PvP player perspective on why PvP players kill friendly "questers" / PvE geared players.

katanagirl1 · February 27

I was in IC last night just finishing up the kill 500 foes Pursuit and ran into a few players of a different alliance, most left me alone and I made sure I was killing mobs somewhere away from them. I turned a corner around a building and came face to face with a crouched AD player who seemed to be hunkering down, so I blew past them in lightning form and let them be on their way.

In Elven Gardens I saw a couple more AD players who weren’t together, so I left them and went on killing mobs. Later though, they teamed up and attacked me while I was finishing off a small group of mobs, but they were hitting me from different directions and I was unable to take on everyone so they ended up killing me.

I still won’t kill them on sight, they have to attack me first, which is why those two were able to take advantage of the situation.

Oblivion_Protocol · February 27

I kill everyone I see. Points are points, and PvP means everybody consents to potentially getting run through by virtue of entering the zone and engaging with it.

aetherial_heavenn · February 27

Arrow312 wrote: »

Does some pve Players really think that "WE" pvpers wait in Queue for dunno hours just to run to the next Quest giver Spot and then wait there for some pve Players Just to kill them and get the 600AP?

The OP makes a fair point. And there are quest turn in options that don't require players to leave their home base. (Fighters guild NPC at home base, don't forget to add a skill point to be able to turn in bounties. There's a 'how to' thread on forum.)

Personally, if in a hurry because I haven't been able to log in and I have 7 mins to get tickets, I just make some invis pots, put on some 5 year old sets and go Bruma when it's blue on w/e camp and do a chapel quest. Or if I have a bit more time, help turn it blue when it's lit for a super quick turn in and decent AP for ten mins play.

But if I really want AP I run in full PvP gear on my PvP character and earn 100k an hour on support, solo. 250k or so with a good group. Quest turn in campers are either desperate to post shiny KBs to their little friends, or are PvEers in my considerable experience.

*see my sig*

React · February 27

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

The answer is simple, they do this because they are not skilled enough to kill other PvP players, they attack a PvE player because the PvE player is ill-equipped to fight back so for them it is something easier, more catered to their skill level.

If you admit to doing this you're also admitting that your not good at fighting.

I love doing this

SeaGtGruff · February 27

Nathanbreakfast wrote: »

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

If I'm in a town to do the quests there, rather than to capture or defend it, I have gotten to where I remove all of my armor as well as my weapon. I wear all heavy armor on my PC NA main, and mostly heavy armor (5 plus 1 medium and 1 light) on my PC EU main, so removing all of my armor just makes it easier to sneak around the guards. It also has the secondary benefit of trying to let enemy players know that I'm just there to quest, not to capture or defend the town.

This makes you a traitor to your faction. The penalty for treason is death.

I have freely given my life for my alliance on the battlefield many, many more times than I have commited treason by running around naked in town, which makes the scales of justice heavily weighted in favor of being able to run around naked in town a few more times. Grand Warlord Dortene might not approve of my (lack of) attire, but I have a deck of "Get Out of Treason for Running Around Naked in Town Free" cards, each loving autographed by High King Emeric himself, whose life I have saved more than once, and whose soul I brought back from the Far Shores so that he might live again.

Amottica · February 27

First, that group of wannabes are not likely to read this thread as those in the forums are a very small portion of the player base.

Even if such a wannabe read this thread they would not heed it since the thought that ran through the mind of those players was that they might finally get to kill an enemy player.

For myself, I have never attacked another player in a questing area unless they attacked me or a member of my alliance who was doing quests. I will protect my alliance members in such situations. I have a thing about someone taking advantage of such a situation as there is no glory in such a kill.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · February 27

SilverBride wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

The answer is simple, they do this because they are not skilled enough to kill other PvP players, they attack a PvE player because the PvE player is ill-equipped to fight back so for them it is something easier, more catered to their skill level.

If you admit to doing this you're also admitting that your not good at fighting.

How is a player supposed to look at another player and KNOW if they are a PvP player, or a PvE player, or how geared and skilled they are?

PvP players may do quests, too. Just because they are questing doesn't mean they are an underskilled and undergeared PvE player.

