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• PC/Mac: EU megaserver for maintenance – September 9, 22:00 UTC (6:00PM EDT) - September 10, 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/682784
The Company (Not the Developers) Needs to Reevaluate What They're Doing
Aka_
✭✭✭✭✭
I don't have much to say on this as the forums bring it up quite often in general. But, ESO is on a downward trajectory and it's more and more obvious.
Content creators and the stream team are leaving the game or shifting it from being a main focus to a side one. As they often base their livelihoods off of the interest and content ESO puts out, this is a very bad sign.
Player count continues to fall. Steam, although limited in its data given that it is one of several ways to access ESO, shows this consistent trend.
The last update was kind of a failure. A quality of life update did not really show noticable improvements to a LOT of aspects of the game that players have specifically requested for months or even years.
Poor communication. The communication between players and developers and the company is abysmal. Everyone here can attest to the disrespect or lack of trust it feels there is between the creators and ourselves, especially between the company itself and us. We can see through the shallow PR messages that say that you "hear" us and you're "wanting to move forward to improve communication". It's bad, and it's been bad for years. You don't trust us. At least, that's the impression I get from the censoring, vague language, sporadic updates on issues, or nearly complete ignoring of PTS feedback. The profit is king. And if the people in charge of the agenda keep this up, they'll realize their short term focus will suck this game's soul dry.
I believe the developers still hold passion for this game and are held back by upper management. I also believe I'm speaking to the void when I write this. Being wanted as a customer has never felt so laborious in general these days with the gaming industry. And that sucks, because people really find joy and friends through games like these. To see that falter, and to witness the cracks in the foundations deepen is sad. It's not too late for the game if the upper echelon of this company let the developers do what they want to do in tandem with what the players have been begging for without response for years. The game has a special skeleton of history, beauty, and passion. And to see it like this is sad. I want the best for this game. But to have no communication, no trust from the people steering the experience is just sad.
Content creators and the stream team are leaving the game or shifting it from being a main focus to a side one. As they often base their livelihoods off of the interest and content ESO puts out, this is a very bad sign.
Player count continues to fall. Steam, although limited in its data given that it is one of several ways to access ESO, shows this consistent trend.
The last update was kind of a failure. A quality of life update did not really show noticable improvements to a LOT of aspects of the game that players have specifically requested for months or even years.
Poor communication. The communication between players and developers and the company is abysmal. Everyone here can attest to the disrespect or lack of trust it feels there is between the creators and ourselves, especially between the company itself and us. We can see through the shallow PR messages that say that you "hear" us and you're "wanting to move forward to improve communication". It's bad, and it's been bad for years. You don't trust us. At least, that's the impression I get from the censoring, vague language, sporadic updates on issues, or nearly complete ignoring of PTS feedback. The profit is king. And if the people in charge of the agenda keep this up, they'll realize their short term focus will suck this game's soul dry.
I believe the developers still hold passion for this game and are held back by upper management. I also believe I'm speaking to the void when I write this. Being wanted as a customer has never felt so laborious in general these days with the gaming industry. And that sucks, because people really find joy and friends through games like these. To see that falter, and to witness the cracks in the foundations deepen is sad. It's not too late for the game if the upper echelon of this company let the developers do what they want to do in tandem with what the players have been begging for without response for years. The game has a special skeleton of history, beauty, and passion. And to see it like this is sad. I want the best for this game. But to have no communication, no trust from the people steering the experience is just sad.
118
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muscle_witch✭✭✭✭Being wanted as a customer has never felt so laborious in general these days with the gaming industry.
I have to disagree with that, there are a lot of companies (especially smaller ones) that have great rapport with their playerbase!
In particular:
- The Potion Crafter team is great - everything they do showcases their enthusiasm for the game they're creating and for the community developing around the game. I love reading their update posts and seeing what's coming
- No Man's Sky is, in my opinion, the MVP for taking a sub-ideal launch and just consistently building trust and appreciation among its players with regular updates, QoL improvements, and an overall commitment to evolving the game as it ages
- The Planet Crafter does a seriously impressive job with its responsiveness to the players, after the last major update they published a balancing patch in just two weeks based on player feedback
Those are just a few off the top of my head, but seriously - don't get too discouraged, there are still a lot of people in the industry committed to the idea of building trust with the player community.18 -
old_scopie1945✭✭✭✭✭I agree 100% about the situation in ESO, and have for some time now. As you say profit is king. Which is a great shame as I love this game.Edited by old_scopie1945 on September 2, 2023 7:30PM28 -
Sarannah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Personally I think ESO would actually be better off without some of the streamers and elite players. They are holding the game back by forcing the barswapping LA weaving playstyle upon everyone. If everyone could reach endgame, with any number of playstyles(no more DPS gap), more players would stick around and the endgame would be much more lively. Which would also allow for the endgame to keep growing. Right now noone really flows into the endgame, which makes it hard for players to stick with an MMO. As endgame is where you want to be at as a player, regardless of skilllevel. And if you can't get there, there is no point in playing the game.
This makes it so players only flow out of the game, instead of into the game and endgame. Causing the playerbase to dwindle bit by bit.
And I do agree ZOS should look at PTS criticism more, as that is where they can still change important issues before implementing them on the live servers. Other than that I feel ZOS's communication is alright for an MMO company. (Keep in mind, they have to get greenlit for any communication they do, and there are behind-the-scene things they can't tell us)
There are issues with the game, some even important/major issues. These important/major issues should be fixed ASAP, so the game's foundation will pull even more players in. But ZOS is still releasing quite a bit of content, and are releasing new systems every now and then. So from where I'm sitting, the game looks like it will only get better.
PS: I play through the standalone client.Edited by Sarannah on September 2, 2023 8:46PM22 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭"As endgame is where you want to be as a player...."
I don't. I have zero interest in endgame. I raided in WoW and RIFT, and I'm DONE DONE DONE with that garbage.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....36 -
RaikaNA✭✭✭✭✭
✭Personally I think ESO would actually be better off without some of the streamers and elite players. They are holding the game back by forcing the barswapping LA weaving playstyle upon everyone. If everyone could reach endgame, with any number of playstyles(no more DPS gap), more players would stick around and the endgame would be much more lively. Which would also allow for the endgame to keep growing. Right now noone really flows into the endgame, which makes it hard for players to stick with an MMO. As endgame is where you want to be at as a player, regardless of skilllevel. And if you can't get there, there is no point in playing the game.
This makes it so players only flow out of the game, instead of into the game and endgame. Causing the playerbase to dwindle bit by bit.
And I do agree ZOS should look at PTS criticism more, as that is where they can still change important issues before implementing them on the live servers. Other than that I feel ZOS's communication is alright for an MMO company. (Keep in mind, they have to get greenlit for any communication they do, and there are behind-the-scene things they can't tell us)
There are issues with the game, some even important/major issues. These important/major issues should be fixed ASAP, so the game's foundation will pull even more players in. But ZOS is still releasing quite a bit of content, and are releasing new systems every now and then. So from where I'm sitting, the game looks like it will only get better.
