Why Sorcerer is Still Awesome

Supreme_Atromancer · August 2023

After 9 years, I still find sorcerer to be my favourite class. Neither introduction of Warden, Necromancer or Arcanist, nor the coming and going of the BiS metas/"viability" have changed that for me.

A couple of years ago, one of the developers mentioned that Sorcerer and Nightblade were the most popular classes. Although various mechanical reasons and ease of play/accessibility are considered significant reasons for that (particularly for sorcerer), I think that a possibly overlooked reason is that these two classes capture the feel of classic Elder Scrolls character archetypes (at least, conceptually); if a large number of the player base are recruited from the classic Elder Scrolls games, it stands to reason they might gravitate to classes that would feel like Elder Scrolls characters.

Sorcerer gives me the best possibility of playing a classic mage. I absolutely love the iconic Hardened Ward in both gameplay and visuals- it feels like the mage's answer to damage mitigation and is drawn straight from Morrowind's "xth Barrier" spells. I hope they never change the visuals for it.

Twilight cops a lot of flack (its a hotbutton topic for the forum-goers), but I've always loved it. Its a core identity spell for sorcerers, and I'd hate to lose it. Its another possibility that they drew from Morrowind, and I love having it. I empathise with people who find the fluttering annoying, but I hope that ZOS remembers that although you don't see it where all the raging and fuming happens on the forums, many playing the game still treasure it.

I've said it before, elsewhere; the image above illustrates the Twilight's method of getting around in Morrowind- the game in which it first made an appearance. I do think it would be a good compromise to have them earthbound like this, taking only to wing when in combat or when their controller is sprinting. The new models of "walking" Twilights in Apocrypha might suggest the developers are thinking this way, too.

Honourable mentions for Mage's Wrath (which is a powerful Daggerfall spell, and perfect as an execute), scamp (though he should not be purple!), and curse/frags/mines (because the gameplay niche was fun and iconic).

The only thing I've never liked was a line dedicated to an energy type (Lightning), because it restricts them too much. Mages in the older games were masters of *all* elements, or specialist in *any*. Trying to make a build that ignores the prime importance of lightning to the class's toolkit gimps you unnecessarily.

I'm glad to hear that the Arcanist was a huge success, and happy that a lot of people are having a lot of fun. Its natural that people have begun to ask about the older classes, going forward. I just hope that if that's done its not done in a way that would obliterate the things some of us really cherish.

SilverIce58 · August 2023

I agree, and I'm glad to hear someone else loves the class too. I love my other characters, but I always come back to my Sorc. First character I made when the game first started, and I still have him.

XxCaLxX · August 2023

I still really like the sorc class also. I just don't like pets. My original sorc is still my "main toon" that I like to make sure I collect all new motifs and prints on but I find myself always playing blade or arcanist now and occasional warden healer. Sorc is definitely the most created class because like you said it's really easy to play and learn for new ppl and also the thousands and thousands that are created by bots. I have never saw another bot that wasn't a sorc and I understand why but for me just always seeing so many sorcs makes it even less desirable to play.

ZOS_Icy · August 2023

Greetings,

This thread has been moved to the Combat & Character Mechanics section, as it is better suited there.

Thank you for your understanding.

SilverIce58 · August 2023

ZOS_Icy wrote: »

Greetings,

This thread has been moved to the Combat & Character Mechanics section, as it is better suited there.

Thank you for your understanding.

With respect, it should stay in general or be pushed to Community Creations.

AcadianPaladin · August 2023

@Supreme_Atromancer I think it's great that you have a class you really enjoy and suits how you like to play!

ZhuJiuyin · August 2023

I also like Sorc, but it's sad that Magic Sorc is still struggling and at the bottom no matter in PvP or PVE.
In U39's VSE HM, all eso logs are about Stam Sorc, none of them are Magic Sorc. They don't even use staffs, but bows and daggers.
What's more ironic is that among the 12 skills (two bars: 5+ ultimate), 4~5 skills do not belong to Sorc's Classes skill line.

Sorc needs a complete overhaul, the Dark magic skill line, most skills and passives are outdated and rarely used, except for shards, almost no one uses Dark magic skills. The same is true for the storm skill line, Sorc has very few sources of practical Shock damage, and most of them are only related to pets (Twilight Matriarch, Volatile Familiar, Atronach). And Boundless Storm, Lightning Splash, and Overload are rarely used in PVE, or even not used at all.