Well if they are doing questing why would they be attacking other players? for one they will run directly at you, usually self-buffing before they reach you.

It is pretty obvious.

Turtle_Bot · February 27

aetherial_heavenn wrote: »

Quest turn in campers are either desperate to post shiny KBs to their little friends, or are PvEers in my considerable experience.

This has been largely my experience as well (especially in Cyrodiil).

Something else I have noticed (and done myself) is when questers call out quest campers in the towns, then PvP players tend to go to the towns to protect the questers (at least until they're needed for actual PvP elsewhere on the map).

It's been the same (in my experience) for all of the aspects of this game (and irl), there will always be a toxic few that need to get their jollies by punching those who can't fight back. It's not something exclusive to PvPers or PvP in general. Fortunately, in ESO (Cyrodiil) at least, there tends to also be a lot of players who will fight back against this type of behaviour.

Muizer · February 27

@FlameDark Very elegantly put.

Do agree with @spartaxoxo about camping entry points and same goes for quest givers and objectives. That's not desirable behaviour I'd say. If I were a game designer, I'd consider that a problem. I'm not though (other than modding in another game) and I don't see a simple solution here.

ApoAlaia · February 27

As a 'quester', who does IC dailies every day and does Cyro town quests most days (unless I can get a favourable scouting quest) during Mayhem and doesn't bother bringing an adequately geared char unless I am planning on PvDooring I operate under the assumption that being seen is being dead.

The moment I wind my neck up to complete an objective or hand in a quest (in town) I know that I'm a sitting duck.

Therefore I don't get upset if someone takes me out. Other players are not mind readers or prescient so ultimately I am a potential future [minor] inconvenience that they can quite easily remove from the board, and they get a small amount of change for their efforts.

If someone is camping the quest givers, I just switch campaigns, come back later, hope for a decent scouting mission or take a FG daily instead.

colossalvoids · February 27

I honestly don't see an issue with anything but people who deliberately going out of their way to camp for pve peeps on events avoiding pvpers at the same time. Other than that it's easily understandable and not really worth paying attention personally, that's a pvp zones so people would do the thing one way or another if seeing the opportunity.

SilverBride · February 27

I don't understand why anyone would expect not to be attacked in a PvP zone. Especially now with the event and the PvP centered Golden Pursuits.

Three of the Pursuits are to complete quests in these towns. Because of this these towns are frequently being attacked and taken over so their faction can do the quests. Players should expect that.

I had a hard time with these too because almost every time I would try to complete and turn in a quest another faction would come and take the town. So I just found a campaign with very few players in it and completed them there. But I did not feel like these other players were wrong for attacking me in a PvP zone.

Arrow312 · February 27

SilverBride wrote: »

I don't understand why anyone would expect not to be attacked in a PvP zone. Especially now with the event and the PvP centered Golden Pursuits.

Three of the Pursuits are to complete quests in these towns. Because of this these towns are frequently being attacked and taken over so their faction can do the quests. Players should expect that.

I had a hard time with these too because almost every time I would try to complete and turn in a quest another faction would come and take the town. So I just found a campaign with very few players in it and completed them there. But I did not feel like these other players were wrong for attacking me in a PvP zone.

in nearly 10 years every MYM the same threads come up. This game needs more players like you who accepted what it is. It is a PvP event where it is possible to get killed.

1.) campers sxcks i dont like this but nobody of us can do anything against.
2.) IC and Cyro are PvP Zones this means of course you can be attacked or killed
3.) Many PvE Players run with the zerg and get the AP and finish the quests so this is ok but when they get killed oh those PvP Players farms PvE Players.
4.) there are more then enough campaigns over the event why most of the PvE Players log into GH?

CalamityCat · February 27

As others have said, it's not always obvious who is just a PvE player doing quests, or who can actually fight. Or whether the group of apparently friendly questors will join in against you should a more capable PvPer show up from their side.

I left a player alone in IC yesterday, they were obviously doing a quest so I just went back out the end of the street... next thing they give chase, attack and I'm swiftly killed lol. Other times I've done town quests in Cyro and everyone is chill even when fights do break out. You never know what sort of response you'll get in Cyro/IC!