PS: I play through the standalone client.
Blaming the streamers and "elite" players for bad patches and holding the game back is so unfair. They're not the developers who make the decisions of adding stuff in the game... they're players just like you and I. As far as animation canceling and LA weaving... this is caused by a broken combat system that ZOS still hasn't fixed yet.
There is nothing holding back anyone from playing end gaming content... however, you do need to work on your rotation and improving yourself and your gear... If you have bad DPS... It's all on you... not the streamer's fault, not the elite player's fault.. its your fault for not understanding your class. Instead of hiring people to do XP/power level runs in skyreach/ Blackrose Prison arena... level up your character in a normal sense.Edited by RaikaNA on September 2, 2023 9:07PM69 -
Blood_again✭✭✭✭✭ESO dies because a team of professionals want money for their job and do their job as they see it right.
I heard that before. Let me remember... in October 2015.
When you tell us about "downward trajectory and it's more and more obvious" 3 months after releasing new chapter with new trial, new class, new type of world event etc., less than a month after QoL update... I can guess you've never seen a state of MMO that really dies. Happy you
I won't comment speculations about bad company that don't allow good developers to give faithful players what they want. Nope.
If you see that everything is bad, the game don't satisfy you, patches are jokes and do nothing good, people are leaving and you think you're speaking to the void - it is a good idea to take a break. Get some rest. All the colors of Tamriel will meet you as bright as before when you get back.8 -
Sarannah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
You contradict yourself. You are saying not to blame the elite players and streamers, and immediately state everyone needs to work on their rotation for the highest DPS.Personally I think ESO would actually be better off without some of the streamers and elite players. They are holding the game back by forcing the barswapping LA weaving playstyle upon everyone. If everyone could reach endgame, with any number of playstyles(no more DPS gap), more players would stick around and the endgame would be much more lively. Which would also allow for the endgame to keep growing. Right now noone really flows into the endgame, which makes it hard for players to stick with an MMO. As endgame is where you want to be at as a player, regardless of skilllevel. And if you can't get there, there is no point in playing the game.
This makes it so players only flow out of the game, instead of into the game and endgame. Causing the playerbase to dwindle bit by bit.
And I do agree ZOS should look at PTS criticism more, as that is where they can still change important issues before implementing them on the live servers. Other than that I feel ZOS's communication is alright for an MMO company. (Keep in mind, they have to get greenlit for any communication they do, and there are behind-the-scene things they can't tell us)
There are issues with the game, some even important/major issues. These important/major issues should be fixed ASAP, so the game's foundation will pull even more players in. But ZOS is still releasing quite a bit of content, and are releasing new systems every now and then. So from where I'm sitting, the game looks like it will only get better.
PS: I play through the standalone client.
Blaming the streamers and "elite" players for bad patches and holding the game back is so unfair. They're not the developers who make the decisions of adding stuff in the game... they're players just like you and I. As far as animation canceling and LA weaving... this is caused by a broken combat system that ZOS still hasn't fixed yet.
There is nothing holding back anyone from playing end gaming content... however, you do need to work on your rotation and improving yourself and your gear... If you have bad DPS... It's all on you... not the streamer's fault, not the elite player's fault.. its your fault for not understanding your class. Instead of hiring people to do XP/power level runs in skyreach/ Blackrose Prison arena... level up your character in a normal sense.
The game needs more playstyles, like the original oakensoul and HA builds, but every time ZOS releases a new playstyle.... guess who wants it nerfed for reasons. So yes, it is the elite and streamers holding this game back, especially if you consider most of the playerbase does not perform the barswapping LA weaving playstyle. Whatever their reasons for not wanting to do the barswapping LA weaving playstyle, they do not do it. (personally I find it buttonsmashing and looks stupid)Edited by Sarannah on September 3, 2023 6:14AM18 -
Katheriah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭It's not other the players fault there's only a few ways to gain enough DPS to comfortly get through endgame content.
I know players that used to do weekly training runs with people. I have massive respect for them. Most people eventually get tired of spending 3-4 hours of their free time on players that refuse to want to get better gear or practice their rotation.
Let's be honest; if you want to finish endgame content, but you don't want to farm endgame gear or practice endgame rotations, then you just want to get carried.
I don't blame anyone that doesn't want to be a free carrier in their free time.41 -
Trundik✭✭✭old_scopie1945 wrote: »I agree 100% about the situation in ESO, and have for some time now. As you say profit is king. Which is a great shame as I love this game.
Zeni Max. Zeni=Money. It was currency name somewhere. So i wouldn't expect something unusual here.
But I feel your pain. Nowadays I feel it more. Rly no reason to stop crown store gifts. It doesn't ruquire service to be down to fix it lol. And otherwise its just greed or dunno. They say nothing. And looks like rotating a lot of healthy players around some wand feels better than loosing some coins. Game is alive, new players still coming, but well they should be pretty scared with such behavior I think.
I wouldn't play starfield personally knowing that next day il buy this game I will be unwanted anymore bc i don't bring coins
I'm not a cow. 6 -
jm42✭✭✭✭Blood_again wrote: »ESO dies because a team of professionals want money for their job and do their job as they see it right.
I heard that before. Let me remember... in October 2015.
When you tell us about "downward trajectory and it's more and more obvious" 3 months after releasing new chapter with new trial, new class, new type of world event etc., less than a month after QoL update... I can guess you've never seen a state of MMO that really dies. Happy you
I won't comment speculations about bad company that don't allow good developers to give faithful players what they want. Nope.
If you see that everything is bad, the game don't satisfy you, patches are jokes and do nothing good, people are leaving and you think you're speaking to the void - it is a good idea to take a break. Get some rest. All the colors of Tamriel will meet you as bright as before when you get back.
new trial and new type of world event are broken for a couple of weeks and since day of launch respectfully with zero freaking updates. thanx for your attention13 -
me_ming✭✭✭✭✭The game needs more playstyles, like the original oakensoul and HA builds, but every time ZOS releases a new playstyle.... guess who wants it nerfed for reasons. So yes, it is the elite and streamers holding this game back, especially if you consider most of the playerbase does not perform the barswapping LA weaving playstyle. Whatever their reasons for not wanting to do the barswapping LA weaving playstyle, they do not do it. (personally I find it buttonsmashing and looks stupid)
May I please have the numbers of this "most of the player base does not perform the bar swapping LA weaving" you're talking about?
