good fighter? Sure that can be made a good story in a TES game.

metheglyn · 4:03AM

6

Syldras wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

So is it more they style of the writing than the content of the quests themselves that you'd like to be more cohesive/consistent?

It's different things that bother me. The worst problem for me are the inconsistencies - the clear lore mistakes (things that can't be explained with unreliable sources or different interpretations). Then, I'm bothered by quests becoming more generic in themes, not making much of the unique fictional world we have here. Not adding to the lore, immersion or atmosphere of the world also makes a quest less interesting for me. Also the tone matters. As I said, there was some specific "TES style", which, for me, borders on all these things - a specific lore/world background that needs to be considered (including the peculiarities of the different fictional cultures), certain themes typical for this world, a certain language style, a certain depth that might not be Shakespearean but still more than we see in many quests recently. I'm personally rather open to what topic gets presented to us in a quest - as long as the story fits this fictional world and its cultures and the established lore.

I see what you're saying, and I agree that the writing has slipped overall in the past few years/chapters. I also wonder how difficult it might be to maintain a consistent tone over many years and different writers.

Syldras wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

If they had written the Nord Village quest in a different tone, would you have liked it better? For me, having it associated with the Nord Cultural Exchange and Rigurt's sister was what bothered me--the Nord Cultural Exchange lends itself to a silliness I don't care for.

The thing is that the Rigurt quests also became more silly from year to year. The first one in the base game wasn't that silly. Sure, Rigurt was never smart, but it wasn't just a joke but a story about cultural differences based on the lore background how difficult it is to unify the different nations that now were supposed to fight together as the Ebonheart Pact - people with very different cultures, beliefs, habits, values, morals, and, on top of that, former enemies. The main problem for me with the Rigurt quests is that it became less about showing us the differences of these cultures (and adding a bit to lore with that) with a bit of humour, but about Rigurt acting clownish (and dumber every year until it became nothing more but silly). Also, too much repetition makes a thing bland, especially if there's not much of a new story to tell. "Clumsy ambassador makes horrible mistakes" might be a more or less amusing story once, or maybe twice, but not seven or eightt times, or how often it was now.

I agree that the Rigurt quests have gotten sillier over the years, and he's used way too much. However, his base game quests weren't that great, either. The Mournhold one had some merit, but the Windhelm one was pretty much just a big joke. Of course, I can't view them without bias, as I've never liked him.

Syldras wrote: »

metheglyn wrote: »

Could they have written the 'magic hat' story in a way you would have liked it? (Not trying to sound combative, so apologies if I come across that way).

Just the theme of "People of a town are horrified by some spooky creature and it turns out in the end that it was just something harmless"? In principle I think there would have been ways to write it in a less silly way, yes. And that other topic about the village speaker not believing his adult offspring was able to be a good fighter? Sure that can be made a good story in a TES game.

I think the Nord village had some good lore moments (sadly, only moments) but the whole thing being overlaid by the Cultural Exchange and Britt's silly way of talking bummed me out. I could have even been OK with the sloth and a magic hat causing chaos if everyone hadn't kept talking about the magic cap like it was a meme. So if we'd had essentially the same quests for the Nord village, only without the Exchange being involved, I would have liked it better.

Pops_ND_Irish · 4:54AM

10

Cooperharley wrote: »

Pops_ND_Irish wrote: »

Great stuff

Interesting rank! If you don't mind me asking, have you been playing for a while? Glad you enjoyed it so much!

Since '15

Syldras · 5:16AM

3

metheglyn wrote: »

I see what you're saying, and I agree that the writing has slipped overall in the past few years/chapters. I also wonder how difficult it might be to maintain a consistent tone over many years and different writers.

Small differences might be more or less unavoidable. But the changes I see here aren't small. Look at the dialogues in the base game main quest, for example, and compare them to some random dialogues today. Also: Characters become less complex, we get simple lessons presented to us, the puzzles are hardly puzzles anymore, there's barely any dire situation anymore that doesn't get "resolved" with some quip a few seconds later, even problems are rather straightforward now most of the time instead of having even a bit of complexity. Generally, there's barely any ambiguity anymore to characters and situations. And if something's supposed to be fishy, they tell us so blatantly that it can't be missed even at all (except maybe if you fell asleep in front of the screen).

metheglyn wrote: »

I agree that the Rigurt quests have gotten sillier over the years, and he's used way too much. However, his base game quests weren't that great, either. The Mournhold one had some merit, but the Windhelm one was pretty much just a big joke. Of course, I can't view them without bias, as I've never liked him.

