Class combination prediction for BG 4v4/8v8 Play for win setup

bladenick · September 14

for U44 new BG, the 4v4 and 8v8 is looks like more or less play for win oriented, and pre-made team get same query as solo, it looks the premade team shall be the dominate
Once play for win, just want to make some paper disccustion of class combination stragegy before U44, what class shall be the most pop if play for win in new BG mode.

My estimation, as currently, sorc get best mobility, best consistant dmg, and meanwhile can tanky... it overwhelming other class, as for other cannot get DPS and tanky at same time.

For premake quene BG, I suppose 3 sorc + 1 healer(4v4) or 6 sorc + 2 healer(8v8) may best/easiest play for win setup? as for current BG we get 3 faction, even the lose side canbe funny.. but i believe not the case for 4v4/8v8 as there only 2 faction.

Kartalin · September 14

nah, 8 man team gets into ball group territory. NB puller/lead, 2 warden deeps, dk deeps, arc rapids/shields, 3 healers/shielders (incl 1 necro and at least 1 sorc).

belial5221_ESO · September 14

You can only queue as 4 man group for either,so you'll get a random 4 others in the 8man one.I tihnk you shouldn't have premades at all,since it makes it unfair,but then it would make it longer for queues.Also with AI,they could have itpair premades when possible,and keep groups about the same level to even it out some.

Kartalin · September 14

You can still comp out a 4 man with ball group strats, it's still stack and burn. Just have to be a little more picky with gear sets and dividing up roles.

SkaraMinoc · September 14

3 bash builds + 1 healer all running group sets and skills with callouts

There was a streamer on PC EU that ran this comp in Cyrodiil for fun and the single target damage was incredibly high. The problem is finding 3 players not only willing to play bash builds but who can also play them effectively.

CameraBeardThePirate · September 17

Sorcs are S tier for solo queue, but in a 4 man, they don't even make the cut. They have very little buff coverage, a bad damage synergy ability, and basically 0 off heals as a dps.

Typically the best 4 man groups will be at least 1 Warden, 1 Arcanist (for Fulminating), 1 DK (great synergies with Talons and Banner, plus giving everyone Sorc/Brut), and another DPS class (usually Nightblade, or another DK).

Even if you were to make a comp with Sorc (probably to get a Negate), you would never stack 3 sorcs. You'd probably never stack 3 of any class, because you need to have different group buff and synergy coverage.

Kartalin · September 17

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

Sorcs are S tier for solo queue, but in a 4 man, they don't even make the cut. They have very little buff coverage, a bad damage synergy ability, and basically 0 off heals as a dps.

Typically the best 4 man groups will be at least 1 Warden, 1 Arcanist (for Fulminating), 1 DK (great synergies with Talons and Banner, plus giving everyone Sorc/Brut), and another DPS class (usually Nightblade, or another DK).

Even if you were to make a comp with Sorc (probably to get a Negate), you would never stack 3 sorcs. You'd probably never stack 3 of any class, because you need to have different group buff and synergy coverage.

I think you have it correct with that combination. Dps nightblade calling the shots and using rush of agony, arc for shields and support (Arkasis and powerful assault?), DK can pull double duty with damage and some healing (dmg set and rallying?), warden with the strongest AOE coordinated burst and running polar wind as a backup heal.

In order to get a sorc in there for a negate maybe swap out nb puller for sorc, but I think the nb dmg will be more useful and needed. Probably no place in 4 person group for a dedicated sorc support/healer as fulminating would be more useful than lightning flood. Might could sneak in a necro dps instead of warden for the boneyard, colossus, and blastbones but that would be a hard choice over the more reliable delayed burst of shalks.

Udrath · September 17

8v8 solo que and first match is you with 7 squishy nightblades vs pre-made. Can’t wait 😂

silky_soft · September 19

Besides moving away from 3 teams, watching 1 team lose half their players once they realise they won't win being a bad idea.

Don't under estimate there being a game with 16 flappy bird socrs or a game with 16 turtles.