Also isn't it that they only thing that is holding YOU back is that YOU don't want to practice weaving? Why is that the fault of those that want that kind of playstyle? Because you can't get to end game without practicing it? I mean, do you really need to be in a score pushing group to complete content in this game? FYI Personally, I find heavy attack builds boring, you're just pressing one button and just looks stupid. I mean, how is just pressing one button interactive? It's so stupid easily, you don't need skill to do it. [snip]
[edited for baiting]Edited by ZOS_Icy on September 3, 2023 4:29PM"We're heroes, my boon companion, and heroes always win! Let that be a lesson to you."
-Caldwell, "The Final Assault"
"There is always a choice. But you don't get to choose what is true, you only get to choose what you will do about it..."
-Abnur Tharn, "God of Schemes"]23 -
Blood_again✭✭✭✭✭new trial and new type of world event are broken for a couple of weeks and since day of launch respectfully with zero freaking updates. thanx for your attention
Broken for a couple of weeks? You meant after update?
See, you told me there was no update for them
Seriously, game is not smooth. Old bugs are being fixed, new arises. I was surprised with last chapter launched without major bugs and with no player items disappeared. OP even created a topic, how good was it.
But there is nothing common with current topic drama. It is a development flow.
I said about "how good/bad is the game global life cicle", you told me about few week long bugs. Ahem.2 -
jm42✭✭✭✭Blood_again wrote: »new trial and new type of world event are broken for a couple of weeks and since day of launch respectfully with zero freaking updates. thanx for your attention
Broken for a couple of weeks? You meant after update?
See, you told me there was no update for them
Seriously, game is not smooth. Old bugs are being fixed, new arises. I was surprised with last chapter launched without major bugs and with no player items disappeared. OP even created a topic, how good was it.
But there is nothing common with current topic drama. It is a development flow.
I said about "how good/bad is the game global life cicle", you told me about few week long bugs. Ahem.
idk what are you talking about but dev team is aware of Sanity's Edge broken boss since 08.21 and keep silence (aka provides no updates) since that. Count yourself how many weeks is thatEdited by jm42 on September 3, 2023 2:29PM5 -
Blood_again✭✭✭✭✭Blood_again wrote: »I said about "how good/bad is the game global life cicle", you told me about few week long bugs. Ahem.
idk what are you talking about but
Yes, I can see it. It is OK.
Thank you for your answer 1 -
loveeso✭✭✭✭I don't have much to say on this as the forums bring it up quite often in general. But, ESO is on a downward trajectory and it's more and more obvious.
Content creators and the stream team are leaving the game or shifting it from being a main focus to a side one. As they often base their livelihoods off of the interest and content ESO puts out, this is a very bad sign.
Player count continues to fall. Steam, although limited in its data given that it is one of several ways to access ESO, shows this consistent trend.
The last update was kind of a failure. A quality of life update did not really show noticable improvements to a LOT of aspects of the game that players have specifically requested for months or even years.
Poor communication. The communication between players and developers and the company is abysmal. Everyone here can attest to the disrespect or lack of trust it feels there is between the creators and ourselves, especially between the company itself and us. We can see through the shallow PR messages that say that you "hear" us and you're "wanting to move forward to improve communication". It's bad, and it's been bad for years. You don't trust us. At least, that's the impression I get from the censoring, vague language, sporadic updates on issues, or nearly complete ignoring of PTS feedback. The profit is king. And if the people in charge of the agenda keep this up, they'll realize their short term focus will suck this game's soul dry.
I believe the developers still hold passion for this game and are held back by upper management. I also believe I'm speaking to the void when I write this. Being wanted as a customer has never felt so laborious in general these days with the gaming industry. And that sucks, because people really find joy and friends through games like these. To see that falter, and to witness the cracks in the foundations deepen is sad. It's not too late for the game if the upper echelon of this company let the developers do what they want to do in tandem with what the players have been begging for without response for years. The game has a special skeleton of history, beauty, and passion. And to see it like this is sad. I want the best for this game. But to have no communication, no trust from the people steering the experience is just sad.
I concur with everything you wrote about ZOS and ESO. [snip]
[edited for discussing moderator action(s)]Edited by ZOS_Icy on September 3, 2023 5:45PMMMOs: ESO (PS & PC), GW2 (😍) & Souls/Elden (😍)7 -
SerafinaWaterstar✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It's not other the players fault there's only a few ways to gain enough DPS to comfortly get through endgame content.
I know players that used to do weekly training runs with people. I have massive respect for them. Most people eventually get tired of spending 3-4 hours of their free time on players that refuse to want to get better gear or practice their rotation.
Let's be honest; if you want to finish endgame content, but you don't want to farm endgame gear or practice endgame rotations, then you just want to get carried.
Sorry but disagree.
The issue is the dependence on rotations for max damage in ‘end game’ stuff.
Not everyone finds this easy to manage, for many different reasons, and not just because they need to practice. (Which is why oakensoul is/was fantastic)
It’s this kind of attitude that puts many people off even trying to get into ‘end game’ - which is a shame.
I have limited time to play and really hate practicing rotations. It takes all the fun & spontaneity out of the game. Dull mechanical button mashing. And not always helpful if needing to respond to situational mechs, to be frank.
(And I lead a prog group that don’t ask for damage stats and are gradually making our merry way through vet trials. Only 3 to go.)
11 -
GooGa592✭✭✭✭✭
✭Less emphasis on crown store and more emphasis on the game would be the solution to making ESO great again.23 -
Sarannah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
Well, of all the content I've done over the past years, I've only seen a dozen or so players use LA weaving(for arguments sake I'll assume they always barswap). This is including in normal and veteran dungeons, but I am mostly in overland though. ZOS has the numbers on this, so they know who is right in what we're saying.The game needs more playstyles, like the original oakensoul and HA builds, but every time ZOS releases a new playstyle.... guess who wants it nerfed for reasons. So yes, it is the elite and streamers holding this game back, especially if you consider most of the playerbase does not perform the barswapping LA weaving playstyle. Whatever their reasons for not wanting to do the barswapping LA weaving playstyle, they do not do it. (personally I find it buttonsmashing and looks stupid)
May I please have the numbers of this "most of the player base does not perform the bar swapping LA weaving" you're talking about?
Also isn't it that they only thing that is holding YOU back is that YOU don't want to practice weaving? Why is that the fault of those that want that kind of playstyle? Because you can't get to end game without practicing it? I mean, do you really need to be in a score pushing group to complete content in this game? FYI Personally, I find heavy attack builds boring, you're just pressing one button and just looks stupid. I mean, how is just pressing one button interactive? It's so stupid easily, you don't need skill to do it. [snip]
[edited for baiting]
This is a game, not many will want to spend hours on a dummy just to play the game. They'll go elsewhere where they can jump into the fun right away, which is something most games offer. More playstyle options would make the game more attractive and better for everyone, while allowing more players to flow into the endgame. Even if it is with a playstyle you (or I) dislike. Ofcourse I do feel the more skillbased playstyles(barswapping LA weaving for example) should always provide somewhat better DPS. Just not a 10k DPS vs 110k DPS difference, but more a 70k DPS vs 110k DPS difference.
