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Do ZOS not keep their promises?
Artem_gig
✭✭✭
Do you remember the letter from the director in 2025?
I'm talking about these promises:
1. We need to seriously address Cyrodiil performance. Our (ambitious) goal is to return it to the concurrency levels we supported in 2014. So, we will be experimenting with a Cyrodiil campaign where all classes will have PvP-specific (and more performant) skills that replace the standard player skills with the expectation that we can support more players per campaign
2. Increasing the difficulty of standard overworld combat
3. Improving the overall feel of combat with animation, FX, and potentially audio work
4. Experimenting with more zones like Craglorn (although not as large in area or scope), created exclusively for high-end group and soft-group content with associated gear chase
5. Adding and refining tools to make guild recruitment, interaction, and management easier and more logical
6. We have many more ideas here, and of course, we are listening to you and will be coming up with new ideas based on your feedback
1. Okay, they're still doing this.
2. They didn't even touch this item...
3. Everything remains exactly the same.
4. Also passing by.
5. Also not completed.
6. Also not mentioned anymore.
So were these promises:
1. A new patcher, with improved visuals and performance (PC only)
2. Returning to the original Wailing Prison tutorial area for all new players - this has already launched, but we will be regularly tweaking it to improve the experience
3. Visually improving base game zones with updated textures and art assets, starting with the "starter islands" - these should start rolling out in March 2025
4. Not showing new players prologue quest or Chapter quest compass pins. The jury is still out on how Stuga will feel about this
5. Sprucing up the game's PC UI, which is long overdue for a modern visual upgrade
6. Other map and UI systems (still in design/idea stage) to make returning to the game more seamless and get you back into the action quickly
And what has been done?
1. Performance has certainly improved, but there is no schedule.
2. It has already happened.
3. Only at the beginning of the year, they improved the starting locations and that's it.
4. I don't know what to say.
5. Well, by the way, this was done and it seemed to be done even well (get it right, from the point of view of design, it has become modern, now it does not overload visual information)
6. they did it anyway.
Yes, the letter said that some of these things will be added after 2025, that is, in 2026-27-28. But it bothers me that they don't talk about it anymore, as if ZOS has forgotten about it.
There was some movement towards this letter only in the first half of the year, and then everything went quiet.
Will the ZOS return to fulfilling their promises later, or is it always forgotten?
I'm talking about these promises:
1. We need to seriously address Cyrodiil performance. Our (ambitious) goal is to return it to the concurrency levels we supported in 2014. So, we will be experimenting with a Cyrodiil campaign where all classes will have PvP-specific (and more performant) skills that replace the standard player skills with the expectation that we can support more players per campaign
2. Increasing the difficulty of standard overworld combat
3. Improving the overall feel of combat with animation, FX, and potentially audio work
4. Experimenting with more zones like Craglorn (although not as large in area or scope), created exclusively for high-end group and soft-group content with associated gear chase
5. Adding and refining tools to make guild recruitment, interaction, and management easier and more logical
6. We have many more ideas here, and of course, we are listening to you and will be coming up with new ideas based on your feedback
1. Okay, they're still doing this.
2. They didn't even touch this item...
3. Everything remains exactly the same.
4. Also passing by.
5. Also not completed.
6. Also not mentioned anymore.
So were these promises:
1. A new patcher, with improved visuals and performance (PC only)
2. Returning to the original Wailing Prison tutorial area for all new players - this has already launched, but we will be regularly tweaking it to improve the experience
3. Visually improving base game zones with updated textures and art assets, starting with the "starter islands" - these should start rolling out in March 2025
4. Not showing new players prologue quest or Chapter quest compass pins. The jury is still out on how Stuga will feel about this
5. Sprucing up the game's PC UI, which is long overdue for a modern visual upgrade
6. Other map and UI systems (still in design/idea stage) to make returning to the game more seamless and get you back into the action quickly
And what has been done?
1. Performance has certainly improved, but there is no schedule.
2. It has already happened.
3. Only at the beginning of the year, they improved the starting locations and that's it.
4. I don't know what to say.
5. Well, by the way, this was done and it seemed to be done even well (get it right, from the point of view of design, it has become modern, now it does not overload visual information)
6. they did it anyway.
Yes, the letter said that some of these things will be added after 2025, that is, in 2026-27-28. But it bothers me that they don't talk about it anymore, as if ZOS has forgotten about it.
There was some movement towards this letter only in the first half of the year, and then everything went quiet.
Will the ZOS return to fulfilling their promises later, or is it always forgotten?
