solo Endless Archive must have save

subarctic · December 2023

Restarting the game each time is Endless Grind, in a monotonous green/black environment with recirculated bosses. Boring, a chore.

No solo save = not playing.

Caradryan · December 2023

Yeah, I just read it might be becouse it should resemble a rouge like. Honestly 3 hours till it gets interesting is kind steep. Id like a Dev comment on this, becouse I hardly can manage 3-5h in one go in a regular week...

Tannus15 · December 2023

yup, too much of a time sink per run.
i like it but i'm not playing it because of the time commitment.

i don't care if there is a save mechanism or if some other change is made.

ZOS_Kevin · December 2023

Nothing to announce, however, we do want to pass along that the team is aware of this feedback. Thanks for sharing your perspective here as having your player experience does certainly help when discussing internally.

MidniteOwl1913 · December 2023

This was supposed to have infinite variety, it doesn't. The first sloggy arc doesn't really change. It must be endured, not enjoyed.

XSTRONG · December 2023

It does need more then a save function to make it interesting again for me.

I see no meaning spending hours in there, it was fun for 2 weeks but then its just an endless grind for nothing.

Necrotech_Master · December 2023

i still dont see a save making sense for the archive

say you were down to 2 threads, saved where you were, came back a week later, then got instantly clapped by a marauder because you didnt remember if you fought one in that arc and then made a mistake fighting the tough mobs after respawning, your run is now over after potentially 5-10 minutes, right after you spent the time running before to get to that point

if people are only interested in the harder content, or want to reduce the grind to get to the harder content, the only suggestion i could think of is some kind of arc-skip mechanic

i dont know how it would be implemented, but it would put you past the "easy" or "grind" content every run consistently to get right into the action

adding a save would not reduce the grind/progression through the first say 4 arcs, it would just delay your inevitable death (due to how the archive works, as another poster mentioned it is a "rogue-like" style, you are going to die)

i completely understand and get not wanting to rerun the first say 4 arcs to get to the challenging content if thats what you were aiming for, but a save feature wont prevent that

in other rogue-like games that use a floor system (though not all), you can usually invest your currency into upgrades which allow you to choose which floor you started on

i think something like that could be implemented for the archive

spartaxoxo · December 2023

1. Rest and education are known to generally increase performance.

2. Addictive behavior being rewarded and poor behavior being punished is not great design

3. People have lives outside of the game and not all circumstances are within a players' control

4. Being able to come back to where you left off can reinvigorate a user

5. A save has absolutely zero bearing on the ability to add a skip. The idea these are alternative solutions when they solve different issues is not a concern for me even remotely. There is absolutely zero reason both a skip and a save couldn't be implemented.

katanagirl1 · December 2023

I suggested the skip feature early on and still think it is the best mechanic to prevent excessively long runs.

The game could somehow keep track of which arc you completed last time and then start you there with a random draw of all verses or visions, whatever - sorry the lingo is not my thing - that you select before the run, so it is as if you did all the arc/stage/cycle stuff and are continuing.

I don’t see how a save would work unless it was a solo run. I don’t really like that idea as well because taking a break and trying to pick back up would probably not work well.

My disclaimer is that I personally haven’t got past the arc 2 Tho’at so I would not be someone who uses either option. My hand can’t play more than a couple of hours and it takes me that long while doing the side puzzles and looting urns.

HappyTheCamper · December 2023

The only thing I’ve enjoyed about EA (IA?) has been the random boss choices at the end of each round, but I have gone through it now 3 times and died at the end of Arc 3/beginning of Arc 4 three times. My most recent time had all repeated bosses from my first two runs.

Add pulls are lame and marauders are the worst idea in eso. Whoever came up with the idea of marauders (a ~2mil boss randomly spawning in that deals 40,000 to 50,000 in the blink of an eye) needs fired. The only thing marauders do is waste your time. If you kill them, you still have to beat the same amount of add pulls. If you die, you still have to beat the same amount of add pulls. The only difference is you get one extra piece of a mediocre class set piece.

Endless Archive needs to be restricted to 2 people. It is not solo friendly. Nothing about it respects a solo player’s time, effort, or energy. And that’s fine, when people on Reddit or the forums make this comment or complaint, the first response is always “you should run it with a friend.” Then make me. Make it so you can’t even run it solo, if the solo mode is just going to be a joke. Quit kidding the fan base in saying this is 1-2 player. It isn’t.