Strange as it may sound, I half agree with you. The game does need more endgame players, which as a consequence would also create more "elite" players. Elite players are great for a game, and for the longterm growth of a game. I do disagree with you on not allowing more easily accessible playstyles for non-elite players, as that is the best way to get more players into endgame.
You contradict yourself. You are saying not to blame the elite players and streamers, and immediately state everyone needs to work on their rotation for the highest DPS.Personally I think ESO would actually be better off without some of the streamers and elite players. They are holding the game back by forcing the barswapping LA weaving playstyle upon everyone. If everyone could reach endgame, with any number of playstyles(no more DPS gap), more players would stick around and the endgame would be much more lively. Which would also allow for the endgame to keep growing. Right now noone really flows into the endgame, which makes it hard for players to stick with an MMO. As endgame is where you want to be at as a player, regardless of skilllevel. And if you can't get there, there is no point in playing the game.
This makes it so players only flow out of the game, instead of into the game and endgame. Causing the playerbase to dwindle bit by bit.
And I do agree ZOS should look at PTS criticism more, as that is where they can still change important issues before implementing them on the live servers. Other than that I feel ZOS's communication is alright for an MMO company. (Keep in mind, they have to get greenlit for any communication they do, and there are behind-the-scene things they can't tell us)
There are issues with the game, some even important/major issues. These important/major issues should be fixed ASAP, so the game's foundation will pull even more players in. But ZOS is still releasing quite a bit of content, and are releasing new systems every now and then. So from where I'm sitting, the game looks like it will only get better.
PS: I play through the standalone client.
Blaming the streamers and "elite" players for bad patches and holding the game back is so unfair. They're not the developers who make the decisions of adding stuff in the game... they're players just like you and I. As far as animation canceling and LA weaving... this is caused by a broken combat system that ZOS still hasn't fixed yet.
There is nothing holding back anyone from playing end gaming content... however, you do need to work on your rotation and improving yourself and your gear... If you have bad DPS... It's all on you... not the streamer's fault, not the elite player's fault.. its your fault for not understanding your class. Instead of hiring people to do XP/power level runs in skyreach/ Blackrose Prison arena... level up your character in a normal sense.
The game needs more playstyles, like the original oakensoul and HA builds, but every time ZOS releases a new playstyle.... guess who wants it nerfed for reasons. So yes, it is the elite and streamers holding this game back, especially if you consider most of the playerbase does not perform the barswapping LA weaving playstyle. Whatever their reasons for not wanting to do the barswapping LA weaving playstyle, they do not do it. (personally I find it buttonsmashing and looks stupid
No, the game needs more "elites" and less duct-tape-playstyles fir people, which are more interested in feeding their FOMO and envy than the game itself and it's mechanics.
Your hating against us others is getting worse btw. Maybe it's time for a long break. I recommend a single-player-game.
Not only that, many more playstyles would also mean more playstyles would fit different people. Allowing more players to have fun in ESO their way.
For the record, I'm not hating against elite players. Some just seem to have the mindset where they feel: "I suffered on a dummy for weeks, so should everyone else." A stance I just simply disagree with, as this is a game.
PS: I'm not trying to take any playstyle away from anyone.Edited by Sarannah on September 3, 2023 7:04PM9 -
Jierdanit✭✭✭✭✭
✭Well, of all the content I've done over the past years, I've only seen a dozen or so players use LA weaving(for arguments sake I'll assume they always barswap). This is including in normal and veteran dungeons, but I am mostly in overland though. ZOS has the numbers on this, so they know who is right in what we're saying.
Well in the content that i mainly do basically everyone is using LA weaving and bar swapping, so simply speaking from personal experience wont do you any good on this.PC/EU, StamSorc Main9 -
boi_anachronism_✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
You contradict yourself. You are saying not to blame the elite players and streamers, and immediately state everyone needs to work on their rotation for the highest DPS.Personally I think ESO would actually be better off without some of the streamers and elite players. They are holding the game back by forcing the barswapping LA weaving playstyle upon everyone. If everyone could reach endgame, with any number of playstyles(no more DPS gap), more players would stick around and the endgame would be much more lively. Which would also allow for the endgame to keep growing. Right now noone really flows into the endgame, which makes it hard for players to stick with an MMO. As endgame is where you want to be at as a player, regardless of skilllevel. And if you can't get there, there is no point in playing the game.
This makes it so players only flow out of the game, instead of into the game and endgame. Causing the playerbase to dwindle bit by bit.
And I do agree ZOS should look at PTS criticism more, as that is where they can still change important issues before implementing them on the live servers. Other than that I feel ZOS's communication is alright for an MMO company. (Keep in mind, they have to get greenlit for any communication they do, and there are behind-the-scene things they can't tell us)
There are issues with the game, some even important/major issues. These important/major issues should be fixed ASAP, so the game's foundation will pull even more players in. But ZOS is still releasing quite a bit of content, and are releasing new systems every now and then. So from where I'm sitting, the game looks like it will only get better.
PS: I play through the standalone client.
Blaming the streamers and "elite" players for bad patches and holding the game back is so unfair. They're not the developers who make the decisions of adding stuff in the game... they're players just like you and I. As far as animation canceling and LA weaving... this is caused by a broken combat system that ZOS still hasn't fixed yet.
There is nothing holding back anyone from playing end gaming content... however, you do need to work on your rotation and improving yourself and your gear... If you have bad DPS... It's all on you... not the streamer's fault, not the elite player's fault.. its your fault for not understanding your class. Instead of hiring people to do XP/power level runs in skyreach/ Blackrose Prison arena... level up your character in a normal sense.
The game needs more playstyles, like the original oakensoul and HA builds, but every time ZOS releases a new playstyle.... guess who wants it nerfed for reasons. So yes, it is the elite and streamers holding this game back, especially if you consider most of the playerbase does not perform the barswapping LA weaving playstyle. Whatever their reasons for not wanting to do the barswapping LA weaving playstyle, they do not do it. (personally I find it buttonsmashing and looks stupid)
Nah dude. It aint. Its the mid level elistist wannabes. End game discovered ha builds lol. Where you think that came from, some pc number cruncher sat down with tooltips and logs. It saw a ton of use by end gamers for ages. Frankly i was happy to have decent dps in random dungeons. Heck the streamers where literally disseminating the information for how to make these builds. Problem is y'all dont know what even constitutes end game. I dont care if you hit 90k on your sorc. Thats great, more power to ya, i helped some of my friends farm gear for theirs. I like my 2 bar. Nothing against oaken. Problem is folks who git 80 on a 2bar and are mad that one bars hit harder then them. Why would 90k bother me when i hit 113+. Iv done leaning runs with a lot of new raiders. It made me happy that they could have a chance to learn. End game is a very small community. Of my guilds in game all of them have a dozen or more overlapping players. On discord i couldnt even count if i tried. The actual end game are by far the most helpful ive ever met. Joe shmo in crag that just got his first vhofhm and is screamin at ppl to git gud suddenly is not endgame.
