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• PC/Mac: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – September 15, 4:00AM EDT (8:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC)
• Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – September 16, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
• PlayStation®: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – September 16, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
Boring patch again?
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amiiegee✭✭✭✭Some players may agree with him, others may not, but I believe we can all agree on this:- ZOS puts more effort into the Crown Store than into actual content.
- Some players like subclassing, others don’t.
- No one asked for subclassing. We all expected more PvE content, but not a single player expected subclassing.
- ZOS should balance all skills and make classes unique, not turn them all into this nonsense.
- And lastly… the community numbers stay the same only because of cross-platform play. Before, we had 20k players on PC and 20k on consoles. Now, with cross-platform, ESO has around 12k players total.
The game is damn boring now, and that’s why people leave.
Agreeing 1-4 but about 5, you mean all platforms together ? Because we dont have crossplay and thats another major issue. In total 12k might be and i guess the most are on PC0 -
Nemesis7884✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The main focus should be
1 make lagging skill lines better
2 balance skill lines better within themselves
3 balance in general - but I dont think balance needs to be everything is equal since this would make things more boring....it should rather be line the rock paper scissor approach where ooo you combine 3 dd skill lines, well ur a glass cannon vs 3 defensive skill lines...
I think the balancing of skill lines should be done with this rock paper scissor approach with + and - in mind to make builds more interesting... if they try to make all skill lines equal it will be extremely boring...
2 -
Æthërnüm✭✭✭When a technical thread is posted here it's always moved to the appropriate Technical Support forum, but when a PvP thread is posted here it is never moved to the appropriate PvP forum - why not?
it's not about support, it's for discussion. i don't need help, i need changes. game is boring when you see cyro/everything else fullfilled with 1-2 copypasta build.
I didn't suggest it was about support, I recognised it was about PvP and there's a separate group of forums for discussing PvP. I was questioning why support threads always get moved but PvP threads never do.
Not only about PvP, PvE included, but lesser.
I can't see why pve would welcome constant changes. It's seriously, seriously aggravating to come back after a patch and find none of your gear/skills work the way they were meant to any more in pve to deal with a PvP problem.
because running the same thing over and over again means stagnation, stagnation is a first step for player to get bored, getting bored means leaving the game. Every game has patches with big changes, since this one does not have such patches anymore, it won't last very long. I am in the game since 2016, i enjoy everything, beside the game losing it's playerbase (on EU) so can't even go dungeon with randoms for some fun and constant same builds working for years in PvP makes me feel like every day is a same day.
i don't think you will understand my point and i think you will tell: play something else. what is not an answer for my point.
I understand your point, but you appear to be trying to claim that because you feel it everyone must. I don't think this is the case, particularly for PvE players. Personally, I get bored by the concept of doing things repeatedly and no amount of fiddling with stats is going to fix that for me -- it'll just make me annoyed on top -- so i spend long stretches of time away from ESO.
i think all or at least biggest part of PvE-lads i know will say that they are barely playing/not playing because it's boring if i ask.0 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Some players may agree with him, others may not, but I believe we can all agree on this:- ZOS puts more effort into the Crown Store than into actual content.
- Some players like subclassing, others don’t.
- No one asked for subclassing. We all expected more PvE content, but not a single player expected subclassing.
- ZOS should balance all skills and make classes unique, not turn them all into this nonsense.
- And lastly… the community numbers stay the same only because of cross-platform play. Before, we had 20k players on PC and 20k on consoles. Now, with cross-platform, ESO has around 12k players total.
The game is damn boring now, and that’s why people leave.
Agreeing 1-4 but about 5, you mean all platforms together ? Because we dont have crossplay and thats another major issue. In total 12k might be and i guess the most are on PC
12K is roughly the average number of PC players playing through Steam daily over recent months. It has nothing to do with the overall number of players across the platforms and through the different launch systems.0 -
Nemesis7884✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Some players may agree with him, others may not, but I believe we can all agree on this:- ZOS puts more effort into the Crown Store than into actual content.
- Some players like subclassing, others don’t.
- No one asked for subclassing. We all expected more PvE content, but not a single player expected subclassing.
- ZOS should balance all skills and make classes unique, not turn them all into this nonsense.
- And lastly… the community numbers stay the same only because of cross-platform play. Before, we had 20k players on PC and 20k on consoles. Now, with cross-platform, ESO has around 12k players total.
The game is damn boring now, and that’s why people leave.