The moment I clear Arc 4 and get my bust, I will never set foot in this content again. It is the glass facade of content: very flashy and creative on the first few runs, but after a while it is mediocre, grindy, unrewarding, and uninspired.

Side note: I’ve ran it 3 times now, for 3 hours each, and I have 0 fragments for either the mount or pet.

Edit: so I don’t personally want it to be 2-man only. That was my bad. I just feel like it’s obvious everything about this suggests that 2-man is the only “legitimate” way of doing it. I like running it solo, and actually prefer it, but it seems there are so many issues when running solo that the only solution is “well, you need to run with a friend for a better experience.”

ESO_player123 · December 2023

HappyTheCamper wrote: »

The only thing I’ve enjoyed about EA (IA?) has been the random boss choices at the end of each round, but I have gone through it now 3 times and died at the end of Arc 3/beginning of Arc 4 three times. My most recent time had all repeated bosses from my first two runs.

Add pulls are lame and marauders are the worst idea in eso. Whoever came up with the idea of marauders (a ~2mil boss randomly spawning in that deals 40,000 to 50,000 in the blink of an eye) needs fired. The only thing marauders do is waste your time. If you kill them, you still have to beat the same amount of add pulls. If you die, you still have to beat the same amount of add pulls. The only difference is you get one extra piece of a mediocre class set piece.

Endless Archive needs to be restricted to 2 people. It is not solo friendly. Nothing about it respects a solo player’s time, effort, or energy. And that’s fine, when people on Reddit or the forums make this comment or complaint, the first response is always “you should run it with a friend.” Then make me. Make it so you can’t even run it solo, if the solo mode is just going to be a joke. Quit kidding the fan base in saying this is 1-2 player. It isn’t.

The moment I clear Arc 4 and get my bust, I will never set foot in this content again.

Side note: I’ve ran it 3 times now, for 3 hours each, and I have 0 fragments for either the mount or pet.

I'm categorically against restricting it to 2 people. I'm not planning to ever run EA with another player, but I run it daily by myself.

The mount fragments (maligraphic ichors) mostly come from completing the daily (I think I also got it as a drop once). All you need to do is grab a quest, finish Arc 1, and turn in the quest.

I agree that Marauders are a bad idea. Who though of spawning them in tiny rooms?

Braffin · December 2023

HappyTheCamper wrote: »

Endless Archive needs to be restricted to 2 people. It is not solo friendly. Nothing about it respects a solo player’s time, effort, or energy. And that’s fine, when people on Reddit or the forums make this comment or complaint, the first response is always “you should run it with a friend.” Then make me. Make it so you can’t even run it solo, if the solo mode is just going to be a joke. Quit kidding the fan base in saying this is 1-2 player. It isn’t.

In fact it is possible to have a good time solo in there. The game isn't responsible if some player's skill doesn't match their expectations.

It's absolutely nonsensical to restrict EA to 2 people, as it's already possible to run in a team (or a companion) if the solo experience is too difficult for someone. Taking away options isn't necessary at all.

A save and skipping functions would be highly appreciated tho. Adjusted (=improved) rewards for solo players could also be a nice addition.

katanagirl1 · December 2023

I’m against making this 2 player too. I have only run with another player once and I think 3 times by myself.

I can’t count on finding a friend to run it when I have time, and I’m not running it with a random player.

Ilumia · December 2023

It would be great with save function for solo.

It would also be nice with a skip option so you can start at the arc number you've previously reached solo three times or something.

I think it would be fantastic if marauders were put into those side portals, so it looks sorta like that arena woman you have to dual (except bigger rooms please), but once you pop in there and see the fire or tornado marauder you can just pop right out and aren't forced to fight and loose a thread if you can't take them, but you get the option of doing it and getting the loot if you do

AlterBlika · December 2023

HappyTheCamper wrote: »

Endless Archive needs to be restricted to 2 people. It is not solo friendly. Nothing about it respects a solo player’s time, effort, or energy. And that’s fine, when people on Reddit or the forums make this comment or complaint, the first response is always “you should run it with a friend.” Then make me. Make it so you can’t even run it solo, if the solo mode is just going to be a joke. Quit kidding the fan base in saying this is 1-2 player. It isn’t.

4-man content isn't restricted to 4 people and you can solo all of it. You can't solo only 12-man content which is trials so what's the problem with 2-man content?

Rowjoh · December 2023

katanagirl1 wrote: »

I suggested the skip feature early on and still think it is the best mechanic to prevent excessively long runs.

