Ithelia's Ending SPOILER

ArchMikem · June 21

Ithelia's Banishment, a Nirn without Magic
So. Just finished the Story.

I kinda wanted to go thru the portal after her? Ithelia went to a world that is completely mundane. No Magicka at all means no Oblivion, no Aetherius, no Daedra. The non existence of Magic means Nirn's creation theory cannot exist. Would the World still have all the same Races? Argonians were created by the Hist, a magical entity. Elves are descendant from Aldmer, who claim created by the Aedric Et'ada, magical entities. With Magic simply non existent, does Evolution come into play? Are Humans the only Race in a mundane Nirn, or was Ithelia sent to a Nirn completely devoid of life? Was she sent to a Nirn at all if there weren't any Aedra to create it?

Or perhaps after Nirn was created, the hole to Aetherius was never made by Magnus and so Magic never poured out into the Mundus, which could explain its absence, but still imply Magicka exists SOMEWHERE in the Aurbis.

I just really don't want to imagine a fate where Ithelia willingly stepped thru a portal to a void. A Reality without Magic, and since all of Elder Scrolls creation depended upon Magic, without it nothing would exist. Reality might exist, but nothing physical. Just empty space.

<edited title for spoiler>

tsaescishoeshiner · June 21

If I remember right, she was sent to a place where specifically her Daedric magic couldn't reach her--it's established earlier in the quest that her power has to try and locate her, and seems to sort of be running around in search. (That could be somewhat metaphorical, of course.)

During the Outcast Inn quest, she seemed almost weary of the power and pressures on her, and I partly expected the quest to end in a way where she gave up her power to live a mortal life (assuming they could explain that working).

The Many Paths show different versions of the Aurbis we recognize--not entirely different kinds of realities altogether. So I wonder what place in some reality there could be where her Daedric power couldn't reach her?

If the Many Paths show different timelines based on slightly different events, what causes or allows events to be different in the first place? If she was sent to some reality where there was no variation in events, would her power be able to exist there? Were she and Mora able to send her somewhere outside the Many Paths? Would that essentially mean splintering off a reality where there aren't multiple realities lol? Or at least, no connection to the Many Paths, so that they practically don't exist?

Or would that not matter, because without her original Daedric power, any accumulation of magic power would still become incorporated into her will and connection to the Many Paths? Are the Many Paths connected to Akatosh (or similar powers in different mythologies) establishing linear time? Eh who knows.

Or ... is there some Exaurbic Lobby of lost/exiled entities where they exist without power?

My main hesitation in hypothesizing too much is wondering whether this was meant as a bit of a cliffhanger or question we'll return to.

Necrotech_Master · June 21

it might make sense to include a spoiler mention in the title lol

that said, i personally feel like they didnt hardly touch on anything related to ithelia, the only real ithelia related part of west weald at all was the outcast inn, that was basically the entirety of the lore we got

we literally were just introduced to ithelia as well and they already shipped her off to nonexistence basically, kind of makes all of the major hype over the past year kind of for nothing if they dont bring up or continue her story in some way

RaddlemanNumber7 · June 21

I thought this was a Yellow Brick Road/Wizard of Oz reference. At the end of the story, having travelled the road and discovered her own capabilities, Dorothy teleports herself to Kansas, where there are undoubtedly no witches or evil flying monkeys.

I'm sure there are people here who will tell us that Kansas is not a bad place to live

ArchMikem · June 21

My thread title was actually Modded because it's a spoiler? The content is now available for everyone and it's been almost a business week for Consoles. Where in the rules does it state the time window until content stops being spoilers?

And it was literally just left as "Ithelia". Could've at least given my thread title a little more context as to what the topic is about.

Rkindaleft · June 25

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

that said, i personally feel like they didnt hardly touch on anything related to ithelia, the only real ithelia related part of west weald at all was the outcast inn, that was basically the entirety of the lore we got

we literally were just introduced to ithelia as well and they already shipped her off to nonexistence basically, kind of makes all of the major hype over the past year kind of for nothing if they dont bring up or continue her story in some way

I agree. It bothered me that they built all this hype around a new Prince then get rid of her as fast as she was introduced. I know this is probably the end of Ithelia based on how ZOS writes their stories, but we really needed a Q4 zone DLC like they had in the past based around Mirrormoor to build more lore for the character.

colossalvoids · June 25

ArchMikem wrote: »

My thread title was actually Modded because it's a spoiler? The content is now available for everyone and it's been almost a business week for Consoles. Where in the rules does it state the time window until content stops being spoilers?

