2H: Reverse Slash and his Morphs

Murmeltier · May 2014

Hello,

i love the 2H Sword, because of the Look and his Abillitie to hit with AOE-Dam. You can Morph Reverse Slash to Reverse Slice, that does extra Splashdamage to nearby Enemies or you can Morph it to Executioner.

Last Skill sounds interesting, because it let every other Meleeskill hit like Reverse Slash. I dont have Access to both, only read about them.

My Question about this Skill is:

1. Reverse Slash gives a Bonus up to 300% Damage vs Enemies with low Health. Is the Splashdamage from the Morph Reverse Slice to nearby Enemies higher than the AOE-Damage from Cleave equiped with Executioner?

2. Which Skill (Reverse Slice vs Cleave with Executioner) have the higher AOE-Radius and hits the most nearby Enemies?

3. Which Skill would you use and why, pls explain an Example so i can learn how they work.

I know that other Skills do better Damage but i like the 2H Sword and try to understand how the Skillline works.

I hope my English isnt too bad to destroy the Idea of the Question i asked

.

MFG Murmeltier

SirPuppingtonVonHat · May 2014

I played with numbers a bit, and here is what I found.

Using ESOhead, I set both abilities to 5000 stamina and 500 weapon damage (far more than normal, but the maximum the calculator would allow). Under these conditions, Carve 4 would deal 494 damage on hit with 816 damage over 10 seconds; with the Executioner 4 bonus, Carve 4 does 582 damage on initial hit plus 963 damage over ten seconds. Reverse Slice would do a maximum of 1590 damage, and 366 damage to two nearby targets.

At one target, Carve + Executioner (C+E) would do a total of 1545 damage, while Reverse Slice would do a maximum of 1590 total.
Against three targets (Reverse Slice's max), C+E would do 4590 damage total, while Reverse Slice would do 2316 damage.
Against six targets (C+E max), C+E wins.

Things to note:
-This test uses numbers that aren't remotely possible at present and depend on a skill calculator. Take all results with a grain of salt.
-This assumes that the target is at a low enough health to get the maximum bonus for Reverse Slice, so unless the target is a boss its dead regardless. Higher % health favors C+E.
-The two sets of abilities are apples and oranges. C+E requires more skill point expenditure and takes two slots, and also has a benefit other than damage. Reverse Slice also has a lower resource cost.

Hope that helps.

Murmeltier · May 2014

Oo, i am impressed by the Numbers and testing you have done, thank you very much.

Apples and Oranges, yes but they are one of the few Stamina based AOE Options the 2H Sword offers. I want to use one of them and your Infos helps me to decide which one i goes.

So i understand your Info right, Carve can hit more then 3 Enemies?

So the 300% Bonus to low Health/Target is on both the same? I mean that Carve hits with the Skilldamage and Reverse Slice with Splashdamage to nearby Enemys. So if i could offers two Slots i could do more Damage per Hit on all Enemies with Carve+E, right?

That is really interesting, i like the Options Teso offers.

SirPuppingtonVonHat · May 2014

I assumed the 300% bonus on the morphs of Reverse Slash because that would be when the skill is most effective. Its kinda an artificial assumption, since the enemy will rarely be at that health threshold for long, but for our theory purposes thats what we should use.

And yes, Cleave and its morphs can hit up to six targets. When you have target saturation in an area and morph it to Carve, thats 24+ ultimate a swing, plus the ultimate from the bleed. There are better ways of generative ultimate in the game, which is why I HIGHLY recommend using it in melee AoE scenarios. Just be careful not to overextend yourself.

beravinprb19_ESO · May 2014

Cleave is not very good against single targets, such as bosses and elite mobs. I like to use Executioners as a stamina dump that can be weaved in with light attacks. That said, its still not very good until you get the enemy below 50% health which, frankly, is already half the battle. Mind you, its still the best boss / single target ability we can get our hands on.

One-Winged · May 2014

Reverse Slice -> AoE Finisher (Best for leveling and boss fights with adds)
Executioner -> Single Target Finisher (Best for long single target fights)

Axer · May 2014

Cleave, Reverse Slash and every other skill in the two handed line are plain garbage in this game for simple reasons:

Class skills deal VASTLY more dps.

I'm VR10, 100% maxxed out two handed and aedric spear, and tested each in a real scenario:
I can maintain around 600 dps with aerdric apear, from 100% to 0. At 25% or lower - it basically auto crits, so my burst dps is around 900 at the point.
Executioner? If I can even hope to get 150 dps from 100 to 25% I was insanely lucky on the crits.
Below 25% it spikes to 300-400 dps. I'm not a stamina build (tank, so not really magicka either, tho my magicka is high), so if I was, maybe 500 dps.. Still VASTLY inferior.

