Can we get Potions of Shieldbreaking/Stunning/Rooting?

Avran_Sylt · March 13

Basically potions that can be used to counter defensive measures in the potion slot to make one-bar builds more versatile. Kinda like the detect pot.

EG:
Shieldbreakers elixir: You quarter your damage for the next 8s but your attacks are considered Oblivion Damage.
Volatile Elixir: Slam this vessel on the ground, upon shattering all enemies within an 8m radius are stunned.
Gripping Elixir: Slamming this vessel on the ground roots all enemies within an 8m radius and slows them by 70% for 8s.

kiwi_tea · March 14

These are all insanely overtuned. Please never.

There is an alchemical root effect already, but it comes from poisons, is single target, and is already pretty decent.

Avran_Sylt · March 14

kiwi_tea wrote: »

These are all insanely overtuned. Please never.

There is an alchemical root effect already, but it comes from poisons, is single target, and is already pretty decent.

How are they overtuned?
- Someone low on health and they try to block or shield themselves: pop a shield breaker elixir to finish them off
- create new burst opportunities against players that haven't added achieved the proper HP/resistance threshold with an off GCD stun, streamers will love this
- If someone is trying to use speed to sprint around obstacles to block LoS, snare and slow them with a gripping elixir.

Similar in fashion to how if a player attempts to enter stealth/invisibility to escape/as defense, pop a detect pot to run them down/invalidate a skillslot for a duration.

Tonturri · March 15

I could see there being issues with a potion that allows any level of oblivion damage, as it's supposed to be a rare damage type that you have to really make sacrifices to have in your build or the oblivion damage itself is very low, but the others seems like they'd be okay with tuning. If someone wants to give up the sustain provided by tri-pots, more power to em. I doubt an AoE stun on a 45 second cooldown is build-making or build-breaking, either, since it'd 99% of the time be better to just slot a CC anyway. Basically everyone with even the slightest idea of what they're doing runs a snare removal skill though, so that area of the game (and others) needs to be fixed up before potions start getting more effects.

Kartalin · March 16

An AOE root & snare, and an AOE stun are things left to 5 piece set bonuses or slotted abilities. Definitely OP if we could source those via potions. We can already get similar effects on one target via a poison which forces us to forego an enchantment.

While it would be nice to have a couple more viable sources of oblivion damage, a complicated potion probably isn’t the answer either. And I would imagine that damage would have to be capped like other sources to prevent abuse.

Avran_Sylt · March 17

Tonturri wrote: »

I could see there being issues with a potion that allows any level of oblivion damage, as it's supposed to be a rare damage type that you have to really make sacrifices to have in your build or the oblivion damage itself is very low, but the others seems like they'd be okay with tuning. If someone wants to give up the sustain provided by tri-pots, more power to em. I doubt an AoE stun on a 45 second cooldown is build-making or build-breaking, either, since it'd 99% of the time be better to just slot a CC anyway. Basically everyone with even the slightest idea of what they're doing runs a snare removal skill though, so that area of the game (and others) needs to be fixed up before potions start getting more effects.

I was leaning more towards an end of calculation modifier, and the sacrifice being that you now deal 1/8th of your damage for the next few seconds. This being countered easily with healing/dodgerolling vs using damage shields/blocking and an opponent that notices you under this effect being able to swap measures appropriately.

As far as snares, yeah, the overall removal of them do diminish the idea.

Kartalin wrote: »

An AOE root & snare, and an AOE stun are things left to 5 piece set bonuses or slotted abilities. Definitely OP if we could source those via potions. We can already get similar effects on one target via a poison which forces us to forego an enchantment.

While it would be nice to have a couple more viable sources of oblivion damage, a complicated potion probably isn’t the answer either. And I would imagine that damage would have to be capped like other sources to prevent abuse.

The damage cap there would be the 1/8th overall reduction in damage (I assume oblivion damage is still halved in PvP), and then it takes the persons build into account, favoring more for high-damage builds/combos than low-damage builds to better fit with the idea of shieldbreaking.

As far as an AoE root + Snare/AoE stun, there's already precedent that potion effects can be more powerful than skill effects: the 43.5m meter increase to stealth detection (ambiguous as to being radius or diameter) and subsequent 12s of reveal on detect pots vs the 8m+3s/3sprevention of skills like magelight, 8m+5s/4sprevention of Hunter or 10m stationary + 5s/4sprevention. These all do have side-benefits, but all do have a cost. The potion use also has opportunity cost, and a long cooldown.

So I don't think it too out there to have significant effects.

Turtle_Bot · March 17

The oblivion damage one does seem very strong, even with a 1/8th damage cap. Imagine ball groups with their 15k+ effective power (combination of damage, pen, crit, etc) now dealing all their damage as oblivion damage that ignores all armor, block and shields.

In saying that, there definitely needs to be more options for potions/poisons. Some additional options for enchantments would be neat too.

Even simple things like named buffs/debuffs, or increase specific damage types (to match enchantments that grant resistant to specific damage types), or maybe single target or AoE damage, like the slottable champion points. Even non-combat effects like buffs to fishing, thieving, harvesting, bartering or companions would be neat.