So yeah.. thats wrong... and crazy bias..
And btw: if you think LA weaving is button mashing you are 100% doing it wrong. Everything needs to be tapped in order. Think of it as a super long combo in fighting game.Edited by boi_anachronism_ on September 3, 2023 8:09PM24 -
Aka_✭✭✭✭✭I think I want to reign in the conversation a little bit here. What I meant to call to the attention of anyone capable of making change that soulless corporate decisions are hurting the game's community and future retention of a playerbase. Personally, I have entered endgame content and get to experience something altogether more interesting and challenging, which is a treat. This started as a heavy attack build and has evolved to 2 bar parsing or trifecta healing. However, I see more and more signs that the way we are talked to, or more often ignored, has consequences on new players and veterans alike.
While I found last chapter to be a fresh experience and even praised the work done by the developers on the overall experience, it's also hard to ignore the distrust between the company and the community. This means that players are, over time, given fewer chances to feel heard and have content reflect the desires of the many. Companies with purely short term profits in mind won't look at what the player wants if that is, say, a years-old combat bug, versus more focus on microtransactions, such as the crown store. One of many examples out there, but I'm not interested in going specific here. There are plenty of example on the forums of this imbalance between what is needed and truly desired versus what is provided or not.
I believe the developers tend to be restrained in what they are allowed to dedicate their resources towards. I also feel that constraints on imaginative storylines, mechanics, enemies, and housing concepts hurts their vision as well. And I imagine they are frustrated with the bugs we are frustrated with (at least, I'd like to think they are if they do actually play the game). It just appears as though this issue is enhanced by frustrating constraints on what they are allowed to communicate or do in general. If a development doesn't turn the quickest, easiest profits, it is likely scrapped.
Finally, I want to reiterate that communication always needs to improve. I think what a few managers, such as Kevin, do is a good start, but we can't be complacent on this front. People, especially players of the takes they love, are often searching for more from the creators of games on what it's like, what decisions are exciting to developers, what limits they're grappling with, and whether we are truly being heard on. Until a time where we can receive an actual, permanent and genuine improvement to the communication style we must struggle against, I do not see the attitude between us and those in charge of moving this game forward (or holding it back sometimes) improving healthily.
8 -
Kiyonami✭✭✭
You contradict yourself. You are saying not to blame the elite players and streamers, and immediately state everyone needs to work on their rotation for the highest DPS.Personally I think ESO would actually be better off without some of the streamers and elite players. They are holding the game back by forcing the barswapping LA weaving playstyle upon everyone. If everyone could reach endgame, with any number of playstyles(no more DPS gap), more players would stick around and the endgame would be much more lively. Which would also allow for the endgame to keep growing. Right now noone really flows into the endgame, which makes it hard for players to stick with an MMO. As endgame is where you want to be at as a player, regardless of skilllevel. And if you can't get there, there is no point in playing the game.
This makes it so players only flow out of the game, instead of into the game and endgame. Causing the playerbase to dwindle bit by bit.
And I do agree ZOS should look at PTS criticism more, as that is where they can still change important issues before implementing them on the live servers. Other than that I feel ZOS's communication is alright for an MMO company. (Keep in mind, they have to get greenlit for any communication they do, and there are behind-the-scene things they can't tell us)
There are issues with the game, some even important/major issues. These important/major issues should be fixed ASAP, so the game's foundation will pull even more players in. But ZOS is still releasing quite a bit of content, and are releasing new systems every now and then. So from where I'm sitting, the game looks like it will only get better.
PS: I play through the standalone client.
Blaming the streamers and "elite" players for bad patches and holding the game back is so unfair. They're not the developers who make the decisions of adding stuff in the game... they're players just like you and I. As far as animation canceling and LA weaving... this is caused by a broken combat system that ZOS still hasn't fixed yet.
There is nothing holding back anyone from playing end gaming content... however, you do need to work on your rotation and improving yourself and your gear... If you have bad DPS... It's all on you... not the streamer's fault, not the elite player's fault.. its your fault for not understanding your class. Instead of hiring people to do XP/power level runs in skyreach/ Blackrose Prison arena... level up your character in a normal sense.
The game needs more playstyles, like the original oakensoul and HA builds, but every time ZOS releases a new playstyle.... guess who wants it nerfed for reasons. So yes, it is the elite and streamers holding this game back, especially if you consider most of the playerbase does not perform the barswapping LA weaving playstyle. Whatever their reasons for not wanting to do the barswapping LA weaving playstyle, they do not do it. (personally I find it buttonsmashing and looks stupid)
Completely agree with everything said. The game really lacks playstyles, for most LA weaving is a meta, the benchmark by which players are judged... And everything would be fine if both categories of players would not be separated because of this. After all, those who successfully use LA weaving think other players are sucks. That's why game needs more playstyles. This will allow more players to be involved in the gameplay. Then the "Elitists" will stop measuring people with DPS numbers (every month more and more often I saw how players are labeled as an outsider because they do not use LA weaving and meta sets and this is a terrible and toxic attitude...)
I've been playing since the beta test. But I don't know how to use LA weaving, and I don't like the whole concept of such a playstyle, it doesn't bring me fun and pleasure (Oh yeah, trying to use weaving with ~300ms ping is already hurting yourself). I really love ESO, but a couple of months ago I stopped playing and uninstalled the game... When the game starts to become work and no longer fun, it's time to stop to keep the brightest and most pleasant memories.
Those who like LA weaving - great, play and enjoy, I'm not asking to take away this feature from the game, but please stop telling other players that they are playing "wrong", saying "go learn" or "delete the game".Edited by Kiyonami on September 3, 2023 11:14PM17 -
Lags✭✭✭✭✭
✭
You contradict yourself. You are saying not to blame the elite players and streamers, and immediately state everyone needs to work on their rotation for the highest DPS.Personally I think ESO would actually be better off without some of the streamers and elite players. They are holding the game back by forcing the barswapping LA weaving playstyle upon everyone. If everyone could reach endgame, with any number of playstyles(no more DPS gap), more players would stick around and the endgame would be much more lively. Which would also allow for the endgame to keep growing. Right now noone really flows into the endgame, which makes it hard for players to stick with an MMO. As endgame is where you want to be at as a player, regardless of skilllevel. And if you can't get there, there is no point in playing the game.
This makes it so players only flow out of the game, instead of into the game and endgame. Causing the playerbase to dwindle bit by bit.