(Not to mention the spear is partiallly aoe, and can deal in the 1500+ dps range AOE vs lots of targets, where as reverse slash, and two handed in general has poor aoe).

Sorcerers also get a vastly superior execute.

gimped nightblades? Maybe its your only choice. But when your only choice is that bad, you should look elsewhere imo.

SirPuppingtonVonHat · May 2014

Weapon-based melee in general needs help. But thats a separate issue from the one this thread is about.

The_Emproer · May 2014

Axer wrote: »

Cleave, Reverse Slash and every other skill in the two handed line are plain garbage in this game for simple reasons:

Class skills deal VASTLY more dps.

I'm VR10, 100% maxxed out two handed and aedric spear, and tested each in a real scenario:
I can maintain around 600 dps with aerdric apear, from 100% to 0. At 25% or lower - it basically auto crits, so my burst dps is around 900 at the point.
Executioner? If I can even hope to get 150 dps from 100 to 25% I was insanely lucky on the crits.
Below 25% it spikes to 300-400 dps. I'm not a stamina build (tank, so not really magicka either, tho my magicka is high), so if I was, maybe 500 dps.. Still VASTLY inferior.

(Not to mention the spear is partiallly aoe, and can deal in the 1500+ dps range AOE vs lots of targets, where as reverse slash, and two handed in general has poor aoe).

Sorcerers also get a vastly superior execute.

gimped nightblades? Maybe its your only choice. But when your only choice is that bad, you should look elsewhere imo.

this is ridiculous. of course you're doing more damage with aedric spear abilities as a magicka, heavy armor build. if you were a stamina, medium armor build you'd be getting much stronger 2H DPS. on top of that, you're playing a templar, which is the worst class in the game for weapon builds since they have absolutely nothing that boosts weapon damage/attack speed like the other classes. your opinions are completely skewed. try playing a medium armor stamina build NB or DK and tell me 2H is worthless, because it isn't. the biggest problem the weapon has is uppercut being a bad ability, the line and weapon as a whole are in a good spot.

these official forums are a complete cesspool, it's just a *** of people spreading misinformation and flawed opinions about balance that aren't remotely true.

Murmeltier · May 2014

I dont talk about VR and PvP because i am at Level 20 with my Templer. I know that some Ideas that work under 50 will get destroys through the Numbers in VR.

But i love the Idea/Synergie between Cleave with Shield as a Tool to use with the Strike Attack from the Templer(Fast Attack Thing, dont know the Name)).

First i run into the Mobs, use Cleave and the Shield absorbs Damage then i use the Strike Attack from the Templer to get the Enemies under 50% and then i spam Cleave/Shield to finish them and avoid Damage. With the Executioner Morph it will goes faster.

Without the Executioner Morph it works really fine and with Movement i can handle Mobgroups in my Level really easy. With the Morph in the Future it can goes faster, i love the Idea.

The Thing is the Templer Classskill uses Magic and the Cleave Stamina, so i can AOE more. My Stats is prio Magic at Softcap with Attribute/Jewels+Buffood and the Armor has only Stamina on it.

I know this is only Theorycrafting and the Reallity works different but this Time it works fine for me.

P.S: It Looks really cool if you Smash as a Paladin in a Silverarmor through Mobgroups and Pop up this Jedimastershield:)).

Wifeaggro13 · May 2014

Axer wrote: »

Cleave, Reverse Slash and every other skill in the two handed line are plain garbage in this game for simple reasons:

Class skills deal VASTLY more dps.

I'm VR10, 100% maxxed out two handed and aedric spear, and tested each in a real scenario:
I can maintain around 600 dps with aerdric apear, from 100% to 0. At 25% or lower - it basically auto crits, so my burst dps is around 900 at the point.
Executioner? If I can even hope to get 150 dps from 100 to 25% I was insanely lucky on the crits.
Below 25% it spikes to 300-400 dps. I'm not a stamina build (tank, so not really magicka either, tho my magicka is high), so if I was, maybe 500 dps.. Still VASTLY inferior.

(Not to mention the spear is partiallly aoe, and can deal in the 1500+ dps range AOE vs lots of targets, where as reverse slash, and two handed in general has poor aoe).

Sorcerers also get a vastly superior execute.

gimped nightblades? Maybe its your only choice. But when your only choice is that bad, you should look elsewhere imo.

every single melee line is compltely broken imo. When i can do more damage then any 2h or dual wield spec by simply blocking and spamming my bash.then dumping mana and repeating . Its very im balanced and poorly designed