The game could somehow keep track of which arc you completed last time and then start you there with a random draw of all verses or visions, whatever - sorry the lingo is not my thing - that you select before the run, so it is as if you did all the arc/stage/cycle stuff and are continuing.

I don’t see how a save would work unless it was a solo run. I don’t really like that idea as well because taking a break and trying to pick back up would probably not work well.

My disclaimer is that I personally haven’t got past the arc 2 Tho’at so I would not be someone who uses either option. My hand can’t play more than a couple of hours and it takes me that long while doing the side puzzles and looting urns.

A 'skip' mechanic IS a save mechanic.

A 'save' is resuming where you left progress already completed. Skipping completed progression to uncompleted content is the same thing.

Saves work brilliantly in all forms of content. It's often the opposite of what you think when resuming after taking a long break. Take Maelstrom Arena on vet for example - when it first launched, most people including me, took breaks after struggling with the 2 trickiest rounds (Ice Rink and Poison). Coming back to it days or even weeks later acted as a complete refresh and mental re-set and we were able to breeze through it wondering how on earth we struggled for hours.

Grizzbeorn · December 2023

HappyTheCamper wrote: »

Endless Archive needs to be restricted to 2 people.

No.

You are asking that it be restricted to YOUR playstyle for everyone just because YOU don't like to run it solo.
Lots of people like or prefer to run EA/IA solo.

People need to stop making demands like this for the game.
You are not the only person for whom the game is designed.

ApoAlaia · December 2023

Would something like this work?

(I haven't played for a long, long time but I want to remember that D3 greater rifts worked a bit like this; with this I mean that this is not a marvellous idea that my big brain produced, rather something I kinda remember.)

The first time one clears arc 1 one gets a token.

That token allows one to skip arc 1 and go directly to arc 2.

The token does not need to be a 'physical' item in one's inventory; it can be tracked in the 'currency' sheet or as an achievement.

The token may or not be account-wide depending on what is perceived to be 'fair'.

The token gets updated every time one clears a higher arc, allowing one to enter the arc immediately above directly, skipping all previous arcs.

The token may or not allow entering any intermediate arcs depending on what is perceived to be 'fair'.

If is a two player party, only arc 1 or the lowest common arc can be entered; one cannot use another player's clears to cheese one's way into higher arcs.

it is still possible to start from arc 1 if one so chooses.

What do you think?

Rowjoh · December 2023

Its really very very simple.

Implement a save mechanic - exactly as in vet Maelstrom Arena and Vateshran Hollows.

Then implement improved rewards that actually benefit your character to make it worth doing in the first place, such as decent sets, a good mythic, an interesting monster helm and desirable weapon sets.

Would solve the majority of frustration, complaints and reason for not doing it, in an instant.

Munkfist · December 2023

If a skip option was ever introduced, I strongly think it should come at the cost of the Verses and Visions from any skipped content.

Don't want to run it, you don't get the perks for it. Otherwise, I think a skip over the early Arcs would be a potential upgrade.

I like the lack of a save myself, just means that when I run it again, I try to be quicker about it and streamline things more and more as I go.

Lord_Graas · December 2023

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Nothing to announce, however, we do want to pass along that the team is aware of this feedback. Thanks for sharing your perspective here as having your player experience does certainly help when discussing internally.

Maybe you will pay attention to how in the game Path of Exile they created an endless delve where you can continue progress at any time and you can move in different sections of your choice? For example, to open a new high-level section you need to spend a certain currency, which can be earned by performing activities in other parts of the game.

El_Borracho · December 2023

A save function would make EA fun to play. The novelty has worn off. Arcs 1 and 2 are not fun to play anymore, as you have to commit 20-40 minutes to get to what you really want to do. I still enjoy the challenge of the upper levels, but to get there is more of a deterrent than an incentive to play.

The save can be easily implemented. You only get it after beating Tho'at. You keep the threads you have, and no more. If you die and lose all your threads, you have the option of starting from the save point or taking your score and starting over. And the save point puts you back at the start of the Arc, not in the middle, similar to VMA.

Your score in EA is not time-dependent, unlike VMA and other arenas, so a save point doesn't impact your score or others. I suppose you could give out a bonus for score runs for players who did not save, but I don't see that as a huge issue.

Natakiro · December 2023

I played for a bit the other day for the first time, but my schedule to play isn't terribly long, so I had some fun and then hopped off, thinking it would resume when I came back. So, I instead found out that it reset everything >_> I played it again yesterday, hoping to put more time in, but life responsibilities came up and I had to go. It just feels really limiting that it doesnt have any way to enjoy this content without sinking a ton of hours nonstop into it without taking breaks. (I know this is an MMO, so it being a grindy time sink comes with the territory...)

