Stamplar in PvP

notyuu · June 6

So, I tired to propperly PvP on my stamplar for the first time since U35 (I did try a few other times between now and then but never really gave it any effort cuz it was suffering) and after spending ~3 days at it my findings of trying to use a stamplar in PvP are...

-You have no defensive options at all
-You have extremely limited healing options and none of the ones from the class work well
-You can't get enemies into execution range due to jabs doing comically low damage to players
-Your mobility is not an option
-Javelin is neat
-Repentence is useless as you can't get a corpse to heal off of in the first place
-The burst skill, PoTL was getting ~5k on crit....pretty sure that isn't working as intended

so I hemmed and hawed and tinkered about, made a hybrid build, but no matter how i cut the mustard it never could kill anything under its own power (yes, using proc sets works, but that works on any class) and at best ended up an unkillable distraction/annoyance for the enemies, which is simply put, not fun to play.

and this isn't even going into the fact that sustain on templar as a whole is HORRID(only one sustain skill with a base cost of 1k/900 that only restores a flat 242/sec of 1 resource)

So simply put zos, can stamplar get some love? or at the very least some of its power back?

for referance, before U35 Stamplar had no mobility or defense, but they also had beefy levels of weapon damage thus could get by with the limited healing skills on offer and jabs actually did damage to them

Firstmep · June 6

Templar has easy access to both major and minor protection.
No healing? You mean outside of vigor, honor the dead, rune focus, living dark and purify?
We also have the best execute in the game.
Jabs dmg is kinda meh yeah, but we got plenty of tools.

notyuu · June 6

Firstmep wrote: »

Templar has easy access to both major and minor protection.
No healing? You mean outside of vigor, honor the dead, rune focus, living dark and purify?

Vigor is non class
Honor the dead is mag
Rune focus is max hp % based thus more suited to tanks
living dark is also suited for tanks
purify uses a pile of mag to cast

Firstmep wrote: »

We also have the best execute in the game.

yes, but it uses mag (also you can't get people down low enough to actually make effective use of it)

Firstmep wrote: »

Jabs dmg is kinda meh yeah, but we got plenty of tools.

No MAGPLAR has plenty of tools, STAMPLAR (which is what the thread is about) has Jabs (kek wew tier bad damage), PoTL(burst damage so low it's gotta be bugged), javelin("it just works") and repentence((no corpses to trigger it with), it needs some love... badly

BXR_Lonestar · June 6

I've been trying to make my Stamplar playable too, and I can't seem to find the magic balance it had 2-3 years ago when I was running around with Stuhn's and deadly strike, charging people, busting their armor, and bursting them down before they knew what happened. That setup still *KIND OF* worked in that I could still kill people, but he just was not survivable, and thus, I'm trying a mix of different sets to try to make him more survivable, while still having enough firepower to kill people. So far, all I can say is that it is a work in progress. If I can find a build that is half-way functional, I'll be happy, but stamina templars right now are in a bad spot, IMO, because the templar kit doesn't lend itself well to being hybridized, and there are not enough dedicated stam-spec skills.

sarahthes · June 6

notyuu wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

Templar has easy access to both major and minor protection.
No healing? You mean outside of vigor, honor the dead, rune focus, living dark and purify?

Vigor is non class
Honor the dead is mag
Rune focus is max hp % based thus more suited to tanks
living dark is also suited for tanks
purify uses a pile of mag to cast

Firstmep wrote: »

We also have the best execute in the game.

yes, but it uses mag (also you can't get people down low enough to actually make effective use of it)

Firstmep wrote: »

Jabs dmg is kinda meh yeah, but we got plenty of tools.

No MAGPLAR has plenty of tools, STAMPLAR (which is what the thread is about) has Jabs (kek wew tier bad damage), PoTL(burst damage so low it's gotta be bugged), javelin("it just works") and repentence((no corpses to trigger it with), it needs some love... badly

Every class is hybrid now.

I run vigor and other stam skills on my mag toons in PvP.

SaffronCitrusflower · June 6

Stamplar super weak in PvP and has been since they gutted it with U35. Try magplar or another class or you'll just get rolled all day in Cyrodiil.

Aurielle · June 6

notyuu wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

Templar has easy access to both major and minor protection.
No healing? You mean outside of vigor, honor the dead, rune focus, living dark and purify?

Vigor is non class
Honor the dead is mag
Rune focus is max hp % based thus more suited to tanks
living dark is also suited for tanks
purify uses a pile of mag to cast

Firstmep wrote: »

We also have the best execute in the game.

yes, but it uses mag (also you can't get people down low enough to actually make effective use of it)

Firstmep wrote: »

Jabs dmg is kinda meh yeah, but we got plenty of tools.