Agreeing 1-4 but about 5, you mean all platforms together ? Because we dont have crossplay and thats another major issue. In total 12k might be and i guess the most are on PC
12K is roughly the average number of PC players playing through Steam daily over recent months. It has nothing to do with the overall number of players across the platforms and through the different launch systems.
A systematic change or lack thereof is probably an indication for other platforms.1 -
M0ntie✭✭✭✭✭I strongly disagree. If you're needing to run a BIS build for the content you want to do then the next update is just down right annoying. I do not want to have to remake all my load outs for every trial just because ZoS can't make their mind up on how skills are going to work.
Re "nobody asked for subclassing". How many posts about wanting to change Class were there on the forums from people too lazy just to make extra characters???? I think subclassing is ZoS attempting to placate these people, when they have said that it was too difficult technically to actually allow a class change. For what its worth, I like Sub classing. Allows for more interesting builds and more variation.
Changing things to make grindy work does NOT make the game interesting.6 -
M0ntie✭✭✭✭✭What would improve the game is better stability. The game stability has been bad recently. People randomly disconnecting and being laggy. How ZoS has not got the game stable after all these years is beyond words.2
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MJallday✭✭✭✭✭
✭lord knows im critical of ZOS - but i have to defend them here
The statement made in the OP was "youve lost 60% of your communuity"
those screenshots blow that assumption out of the water and theres little evidence to suggest that.
The average players in December 2024 was 10301
The average players in July 2025 was 10236
therefore, the game has lost an average of 65 players over a 6 month period
that's a bit different from the 60% quoted
what i suspect the OP was doing is basing your assumption on that 1 month drop between june (13157 average) and july (10236) - which is actually a 22% drop
there is insufficient data to know whether this is related to the game. In fact, based on the data, its a more reasonable assumption that people have finished the part 1 and are awaiting for part 2. The data itself shows this, as is noted between March and April (which co-insides with the new software drop) - a significant increase can be seem
what anyone analysing the data is seeing here is an influx of players playing the new content, finishing it, then doing something else. which is quite normal in gaming - with the core base staying as is (minus 65)
also worth noting
1) not everyone plays through steam on pc
2) console (xbox and ps) figures are not counted
3) steam figures are highly subjective, not official ZOS figures and could prone to error
so this isnt an accurate picture. its part of the picture
wjilst i dont doubt there is a drop in peoples opinions, to claim figures like the OP has without factuality, is just wrong.
Edited by MJallday on August 12, 2025 10:31AM5 -
Æthërnüm✭✭✭Iquote="Deimus;c-8356617"]You're right, It should feel like strides towards balance are happening every patch. The gap between the most used skill lines and least used should get noticeably smaller every 3 months.
It has been pointed out repeatedly that the combat balance changes are too small for quarterly releases. None of U47's changes creates excitement to try anything new and does nothing to shake up the current PvP meta.
Like you said the movement of Major Resolve from Lightning Form to Bound Armor was the only change that might have had any effect. So the same overperforming skill lines will be used by most of the playerbase and NOTHING was done to make any of the weaker lines more appealing.
Once again we're sitting in a stagnant patch for 3 months hoping they decide to buff weak and unused skill lines to make more builds competitively viable or actually remove the power from overperforming skill lines in U48. Preferably they expend the effort to do both.
I dont think its that they won't balance, I think they can't balance. All the back and forth, all the nerfs, all the buffs over the years never resulted in balance. I think subclassing was supposed to be the answer to this, the "we can't do it so here, have any skill line you want, balance yourselves". I guess in theory a cookie cutter BIS Arc+NB+insert rando base class here approach looked pretty good on paper. In reality not so much. Some people embraced it, a lot didn't. I think anyone holding out hope for balance at this point is wasting their time. Imo. [
[/quote]
yeah, but thaNemesis7884 wrote: »The main focus should be
1 make lagging skill lines better
2 balance skill lines better within themselves
3 balance in general - but I dont think balance needs to be everything is equal since this would make things more boring....it should rather be line the rock paper scissor approach where ooo you combine 3 dd skill lines, well ur a glass cannon vs 3 defensive skill lines...
I think the balancing of skill lines should be done with this rock paper scissor approach with + and - in mind to make builds more interesting... if they try to make all skill lines equal it will be extremely boring...