I was hoping this would be something fun I could work on before bed on my Steam Deck, but NOPE. I only have like an hour MAX to sink into gaming in one sitting, so this is frustrating. I wish it would at least let you save after an Arc or something

This was a game mode that I thought was gonna be a nice addition and was looking forward to it, since having more non-braindead-overland content to solo is nice.

Please add a way to resume. I feel like with the way it is now, I will only bother to do it for the weekly endeavor, should it come up again.

Edit: Like right now, I just finished the first arc, but now I gotta head to the store to get some stuff and I know the game will boot me for idling by the time I get back. It's so tedious to start over AGAIN.

katanagirl1 · December 2023

Rowjoh wrote: »

katanagirl1 wrote: »

I suggested the skip feature early on and still think it is the best mechanic to prevent excessively long runs.

The game could somehow keep track of which arc you completed last time and then start you there with a random draw of all verses or visions, whatever - sorry the lingo is not my thing - that you select before the run, so it is as if you did all the arc/stage/cycle stuff and are continuing.

I don’t see how a save would work unless it was a solo run. I don’t really like that idea as well because taking a break and trying to pick back up would probably not work well.

My disclaimer is that I personally haven’t got past the arc 2 Tho’at so I would not be someone who uses either option. My hand can’t play more than a couple of hours and it takes me that long while doing the side puzzles and looting urns.

A 'skip' mechanic IS a save mechanic.

A 'save' is resuming where you left progress already completed. Skipping completed progression to uncompleted content is the same thing.

Saves work brilliantly in all forms of content. It's often the opposite of what you think when resuming after taking a long break. Take Maelstrom Arena on vet for example - when it first launched, most people including me, took breaks after struggling with the 2 trickiest rounds (Ice Rink and Poison). Coming back to it days or even weeks later acted as a complete refresh and mental re-set and we were able to breeze through it wondering how on earth we struggled for hours.

Ah ok maybe it would work for others. I might find it difficult to restart without the earlier arcs warmup.

HappyTheCamper · December 2023

ESO_player123 wrote: »

HappyTheCamper wrote: »

The only thing I’ve enjoyed about EA (IA?) has been the random boss choices at the end of each round, but I have gone through it now 3 times and died at the end of Arc 3/beginning of Arc 4 three times. My most recent time had all repeated bosses from my first two runs.

Add pulls are lame and marauders are the worst idea in eso. Whoever came up with the idea of marauders (a ~2mil boss randomly spawning in that deals 40,000 to 50,000 in the blink of an eye) needs fired. The only thing marauders do is waste your time. If you kill them, you still have to beat the same amount of add pulls. If you die, you still have to beat the same amount of add pulls. The only difference is you get one extra piece of a mediocre class set piece.

Endless Archive needs to be restricted to 2 people. It is not solo friendly. Nothing about it respects a solo player’s time, effort, or energy. And that’s fine, when people on Reddit or the forums make this comment or complaint, the first response is always “you should run it with a friend.” Then make me. Make it so you can’t even run it solo, if the solo mode is just going to be a joke. Quit kidding the fan base in saying this is 1-2 player. It isn’t.

The moment I clear Arc 4 and get my bust, I will never set foot in this content again.

Side note: I’ve ran it 3 times now, for 3 hours each, and I have 0 fragments for either the mount or pet.

The mount fragments (maligraphic ichors) mostly come from completing the daily (I think I also got it as a drop once). All you need to do is grab a quest, finish Arc 1, and turn in the quest.

This helps, but I’ve ran it on 2 different characters three times. I turned the quest in and still have nothing. Just figured that’s the luck of the drop I guess.

HappyTheCamper · December 2023

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

HappyTheCamper wrote: »

Endless Archive needs to be restricted to 2 people.

No.

You are asking that it be restricted to YOUR playstyle for everyone just because YOU don't like to run it solo.
Lots of people like or prefer to run EA/IA solo.

People need to stop making demands like this for the game.
You are not the only person for whom the game is designed.

So this is my fault, as I ranted very poorly. I apologize.

I don’t personally want it to be restricted to 2-man. It just seems like whenever I want to run solo (which I prefer) or whenever I see people suggesting help for solo runs, the number one comment is always “don’t do it solo, run with a friend.” Plus running with a partner allows for infinite revives, while solo you only get 2 deaths. And the issue with companions dying and pets dying affects solo players way more. Even after the new patch my companion and pets constantly die.

