Official Discussion Thread, "Discover Infinite Adventure In The Infinite Archive"

ZOS_Kevin · September 2023

This is the official discussion thread for, "Discover Infinite Adventure In The Infinite Archive"

"Delve into an all-new PvE activity with the Infinite Archive, arriving soon with the free Update 40 base-game patch."

Necrotech_Master · September 2023

this also sounds exciting, with the way its set up, it sounds kind of like a rogue-like excursion as you progress through the archive

been kind of into those types of games lately, so i think it will be fun to see what happens with it

Animar111 · September 2023

I will like this along with a lot of players……But I hope the rewards get better and better the deeper you delve…..

XSTRONG · September 2023

Animar111 wrote: »

I will like this along with a lot of players……But I hope the rewards get better and better the deeper you delve…..

In the live stream they got more currency the further they got and the vendor had some good stuff to purchase "as it looks right now".

The mount no one knows how to get it yet, I dont think from currency but maybe.

SilverBride · September 2023

I was really interested in hearing more about these, then I read this:

"...after you defeat the corruption at the archive’s heart, your expedition doesn’t end there, as you can traverse ever deeper into more Stages, Cycles, and Arcs, with the difficulty gradually increasing as you do! "

This is a deal breaker for me.

Katheriah · September 2023

SilverBride wrote: »

I was really interested in hearing more about these, then I read this:

"...after you defeat the corruption at the archive’s heart, your expedition doesn’t end there, as you can traverse ever deeper into more Stages, Cycles, and Arcs, with the difficulty gradually increasing as you do! "

This is a deal breaker for me.

Well, otherwise the endless part would be your time management instead of skill.

I have to say though, what they showed on stream seemed relatively easy and some buffs might even out the difficulty incease.

SilverBride · September 2023

Why couldn't the endless part be more Stages, Cycles and Arcs without added difficulty?

Besides the difficulty increase it also sounds a lot like an arena, and I've never really cared much for those. I really have little interest in even checking it out.

Katheriah · September 2023

Because otherwise there's no challenge to it, besides your patience.

To me, personally, it really wouldn't make any sense to make an endless dungeon where the only challenge is to stay awake.

Elsonso · September 2023

SilverBride wrote: »

I was really interested in hearing more about these, then I read this:

"...after you defeat the corruption at the archive’s heart, your expedition doesn’t end there, as you can traverse ever deeper into more Stages, Cycles, and Arcs, with the difficulty gradually increasing as you do! "

As for why it ramps up... that seems clear on reflection. Players have different skill levels, and this needs to cater to a wide range of them. The entry point is on the easier side such that the overwhelming majority of players will have no problems and will be able to beat the entry difficulty. After that, the Peter Principle is applied... or, for those who attended county fairs, a tractor pull. Difficulty increases as game play continues and players drop out when they get to the point where they can no longer beat the difficulty. It allows the lower end players to do the content for a while, and still allows for the higher end players who can handle more.

It is a self-adjusting system where neither the game nor the player needs to quantify at what point they feel challenged and at what point they reach their limit. No configuring. No options to set. No guessing. That makes the arena dirt simple. Go in and mop the floor until the real opponents show up, then exit when it gets too hard.

As a matter of fact, it seems so simple that they felt the need to add complexity in the form Stages, Cycles, and Arcs, then Visions and Verses that, when chosen correctly, can advance the player further than they are actually capable of going.

SilverBride wrote: »

Besides the difficulty increase it also sounds a lot like an arena, and I've never really cared much for those.

It is an arena. A ranked arena. A large room where monsters appear and must be defeated before the player can move on to the next large room. It is only a dungeon in the broad sense where "dungeon" includes arenas. I wanted an actual dungeon. Something with branching corridors and rooms that randomly expanded from the start, and yes, got harder the further in the player went. I wanted to see what they could come up with to make such a thing, and make it interesting. They've done arenas before, and are quite good at it. I wanted something new.

SilverBride · September 2023

Elsonso wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Besides the difficulty increase it also sounds a lot like an arena, and I've never really cared much for those.

It is an arena. A ranked arena. A large room where monsters appear and must be defeated before the player can move on to the next large room. It is only a dungeon in the broad sense where "dungeon" includes arenas. I wanted an actual dungeon. Something with branching corridors and rooms that randomly expanded from the start, and yes, got harder the further in the player went. I wanted to see what they could come up with to make such a thing, and make it interesting. They've done arenas before, and are quite good at it. I wanted something new.

I wanted something similar to what you did. The "endless dungeon" that was talked about before sounded like that is what it would be. Now they are calling it an "Endless Archive" which doesn't really tell me what it is. It's only from the description given now that I figured I out it is really an arena. I wish that would have been more clear from the start and I wouldn't have gotten my hopes up.