ZOS thought: give everything to everyonelord knows im critical of ZOS - but i have to defend them here
The statement made in the OP was "youve lost 60% of your communuity"
those screenshots blow that assumption out of the water and theres little evidence to suggest that.
The average players in December 2024 was 10301
The average players in July 2025 was 10236
therefore, the game has lost an average of 65 players over a 6 month period
that's a bit different from the 60% quoted
what i suspect the OP was doing is basing your assumption on that 1 month drop between june (13157 average) and july (10236) - which is actually a 22% drop
there is insufficient data to know whether this is related to the game. In fact, based on the data, its a more reasonable assumption that people have finished the part 1 and are awaiting for part 2. The data itself shows this, as is noted between March and April (which co-insides with the new software drop) - a significant increase can be seem
what anyone analysing the data is seeing here is an influx of players playing the new content, finishing it, then doing something else. which is quite normal in gaming - with the core base staying as is (minus 65)
also worth noting
1) not everyone plays through steam on pc
2) console (xbox and ps) figures are not counted
3) steam figures are highly subjective, not official ZOS figures and could prone to error
so this isnt an accurate picture. its part of the picture
wjilst i dont doubt there is a drop in peoples opinions, to claim figures like the OP has without factuality, is just wrong.
me talking specifically about PC EU, i compare it to older years, you can check it out yourself, i mentioned before that not everyone is on steam ,but since some time steam is the popular platform to buy the game.
so comparison mostly for Skyrim/Elsweyr patches.1 -
Æthërnüm✭✭✭I strongly disagree. If you're needing to run a BIS build for the content you want to do then the next update is just down right annoying. I do not want to have to remake all my load outs for every trial just because ZoS can't make their mind up on how skills are going to work.
Re "nobody asked for subclassing". How many posts about wanting to change Class were there on the forums from people too lazy just to make extra characters???? I think subclassing is ZoS attempting to placate these people, when they have said that it was too difficult technically to actually allow a class change. For what its worth, I like Sub classing. Allows for more interesting builds and more variation.
Changing things to make grindy work does NOT make the game interesting.
grindy? i guess you haven't seen or experienced a real grindy stuff like BDO1 -
MJallday✭✭✭✭✭
✭Iquote="Deimus;c-8356617"]You're right, It should feel like strides towards balance are happening every patch. The gap between the most used skill lines and least used should get noticeably smaller every 3 months.
It has been pointed out repeatedly that the combat balance changes are too small for quarterly releases. None of U47's changes creates excitement to try anything new and does nothing to shake up the current PvP meta.
Like you said the movement of Major Resolve from Lightning Form to Bound Armor was the only change that might have had any effect. So the same overperforming skill lines will be used by most of the playerbase and NOTHING was done to make any of the weaker lines more appealing.
Once again we're sitting in a stagnant patch for 3 months hoping they decide to buff weak and unused skill lines to make more builds competitively viable or actually remove the power from overperforming skill lines in U48. Preferably they expend the effort to do both.
I dont think its that they won't balance, I think they can't balance. All the back and forth, all the nerfs, all the buffs over the years never resulted in balance. I think subclassing was supposed to be the answer to this, the "we can't do it so here, have any skill line you want, balance yourselves". I guess in theory a cookie cutter BIS Arc+NB+insert rando base class here approach looked pretty good on paper. In reality not so much. Some people embraced it, a lot didn't. I think anyone holding out hope for balance at this point is wasting their time. Imo. [Nemesis7884 wrote: »The main focus should be
1 make lagging skill lines better
2 balance skill lines better within themselves
3 balance in general - but I dont think balance needs to be everything is equal since this would make things more boring....it should rather be line the rock paper scissor approach where ooo you combine 3 dd skill lines, well ur a glass cannon vs 3 defensive skill lines...
I think the balancing of skill lines should be done with this rock paper scissor approach with + and - in mind to make builds more interesting... if they try to make all skill lines equal it will be extremely boring...
ZOS thought: give everything to everyonelord knows im critical of ZOS - but i have to defend them here
The statement made in the OP was "youve lost 60% of your communuity"
those screenshots blow that assumption out of the water and theres little evidence to suggest that.