And I do agree ZOS should look at PTS criticism more, as that is where they can still change important issues before implementing them on the live servers. Other than that I feel ZOS's communication is alright for an MMO company. (Keep in mind, they have to get greenlit for any communication they do, and there are behind-the-scene things they can't tell us)
There are issues with the game, some even important/major issues. These important/major issues should be fixed ASAP, so the game's foundation will pull even more players in. But ZOS is still releasing quite a bit of content, and are releasing new systems every now and then. So from where I'm sitting, the game looks like it will only get better.
PS: I play through the standalone client.
Blaming the streamers and "elite" players for bad patches and holding the game back is so unfair. They're not the developers who make the decisions of adding stuff in the game... they're players just like you and I. As far as animation canceling and LA weaving... this is caused by a broken combat system that ZOS still hasn't fixed yet.
There is nothing holding back anyone from playing end gaming content... however, you do need to work on your rotation and improving yourself and your gear... If you have bad DPS... It's all on you... not the streamer's fault, not the elite player's fault.. its your fault for not understanding your class. Instead of hiring people to do XP/power level runs in skyreach/ Blackrose Prison arena... level up your character in a normal sense.
The game needs more playstyles, like the original oakensoul and HA builds, but every time ZOS releases a new playstyle.... guess who wants it nerfed for reasons. So yes, it is the elite and streamers holding this game back, especially if you consider most of the playerbase does not perform the barswapping LA weaving playstyle. Whatever their reasons for not wanting to do the barswapping LA weaving playstyle, they do not do it. (personally I find it buttonsmashing and looks stupid)
lol yes its button mashing. God forbid people learn how to play the game and then begin to play faster after a while. Its like those pesky kids that play on the basketball team and are really good. I just want to sit like a stump in the middle of the court and shoot the ball every so often, but those guys put in effort and ruin the game. Everyone should enjoy their hobbies like i do.
But really this is the fault of zos. If rewards were better across the board there would be no need for people to complain. Because low effort players would be able to get mounts and other things without complaining that these things are locked behind content that they cant do.
And I dont think many end game players cared about heavy attack builds. If a low effort heavy attack build pulls 80k dps, and a high effort weaving build pulls 120-130k dps, im fine with that. You should never be on par with players putting in waaay more effort, but you should still be able to participate if you go through the effort of getting the gear, upgrading it, and learning what to do, even though it is very basic. You can do almost anything with 80k dps, this game is way more mechanics based.
I played a heavy attack sorc for a bit. And arcanist is less effort and more damage. You guys already got your way, just look at arcanist. Zos is already going in this direction. But you view small nerfs as they only care about end game players. You're wrong. 95% of the game is made for casual players. And what did you have before oakensoul?
I wonder how a player who had 20k dps before oakensoul could then turn around and say zos only cares about the end came community. You guys have won, zos is making this game for you while leaving a tiny piece of it for "competitive" pve/pvp players that want to put in effort and challenge themselves a little bit.
And thats why things will only go down hill. Because despite what you think many people like to be challenged. Many people like to have things to aspire to. Many people like to put in some effort and be rewarded properly. The popularity of games like osrs, classic wow, and others, should be telling enough. And when that doesnt exist things can get very stale very fast for a lot of players. But time will tell.10 -
Tannus15✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
You contradict yourself. You are saying not to blame the elite players and streamers, and immediately state everyone needs to work on their rotation for the highest DPS.Personally I think ESO would actually be better off without some of the streamers and elite players. They are holding the game back by forcing the barswapping LA weaving playstyle upon everyone. If everyone could reach endgame, with any number of playstyles(no more DPS gap), more players would stick around and the endgame would be much more lively. Which would also allow for the endgame to keep growing. Right now noone really flows into the endgame, which makes it hard for players to stick with an MMO. As endgame is where you want to be at as a player, regardless of skilllevel. And if you can't get there, there is no point in playing the game.
This makes it so players only flow out of the game, instead of into the game and endgame. Causing the playerbase to dwindle bit by bit.
And I do agree ZOS should look at PTS criticism more, as that is where they can still change important issues before implementing them on the live servers. Other than that I feel ZOS's communication is alright for an MMO company. (Keep in mind, they have to get greenlit for any communication they do, and there are behind-the-scene things they can't tell us)
There are issues with the game, some even important/major issues. These important/major issues should be fixed ASAP, so the game's foundation will pull even more players in. But ZOS is still releasing quite a bit of content, and are releasing new systems every now and then. So from where I'm sitting, the game looks like it will only get better.
PS: I play through the standalone client.
Blaming the streamers and "elite" players for bad patches and holding the game back is so unfair. They're not the developers who make the decisions of adding stuff in the game... they're players just like you and I. As far as animation canceling and LA weaving... this is caused by a broken combat system that ZOS still hasn't fixed yet.
There is nothing holding back anyone from playing end gaming content... however, you do need to work on your rotation and improving yourself and your gear... If you have bad DPS... It's all on you... not the streamer's fault, not the elite player's fault.. its your fault for not understanding your class. Instead of hiring people to do XP/power level runs in skyreach/ Blackrose Prison arena... level up your character in a normal sense.
The game needs more playstyles, like the original oakensoul and HA builds, but every time ZOS releases a new playstyle.... guess who wants it nerfed for reasons. So yes, it is the elite and streamers holding this game back, especially if you consider most of the playerbase does not perform the barswapping LA weaving playstyle. Whatever their reasons for not wanting to do the barswapping LA weaving playstyle, they do not do it. (personally I find it buttonsmashing and looks stupid)
Completely agree with everything said. The game really lacks playstyles, for most LA weaving is a meta, the benchmark by which players are judged... And everything would be fine if both categories of players would not be separated because of this. After all, those who successfully use LA weaving think other players are sucks. That's why game needs more playstyles. This will allow more players to be involved in the gameplay. Then the "Elitists" will stop measuring people with DPS numbers (every month more and more often I saw how players are labeled as an outsider because they do not use LA weaving and meta sets and this is a terrible and toxic attitude...)
I've been playing since the beta test. But I don't know how to use LA weaving, and I don't like the whole concept of such a playstyle, it doesn't bring me fun and pleasure (Oh yeah, trying to use weaving with ~300ms ping is already hurting yourself). I really love ESO, but a couple of months ago I stopped playing and uninstalled the game... When the game starts to become work and no longer fun, it's time to stop to keep the brightest and most pleasant memories.
Those who like LA weaving - great, play and enjoy, I'm not asking to take away this feature from the game, but please stop telling other players that they are playing "wrong", saying "go learn" or "delete the game".
[snip] they literally just added a new class for which light weaving is so unimportant the mythic which NERFS YOUR LIGHT ATTACK DAMAGE is BIS.
Drop your false narrative about light attack weaving being so super duper important or that end game players are gate keeping.
