Maelstrom Arena Veteran Ice stage random OHKs?

Scarefish · July 24

I don't get how to get past this stage. This dungeon is somehow even harder than BRP and yet it's a solo arena. I assumed you have to stay on the ice platforms, but I keep getting shattered from random arrows anyway and it seems luck-based. I just have to hope the enemies don't choose to insta-kill me

tomofhyrule · July 24

Arena 5 is one of the most hated for a reason. Wait until Arena 7.

You need to stay on the platforms in order not to get frozen by the water. Every so often, a troll will spawn from the center and run to one of the three platforms. This troll needs to die immediately. It will start bashing one of the platforms with an interruptable channel, and if it finishes it'll break the whole platform he's on. A ranged interrupt or gap closer will help here.

There are also a lot of ranged adds that don't bother walking over. If you have a pull ability (Silver Leash or DK Chains, or the new Leashing Soul from Scribing), you can pull them into melee range. Otherwise, range them down and try to keep your shields and heals up.

The boss of the arena has a mechanic where she will break the platforms in order. It is imperative that you not try to burn her down. Push her a bit, then clean up her adds. Push a bit more, then deal with the adds. If you overburn her, you will get overwhelmed. She's designed to enrage and break the platform she's on at 75% and at 50% health, so be ready - as soon as you get close or see her turn red, get to another platform ASAP. If she shouts, she'll stun you in the water and you're done.

There's a reason the Ice arena is the one that makes it very clear that vMA is a veteran arena. But always watch for the trolls, deal with the adds, and take things kinda slowly and keep it clean.

w002exp · July 24

A lot of people don't realize the boss's mechs here are based on her health. If you burn her down too quickly you're going to trigger them all at once and have your hands full. Slow down the damage to slow to a sustainable pace. A ranged spammable makes dealing with the trolls easier. Prioritize trolls then adds before the boss. The boss herself doesn't do much damage, it's just when she breaks the ice that gets most people. She does it at set times. When her health gets to those points start thinking of which platform you need to move to. I believe she enrages (looks like she has red fire) before she breaks a platform. That's your queue to move. Once you figure her out she will no longer be tough again.

Also don't let the trolls panic you into a poor choice. You have a few seconds before they can break ice. Take care of your survival first then deal with the trolls.

BlackRaidho · July 24

Don’t believe it’s done once you make it through 😁

AnduinTryggva · July 24

Scarefish wrote: »

I don't get how to get past this stage. This dungeon is somehow even harder than BRP and yet it's a solo arena. I assumed you have to stay on the ice platforms, but I keep getting shattered from random arrows anyway and it seems luck-based. I just have to hope the enemies don't choose to insta-kill me

Yeah. It is really hard.

Ideally you have an addon that indicates health of end boss. She will at two values of her health jump into the air and destroy that platform. You have to anticipate this and move along to another. The final phase you throw your ults and everything on her to burn her down.

What is really annoying are those mages and archers. They can do quite some harm so make sure to kill them as soon as they spawn. They have their fix instances when they spawn.

Highest priority however are those trolls. As soon as one spawns in the center they will run to a platform and channel their platform destruction ability. You could in principle just interrupt and otherwise ignore them but it is much easier to run to them, interrupt them and kill them off.

I struggled so much on this arena but with practice I manage now more often than not to not die thru it. Initially I too thought it was impossible to not die in this arena but it is really practice.

What I also learned: Observe the boss what he/she does or says prior to a key mechanic (for the endboss of this arena the jump with following platform destruction). Alongside the health bar this gives precious clues on what is to come helping a lot to prepare (here: running to another platform).

This arena is really about to know what spawns when and to correctly prioritize your actions.

In addition you could try to adapt your build a bit. For instance you could slot a speed ability that helps running from one platform to another (for instance to quickly kill the troll). Alternatively you could use a gap closer like the two handed ability (I never remember these names). Or you could slot a ranged interrupt (see dual wield skill tree, that dagger) in order to interrupt the troll from a distance while you run to the platform.

There is no shame in trying and playing around a bit with skills to see what works best for you.

If you play a dragonknight you could use that shield that throws back ranged attacks. That is pretty good and I use this a lot in later stages on my dk. There is probably also a sword and board skill that can do the same, have to check.