I suggest：
1. Let Shattering Prison become the Sorcer version of the elemental wall. After casting, it will cause a direct damage + continuous damage for 20 seconds, and after receiving continuous damage for 2 seconds, let the target Off Balance or immobilize enemies. And While slotted, gives Major Savagery and Prophecy.

2.Unholy Knowledge and Persistence should be merged and give new passive
For example, when Sorc uses Dark magic to cause Disabling Effects, Partially Disabling Effects, increase X% crit for Y seconds.
In this way, since most BOSS have the ability to resist Disabling Effects and Partially Disabling Effects, this new passive will not be too powerful in PVE.
But it can well make up for the crit that Sorc lacks in PVP, and it can also enhance the use efficiency of Critical Surge.

3. Turn Boundless Storm into continuous damage on the target, similar to Wardens' Growing Swarm. Let Boundless Storm cause continuous damage to the target, and Shock damage to the surroundings every two seconds, and continuously restore player magic or stam (based on the maximum resource).

4. Expert Mage should increase from the current 2% Weapon and Spell Damage to 3%, which is the same as Fighters Guild's passive. Reduce Sorc's passive dependence on Fighters Guild, and encourage players to use Sorc's Classes skills more

LittlePinkDot · August 2023

Supreme_Atromancer wrote: »

After 9 years, I still find sorcerer to be my favourite class. Neither introduction of Warden, Necromancer or Arcanist, nor the coming and going of the BiS metas/"viability" have changed that for me.

A couple of years ago, one of the developers mentioned that Sorcerer and Nightblade were the most popular classes. Although various mechanical reasons and ease of play/accessibility are considered significant reasons for that (particularly for sorcerer), I think that a possibly overlooked reason is that these two classes capture the feel of classic Elder Scrolls character archetypes (at least, conceptually); if a large number of the player base are recruited from the classic Elder Scrolls games, it stands to reason they might gravitate to classes that would feel like Elder Scrolls characters.

Sorcerer gives me the best possibility of playing a classic mage. I absolutely love the iconic Hardened Ward in both gameplay and visuals- it feels like the mage's answer to damage mitigation and is drawn straight from Morrowind's "xth Barrier" spells. I hope they never change the visuals for it.

Twilight cops a lot of flack (its a hotbutton topic for the forum-goers), but I've always loved it. Its a core identity spell for sorcerers, and I'd hate to lose it. Its another possibility that they drew from Morrowind, and I love having it. I empathise with people who find the fluttering annoying, but I hope that ZOS remembers that although you don't see it where all the raging and fuming happens on the forums, many playing the game still treasure it.

I've said it before, elsewhere; the image above illustrates the Twilight's method of getting around in Morrowind- the game in which it first made an appearance. I do think it would be a good compromise to have them earthbound like this, taking only to wing when in combat or when their controller is sprinting. The new models of "walking" Twilights in Apocrypha might suggest the developers are thinking this way, too.

Honourable mentions for Mage's Wrath (which is a powerful Daggerfall spell, and perfect as an execute), scamp (though he should not be purple!), and curse/frags/mines (because the gameplay niche was fun and iconic).

The only thing I've never liked was a line dedicated to an energy type (Lightning), because it restricts them too much. Mages in the older games were masters of *all* elements, or specialist in *any*. Trying to make a build that ignores the prime importance of lightning to the class's toolkit gimps you unnecessarily.

I'm glad to hear that the Arcanist was a huge success, and happy that a lot of people are having a lot of fun. Its natural that people have begun to ask about the older classes, going forward. I just hope that if that's done its not done in a way that would obliterate the things some of us really cherish.

Stamsorc is the best sorc!

Turtle_Bot · August 2023

Sorcerer as a concept is still really cool, but it's current iteration is just not what it used to be.

The idea of a fast paced mage no longer exists, to the point that you barely play the class anymore when going for that playstyle.

You are now either:
A Summoner:
With everything focused on pets and buffing them up while trying to provide some AoE from out of class abilities.
A left click build:
Hold down left click for heavy attacks while "weaving" skills once every few seconds between heavy attacks. This is currently the closest thing sorc has to a somewhat viable "lightning/arcane mage" that the class is supposed to be and even this requires the pets to actually perform remotely decent.
A proc carrier:
This is more stamsorc, but it holds true for magsorc as well. You no longer play the class, but instead try to stack up as many procs as you can on the enemy and hope they die before you do.