The average players in December 2024 was 10301
The average players in July 2025 was 10236
therefore, the game has lost an average of 65 players over a 6 month period
that's a bit different from the 60% quoted
what i suspect the OP was doing is basing your assumption on that 1 month drop between june (13157 average) and july (10236) - which is actually a 22% drop
there is insufficient data to know whether this is related to the game. In fact, based on the data, its a more reasonable assumption that people have finished the part 1 and are awaiting for part 2. The data itself shows this, as is noted between March and April (which co-insides with the new software drop) - a significant increase can be seem
what anyone analysing the data is seeing here is an influx of players playing the new content, finishing it, then doing something else. which is quite normal in gaming - with the core base staying as is (minus 65)
also worth noting
1) not everyone plays through steam on pc
2) console (xbox and ps) figures are not counted
3) steam figures are highly subjective, not official ZOS figures and could prone to error
so this isnt an accurate picture. its part of the picture
wjilst i dont doubt there is a drop in peoples opinions, to claim figures like the OP has without factuality, is just wrong.
me talking specifically about PC EU, i compare it to older years, you can check it out yourself, i mentioned before that not everyone is on steam ,but since some time steam is the popular platform to buy the game.
so comparison mostly for Skyrim/Elsweyr patches.
I did, and the figures dont hold water either
im not arguing that the servers dont feel busy. I mean the jump between xbox eu and NA is night and day.. let alone what it must have felt like when people people played them. however one thing you have to remember, is when the game first came out, there were only a few zones.
SInce release, had Apocrypha, Artaeum, Blackreach (x 2) , Blackwood, High isle, Northern Elsewyr, Southern Elswry, Summerset, Telvannie peninsula, Vvardenfell, Western Skyrim, West Weald, Clockwork city, deadlands, fargrave, galen, gold coast, hews bane, murkmile, the reach, wrothgar, solstice and i dare say a few ive forgotten
it might feel emptier, but we're more spread out.
consider that.
Edited by MJallday on August 12, 2025 11:20AM2 -
tomofhyrule✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Re "nobody asked for subclassing". How many posts about wanting to change Class were there on the forums from people too lazy just to make extra characters???? I think subclassing is ZoS attempting to placate these people, when they have said that it was too difficult technically to actually allow a class change. For what its worth, I like Sub classing. Allows for more interesting builds and more variation.
Oh people were totally asking for Subclassing.
What people weren't asking for was that everyone should be forced to Subclass, whether they want to or not. Unfortunately, due to the balance, that's what we got.
You want Subclassing? Fine, go nuts. But if your enjoyment of the game specifically depends on making me not play the way I want, then that's a problem.2 -
xylena_lazarow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭U47 goes the absolute wrong direction for build PvP, further buffing the already oppressive small scale Assassin meta, and doubling down on preserving the godawful proc set / pull bomb / ball group large scale meta. So unless you enjoy exactly those things, it's cooked, we can only pray for Vengeance.PC/NA || Cyro/BGs || RIP old PvP build system || bring Vengeance2 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Nemesis7884 wrote: »Some players may agree with him, others may not, but I believe we can all agree on this:- ZOS puts more effort into the Crown Store than into actual content.
- Some players like subclassing, others don’t.
- No one asked for subclassing. We all expected more PvE content, but not a single player expected subclassing.
- ZOS should balance all skills and make classes unique, not turn them all into this nonsense.
- And lastly… the community numbers stay the same only because of cross-platform play. Before, we had 20k players on PC and 20k on consoles. Now, with cross-platform, ESO has around 12k players total.
The game is damn boring now, and that’s why people leave.
Agreeing 1-4 but about 5, you mean all platforms together ? Because we dont have crossplay and thats another major issue. In total 12k might be and i guess the most are on PC
12K is roughly the average number of PC players playing through Steam daily over recent months. It has nothing to do with the overall number of players across the platforms and through the different launch systems.
A systematic change or lack thereof is probably an indication for other platforms.
That may or may not be the case, however it's irrelevant to my comment as quoted by you and which was simply to counter the claim that "ESO has around 12k players total" which is palpably false.0 -
MincMincMinc✭✭✭✭✭
✭You want to talk about boring? Cyrodil has been the same for 10 years with only a minor roadbump change halfway through that everyone hated.