As the adds can be quite annoying I use a lot of caltrops and aoe to burn them down. If I remember correctly some of the more annoying adds spawn quite close together (like the nyriads, archers and mages that spawn outside of the platforms). Ideally some fire and forget aoes.

fred4 · July 24

@tomofhyrule pretty much covers it perfectly, but to elaborate on the final boss:

Start off on the platform where you first spawned into the arena. I believe it has the speed sigil next to it. Keep an eye out for trolls, but only temporarily divert to another platform, if you have to. Gap closers and ranged interrupts (Crushing Shock) are both viable to deal with trolls.

At 90% of boss health, two adds spawn.

At 75% of boss health she destroys the first platform. Her shout, before she does this, is kind of subtle, and so is the animation. You will see a brief red AOE flash around her and she will go to the middle of the platform.

Move to the platform to the right, the one with the healing sigil. Turn around and focus adds as best you can, e.g. there will at least be one new Nereid, which will come close, but tends to stay on the ice. Those ranged Nerieds and ranged bow adds on the ice are nasty. They need to be focused before the boss or they can be pulled (Silver Leash, DK chains, crafted pull skill).

At 60% a bunch of more adds spawn.

At 45% (not 50%) the boss destroys the second platform. Move over to the final platform and take the damage shield sigil as you arrive (it's on that side). This will reflect ranged attacks. It may allow you to focus the boss and possibly ignore the adds.

In general this arena - definitely from round 4 onwards, e.g. the round that precedes the final boss - tests your DPS, specifically your AOE (area of effect) DPS. It's quite unlike the arenas before it in that regard. You basically need to have a skill like Flail / Fatecarver, Puncturing Sweeps, Sap Essence, Pulsar, Brawler, DK Breath, and so on. If you don't have a proper build or good damage rotation, this arena lets you know. On classes that don't heal from damage or that don't have automatic shields, the Pale Order ring is recommended.

If your DPS is too low, you may be able to compensate via a tanky setup. In other words you will need to absorb more damage due to not killing stuff fast enough. However this may be the result of a too tanky setup in the first place. It's a catch 22. It may also leave you without enough damage to execute the boss on the final platform fast enough. There is a power sigil next to that platform you could try in that case.

If your damage is marginal, then you best be systematic. You need to pay attention to mechanics and follow the guides, such as from this thread. Pay attention to the boss health, make sure you don't overburn her before the final platform, and prioritise the adds over the boss.

If your damage is high, you only need to be aware of when to move platform, e.g. for trolls and when the boss is about to shatter a platform. However, you don't need to pay attention to burning adds before the boss anymore. This is especially true, if you are an arcanist, because you can just beam through the boss and kill adds behind her at the same time. It applies to every class, though. Playing like vTrials player, leaving AOEs on the ground and applying DOTs, means you melt everything at the same time, including the boss. This makes it hard to prioritise stuff anymore.

fred4 · July 24

For what it's worth, I have a couple of videos, including builds. The following is my magplar with only basegame gear at CP800:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QWFNzazpD0

Here is my Brawlersorc. This is my tank meets DPS build, which will solo everything up to vet hardmode base game dungeons. I don't know whether it comes across, but this build is very comfortable to play. The video title refers to the fact that you can ignore mechanics, not because you burn everything quickly, but because you are so tanky it doesn't matter anymore. This build is the exception that proves the rule, e.g. a build that is extremely tanky, but still does decent damage:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_iJn2tF1YM

Dragonnord · July 24

Scarefish wrote: »

I keep getting shattered from random arrows anyway and it seems luck-based. I just have to hope the enemies don't choose to insta-kill me

There is no random anything in that stage. Besides the troll going to a random platform, everything else is always exactly the same.

IE: Adds appear on the same exact moment (after round, add wave or boss %) and at the same exact spot, always (so no random arrows).

Just learn things, times and mecs, as there is nothing random there.

Probably the only random things in Maelstrom are the poison plants on stage 7 and ghosts on stage 9. I don't recall anything else random in the whole arena.

lillybit · July 24

The one-shot arrows are telegraphed before they hit by an orange glow on your character and can be blocked - it's easy to miss when there's so much going on and taking focus but it's worth keeping half an eye out for it, it'll come in to play on other rounds too

allochthons · July 24

Skills that reflect ranged attacks can also really help with the archers. The Warden Crystallized Slab, and the One Hand and Shield skill Defensive Stance.

Not that you're going to be running a S&B under normal circumstances, but it might be useful to backbar until you learn the archers.