In IC especially, solo players can often be deadly. So I think it's understandable that some players attack first. I would never intentionally give a player a bad experience though. I doubt I'm the only PvPer who targets the nasty gankers though.

A little tip especially for IC - if you do find a player jumps you while you're questing, try and run towards an area where other players in your alliance might see you and join the fight. If you have to separate from those in your alliance to do a quest, keep your buffs and a HOT up and be on your heal bar ready to heal when (not if) you get attacked. Then you might be able to run towards others in your alliance who can help. It doesn't always work, but try to be aware where those players are and head that way. Cut through buildings or behind terrain so you are a little harder to target/chase. When it works, try and do some damage to your attacker and get some of their tel var. Killing someone who thought you'd be their easy target is just so so satisfying!

I like to always have a group heal like echoing vigor so if I get into a fight with others in my alliance, I can heal them and that gives us all a better chance of winning. Even if you're playing by yourself, heal/buff players in passing and help them stay alive. Otherwise if they die, that enemy is likely to pick on you next. The more of your alliance who are alive, the safer you are. Don't think PvP is just about being able to fight players, being even a noob healer can really help and be satisfying.

Elvenheart · February 27

moo_2021 wrote: »

Thumbless_Bot wrote: »

If I knew farming for columbine in cyro was as mundane as farming for columbine in Deshaan it would be less enjoyable. The mere fact that you can be attacked at any time is one of the most enjoyable parts of pvp in this game.

no it's not. It's a warzone not a horror show. I don't want to keep my buffs up all the time and treat everyone like crazy serial killers.

Once when I was riding in an empty campaign, 3 guys intercepted me and dragged me down from my indrik. I almost had a heart attack and immediatedly transformed in panic. Though a few seconds later 2 were already dead and the third hid behind rock, unaware that I can see through objects as vamp. Then I stabbed him to death in rage.

It was not nice.

A vampire Scion transforms and slaughters three in a rage, and it’s not a horror show? 🤣 🧛‍♂️

Way to go turning the tables on them, btw. I bet they weren’t expecting that!

LPapirius · February 27

Look. There are additional campaigns added during the PvP events that allow PvE players go into those camps that are essentially deserted and do the town quest. Pick the one that has your colors population advantage and to to that camp. The town quests take, on average, less than 5 minutes. So that's two tickets for less than 5 minutes effort. You just have to buck up and set foot in a PvP zone that might have 40 players total including all 3 factions in it.

There are extra campaigns in IC too during the event. Find a campaign that has your color's pop advantage and go there and do a daily real quick. This will also only take 5-10 minutes. You might get killed, but more likely you can just run by other opposing factions players who just want to be left alone and do the daily quest just like you do.

There is no reason for all this "PvE players are victimized by having to enter a PvP zone" when in fact they don't even have to PvP or in many cases not even see another player of an opposing faction the whole time they get their tickets.

Grizzbeorn · February 27

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Heelie wrote: »

I can not think of a single time recently where I let a PvE player live, and that they didn't attack me as soon as they saw an opportunity to do so.

This is accurate.

No. It is not.

You speak as though every PvE player will attack you as soon as you turn your back.
That just isn't true.

Zama666 · February 27

PVP zone as was mentioned - fair game.
Join a guild or use the zone chat to get help.
That is the game.

Tommy_The_Gun · February 27

From my observation there is also another reason why sometimes people of 3 different factions can "ignore" eachother & peacefully do questing, but sometimes out of nowhere they begin to fight.

Allaiance guard NPCs. Very often they are too close to the quest giver NPC, so if the city is controlled by different Allaiance, those guards will attack "enemy" players. And if that happens it takes very little to one actual player to panic & attack them too... and then chaos spreads like a wildfire...

But it is not always like this. Most of the time it is just ganker or gankers or even an actual "ball group" that just abandon actual PvP and they specifically chose to grief & troll questing hubs. It even happens on "empty" campaigns when there is only 1 faction playing.

Delimber · February 27

I don't attack questers unless they strike first.
However, at a Keep or rss, everyone is a fair target.