And it was literally just left as "Ithelia". Could've at least given my thread title a little more context as to what the topic is about.

It's quite obviously was a spoiler, it's the most fresh content and will remain such for a year. It's the same every time before new piece comes, in this case a new chapter as there's no story dlc ahead. It's not available to everyone yet, it will be when on deep sale and in crown store.

Necrotech_Master · June 25

Rkindaleft wrote: »

Necrotech_Master wrote: »

that said, i personally feel like they didnt hardly touch on anything related to ithelia, the only real ithelia related part of west weald at all was the outcast inn, that was basically the entirety of the lore we got

we literally were just introduced to ithelia as well and they already shipped her off to nonexistence basically, kind of makes all of the major hype over the past year kind of for nothing if they dont bring up or continue her story in some way

I agree. It bothered me that they built all this hype around a new Prince then get rid of her as fast as she was introduced. I know this is probably the end of Ithelia based on how ZOS writes their stories, but we really needed a Q4 zone DLC like they had in the past based around Mirrormoor to build more lore for the character.

exactly

its not like molag bal, whom we just banished in the main story, he can always come back

dagon is the same way after the whole blackwood/deadlands story, he obviously can return too

ithelia they basically completely removed her, shes trapped in a dead realm, with no way to portal into it, and mora wiped everythings (to include both mortal and daedra) memory save his and yours

all we had to come back to after that was a bunch of the NPCs who just seemed very confused about what we were fighting for aside from there being "daedric incursions from an unknown realm"

i mean they also could have expanded on the background of potentially how mirrormoor and fargrave are related, or even if they are the same realm

AvalonRanger · June 30

At least, Ithelia can enjoy dringking "mead" in the other dimension world anyway.
We don't need any of magika power to brew "mead", right?

Pelanora · July 1

H. Mora is a hateful misogynistic squid who should be calamari-ed and fed to the slaughterfish

ArchMikem · July 1

Pelanora wrote: »

H. Mora is a hateful misogynistic squid who should be calamari-ed and fed to the slaughterfish

Where'd you get Misogynist from?

ragnarok6644b14_ESO · July 20

I hope they reveal Ithelia to be a lost/confused part of Meridia (hinted at in the Bladesong of Boethra iirc).

That makes a lot of sense to me (prisms, the quantum mechanics esque view of determinism, luminousness/lucentness, the rage, etc). Even her magic and themes are the same color.

This means that this part of "Meridia" mantled Magnus - leaving reality - in some way, which is also cool. This also explains why the Ayleids (whose ruins are covered in Ithelia mirrors and stuff) worshipped Meridia. Meridia is the Mirror of the Lie and Ithelia's Relic is the Mirror of Truth...

Anyways idk. It'd be neat and it would allow for a future TES to feature Meridia having a "Jygalagg" moment when Ithelia's power comes crawling back... or maybe not idk.

fall0athboy · July 30

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

I thought this was a Yellow Brick Road/Wizard of Oz reference. At the end of the story, having travelled the road and discovered her own capabilities, Dorothy teleports herself to Kansas, where there are undoubtedly no witches or evil flying monkeys.

I'm sure there are people here who will tell us that Kansas is not a bad place to live

My headcanon is basically this: Ithelia came to our world, the real world.

Syldras · July 30

ArchMikem wrote: »

Where'd you get Misogynist from?

It's astounding how often the claim of misogyny comes up when it comes to Ithelia (by different users). I've seen 5 or 6 times in different threads. I especially remember one where Ithelia's character design was criticised (as in: botched facial animations, look not fitting the usual character style of ESO, etc); the claim was that this was "typical male gamer" behaviour to insult female characters if they don't find them attractive - which was a hot take, considering that around two thirds of the discussants in that thread were female, and the reasons for criticism were clearly given (and except for one or two odd posts on 4 or 5 pages obviously not linked to beauty standards or personal attraction).

And once questioned, there's never an explanation, unfortunately (I'd be open to a discussion). I personally find it concerning, to be honest, if there are accusations of sexism (or racism, or homophobia,...) without a real basis, because if will make many people grow tired or the topic and then care less about real cases (no matter if this is "wrong", it is a known effect). Which then has a negative effect for the people concerned in the end.

ajkb78 · August 3

Syldras wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

Where'd you get Misogynist from?