They weren't my favorite quests either, but if it had only been these two quests, it wouldn't have bothered me.

metheglyn wrote: »

I think the Nord village had some good lore moments (sadly, only moments) but the whole thing being overlaid by the Cultural Exchange and Britt's silly way of talking bummed me out.

I guess I personally don't attribute that to the Cultural Exchange that much. Even without that theme the quest could have ended up silly.

metheglyn wrote: »

I could have even been OK with the sloth and a magic hat causing chaos if everyone hadn't kept talking about the magic cap like it was a meme.

That was also the thing that bothered me most about that part of that quest chain. It also made me wonder: Why? It didn't feel fitting at all.

redlink1979 · 11:10AM

3

You can do better, ZOS. Yes you can!
*while looking at Wrothgar*

Radiate77 · 11:26AM

1

redlink1979 wrote: »

You can do better, ZOS. Yes you can!
*while looking at Wrothgar*

Man, we really have been chasing Wrothgar for almost ten years now.

I feel like the jump from Vet 14 to Vet 16, with Magicka builds finally getting their Hunding’s Rage, really helped people to be excited to get out there and explore the new region, and wow were there some fun quests.

Orsinium was a crossroads for a lot of players on console, where people were finally beginning to catch up to all of the PC transfers and experience content together for the first time.

Pops_ND_Irish · 5:16PM

10

Cooperharley wrote: »

Pops_ND_Irish wrote: »

Great stuff

Interesting rank! If you don't mind me asking, have you been playing for a while? Glad you enjoyed it so much!

Since '15

katanagirl1 · 8:14PM

6

Okay, I finished the main story last night. I only have a few delves left to do now and the trial.

It’s really hard to assign a single number to this year’s content. I would have to assign a score to each part and add a weighting to each that represents how important they are to me. For example, I only run dlc group dungeons typically once for completion on normal and then try to avoid doing them ever again. I am not a fan of the “Dance, Dance, Revolution” aoe style that covers the whole floor that these bosses (which have been made harder) have nowadays, since I use the Dungeon Finder for a group. I would like to run the trial, but the one guild I am in that is active is not doing that one yet, so I would have to use the Group Finder for that. So these areas do not influence my score in a positive way like it might for others.

I’m not a fan of the zone, as mentioned previously it is a disorganized mish-mash of Summerset and Black Marsh assets with High Isle Reef Guardians and orgnaugs and hadolids thrown in as well. It might have worked if more thought was put into their placement, but Lamias on the beach just make me laugh at the absurdity. Voriplasms outside the Sunport door are equally out of place. I like the plants and bismuth furnishings you can get for harvesting there and that is the only reason for me to ever go back.

Now for the story. I was just getting interested in the story in part 1 when it ended and the long grind for the wall started. I put the smallest effort required in doing this part as I have grown tired of wasting my time pursuing rewards lately in the game as of late with ridiculously low drop rates. The grind has been discussed at length, I do not think rehashing it at this point is helpful, no one enjoyed that. I ran the time-limited fortress twice, never got to use a ballista for the bosses, and found the same miniscule rewards there as elsewhere. It was good enough to say I did it, I suppose. I didn’t have trouble with bugs, other than the quest marker constantly indicating I should go back to the beginning for dialog that would not progress, and the fact that players would push ahead and leave mobs for a handful of people to slog through to get to the end.

The story in part 2 was much more engaging than I expected. There will be spoilers at this point. I mentioned before that Darien’s whining got old, thankfully he got over that. I really like all of the Argonian lore for these new tribes, both the Tide-Born and the Stone-Nest, and I liked the new character Jeetra. Learning about the history of the island in order to find a way to defeat the Worm Cult and Mannimarco was interesting and refreshing. During the final quest, being able to control the colossal voskrona was a cool mechanic as well. Just one complaint about the followers like Darian and others, I like to go stealth for this type of situation and I was unable to do so because they all kept my character from doing that. I do these quests on my main character and she is not a high dps build. I was able to defeat Mannimarco without too much trouble, which I appreciate since I am there for the story and prefer to do high APM activities elsewhere like in trials and PvP.

Overall, I would have rated the content very poorly in the beginning, but now that I have had time to get past the terrible start and leisurely do the story quests, I can rate it higher. I still loathed the flirty dialog options, and don’t understand why we have the ones withe the tragedy and comedy faces when we already had the FG and MG persuasion choices in the base game, so that is reinventing the wheel in my opinion. I made sure to not do the romance option at the end, it just did not make sense for me. Darien just lost someone he loved and jumping in the sack with my Khajiit who has been has fighting companion through all of the content was not what I would have chosen. I suppose those who wanted that option could justify it in someway that made sense for them. I would bet that the content would have been rated even higher if it had not been split so that is was more timely and coherent.