4
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ShutUpitsRed✭✭✭✭This is why I didn't even bother reading "Developer Deep Dive—ESO's Class Identity Refresh" lol. Like ok, sure you will. I'll count those bantam guar when they hatch. :P11 -
valenwood_vegan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Well it's not an *excuse*, but it's worth considering that they suffered from layoffs in the latter half of the year and it's likely their budget was cut as well. And the person who wrote that letter departed from the studio as well. There have been some signs that the new leadership is willing to change and learn from mistakes, but other signs point to more of the same, and there is a history of not really following through / leaving things unfinished to move on to the next big hype. Really, we'll just have to see if they can impress us next year. I know I won't be pre-ordering anything, but I'm personally willing to keep monitoring the game to see if things improve. But I've also reduced my engagement with eso and the clock is ticking.17 -
virtus753✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭valenwood_vegan wrote: »Well it's not an *excuse*, but it's worth considering that they suffered from layoffs in the latter half of the year and it's likely their budget was cut as well. And the person who wrote that letter departed from the studio as well. There have been some signs that the new leadership is willing to change and learn from mistakes, but other signs point to more of the same, and there is a history of not really following through / leaving things unfinished to move on to the next big hype. Really, we'll just have to see if they can impress us next year. I know I won't be pre-ordering anything, but I'm personally willing to keep monitoring the game to see if things improve. But I've also reduced my engagement with eso and the clock is ticking.
I think it's easy to lose sight of this or never see it in the first place. Their (grand)parent company's expectation of a 30% margin from its gaming division seems to be making an impact visible even from a player's perspective. I can only imagine how much more is going on behind the scenes that doesn't get shared. Events, games, studios getting canceled is a noticeable general trend in gaming as it becomes more corporatized in an effort to rescue declining margins. Making a lot of money doesn't necessarily mean making enough in this kind of environment. What the studio wants and may genuinely intend to develop and deliver won't always align with the practical demands of being a subsidiary of a big tech corporation, and things can change suddenly on studios in ways they don't expect when their parent companies change priorities (see AGS). I agree both that it's not an excuse and that it should nevertheless be kept in mind.Edited by virtus753 on December 4, 2025 1:07AM4 -
Rohamad_Ali✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The birth of ESO's woes was in the Crown store. It's been a bitter road of broken promises ever since.
The cosmetic items have been the only thing that work correctly. Sometimes.2 -
Soarora✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The letter was not that long ago. I'm just as cynical as the next person but we have to be realistic, they cannot fulfill all those promises instantly and communication has been improving. We'll just have to wait and see if ZOS keeps on the up and up or if they crawl back into their hole.PC/NA Dungeoneer (Tank/DPS/Heal), Trialist (DPS/Tank/Heal), and amateur Battlegrounder (DPS) with a passion for The Elder Scrolls lore- CP 2000+
- Warden Healer - Arcanist Healer - Warden Brittleden - Stamarc - Sorc Tank - Necro Tank - Templar Tank - Arcanist Tank
- Trials: 9/12 HMs - 4/8 Tris
- Dungeons: 32/32 HMs - 25/26 Tris
- All Veterans completed!
View my builds!
4 -
imPDA✭✭✭The letter was not that long ago.
It is been a year ago. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/670691/studio-director-s-letter-2025-beyond/p1
Yes, we can't expect all of this to be implemented during 2025, and probably some other ideas took the priority and things mentioned in the letter was not implemented because of it, but it is good to sum it all up.0 -
licenturion✭✭✭✭✭
✭I assume some things have been pushed back because of the layoffs.
Also, stuff like more difficult overland seems something they focus on after the class refresh. If they do it before they need to rebalance everything again when the class refresh is out.0 -
Tra_Lalan✭✭✭✭✭3. Improving the overall feel of combat with animation, FX, and potentially audio work
Acually they did adress that. And the way they did that, we should all be happy that they didnt touch the other things (animations with reduced frames number, skills not firing, bar swap not executed properly - which makes the combat just feel bad)
Edited by Tra_Lalan on December 4, 2025 9:53AM4 -
Ezhh✭✭✭✭✭
✭3. Improving the overall feel of combat with animation, FX, and potentially audio work
This is definitely not:3. Everything remains exactly the same.
Having my character constantly make weird janky flinch movements, hold her daggers as though they are a bow, and have her arms teleport from one position to another without passing the space in between after switching a sword through her own body are definitely not "remains exactly the same".