It's astounding how often the claim of misogyny comes up when it comes to Ithelia (by different users). I've seen 5 or 6 times in different threads. I especially remember one where Ithelia's character design was criticised (as in: botched facial animations, look not fitting the usual character style of ESO, etc); the claim was that this was "typical male gamer" behaviour to insult female characters if they don't find them attractive - which was a hot take, considering that around two thirds of the discussants in that thread were female, and the reasons for criticism were clearly given (and except for one or two odd posts on 4 or 5 pages obviously not linked to beauty standards or personal attraction).

And once questioned, there's never an explanation, unfortunately (I'd be open to a discussion). I personally find it concerning, to be honest, if there are accusations of sexism (or racism, or homophobia,...) without a real basis, because if will make many people grow tired or the topic and then care less about real cases (no matter if this is "wrong", it is a known effect). Which then has a negative effect for the people concerned in the end.

Anyone who thinks Ithelia had botched facial expressions has clearly never tried to make a Breton character that doesn't look cross-eyed. I didn't find her to be outside the ESO norms of character weirdness at all to be honest. Agree I'd like some more lore, I guess there are constraints given nobody in future Nirn has heard of her but hopefully there's some kind of way back for her.

Syldras · August 4

ajkb78 wrote: »

Anyone who thinks Ithelia had botched facial expressions has clearly never tried to make a Breton character that doesn't look cross-eyed. I didn't find her to be outside the ESO norms of character weirdness at all to be honest.

Not sure if something has been changed meanwhile (a mod mentioned they were going to look into the issue back then), but there was clearly something not right about her character model technically. Among others, her teeth seemed to be placed weirdly in her mouth, making one quarter of them look much darker than the rest all the time (upper left it was, if I remember right), and there's also no light reflection in her eyes (not sure how else to describe it - I mean the white spot inside the pupil that every other being in ESO has). Also, ZOS has confirmed that Ithelia uses a different character model with different facial animations compared to other npcs, which is very noticeable to some people, which also leads to the feeling that she was somehow out of place.

IldaraFathryon · August 4

ajkb78 wrote: »

Syldras wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

Where'd you get Misogynist from?

It's astounding how often the claim of misogyny comes up when it comes to Ithelia (by different users). I've seen 5 or 6 times in different threads. I especially remember one where Ithelia's character design was criticised (as in: botched facial animations, look not fitting the usual character style of ESO, etc); the claim was that this was "typical male gamer" behaviour to insult female characters if they don't find them attractive - which was a hot take, considering that around two thirds of the discussants in that thread were female, and the reasons for criticism were clearly given (and except for one or two odd posts on 4 or 5 pages obviously not linked to beauty standards or personal attraction).

And once questioned, there's never an explanation, unfortunately (I'd be open to a discussion). I personally find it concerning, to be honest, if there are accusations of sexism (or racism, or homophobia,...) without a real basis, because if will make many people grow tired or the topic and then care less about real cases (no matter if this is "wrong", it is a known effect). Which then has a negative effect for the people concerned in the end.

Anyone who thinks Ithelia had botched facial expressions has clearly never tried to make a Breton character that doesn't look cross-eyed. I didn't find her to be outside the ESO norms of character weirdness at all to be honest. Agree I'd like some more lore, I guess there are constraints given nobody in future Nirn has heard of her but hopefully there's some kind of way back for her.

It's also in part that her animations for speech noticeably much less smooth than any other humanoid NPC in the game, at worst, not even matching the audio that plays.

Morvan · August 19

She was obviously sent to the Fallout universe. /s

HoffmannTheBest · September 16

Elves are descendant from Aldmer

Actually, no. The Aldmer are the ancestors of the elves, that is, the ancient elves. And they all descended from a single ancestor of elves and humans - the Ehlnofey.

According to Anuad, the Ehlnofey of Tamriel became elves, while the Ehlnofey wanderers became humans and possibly the Tsaesci.

It is also incorrect about the Hist, they are a race of intelligent trees, like those that grow in Valenwood, or the Sleeping Tree in Skyrim, or another example - the tree of the "Black Tree" company from Oblivion.
This is one of the original races that inhabited Tamriel, and not just some Argonian magic.

dazee · October 29

She actually appeared in my back yard, true story.

Ithelia's Ending **SPOILER**

Ithelia's Ending SPOILER