In IC, I tend to leave others alone, unless they are ganking the easy marks. Then it's a fun game of gank the ganker....that is a good time.

But there are days when you just gotta go after the mob that's boss farming in the city lol.

But in closing, I don't think they ever should have made the towns capture points. They don't count for anything, and only Bruma serves and real positional advantage.

Vonnegut2506 · February 28

I for one am grateful to the PvP players that will attack PvE players. I do a quest turn in for Bruma, go outside, and in less than 10 seconds some PvP player will come by and steamroll me giving me a free port back to base. Thank you, sweaty free transportation guy.

JemadarofCaerSalis · February 28

SilverBride wrote: »

I don't understand why anyone would expect not to be attacked in a PvP zone. Especially now with the event and the PvP centered Golden Pursuits.

Three of the Pursuits are to complete quests in these towns. Because of this these towns are frequently being attacked and taken over so their faction can do the quests. Players should expect that.

I had a hard time with these too because almost every time I would try to complete and turn in a quest another faction would come and take the town. So I just found a campaign with very few players in it and completed them there. But I did not feel like these other players were wrong for attacking me in a PvP zone.

I have no issues with that (it happened to me several times) but just today, I needed one more ticket before I am finished with the event (so I end with 12 for the next event) and went to cropsford, which my alliance had. There were two people from a different alliance there killing everyone they saw. I know they were camping because they had perfect opportunities to take over the town, but seemed to have been very careful about doing so (as I could respawn in that town everytime I died).

Went to Vlastarius (or however it is spelled) and there was at least one person from another alliance doing the same thing to THAT town, and again, it wasn't listed as being attacked. Fortunately that person wasn't as efficient as the ones in Cropsford, so I got the quest done.

I wish there was something that could be done about that, so that campers couldn't just camp spawn points or quest givers.

I also thought of perhaps having an personality or polymorph (this isn't a serious suggestion) where it would show the player walking around with hands up and the player could neither attack nor be attacked. They could still talk to people, so they could turn in quests or get them, and perhaps interact with the world (maybe even kill NPCs or monsters but just not be able to attack players). To combat the issue of them turning around and attacking players, the personality/polymorph couldn't be removed unless they were in a 'safe zone' such as their alliance base. So, once they leave the base, it was on until they went back. They also couldn't just toss it on in the middle of a fight to heal or run away. (it would also make it extremely obvious who was just there for questing or getting skyshards etc..)

That way people who just want to do quests could do so, and not be attacked, but they also couldn't attack other players.

kind_hero · February 28

IMO it is a problem of design... Why would you want people who don't want to PvP, doing quests and whatnot in a PvP area, where chances to get into fights with PvP players is high? The closest answer is that developers want more people to do certain content, PvP in this case. Carrot on a stick...

I don't think it is fun for a regular pvp player to defeat pve players totally unfamiliar to pvp combat. Probably you feel good for a few times, than it's just very predictable, like dealing with overland pve mobs. So, why would the devs want to do this? I am not good at pvp, I don't have the gear and cp setup for that, so for me it is frustrating to do the required quests for tickets and golden.

For example: as a DC player, it is a time investment to get to Cheydinhal or Cropsford to do those quests. It is very very annoying to be killed there, while the closest blue keep is across the map. Especially, when I have no real desire to be there, besides the artificial goal post set by the devs with their golden rewards system. I completed all the Cyrodiil quests years ago. To do that I took all sorts of precautions: I entered in low population campaigns at low activity hours, or got into campaigns where my faction would dominate the map completely. But during these events, such planning is impossible.

Sure, I could skip the rewards, none really forces me, but you know what I mean. This system of events try to push people in doing content they wouldn't really do. I am not sure who benefits from that other than lead devs who want to show the game is quite active.