I was looking forward to something new, but my interest now is zero.

Kallykat · September 2023

Elsonso wrote: »

It is an arena. A ranked arena. A large room where monsters appear and must be defeated before the player can move on to the next large room. It is only a dungeon in the broad sense where "dungeon" includes arenas. I wanted an actual dungeon. Something with branching corridors and rooms that randomly expanded from the start, and yes, got harder the further in the player went. I wanted to see what they could come up with to make such a thing, and make it interesting. They've done arenas before, and are quite good at it. I wanted something new.

I'm a little confused by this distinction between an arena and a dungeon. I've seen several players mention that the EA is an arena and not a dungeon, but this comment make it sound like the main difference is the shape of the map. If that's the case, the difference doesn't really seem substantive to me. I think there has to be something more to it. Can someone please explain to me what makes an arena vs a dungeon and why people are saying EA is an arena?

kynesgrove · September 2023

It is an Arena in the sense that "Arenas" are non-traditional dungeons. Similarly Trials are also technically non-traditional dungeons just for large groups of people.

Arenas can be very varied and it depends on how they function internally.

For example if Vateshran as it is were available for 4 players it will still be an Arena, due to its myriad mechanics being unique versus a traditional dungeon. The mechanics are largely non-standard and unique to Vateshran, and similar enough to Maelstrom.

If Vateshran had some of the hallmarks of random generated corridors, was available for two players and repeatable, it would still be an Arena. Or especially an Arena, because so many factors make it unique versus a traditional dungeon.

I'd say EA is closer to Blackrose Prison (which is a 4 player Arena but closest to a traditional dungeon). Except only 2 players, smaller areas, unique end-of-round buff choice mechanic, and endless.

And what makes Arenas more Arena-like, is that they are game modes that often drop "Arena-Weapons" at the end. I assume the class specific gear will be "Arena-Gear". These items often are also used as a metric to determine if someting is an Arena. Since they are build changing, not always BiS, constrained to certain skills and now classes, can alter playstyles, and finally dropping solely inside the Arena.

All Trials and Arenas are technically a variation of being a Dungeon, instanced adventures with their own stories. But not all Dungeons are Arenas and Trials.

Elsonso · September 2023

Kallykat wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

It is an arena. A ranked arena. A large room where monsters appear and must be defeated before the player can move on to the next large room. It is only a dungeon in the broad sense where "dungeon" includes arenas. I wanted an actual dungeon. Something with branching corridors and rooms that randomly expanded from the start, and yes, got harder the further in the player went. I wanted to see what they could come up with to make such a thing, and make it interesting. They've done arenas before, and are quite good at it. I wanted something new.

I'm a little confused by this distinction between an arena and a dungeon. I've seen several players mention that the EA is an arena and not a dungeon, but this comment make it sound like the main difference is the shape of the map. If that's the case, the difference doesn't really seem substantive to me. I think there has to be something more to it. Can someone please explain to me what makes an arena vs a dungeon and why people are saying EA is an arena?

Simple 100 mile high answer? In arenas, the opponents come to you. In a dungeon, you have to seek out and find the opponents. Obviously, variations, blending, and mixing of definitions can happen, but Endless Archive is pretty clear cut as an arena.

It is very similar to the other in-game arenas, and not so much with the in-game dungeons.

AstroST · September 2023

Am I the only one not really interested in playing what seems to be mostly recycled content?
This is the only thing we will have till next year expasnsion and it just seems to me a very low effort thing.

Will be this thing good enough to mantain your interest in playing ESO?

Katheriah · September 2023

Yep

Soarora · September 2023

AstroST wrote: »

Am I the only one not really interested in playing what seems to be mostly recycled content?
This is the only thing we will have till next year expasnsion and it just seems to me a very low effort thing.

Will be this thing good enough to mantain your interest in playing ESO?

It does not feel low effort as the mechanics are not just copy and pasted, they're adapted for the arena. I feel very rewarded for knowing mechanics throughout the game and quite enjoy it.

Elsonso · September 2023

Soarora wrote: »

AstroST wrote: »

Am I the only one not really interested in playing what seems to be mostly recycled content?
This is the only thing we will have till next year expasnsion and it just seems to me a very low effort thing.

Will be this thing good enough to mantain your interest in playing ESO?

It does not feel low effort as the mechanics are not just copy and pasted, they're adapted for the arena. I feel very rewarded for knowing mechanics throughout the game and quite enjoy it.

It was pretty clear from the way they talked about the bosses that even though they were ported in from other places, they were more than just a copy. They they were tuned to the purpose.

It makes me wonder whether they hand tuned each of the bosses, or whether they have implemented a dynamic boss scaling system to do the work.