Somehow Mount speeds have more than doubled, but it still feels like mount simulator because the population cap is 1/4 what it used to be. Not only that, but at the same time that lower population is occupied by 2-3 groups per faction that stand within an 8m radius and are practically immortal, stacking every effect in the game which VERY CLEARLY has an effect on the server. Of course it will feel like an empty mount simulator when you have to run around for half an hour until there is a fight you can even participate in.We should use the insightful and awesome buttons more1 -
BasP✭✭✭✭✭Even as a PvE'er, I definitely agree. While I've spent quite some hours on the PTS during the U46 and U47 PTS cycles testing things and coming up with feedback, I'm not motivated to actually play the game itself anymore. The balance is way off right now and knowing that nothing will change for the foreseeable future just makes ESO less fun for me. On most days I only log in to do a couple of crafting dailies, if that.1
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Æthërnüm✭✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »You want to talk about boring? Cyrodil has been the same for 10 years with only a minor roadbump change halfway through that everyone hated.
Somehow Mount speeds have more than doubled, but it still feels like mount simulator because the population cap is 1/4 what it used to be. Not only that, but at the same time that lower population is occupied by 2-3 groups per faction that stand within an 8m radius and are practically immortal, stacking every effect in the game which VERY CLEARLY has an effect on the server. Of course it will feel like an empty mount simulator when you have to run around for half an hour until there is a fight you can even participate in.
PvP as it is makes different situations with specific circumstances. talking about "same Cyrodiil for 10 years" while people playing Dota and stuff like this for even more. PvP is not needed in such huge stuff like PvE, cause PvP (as a true high-end content) is self-changeable as it is. Not anymore, coz all the time you see copypasta lads running around, but still.1 -
Æthërnüm✭✭✭xylena_lazarow wrote: »U47 goes the absolute wrong direction for build PvP, further buffing the already oppressive small scale Assassin meta, and doubling down on preserving the godawful proc set / pull bomb / ball group large scale meta. So unless you enjoy exactly those things, it's cooked, we can only pray for Vengeance.
Vengeance is a dead-born thing.3 -
Dock01✭✭✭GeneralGrundmann wrote: »Reliable source please for the: "you lost about 60% of your community?" quote!
you must be new if you need "source" for that lmaoMincMincMinc wrote: »You want to talk about boring? Cyrodil has been the same for 10 years with only a minor roadbump change halfway through that everyone hated.
Somehow Mount speeds have more than doubled, but it still feels like mount simulator because the population cap is 1/4 what it used to be. Not only that, but at the same time that lower population is occupied by 2-3 groups per faction that stand within an 8m radius and are practically immortal, stacking every effect in the game which VERY CLEARLY has an effect on the server. Of course it will feel like an empty mount simulator when you have to run around for half an hour until there is a fight you can even participate in.
PvP as it is makes different situations with specific circumstances. talking about "same Cyrodiil for 10 years" while people playing Dota and stuff like this for even more. PvP is not needed in such huge stuff like PvE, cause PvP (as a true high-end content) is self-changeable as it is. Not anymore, coz all the time you see copypasta lads running around, but still.
Don’t bother comparing ESO to real PvP titles like Dota, League, Valorant, or Fortnite. Those are true competitive games with esports. ESO isn’t , it’s pure player vs-gear, not skill based, and never will be. You have to buy every DLC dungeon just to get the gear, so the “competition” is basically pretend. No esports, no real system, and no one cares.Edited by Dock01 on August 13, 2025 12:49PM1 -
Æthërnüm✭✭✭GeneralGrundmann wrote: »Reliable source please for the: "you lost about 60% of your community?" quote!
you must be new if you need "source" for that lmaoMincMincMinc wrote: »You want to talk about boring? Cyrodil has been the same for 10 years with only a minor roadbump change halfway through that everyone hated.
Somehow Mount speeds have more than doubled, but it still feels like mount simulator because the population cap is 1/4 what it used to be. Not only that, but at the same time that lower population is occupied by 2-3 groups per faction that stand within an 8m radius and are practically immortal, stacking every effect in the game which VERY CLEARLY has an effect on the server. Of course it will feel like an empty mount simulator when you have to run around for half an hour until there is a fight you can even participate in.
PvP as it is makes different situations with specific circumstances. talking about "same Cyrodiil for 10 years" while people playing Dota and stuff like this for even more. PvP is not needed in such huge stuff like PvE, cause PvP (as a true high-end content) is self-changeable as it is. Not anymore, coz all the time you see copypasta lads running around, but still.
Don’t bother comparing ESO to real PvP titles like Dota, League, Valorant, or Fortnite. Those are true competitive games with esports. ESO isn’t , it’s pure player vs-gear, not skill based, and never will be. You have to buy every DLC dungeon just to get the gear, so the “competition” is basically pretend. No esports, no real system, and no one cares.
sure, keep me in touch, bud!1