Combat feels worse than ever.9 -
twisttop138✭✭✭✭✭
✭I would very much hope they trashcan that Craglorn idea. Craglorn is cool but a failed experiment. A Craglorn type area with gear chase I could very much see them not give us a trial or dungeons this year and say well you got this. Let's hope not but this idea not out of this world.3 -
Destai✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I don't really think of ZOS as a promise-making company. If anything, I see the opposite where they're very hesitant to comment on anything until it's near completion. The problem with ZOS and this area is more around solid status updates. Like Crossplay for instance - they only really mentioned it in interviews, and even, it was really high-level commentary. For any feature or request, I would expect ZOS to answer more like this:
1. Is the feature possible?
2. Are actively you working towards making it possible?
3. Are you actively on on it?
4. If you are actively working on it, what work is being done?
5. If you are actively working on it, approximately how far long is the project?
And just keeping that framework up to date. Simple stuff.
Personally, I'd even like to know when they're exploring something. It's nice to see when things are being tried, and if they don't release, fine, just telling us why and what the future of that solution looks like.0 -
Madarc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Everything important about this (or similar) topics has already been mentioned in this forum, so I can only hope that the developers read this and forward it to the relevant departments.
The most important point for me seems to be the time it takes to put together satisfactory update-packages based on these findings.
I also remember for example a statement made at the time of the subclass's release:
(paraphrased) “We are excited to see what the community will do with this.”
Couldn't you have predicted that, @ZOS?
It's time, ZOS. Don't destroy any more pillars of trust if you really care about the community. So step on the gas this time...Edited by Madarc on December 4, 2025 5:46PMGeschichten werden nicht berühmt, weil sie passiert sind – sondern weil sie erzählt wurden.1 -
Attorneyatlawl✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭twisttop138 wrote: »I would very much hope they trashcan that Craglorn idea. Craglorn is cool but a failed experiment. A Craglorn type area with gear chase I could very much see them not give us a trial or dungeons this year and say well you got this. Let's hope not but this idea not out of this world.
Completely disagree... It was great fun when it was new.-First-Wave Closed Beta Tester of the Psijic Order, aka the 0.016 percent.
Exploits suck. Don't blame just the game, blame the players abusing them!
-Playing since July 2013, back when we had a killspam channel in Cyrodiil and the lands of Tamriel were roamed by dinosaurs.
________________
-In-game mains abound with "Nerf" in their name. As I am asked occasionally, I do not play on anything but the PC NA Megaserver at this time.1 -
Dock01✭✭✭✭Do you remember the letter from the director in 2025?
I'm talking about these promises:
1. We need to seriously address Cyrodiil performance. Our (ambitious) goal is to return it to the concurrency levels we supported in 2014. So, we will be experimenting with a Cyrodiil campaign where all classes will have PvP-specific (and more performant) skills that replace the standard player skills with the expectation that we can support more players per campaign
2. Increasing the difficulty of standard overworld combat
3. Improving the overall feel of combat with animation, FX, and potentially audio work
4. Experimenting with more zones like Craglorn (although not as large in area or scope), created exclusively for high-end group and soft-group content with associated gear chase
5. Adding and refining tools to make guild recruitment, interaction, and management easier and more logical
6. We have many more ideas here, and of course, we are listening to you and will be coming up with new ideas based on your feedback
1. Okay, they're still doing this.
2. They didn't even touch this item...
3. Everything remains exactly the same.
4. Also passing by.
5. Also not completed.
6. Also not mentioned anymore.
So were these promises:
1. A new patcher, with improved visuals and performance (PC only)
2. Returning to the original Wailing Prison tutorial area for all new players - this has already launched, but we will be regularly tweaking it to improve the experience
3. Visually improving base game zones with updated textures and art assets, starting with the "starter islands" - these should start rolling out in March 2025
4. Not showing new players prologue quest or Chapter quest compass pins. The jury is still out on how Stuga will feel about this
5. Sprucing up the game's PC UI, which is long overdue for a modern visual upgrade
6. Other map and UI systems (still in design/idea stage) to make returning to the game more seamless and get you back into the action quickly
And what has been done?
1. Performance has certainly improved, but there is no schedule.
2. It has already happened.
3. Only at the beginning of the year, they improved the starting locations and that's it.
4. I don't know what to say.
5. Well, by the way, this was done and it seemed to be done even well (get it right, from the point of view of design, it has become modern, now it does not overload visual information)
6. they did it anyway.
Yes, the letter said that some of these things will be added after 2025, that is, in 2026-27-28. But it bothers me that they don't talk about it anymore, as if ZOS has forgotten about it.
There was some movement towards this letter only in the first half of the year, and then everything went quiet.
Will the ZOS return to fulfilling their promises later, or is it always forgotten?