The high count nb one sounds like fun, because people will actually die. No bs forever HoT cross healing.

They need to buff defile and cost increase poisons to their original levels for this to work. Add more sources of healing absorption.

H_E · November 1

optimal group is 4 sorcs or 7 sorcs and a cro

bladenick · November 2

H_E wrote: »

optimal group is 4 sorcs or 7 sorcs and a cro

@H_E
Any practice? I just speculate, never try after U44

xylena_lazarow · November 2

I don't think they're mashing premades into the solo queue (yet) but there are a lot of comp group players bringing their minmax ball group builds (i.e. RoA bombers and Arkasis healers), these guys are pretty good at the ball group thing and it's not that hard a playstyle to begin with, so when they get put on the same BGs team, surprise they're a ball group.

evLRise · November 3

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

I don't think they're mashing premades into the solo queue (yet) but there are a lot of comp group players bringing their minmax ball group builds (i.e. RoA bombers and Arkasis healers), these guys are pretty good at the ball group thing and it's not that hard a playstyle to begin with, so when they get put on the same BGs team, surprise they're a ball group.

Playing a ball group build is useless when you're solo so do yourself a favor and ignore this bait guys.

That aside, best comps to try are along the lines of:
1. NB
2. DK
3. Arca
4. Warden

Mix of pressure and burst OR

1. Warden
2. Warden #2
3. Warden #3
4. Plar with CC and purges

Full burst comp with northern storm and nova.

There are some 4-man groups trying the Rush of Agony / Plaguebreak pull and pop thing. It's really unoptimal for 4-man and will only work against people where you didn't even need those sets anyway.

xylena_lazarow · November 3

evLRise wrote: »

Playing a ball group build is useless when you're solo so do yourself a favor and ignore this bait guys.

Not in the 8v8 it isn't. In the 4v4 solo you end up next to a 17k hp Arcanist wearing Pale Order anyway.

evLRise · November 3

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Not in the 8v8 it isn't. In the 4v4 solo you end up next to a 17k hp Arcanist wearing Pale Order anyway.

If only people knew how to read:

evLRise wrote: »

will only work against people where you didn't even need those sets anyway.

Also, please play ballgroup builds in BGs and see how well you do with:
- No Resistances
- No Solo Heals
- No Sustain
- No Brutality / sorcery buffs.
- No damage.

I'd be so happy to get matched against solo people wearing ballgroup builds every single game.

And dying vs RoA bombers in BGs = skill issue.

xylena_lazarow · November 3

evLRise wrote: »

I'd be so happy to get matched against solo people wearing ballgroup builds every single game. And dying vs RoA bombers in BGs = skill issue.

Have you played the 8v8? Also wild guess, they tweak their ball builds for this game mode. Nobody is dying to RoA in a hardcore 4v4 but I watch plenty of players get pulled and VD'd by idiotic gear sets automating gameplay in the 8v8. Optimizing for entering a chaotic environment with randoms is not the same optimizing a 4 person premade.

MarioMario · November 4

3x
-40k khajiit health warden
-Rallying / powerful / olorime-spc ice staff back bar
-Acuity front bar nirnho/sharp dual axes
-Balorgh ms

1x
-40k health imperial support dk/plar
-Arkasis ice staff back bar
-Rush of agony front bar
-Symphony MS

DEFENSE

Wardens sitting in backbar, keeping up echoing vigor, and timing deep fissure to keep a bit of pressure, spamming polar at occurrence. One warden should slot major resolve, others slot damage shields from scribe.

Support using scribe major heroism, scribe shield, scribe minor resolve + minor protection, major sorcery/brutality.

You don't need many skills so you can slot major protection both bar all group.

Scribe shield scale on max health so have fun trying bursting them.

OFFENSE

When northern storm is up, agony pulls + CC into 3x full buffed and 100% crit northen storms + delayed chilling contingency + 70% class signature snare.

(You can be creative with CC on a agony stack, from turn evil to timing volcanic rune, class skills, scribe skills, dawnbreaker etc)