The advice above by the other posters is great. This fight is extremely hard, and can take a long time to learn. The first time I cleared it on vet, I just sat and breathed deep for minutes after, getting the adrenaline and shakes out of my system.

Now the fight is fairly routine for me. But I still hate it.

virtus753 · July 25

allochthons wrote: »

Skills that reflect ranged attacks can also really help with the archers. The Warden Crystallized Slab, and the One Hand and Shield skill Defensive Stance.

Not that you're going to be running a S&B under normal circumstances, but it might be useful to backbar until you learn the archers.

Slab can be very useful against range, but it doesn’t actually reflect attacks. It works like DK’s Dragon Fire Scale (mentioned above) in that it sends out a retaliatory projectile when an incoming projectile lands. For both skills, the outgoing attack scales with your own stats, regardless of the incoming damage. And the incoming projectiles still land, so they can cause significant damage or even outright kill you if they’re more powerful than your mitigation. But yes, both skills can still be helpful here, especially as Slab’s outgoing projectile stuns.

Defensive Stance properly reflects an incoming direct damage projectile. You will not take any damage from a reflected attack, which gets sent back as is to the attacker—it can even cause the attacker’s own proc sets and any related status effects to proc on themselves in a duel or PvP. As you noted, though, it comes with the tradeoff of restricting you to sword and board on that bar. It also only reflects once per cast. Spamming it isn’t a realistic option, making it more of a burst and/or single-target defense than the more sustained alternative of Slab or Scale. OP may want to experiment to find which skill they’d benefit from most.

PrinceShroob · July 25

Note that after you're left with one platform, you have about 20 seconds to finish the Matriarch off before she breaks the final platform (now only does getting hit by Iceberg Calving kill you, if you avoid it you'll die shortly to the freezing water).

One final bit of advice is to get her close to the health percentages when she's about to destroy a platform (75% and 45%) and then run to another platform to bring her down the rest of the way with a ranged attack. If done correctly, she'll start to chase you, then double back to destroy the platform. If you only start running when she's about to destroy the ice, your position can desync and you'll die to Iceberg Calving despite appearing to be nowhere near it.

Necrotech_Master · July 25

virtus753 wrote: »

allochthons wrote: »

Skills that reflect ranged attacks can also really help with the archers. The Warden Crystallized Slab, and the One Hand and Shield skill Defensive Stance.

Not that you're going to be running a S&B under normal circumstances, but it might be useful to backbar until you learn the archers.

Slab can be very useful against range, but it doesn’t actually reflect attacks. It works like DK’s Dragon Fire Scale (mentioned above) in that it sends out a retaliatory projectile when an incoming projectile lands. For both skills, the outgoing attack scales with your own stats, regardless of the incoming damage. And the incoming projectiles still land, so they can cause significant damage or even outright kill you if they’re more powerful than your mitigation. But yes, both skills can still be helpful here, especially as Slab’s outgoing projectile stuns.

Defensive Stance properly reflects an incoming direct damage projectile. You will not take any damage from a reflected attack, which gets sent back as is to the attacker—it can even cause the attacker’s own proc sets and any related status effects to proc on themselves in a duel or PvP. As you noted, though, it comes with the tradeoff of restricting you to sword and board on that bar. It also only reflects once per cast. Spamming it isn’t a realistic option, making it more of a burst and/or single-target defense than the more sustained alternative of Slab or Scale. OP may want to experiment to find which skill they’d benefit from most.

from my testing, reflecting a projectile such as defensive posture, the reflected attack is actually still treated as YOUR attack based on the combat logs, but i havent done thorough enough testing to determine if the reflected attack dmg is based on your stats, or a 1:1 of the original attack, as its very hard to tell with npcs and i havent done enough dueling tests to confirm this

because the reflected attack is still treated as you dealing the attack, i also dont know if it will make the opponent trigger their own proc sets, or if it would trigger your proc sets (not enough duel testing lol)

Desiato · July 25

nm

notyuu · July 25

The magic trick to avoid getting deleted by the arrows is knowing that for 1 second after dodge rolling you're immune to single target projectiles, use this to get close enough to the archers and break their face

vgabor · July 25

This is a stage where the fighter guild silver leash helps a lot, just pull those archers from the water to yourself, it not just gets them to solid ground instead of that water but also interrupts their channeling.