Exactly, and somehow the new team is going to do all this with half the staff and budget ? its the same thing all over again, this cant go on like this foreverEdited by Dock01 on December 5, 2025 11:08AM4 -
Veinblood1965✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭valenwood_vegan wrote: »Well it's not an *excuse*, but it's worth considering that they suffered from layoffs in the latter half of the year and it's likely their budget was cut as well. And the person who wrote that letter departed from the studio as well. There have been some signs that the new leadership is willing to change and learn from mistakes, but other signs point to more of the same, and there is a history of not really following through / leaving things unfinished to move on to the next big hype. Really, we'll just have to see if they can impress us next year. I know I won't be pre-ordering anything, but I'm personally willing to keep monitoring the game to see if things improve. But I've also reduced my engagement with eso and the clock is ticking.
True, plus this was released in 2025. It's not like they can just wake up the next day, flip a switch and wala! There's so many moving parts to this game I'd imagine every change has to be carefully worked through. You would not want to go to the skooma bar and order a high ale and end up with a flagon of skeever blood would you?0 -
Sluggy✭✭✭✭✭
✭ShutUpitsRed wrote: »This is why I didn't even bother reading "Developer Deep Dive—ESO's Class Identity Refresh" lol. Like ok, sure you will. I'll count those bantam guar when they hatch. :P
I glanced at it but I've come to hate it when people use the term "Deep Dive" these days and then give an extremely brief overview. If it takes me less than a couple hours to read it ain't a deep dive.6 -
lostineternity✭✭✭✭valenwood_vegan wrote: »Well it's not an *excuse*, but it's worth considering that they suffered from layoffs
Did they suffer from layoffs for the past 10 years?2 -
Veinblood1965✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭lostineternity wrote: »valenwood_vegan wrote: »Well it's not an *excuse*, but it's worth considering that they suffered from layoffs
Did they suffer from layoffs for the past 10 years?
No idea, doesn't matter in the context of this post which was due to a 2025 statement...Get back with me in 2035...3 -
MorallyBipolar✭✭✭✭ZOS said that vengeance was a test to gather information to improve live Cyrodiil.
Now ZOS is saying their not even going to try to fix anything with normal live Cyrodiil.4 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭They did talk about number 2 in the overland thread. It was supposed to come this year but was pushed back to an unspecified date. They didn't say why but we all saw the large shakeups in the company since that message.
I don't think you can really say it's a broken promise when they told us ahead of time it wouldn't all be in 2025. The 2025 communication mostly revolved around the features we got this year. Presumably we'll get more information next year too.1 -
valenwood_vegan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭lostineternity wrote: »valenwood_vegan wrote: »Well it's not an *excuse*, but it's worth considering that they suffered from layoffs
Did they suffer from layoffs for the past 10 years?
I have no idea, I don't work there. The question in the OP specifically referenced Matt's 2025 letter, and I believe the 2025 layoffs and his departure from the studio in 2025 are directly relevant to the promises made in *that* letter.
I also literally stated that they have a history of not following through on promises, so not sure what point you wanna make with me.Edited by valenwood_vegan on December 5, 2025 7:40PM0 -
Artem_gig✭✭✭MorallyBipolar wrote: »ZOS said that vengeance was a test to gather information to improve live Cyrodiil.
Now ZOS is saying their not even going to try to fix anything with normal live Cyrodiil.
and I think they're doing the right thing. Regular cyrodil is unplayable and terrible. There's no point in fixing something that was originally designed to be broken. They need to completely rethink their approach to mass pvp, and what they're doing now is the best they can do for now.1 -
Artem_gig✭✭✭valenwood_vegan wrote: »lostineternity wrote: »valenwood_vegan wrote: »Well it's not an *excuse*, but it's worth considering that they suffered from layoffs
Did they suffer from layoffs for the past 10 years?
I have no idea, I don't work there. The question in the OP specifically referenced Matt's 2025 letter, and I believe the 2025 layoffs and his departure from the studio in 2025 are directly relevant to the promises made in *that* letter.
I also literally stated that they have a history of not following through on promises, so not sure what point you wanna make with me.
I'm aware of the layoffs. I wrote this post because, being aware of these layoffs, I was surprised that they were initiating a massive reorganization of classes, thus adding to their already extensive list of promised plans. Their staff has been reduced by 50%, but instead of simply avoiding taking on even more work and fulfilling their promises, they are choosing to work even harder or completely change the direction of their work.3 -
moderatelyfatman✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It reminds me of the double speak of politicians:
In 2025: "By 2030, no child will live in poverty!"
in 2028: "By 2030, no child will need to live in poverty!"
in 2030: "We've fulfilled our promise that by 2030, no child would want to live in poverty!"0 -
moderatelyfatman✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MorallyBipolar wrote: »ZOS said that vengeance was a test to gather information to improve live Cyrodiil.
