Absolutely not. Assassination tree is a disaster.

SilverBride wrote: »

Disagree.

Let us agree to disagree. And by that I mean: click "agree" because I agree with your "Disagree."

JustLovely wrote: »

Nope. Balance has never been worse. There are no classes now. The game has become like partially solidified jello sort of oozing all over the place with no noteworthy direction.

This was a big gamble on the part of the devs.

Are you all playing with subclass builds?

I'm finding that my Stamarc build from 6 months ago is doing better than it was before subclassing, but some of that might be because other egregiously imbalanced things (e.g. Hardened Ward's ridiculous healing in PVP) got nerfed.

taugrim wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Absolutely not. Assassination tree is a disaster.

Is that the main or only one that's problematic?

The skills do look strong, and they don't have dependencies on other NB trees.

It's not the only one, but it definitely is the main cuplrit. The main things that make it so strong are:
1. the insane crit chance the line provides from the passives (this was an issues years ago and why crit chance is supposed to be hard to get in PvP)
2. the ability to hold 2 spec bows for what is essentially a 40-60k burst of damage (1 spec bow was already problematic before this patch, I really cannot understand why the devs thought it would be a good idea to allow it to be double cast)
3. one of the best single target ultimates in the game in incap that further buffs damage by an obscene 20% (nothing else in the game comes close to this particular DPS increase with the closest being the 15% frost damage from winters embrace, but that's limited to frost damage only that has very good active abilities to take advantage of such a buff).
4. the line is completely generic in how it buffs damage, It's not restricted to any 1 thing such as frost (winters embrace), DoTs (gravelord), multi-hit abilities (to get the most out of aedric spear), physical/shock (storm calling) or flame/poison (ardent flame).

If you want access to generic buffs to damage in PvP, you slot assassination. The others can fit better for more niche builds, but even then most still aren't as strong for those niches as just slotting assassination would be.

Aedric spear and storm calling are other very strong DPS lines, not as OP as assassination, but still very strong in their own way via their solid mix of offense + defense. Dark magic is a decent line as well mostly for sustain, but frags procs can hit hard.

As for pure defense, the recent buffs to templars restoring light line have made it probably the best defensive line, mostly from the crazy amount of sustain it provides combined with healing, cleanse and access to major resolve all from 1 line. Wardens Winters embrace line is still very strong, but lacks the sustain that restoring light provides. On a dedicated frost build, winters embrace is better though for that 15% frost damage done and the bonuses to the chilled status effect.

There are some lines that would be stronger for more niche builds such as gravelord and ardent flame for DoT builds, bone tyrant and draconic power for bash builds. Even on these builds, slotting assassination can provide insane buffs via insane burst and generic DPS buffs that are just as strong as those more niche lines despite being completely generic.

To give an example of how broken Assassination is, it's not only the best DPS line in PvP, but it's the best DPS buffing line for PvE as well (Arc beam is still best line overall for its cleave, but every meta build posted so far has included assassination, even non-beam builds all have that line slotted because it buffs all DPS far too much, even just passively and not actively using the spec bow proc).

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

taugrim wrote: »

The skills do look strong, and they don't have dependencies on other NB trees.

I've gone in depth in previous posts of mine so I'll summarize the worst of it:

1) double spec bow cast is insane design for pvp

2) instant single target spammable that hits harder than other classes' ults or cast time skills

3) now a completely absurd amount of crit chance from its already strong passives

4) independently strong, can be slapped on any build

Have yet to had issues with double bow proc, not seeing it as a problem, at least in BG's. Might be a different issue in Cyrodiil, haven't done much of that this update.

Finding everyone having access to blastbones to be a much bigger problem. People severely underestimate how hard blastbones hit, on top of adding both defiles, having a huge AoE on impact and putting a slow on you everytime it lands (hamstrung) it's what makes BG's an awful experience atm.

Major_Mangle wrote: »

Have yet to had issues with double bow proc

Finding everyone having access to blastbones to be a much bigger problem

Players are still trying to have "fun" with things like D-Swing, give it a few more weeks and they'll all be on double spec bow when they get sick of being smacked by 19k bows as they swing at air. Blastbones is its own heinous problem, a body blocking roulette wheel that's as miserable for its user as it is for its opponents.

Turtle_Bot wrote: »

taugrim wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Absolutely not. Assassination tree is a disaster.

Is that the main or only one that's problematic?

The skills do look strong, and they don't have dependencies on other NB trees.

It's not the only one, but it definitely is the main cuplrit. The main things that make it so strong are:
2. the ability to hold 2 spec bows for what is essentially a 40-60k burst of damage (1 spec bow was already problematic before this patch, I really cannot understand why the devs thought it would be a good idea to allow it to be double cast)
3. one of the best single target ultimates in the game in incap that further buffs damage by an obscene 20% (nothing else in the game comes close to this particular DPS increase with the closest being the 15% frost damage from winters embrace, but that's limited to frost damage only that has very good active abilities to take advantage of such a buff).
4. the line is completely generic in how it buffs damage, It's not restricted to any 1 thing such as frost (winters embrace), DoTs (gravelord), multi-hit abilities (to get the most out of aedric spear), physical/shock (storm calling) or flame/poison (ardent flame).

If you want access to generic buffs to damage in PvP, you slot assassination. The others can fit better for more niche builds, but even then most still aren't as strong for those niches as just slotting assassination would be.

Having 2 spec bows is insane / inane. Having 1 big ranged burst was already super powerful for a non-ultimate. What a weird choice.

The point of ESO was to have viable choices. The 3rd and especially 4th point go against that.

Adjusting a few overperforming skills on specific classes is not going to have any effect when you then allow players to choose from every skill in the game to help reach levels of burst damage never seen before.

taugrim wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Absolutely not. Assassination tree is a disaster.

Is that the main or only one that's problematic?

The skills do look strong, and they don't have dependencies on other NB trees.

All of the lines that provide Crit Chance or Crit Damage are strong, because with Monomyth this patch, Crit is King.

The problem with Assassination is that it provides both of these, and it has them in spades.

Double axes, in 5 medium, and I can still have 60% crit chance in PvP, with ~140% crit damage, and I'm not even a Khajiit; that damage could go higher. The crit chance also goes up when flanking and even further in execute since I'm using Grave Lord; I have a 85% crit chance in execute at times.

And on top of the crazy crit passives just for existing, Assassination also gets 3 of the hands down best single target abilities in the game. Incap (or even Soul Harvest) hits like a truck, is extremely cheap, and boosts your damage twice as much as the other damage boosting abilities (Colossus/Tentacular Dread). Surprise attack and Concealed Weapon are both incredible abilities, with higher tooltips than a regular spammable on top of extra effects that make them deal even more damage.

Finally, the worst offender: Grim Focus is the most obscenely overtuned skill in the game. It was already S+ tier for single target burst in PvP, and they quite literally made it twice as good this patch. The fact that you can fire off back to back spec bows now is so blatantly overtuned that I'm not sure how it ever made it off the cutting room floor. And if you're too lazy to ever press the button, enjoy weapon and spell damage equivalent to a 5 piece set just for having it slotted on either bar. What's that? There's significantly worse abilities than Grim Focus that have still yet to receive the double bar treatment? What, like we're supposed to make other classes as good as nightblade? Get out of town.

Balanced, yes, super balanced!

I put assassination on my DK, then liked it so much I added storm calling.

Then I noticed I was only using one DK ability. So really I am not a DK anymore.

So, it is balanced because there are no more classes.

Except for my NB . I kept two class lines and only added Templar restoring light since it seems better than siphoning.