ElvenOverlord · February 28

This is why I just avoid pvp altogether that way there will be no ignorant assumptions made about me or what I may do. I never attack anyone in pvp unless attacked first and I never join in on a beat down. But whether a PvPer is toxic or just falsely assume I’ll third party them, the result is the same: a horrible experience and me not being able to quest. So I avoid it altogether.

necro_the_crafter · February 28

I also have a funny anecdot that happened to me right now
PC EU, Evergloam
Went to capture vlastarus, started with central flag.
First guy with start spaming snipes on me only for his 3 friends to join after, I retaliated and killed them, they resed in vlas and attack me once again. After second attempt when I finished them, one of them starded PMing about how I have 0 brains to kill PvE players.

I sent this guy combat logs that shows that they attacked first and he just blocked me. Nice.

Here first guy attacking me

second buddy join in for the brawl

third buddy join

one of quester got colloteral damage from my FoO

after wich he decided that he gona fight me back while i dealing with guards

And here is the PM

So yeah, I mean, that what Cyrodiil is about, territorial conflict.
I want vlastarus for set merchant, you want it for a questing, and our interests clash in a battle, and power would decide whos interests should prevail. Thats is the basic premise of eso PvP. That is why they attacked me, and why I retaliated. Thats fun.

But why do you have to remind me that you are PvE player? should I stand still when you gang on me and accept my fate because you are quester?

WaywardArgonian · February 28

SilverBride wrote: »

How is a player supposed to look at another player and KNOW if they are a PvP player, or a PvE player, or how geared and skilled they are?

Simple: if they spam Critical Rush on you, they are a PVE'er.

DestroyerPewnack · February 28

Filthy ganker here...
I spent a few good hours ganking PvE players at the villages. It was the funniest thing ever.
One time I was ganking 3 PvE players. I killed the first two, but I was 1 HP by the time I turned to kill the third. He just held block and didn't finish me off. So, I let him live. Other than that, I killed every single player on sight.
My favorite time of the year, to be honest.

I understand it's probably frustrating for PvE players, so here are some recommendations:

1. Skip the event. 99% of this game is PvE, and there is plenty of other things to do.

2. Go in a group, guild or otherwise, preferably with PvP veterans who can watch over you. Most decent PvP players can quickly finish off gankers, and can keep other actual PvP players occupied while you finish your quests.

ApoAlaia · February 28

DestroyerPewnack wrote: »

Filthy ganker here...
I spent a few good hours ganking PvE players at the villages. It was the funniest thing ever.
One time I was ganking 3 PvE players. I killed the first two, but I was 1 HP by the time I turned to kill the third. He just held block and didn't finish me off. So, I let him live. Other than that, I killed every single player on sight.
My favorite time of the year, to be honest.

I understand it's probably frustrating for PvE players, so here are some recommendations:

1. Skip the event. 99% of this game is PvE, and there is plenty of other things to do.

2. Go in a group, guild or otherwise, preferably with PvP veterans who can watch over you. Most decent PvP players can quickly finish off gankers, and can keep other actual PvP players occupied while you finish your quests.

Not sure why but your post reminded me of:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4dn76ZPt_Y0

Calastir · February 28

DestroyerPewnack wrote: »

Filthy ganker here...
I spent a few good hours ganking PvE players at the villages. It was the funniest thing ever.
One time I was ganking 3 PvE players. I killed the first two, but I was 1 HP by the time I turned to kill the third. He just held block and didn't finish me off. So, I let him live. Other than that, I killed every single player on sight.
My favorite time of the year, to be honest.

I understand it's probably frustrating for PvE players, so here are some recommendations:

1. Skip the event. 99% of this game is PvE, and there is plenty of other things to do.

2. Go in a group, guild or otherwise, preferably with PvP veterans who can watch over you. Most decent PvP players can quickly finish off gankers, and can keep other actual PvP players occupied while you finish your quests.

"Ha ha bullying funny"

It baffles me every time someone thinks this way.

DestroyerPewnack · February 28

Calastir wrote: »

"Ha ha bullying is funny"

It baffles me every time someone think this way.

Where as I am baffled by how soft some of our fellow community members are.
If someone dies in a vet HM dungeon, do we say the boss is bullying them? No. We say they are underprepared for the activity they're trying to attempt.
Killing players in a PvP zone is not bullying. If they are underprepared for the requirements of that activity, that is their fault, and their fault alone.