Trend of favoring ranged playstyles furthered with new DLC

AnduinTryggva · July 2

Unfortunately the trend towards favoring ranged playstyles is furthered with the new DLC. I wonder if ZOS is pursuing a long term strategy here to phase out melee weapons from the game. From an economic standpoint this is understandable as for melee weapons there are many and complicated models and textures to be created with each new style whereas staves are easier to do. But from a client perspective this is really a very very bad trend.

I have run veteran Lucent Citadel now several times. My playstyle is melee, Isimply don't like ranged play as much.

But specifically the Orphidic Shard boss is terrible for me as melee players. I constantly have to run and dodge roll. The Shard is casting shock wave so often that I spend more time dodge rolling out of it than casting a skill (that have melee range due to my melee setup).

During the two preceding boss fights I keep up with group damage and do my share of damage, also for the bosses following the shard (~10% of group damage). Despite sometimes to have to run in order to do the platforms or to avoid overlapping aoe or to kill adds.

This damage share entirely breaks down during Shard boss fight and at best I do 3% of group damage during this fight (most other dds in group run ranged). And it is NOT because of mirror mechanics. It is that insanely frequent casting of the shockwave when FINALLY dds could stack on boss and that spam of aoe that stack twice or three times from adds that require to constantly move out of melee range.

I am really getting angry on these fight designs that so overtly push towards ranged playstyles.

Ph1p · July 2

Just to get this straight: You struggle with a boss mechanic that happens every 25-30 seconds and suggest this is a sign that ZOS will "phase out melee weapons from the game", along with the respective playstyles, skill trees, and outfit options?

There is nothing in the game to support that notion: By and large, melee builds deal more damage than ranged builds and daggers are still the front bar weapon of choice for group PVE content. In trials, the group still generally stacks on the target in melee range, because that's the best way for the healers to do their job and still cover the main tank. ZOS recently even increased the range of melee to make it more viable and forgiving.

Of course, sometimes ranged setups can be better in fights that are highly mobile or frequently shift targets, especially for newer groups. For example, for vCR+3 or vAS+2, my group initially recommended ranged builds to minimize moving out of position (i.e., away from melee range of the main target!). But as the group got better, that became less relevant. In the same way, you will learn, improve, and adapt to the Shard boss mechanics.

moderatelyfatman · July 2

I haven't done any hard modes in Lucent Citadel but I've cleared it on my stamden, magDK and templar who are all melee and not had any issues. I've found the trial quite enjoyable as a melee DD overall.

But I do think that some of the newer content hard modes makes life very hard on melee builds e.g. Oathsworn Pit.

spartaxoxo · July 2

Melee builds have out damaged ranged builds for a good while now. The existence of a small amount of content that might be better in ranged doesn't make melee any less favored.

ValueDrift · July 2

In Infinite Archive stuff that forces you out of melee range for a moment is at least very common. And then there's of course Marauder Gothmau.

AnduinTryggva · July 2

Ph1p wrote: »

Just to get this straight: You struggle with a boss mechanic that happens every 25-30 seconds and suggest this is a sign that ZOS will "phase out melee weapons from the game", along with the respective playstyles, skill trees, and outfit options?

There is nothing in the game to support that notion: By and large, melee builds deal more damage than ranged builds and daggers are still the front bar weapon of choice for group PVE content. In trials, the group still generally stacks on the target in melee range, because that's the best way for the healers to do their job and still cover the main tank. ZOS recently even increased the range of melee to make it more viable and forgiving.

Of course, sometimes ranged setups can be better in fights that are highly mobile or frequently shift targets, especially for newer groups. For example, for vCR+3 or vAS+2, my group initially recommended ranged builds to minimize moving out of position (i.e., away from melee range of the main target!). But as the group got better, that became less relevant. In the same way, you will learn, improve, and adapt to the Shard boss mechanics.

Thanks for sharing your point of view.

While I can understand your argumentation I am not convinced. I will explain:

What you say applies perhaps to fix regular raid groups. Let me tell you this: I play this game I cannot remember for how long, more than five years for sure. Since FOUR years I regularly tried to get into a fix regular raid group. While I managed to get into two they fell apart shortly after because key players had new real life time constraints and no one could be found to replace them. And as a newbie to a regular vet trial group I would not feel comfortable to take over a key position. That is bad luck and I don't complain about that. With the evolution of the player base it looks like it will get harder and harder to form a regular trial group. Consequence is that I exclusively run with pugs. So I have to do with support roles that come with their gear (no complaints on them please, thanks to all tanks and heals going for pug trials!) and other dds with their personal level of understanding of the mechanics. Sometimes I do things alone that more dds should do and would do in a regular group (e.g. like killing adds or bashing fire shooters.

And as you say yourself in certain circumstances ranged is easier. I would say pugs with that kind of mechanics that we get recently more and more are just such kind of circumstances as well. And there is where my complaint goes. ZOS needs to acknowledge that pug trial runs are very common and with the evolution of the playerbase will very likely be more and more common. Beware: I do not ask to tone down difficulty level. Not at all. I am very happy with the difficulty level of vLC and I do enjoy that trial very much. What I ask is that the gap between ranged and melee should not be as large in pug runs.

sarahthes · July 2

vLC HM feels absolutely terrible on non arcanist classes. I've cleared the HM on arcanist (on pts) and am progging it on live on dk and let me tell you that second boss just feels bad.