None of these involve actually playing the sorcerer as a class outside of pets, but that is using sorcerer as a summoner and not as a mage that it is supposed to be.

No-pet sorcs are a complete relic now, they don't exist as a class anymore, and those "petless sorcs" you see run around are now just a group of weapon/world skills with streak + crit surge thrown in there. It's a shame, because that elemental (lightning/arcane) mage playstyle was what originally drew me to sorcerer when I first started playing almost a decade ago.

I really hope the devs take a long hard look at the sorcerer class, especially no pet sorcerer and do something to truly bring it back. It has been far too long since that playstyle was viable and it has been in drastic need of huge reworks for years on end now.

Too bad there's no 'Sorcerer dev' like there is 'NB dev' to sneak in some nice reworks/buffs to the class every patch, even when it doesn't actually need any.

IndyMike26 · August 2023

I’ve played sorc for nearly 7 years, and I don’t like what they’ve done to it over that time. I want to play a MAG sorc. Not a stam sorc or a hybrid sorc with swords or daggers or ridiculous stamina based skills.

I remember the days when there were too many great sorc skills to place on your bar. Now, it feels like I have more weapon or non-sorc skills than sorc skills, and they pretty much gutted the ultimates to the point where I am usually better off with a non-sorc skill line ulti.

We keep getting forced into these ridiculous hybrid builds in order to compete at the higher levels or parse high enough to run in vet trials. I want the option to actually play as I want — as a mag sorc — not a stam sorc, not a hybrid sorc. This game used to have the motto of “play as you want,” but that has been lost for years at this point…

ZhuJiuyin · August 2023

There is no doubt that magic sorc needs more attention, more buffs and rework.
When I play sorc, I hope to use a staff to cast magic, and use dark magic and lightning to destroy the enemy, instead of using a bunch of skills that consume stam. Similarly, I don't want to run around in the world with a bow and dagger.
Pets are fun, but forcing sorc to use pets is boring, takes up our bar, and doesn't function as it should. How many people use Twilight Tormentor's skills in PVE?
The current magic sorc doesn't look like a user of dark magic or lightning magic at all. It's just... a summoner with two pets, and uses many non-classes skills, and doesn't even hold a staff.

The current Dark Magic and Storm Calling skills are very weak, and Suppression Field has low damage and needs to consume more ultimate points than Atronach. The Major Brutality and Major Sorcery time provided by the Surge (33 seconds) compared to the time provided by DK's Igneous Weapons (60 seconds, providing the team) is a joke.
Blood Magic, Persistence, Energized are obsolete and useless (or difficult to be triggered by magic skills), Magicka Recovery 10% provided by Capacitor, compared to Health and Stamina Recovery by 20% provided by Daedric Protection, Magicka Recovery provided is too little.

The magic sorc desperately needs of huge reworks/buffs! Please allow players to actually play as a sorc that uses magic, not a stitch monster holding a dagger or bow and shooting magic!

fizzylu · September 2023

I've always mained a sorcerer (mostly pvp) and it's very obvious he has fallen behind as the years have gone by. While I love the class, I do think it needs a slight rework. So many abilities feel useless and like they have no purpose, then the remotely useful ones we do have still don't feel very up-to-date with the direction Zenimax has taken combat. It always feels like I'm putting significantly more work and getting significantly less payoff playing a sorc (stam, magicka, or hybrid) compared to when I play other classes. To the point that I've wished I could change my mains class haha which is sad, because sorcerer truly is my favorite.... but it's more just in concept at this point, and not because of the actual gameplay.

kougaSarutobi · September 2023

I played sorcerer and I liked it a lot but I could find a good AOE ability tbh, someone correct me if I'm wrong please.

Thanks

Turtle_Bot · September 2023

kougaSarutobi wrote: »

I played sorcerer and I liked it a lot but I could find a good AOE ability tbh, someone correct me if I'm wrong please.

Thanks

You're not wrong there. Outside of heavy attack builds (which just got their AoE gutted this patch for majority of content) sorc is second (barely) to NB in having the worst cleave in the game.

Stamsorc has weapon abilities and being melee range has hurricane which helps a lot, but magsorc is just sweet out of luck when it comes to AoE.