Now ZOS is saying their not even going to try to fix anything with normal live Cyrodiil.
and I think they're doing the right thing. Regular cyrodil is unplayable and terrible. There's no point in fixing something that was originally designed to be broken. They need to completely rethink their approach to mass pvp, and what they're doing now is the best they can do for now.
Why does regular Cyrodiil have to be unplayable and terrible? It wasn't always the case: in early 2022 ZOS upgraded the servers and the game ran smoothly for a few months. It wasn't perfect and there was still lag/desyc but skills worked when you pressed the buttons and a ball group turning up didn't automatically mean you got logged out.
And then High Isle shipped and something broke.
I think 95% of the playerbase would be happy to have a Greyhost/Blackreach that performed at the level of early 2022. I don't see how asking for something we had before is an impossible request.
What gets me going is that the devs have done ZERO test changes to Greyhost or Blackreach; or made a third campaign to test out these changes. They've put 100% of their effort so far into Vengeance which tells us that they never intended to fix regular Cyrodiil.Edited by moderatelyfatman on December 7, 2025 6:41AM0 -
MorallyBipolar wrote: »ZOS said that vengeance was a test to gather information to improve live Cyrodiil.
Now ZOS is saying their not even going to try to fix anything with normal live Cyrodiil.
and I think they're doing the right thing. Regular cyrodil is unplayable and terrible. There's no point in fixing something that was originally designed to be broken. They need to completely rethink their approach to mass pvp, and what they're doing now is the best they can do for now.
Who says regular Cyrodiil was designed to be broken? Performance wasn't always terrible and the DEVs even said themselves that they know that HoTs and shield stacking are a major problem that cause issues with performance. In my opinion, they should focus more energy on fixing that problem before telling us that we'll have Vengeance (and maybe GH) permanently.1 -
Artem_gig✭✭✭moderatelyfatman wrote: »MorallyBipolar wrote: »ZOS said that vengeance was a test to gather information to improve live Cyrodiil.
Now ZOS is saying their not even going to try to fix anything with normal live Cyrodiil.
and I think they're doing the right thing. Regular cyrodil is unplayable and terrible. There's no point in fixing something that was originally designed to be broken. They need to completely rethink their approach to mass pvp, and what they're doing now is the best they can do for now.
Why does regular Cyrodiil have to be unplayable and terrible? It wasn't always the case: in early 2022 ZOS upgraded the servers and the game ran smoothly for a few months. It wasn't perfect and there was still lag/desyc but skills worked when you pressed the buttons and a ball group turning up didn't automatically mean you got logged out.
And then High Isle shipped and something broke.
I think 95% of the playerbase would be happy to have a Greyhost/Blackreach that performed at the level of early 2022. I don't see how asking for something we had before is an impossible request.
What gets me going is that the devs have done ZERO test changes to Greyhost or Blackreach; or made a third campaign to test out these changes. They've put 100% of their effort so far into Vengeance which tells us that they never intended to fix regular Cyrodiil.
You misunderstood me. The problem with Cyrodil is not the stability of its operation, but the fact that it is a dull and disgusting imitation of PvP, where players fight not against other players, but against their builds. The balance is so terrible that it is hard to imagine how it was allowed to happen in the first place. To get rid of this, they had to start from scratch. It's not acceptable for a PvP situation to occur where you get killed with a single hit, while the opponent doesn't lose 10% of their HP even with 100 hits.1 -
Artem_gig✭✭✭TheSherryOnTop wrote: »MorallyBipolar wrote: »ZOS said that vengeance was a test to gather information to improve live Cyrodiil.
Now ZOS is saying their not even going to try to fix anything with normal live Cyrodiil.
and I think they're doing the right thing. Regular cyrodil is unplayable and terrible. There's no point in fixing something that was originally designed to be broken. They need to completely rethink their approach to mass pvp, and what they're doing now is the best they can do for now.
Who says regular Cyrodiil was designed to be broken? Performance wasn't always terrible and the DEVs even said themselves that they know that HoTs and shield stacking are a major problem that cause issues with performance. In my opinion, they should focus more energy on fixing that problem before telling us that we'll have Vengeance (and maybe GH) permanently.
Broken not in terms of performance, but in terms of balance, as I mentioned above.1 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I can recall the letter setting out what were clearly their aims, intentions, and goals, but perhaps the OP can point out where in the letter these things were stated as "promises".1