No MAGPLAR has plenty of tools, STAMPLAR (which is what the thread is about) has Jabs (kek wew tier bad damage), PoTL(burst damage so low it's gotta be bugged), javelin("it just works") and repentence((no corpses to trigger it with), it needs some love... badly

I agree that jabs and PoTL both need some work (jabs in particular is laughable, even when stacking weapon damage and running a full gold set of Deadly), but there’s nothing wrong with HtD and Living Dark. Sure, they use magicka, but you can still get massive heals with them, thanks to hybridization changes. I use Sugar Skulls as my food, so I seldom run into sustain issues with stamina OR magicka.

I’d personally like to see a buff to jabs and a slight nerf to Jesus Beam. It feels bad to steal kills from other players who have to do the hard work of bursting the enemy into execute range.

DigiAngel · June 6

Not to mention that execute takes an eternity compared to others, and super easy to break via line of sight.

katanagirl1 · June 7

Yeah I miss my stamplar. She used to be fun to play and strong. Now she feels like my PvE stamblade.

I never liked jabs in PvP though. No one stands still long enough for it to be useful.

Bluestin · June 7

Magplar isn't really that great either; it does have greater access to the class skills to an extent, but all of it's damage is back-loaded onto the execute. Radiant Oppression would likely do you just as well on a Stamplar as it does on a Magplar. Magplar Sweeps/Backlash is just as abysmal as Stamplar's.

After Update 35 they appear to have left Templar (The class, regardless of resource split) with most of it's damage on its execute. For me, that doesn't feel very good to play.

SmashRadiation · June 7

As a long time Stamplar player I can't help but agree that it's definitely had its fall from glory. The Hybridization update helped Stamplar a lot but by that time the class was gutted far beyond repair, especially after the jabs animation change. I've been enjoying magplar lately, albeit only using the class healing as the defining feature of Templar in the build, but it works

I just wish i could have fun on Stamplar again, the jabs yes aren't great. On the right setup i've found them manageable but ultimately, I've kinda just restored to the Wrecking Blow/D-Swing spam and it just doesn't feel fun

dinokstrunz · June 7

I don't think Templar or Stamplar specifically is in a terrible spot. Sure it's not on the same tier as Magsorc or Arcanist but it can still hold its own. Defensively templar are very strong but lack in damage. Biting Jabs damage is pretty okay just isn't reliable in a few situations such as LoSing targets and ofc the animation is pretty whack (in a bad way) compared to OG jabs.

My only gripe with templar currently is backlash and its morphs are still trash. Templar was fearsome when it was bugged and hit like a truck. It could do with some minor damage buff.

Udrath · June 7

All the damage is in beam, even on stamplar. Burning light also was nerfed alongside jabs. It used to have no cool-down, now it’s .5 seconds. Jabs used to do 4 ticks of damage now it’s 3 and clunky.

notyuu · June 7

Udrath wrote: »

All the damage is in beam, even on stamplar. Burning light also was nerfed alongside jabs. It used to have no cool-down, now it’s .5 seconds. Jabs used to do 4 ticks of damage now it’s 3 and clunky.

Which is most of the reason why stamplars has functionally no class identity ATM, which is something zos really needs to address

BXR_Lonestar · June 7

dinokstrunz wrote: »

Defensively templar are very strong but lack in damage.

This is the problem. I've geared my Stamplar out several different ways to improve sustain, and when so geared, he can go toe to toe with anyone, but those are fights that he lacks the firepower to WIN. So it's a losing battle where the best you can hope for is a draw. Power of the Light used to be something that gave you the edge so you could light up your target and hit them with enough burst, and PotL would finish them off, but now it just doesn't seem like you can stack enough damage within the small window PotL grants you to have enough damage to finish your opponent.

Instead, I find myself using the execute, which is fantastic, but not when you are in terrain where people can easily break line of sight. And to be perfectly honest, in most engagements where I AM getting kills, I feel like I'm just running around beaming people to finish them off - which is pretty much all the Stamplar can do at this point.

Like I said previously, I think the problem is that there are too many morphs that are mag/mag - meaning both morphs use magika. And the morphs that use stam are usually just "meh" compared to the mag morphs anyways.

It would be nice to have them take a second look at the Templar class kit and make some tweaks to make the stam spec more viable.

Aurielle · June 7

BXR_Lonestar wrote: »

dinokstrunz wrote: »

Defensively templar are very strong but lack in damage.

This is the problem. I've geared my Stamplar out several different ways to improve sustain, and when so geared, he can go toe to toe with anyone, but those are fights that he lacks the firepower to WIN. So it's a losing battle where the best you can hope for is a draw.

You just reminded me of something amusing.

Semi-recently, I encountered a solo Magcro while on my Stamplar. The Necro engaged.

We tickled each other for about ten minutes, exchanging our “burst” rotations to no avail … until I finally stood still and did the bow emote. He stopped as well, waved. We went our separate ways.