I just don’t think they put as much thought into solo runs, and was making a way too dramatic point for them to adjust it or remove it.

OBJnoob · December 2023

Here's a thought: where is all this saved data being stored? Is it client-side or server-side?

I don't know much about technology but I would imagine it would need to be stored server-side so that it can't be, I dunno, hacked or tampered with in some way.

So maybe that's the reason why we can't save. I mean that would be an awful lot of data, wouldn't it? If the way these EA discussions are trending is any indication... A lot of people are playing it.

You can't save your progress in a dungeon either, can you? If you log out for whatever reason, aren't you somewhere else when you log back in? The problem might also be with the fact that these places are "instanced."

ESO_player123 · December 2023

HappyTheCamper wrote: »

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

HappyTheCamper wrote: »

Endless Archive needs to be restricted to 2 people.

No.

You are asking that it be restricted to YOUR playstyle for everyone just because YOU don't like to run it solo.
Lots of people like or prefer to run EA/IA solo.

People need to stop making demands like this for the game.
You are not the only person for whom the game is designed.

So this is my fault, as I ranted very poorly. I apologize.

I don’t personally want it to be restricted to 2-man. It just seems like whenever I want to run solo (which I prefer) or whenever I see people suggesting help for solo runs, the number one comment is always “don’t do it solo, run with a friend.” Plus running with a partner allows for infinite revives, while solo you only get 2 deaths. And the issue with companions dying and pets dying affects solo players way more. Even after the new patch my companion and pets constantly die.

I just don’t think they put as much thought into solo runs, and was making a way too dramatic point for them to adjust it or remove it.

At which Arc does your companion constantly die? I recently went with a companion past Arc 4 Tho'at and he died may be twice to very specific bosses (not Tho'at). If you are talking about arc 4 and bellow, make sure that your companion is a tank with a taunt slotted. Make sure to slot his shield and heals abilities and he will tank Marauders and Tho'at and most bosses for you.

HappyTheCamper · December 2023

ESO_player123 wrote: »

HappyTheCamper wrote: »

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

HappyTheCamper wrote: »

Endless Archive needs to be restricted to 2 people.

No.

You are asking that it be restricted to YOUR playstyle for everyone just because YOU don't like to run it solo.
Lots of people like or prefer to run EA/IA solo.

People need to stop making demands like this for the game.
You are not the only person for whom the game is designed.

So this is my fault, as I ranted very poorly. I apologize.

I don’t personally want it to be restricted to 2-man. It just seems like whenever I want to run solo (which I prefer) or whenever I see people suggesting help for solo runs, the number one comment is always “don’t do it solo, run with a friend.” Plus running with a partner allows for infinite revives, while solo you only get 2 deaths. And the issue with companions dying and pets dying affects solo players way more. Even after the new patch my companion and pets constantly die.

I just don’t think they put as much thought into solo runs, and was making a way too dramatic point for them to adjust it or remove it.

At which Arc does your companion constantly die? I recently went with a companion past Arc 4 Tho'at and he died may be twice to very specific bosses (not Tho'at). If you are talking about arc 4 and bellow, make sure that your companion is a tank with a taunt slotted. Make sure to slot his shield and heals abilities and he will tank Marauders and Tho'at and most bosses for you.

Yea it is weird. So I’ve ran with 18 Isobel and 20 Bastian. They have purple vigorous gear and they both have taunts, shield skills and heals.

Funny enough Isobel did a good job lasting through every fight except any Tho’at. She could survive any boss in arcs 1-3 but died easily in arc 1 Tho’at. Bastian on the other hand died almost every fight after arc 1 last night. He has shields and heals. Super strange!

Tornaad · December 2023

What I would specifically want is that when you enter, it would give you the option of continuing where you left off (assuming you had any threads left from the last time) or restarting.

XSTRONG · December 2023

Lord_Graas wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Nothing to announce, however, we do want to pass along that the team is aware of this feedback. Thanks for sharing your perspective here as having your player experience does certainly help when discussing internally.

Maybe you will pay attention to how in the game Path of Exile they created an endless delve where you can continue progress at any time and you can move in different sections of your choice? For example, to open a new high-level section you need to spend a certain currency, which can be earned by performing activities in other parts of the game.

This sounds interesting, I also think a Sigil like feature where you can choose difficulty like i Diablo 4, if you are a new player or a end game vet player you can just choose from Sigil 1-10 for example.