I've got some really bad news for you, no one cares how you do your dps.
People only care how much dps you do. ESOLogs trumps dummy parses everytime. If you're being told you're not good enough, it's probably because you don't do enough dps. No one it checking your light attack / skill ratio. they are looking at the dps chart and thinking "maybe that guy would like some advice" and then you're coming back at them all "I PLAY HOW I WANT ELITIST!"
let me give you a hint:
if you're the 8% then you are being carried.
If I was the 8% you'd be damn sure I'd be looking to improve so that 11 other people aren't having to make up for my short comings.
[edited for profanity bypass]Edited by ZOS_Icy on September 4, 2023 10:38AM22 -
Tannus15✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭The last update was kind of a failure. A quality of life update did not really show noticable improvements to a LOT of aspects of the game that players have specifically requested for months or even years.
this is quite interesting. there were literally hundreds of bug fixes, pages and pages of fixes for the game and it honestly feels like the tip of the ice berg.
I can't think of anything that underlines how off the rails the development process has become over the past 6 years of constant releases every quarter than the fact the tech debt and backlog was not being looked at or cleared AT ALL.
There must be millions of logged issues by now. I wouldn't be surprised if the scope of the problem is so big that there isn't a running joke of just chucking the latest issue on the pile of things they aren't going to do.8 -
Sarannah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Personally I would want the endgame to have atleast a few dozen different playstyles, so everyone can have one. Without making it seem like everyone only uses the same playstyle.
Some ideas:
Mythic 1: Gear has no effect, cannot use skills, fist attacks deal 25k base damage. (unarmed)
Mythic 2: Cannot use skills, light attacks deal 15k base damage per hit.
Mythic 3: When wearing a helmet your attacks have 50% chance to blind you, causing you to miss your target, attacks deal 120% more damage.
Mythic 4: Your shield counts as a second weapon but without damage, and can be used to dual wield. Attacks involving your shield deal 40% increased damage.
Mythic 5: Without any CP's allocated, gain 15% increased resistances, defenses, and damage.
Etc, etc, so many new builds/playstyles could be unlocked this way. And this is just through mythics, ZOS could use other means to create playstyles.
PS: Took this from another thread where I posted these playstyle ideas. Even if they are not top tier, they can be fun for certain players.2 -
JanTanhide✭✭✭✭✭
✭It's not other the players fault there's only a few ways to gain enough DPS to comfortly get through endgame content.
I know players that used to do weekly training runs with people. I have massive respect for them. Most people eventually get tired of spending 3-4 hours of their free time on players that refuse to want to get better gear or practice their rotation.
Let's be honest; if you want to finish endgame content, but you don't want to farm endgame gear or practice endgame rotations, then you just want to get carried.
I don't blame anyone that doesn't want to be a free carrier in their free time.
THIS! 100%. Too many people just want the game to be so easy they can walk through Vet content eating a hamburger and pushing one button as they go. Nope, get good or don't complain about those of us who have spent thousands of hours doing dungeon and trial runs to get the best gear and learn the game's mechanics.3 -
Kiyonami✭✭✭
You contradict yourself. You are saying not to blame the elite players and streamers, and immediately state everyone needs to work on their rotation for the highest DPS.Personally I think ESO would actually be better off without some of the streamers and elite players. They are holding the game back by forcing the barswapping LA weaving playstyle upon everyone. If everyone could reach endgame, with any number of playstyles(no more DPS gap), more players would stick around and the endgame would be much more lively. Which would also allow for the endgame to keep growing. Right now noone really flows into the endgame, which makes it hard for players to stick with an MMO. As endgame is where you want to be at as a player, regardless of skilllevel. And if you can't get there, there is no point in playing the game.
This makes it so players only flow out of the game, instead of into the game and endgame. Causing the playerbase to dwindle bit by bit.
And I do agree ZOS should look at PTS criticism more, as that is where they can still change important issues before implementing them on the live servers. Other than that I feel ZOS's communication is alright for an MMO company. (Keep in mind, they have to get greenlit for any communication they do, and there are behind-the-scene things they can't tell us)
There are issues with the game, some even important/major issues. These important/major issues should be fixed ASAP, so the game's foundation will pull even more players in. But ZOS is still releasing quite a bit of content, and are releasing new systems every now and then. So from where I'm sitting, the game looks like it will only get better.
PS: I play through the standalone client.
Blaming the streamers and "elite" players for bad patches and holding the game back is so unfair. They're not the developers who make the decisions of adding stuff in the game... they're players just like you and I. As far as animation canceling and LA weaving... this is caused by a broken combat system that ZOS still hasn't fixed yet.
There is nothing holding back anyone from playing end gaming content... however, you do need to work on your rotation and improving yourself and your gear... If you have bad DPS... It's all on you... not the streamer's fault, not the elite player's fault.. its your fault for not understanding your class. Instead of hiring people to do XP/power level runs in skyreach/ Blackrose Prison arena... level up your character in a normal sense.
The game needs more playstyles, like the original oakensoul and HA builds, but every time ZOS releases a new playstyle.... guess who wants it nerfed for reasons. So yes, it is the elite and streamers holding this game back, especially if you consider most of the playerbase does not perform the barswapping LA weaving playstyle. Whatever their reasons for not wanting to do the barswapping LA weaving playstyle, they do not do it. (personally I find it buttonsmashing and looks stupid)
Completely agree with everything said. The game really lacks playstyles, for most LA weaving is a meta, the benchmark by which players are judged... And everything would be fine if both categories of players would not be separated because of this. After all, those who successfully use LA weaving think other players are sucks. That's why game needs more playstyles. This will allow more players to be involved in the gameplay. Then the "Elitists" will stop measuring people with DPS numbers (every month more and more often I saw how players are labeled as an outsider because they do not use LA weaving and meta sets and this is a terrible and toxic attitude...)
I've been playing since the beta test. But I don't know how to use LA weaving, and I don't like the whole concept of such a playstyle, it doesn't bring me fun and pleasure (Oh yeah, trying to use weaving with ~300ms ping is already hurting yourself). I really love ESO, but a couple of months ago I stopped playing and uninstalled the game... When the game starts to become work and no longer fun, it's time to stop to keep the brightest and most pleasant memories.
Those who like LA weaving - great, play and enjoy, I'm not asking to take away this feature from the game, but please stop telling other players that they are playing "wrong", saying "go learn" or "delete the game".
[snip] they literally just added a new class for which light weaving is so unimportant the mythic which NERFS YOUR LIGHT ATTACK DAMAGE is BIS.
Drop your false narrative about light attack weaving being so super duper important or that end game players are gate keeping.
I've got some really bad news for you, no one cares how you do your dps.
People only care how much dps you do. ESOLogs trumps dummy parses everytime. If you're being told you're not good enough, it's probably because you don't do enough dps. No one it checking your light attack / skill ratio. they are looking at the dps chart and thinking "maybe that guy would like some advice" and then you're coming back at them all "I PLAY HOW I WANT ELITIST!"
let me give you a hint:
if you're the 8% then you are being carried.
If I was the 8% you'd be damn sure I'd be looking to improve so that 11 other people aren't having to make up for my short comings.
[edited for profanity bypass]
Dealing damage is directly related to playstyle. Either you use a meta build, or you add weaving, or you are among the outsiders. The player does not have the opportunity to play as he wants, no choice of playstyle to play comfortably and at an acceptable effective DPS level.
You say - People only care how much dps you do - that's another problem. Numbers, numbers, numbers... People come to play a game, not to a math class. Dummy parses is another one of the things that separates the players. Players like you will never understand that if, for example, killing the boss for 5-7 minutes longer - For me personally that don’t make any difference, and it doesn’t matter to me if I deal 15% damage, and someone else 8%, for all the years of the game I never think about that... That never mattered to me.
I have always believed that the stronger player should help the weaker one. But apparently the personal ego and the thirst for superiority over others won. I don’t know about you, but personally I don’t want to force myself to play by the rules invented by someone, bypassing my moral principles.Edited by Kiyonami on September 4, 2023 4:48PM12 -
Jierdanit✭✭✭✭✭
✭
You contradict yourself. You are saying not to blame the elite players and streamers, and immediately state everyone needs to work on their rotation for the highest DPS.Personally I think ESO would actually be better off without some of the streamers and elite players. They are holding the game back by forcing the barswapping LA weaving playstyle upon everyone. If everyone could reach endgame, with any number of playstyles(no more DPS gap), more players would stick around and the endgame would be much more lively. Which would also allow for the endgame to keep growing. Right now noone really flows into the endgame, which makes it hard for players to stick with an MMO. As endgame is where you want to be at as a player, regardless of skilllevel. And if you can't get there, there is no point in playing the game.
This makes it so players only flow out of the game, instead of into the game and endgame. Causing the playerbase to dwindle bit by bit.
And I do agree ZOS should look at PTS criticism more, as that is where they can still change important issues before implementing them on the live servers. Other than that I feel ZOS's communication is alright for an MMO company. (Keep in mind, they have to get greenlit for any communication they do, and there are behind-the-scene things they can't tell us)
There are issues with the game, some even important/major issues. These important/major issues should be fixed ASAP, so the game's foundation will pull even more players in. But ZOS is still releasing quite a bit of content, and are releasing new systems every now and then. So from where I'm sitting, the game looks like it will only get better.
PS: I play through the standalone client.
Blaming the streamers and "elite" players for bad patches and holding the game back is so unfair. They're not the developers who make the decisions of adding stuff in the game... they're players just like you and I. As far as animation canceling and LA weaving... this is caused by a broken combat system that ZOS still hasn't fixed yet.
There is nothing holding back anyone from playing end gaming content... however, you do need to work on your rotation and improving yourself and your gear... If you have bad DPS... It's all on you... not the streamer's fault, not the elite player's fault.. its your fault for not understanding your class. Instead of hiring people to do XP/power level runs in skyreach/ Blackrose Prison arena... level up your character in a normal sense.
The game needs more playstyles, like the original oakensoul and HA builds, but every time ZOS releases a new playstyle.... guess who wants it nerfed for reasons. So yes, it is the elite and streamers holding this game back, especially if you consider most of the playerbase does not perform the barswapping LA weaving playstyle. Whatever their reasons for not wanting to do the barswapping LA weaving playstyle, they do not do it. (personally I find it buttonsmashing and looks stupid)
Completely agree with everything said. The game really lacks playstyles, for most LA weaving is a meta, the benchmark by which players are judged... And everything would be fine if both categories of players would not be separated because of this. After all, those who successfully use LA weaving think other players are sucks. That's why game needs more playstyles. This will allow more players to be involved in the gameplay. Then the "Elitists" will stop measuring people with DPS numbers (every month more and more often I saw how players are labeled as an outsider because they do not use LA weaving and meta sets and this is a terrible and toxic attitude...)
I've been playing since the beta test. But I don't know how to use LA weaving, and I don't like the whole concept of such a playstyle, it doesn't bring me fun and pleasure (Oh yeah, trying to use weaving with ~300ms ping is already hurting yourself). I really love ESO, but a couple of months ago I stopped playing and uninstalled the game... When the game starts to become work and no longer fun, it's time to stop to keep the brightest and most pleasant memories.
Those who like LA weaving - great, play and enjoy, I'm not asking to take away this feature from the game, but please stop telling other players that they are playing "wrong", saying "go learn" or "delete the game".
[snip] they literally just added a new class for which light weaving is so unimportant the mythic which NERFS YOUR LIGHT ATTACK DAMAGE is BIS.
Drop your false narrative about light attack weaving being so super duper important or that end game players are gate keeping.
I've got some really bad news for you, no one cares how you do your dps.
People only care how much dps you do. ESOLogs trumps dummy parses everytime. If you're being told you're not good enough, it's probably because you don't do enough dps. No one it checking your light attack / skill ratio. they are looking at the dps chart and thinking "maybe that guy would like some advice" and then you're coming back at them all "I PLAY HOW I WANT ELITIST!"
let me give you a hint:
if you're the 8% then you are being carried.
If I was the 8% you'd be damn sure I'd be looking to improve so that 11 other people aren't having to make up for my short comings.
[edited for profanity bypass]
Dealing damage is directly related to playstyle. Either you use a meta build, or you add weaving, or you are among the outsiders. The player does not have the opportunity to play as he wants, no choice of playstyle to play comfortably and at an acceptable effective DPS level.
You say - People only care how much dps you do - that's another problem. Numbers, numbers, numbers... People come to play a game, not to a math class. Dummy parses is another one of the things that separates the players. Players like you will never understand that if, for example, killing the boss for 5-7 minutes longer - I personally don’t make any difference, and it doesn’t matter to me if I deal 15% damage, and someone else 8%, for all the years of the game I never I didn't think about it, it never mattered to me.
I have always believed that the stronger player should help the weaker one. But apparently the personal ego and the thirst for superiority over others won. I don’t know about you, but personally I don’t want to force myself to play by the rules invented by someone, bypassing my moral principles.
If you dont want to do what is necessary to get to the highest levels of DPS, etc. in the game that is perfectly fine, as long as you dont expect people to still take you into areas where its necessary.
You can do basically all the content in the game without the need for weaving and with a build you like, since most of it is pretty easy.
However if you want to do HM trials and scorepushing, you cant expect people to take you into their group if you provide less than someone else who does run meta builds and is weaving.
You just cant play in a suboptimal way and expect to be able to take part in the areas of the game for which you need to do the best possible DPS.PC/EU, StamSorc Main17