Uh-oh; fun detected.
(Arcanist has been very fun to play.)

I've got a bad feeling about this...

Arcanist is nice with pale order, but I find it the same as using a heavy attack oakensoul lightninstaff combo when it comes to survival solo play.

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

Grizzbeorn wrote: »

Uh-oh; fun detected.
(Arcanist has been very fun to play.)

I've got a bad feeling about this...

Don’t worry, Arcanist is bad in PvP, so there‘s no need for nerfs.

If Arcanist is bad in PvP, then there must be a lot of non-Arcanist players who are worse than some of the Arcanist players.

Yes, there are. And that’s simply due to most players not having played an Arcanist yet and therefore they don’t know how to counter them. And countering them is super easy. Arcanist might shine in groups due to the extensive buffs it provides, but it’s severely lacking as a damage dealer in PvP especially in 1:1 situations.

And remember, if you’re playing one of the usual OP PvP builds and just use Arcanist for its buffs to support it, not the class is strong, those OP builds are (as they’re strong on basically every class, has nothing to do with Arcanist in the end).

I love my arc but its a sad day when the new class main dps channel does easily 2 - 3× the dmg of its closest counter part - tempar jabs. Not only that it comes with a shield and and massiv cleave.
I'm a temp main but the arc is just better in every way so il be sticking to that for the time being.

Seraphayel wrote: »

Syiccal wrote: »

I love my arc but its a sad day when the new class main dps channel does easily 2 - 3× the dmg of its closest counter part - tempar jabs. Not only that it comes with a shield and and massiv cleave.
I'm a temp main but the arc is just better in every way so il be sticking to that for the time being.

Jabs doesn’t need three Crux to do recognizable damage and Jabs also procs Burning Light very frequently. Plus it’s a way faster animation overall than the beam. The comparison is lacking, at best. Plus it‘s super easy to counter or interrupt the beam while countering Jabs is pretty much impossible.

I'm coming from a pve perspective to be fair. Amd 3 crux isn't an issue you almost always have it

LannStone wrote: »

Just thought that I'd report that I finally soloed my first Level 2 four-man dungeon on my arcanist (CP 1800, magicka)
Elden Hollow II, after never being able to get to the end on my other characters
Whatever arcanist's strengths and weaknesses in group content, I'd say the combination of damage, heals, stuns and mobility is pretty ideal for solo play

Honestly not at all. I agree it's fun and I agree it's different. It makes some content easier and, perhaps, more accessible as you are demonstrating with your post. On the other hand, was this vet? You didn't say. Either way, Elden Hollow 2 is not the measure of a good solo build. The two vet solo arenas are to some degree, but I'd say vet Scalecaller, which has been soloed on a heavy attack build, is harder than those. So is vet Blackrose Prison. Go into even just the first arena on vet and you'll find out what your build is really made of. Elden Hollow 2 is a nice achievement, but it cannot measure whether Arcanist is ideal for solo play at higher levels.

I like the idea of using Pragmatic as a shield, but I dare say you're not doing a lot of damage if you're using it that way. EDIT: I take that back. I really like the idea of getting a cheap shield this way if the shield procs immediately and not just after one second. However, if it's after one second, then it's useless in harder content or in PvP. Judging by how often my Fatecarver has gotten interrupted before it even starts, I would say the damage and the shield take 1 second to proc, but I could be wrong.

Depending on content, I bet a heavy attack build will beat a Fatecarver build, because the heavy attack stays on target, restores resources, and takes less time than Fatecarver while you can also cast a shield. In other situations, such as Blackrose Prison, a Master's 2H Brawler build beats the crap out of everything I have tried. The main problem I have with Arcanist is that it requires active healing (if you don't just spam Flail). That is IMO not easy to play compared to a magplar, who heals from Sweeps, for higher amounts than Flail in my experience, or a Brawlersorc, who is best described as a magplar on steroids. The Arcanist channel is far too long. You are open during that time, you can't bash, you can't block, and NPCs will interrupt you. Can I play it? Yes. Is it comfortable in even just normal Blackrose Prison solo? Hell no.

Does this mean I actually think Arcanist needs buffs? No. It shines in AOE situations and it's nice it's so different. That is IMO good class design. It's also cool how it suits some people, like you, and enables you to solo content you couldn't before. On the other hand take it into vet Blackrose Prison or vet Scalecaller solo and report back. I think you will find that Arcanist has limits and I believe those limits are real and will have everything to do with the class and not so much with your skill. If you play a Fatecarver build that is. You could obviously make a Master's 2H Brawler build on any class, though I suspect sorc is still the best for that. It has semi-passive Crit Surge healing (on top of the Pale Order option) and Dark Deal sustain, even if I give Arcanist credit for it's regen passives. You could obviously also make an Arc heavy attack build, though again I suspect sorc has the best passives for that.

fred4 wrote: »

LannStone wrote: »

Just thought that I'd report that I finally soloed my first Level 2 four-man dungeon on my arcanist (CP 1800, magicka)
Elden Hollow II, after never being able to get to the end on my other characters
Whatever arcanist's strengths and weaknesses in group content, I'd say the combination of damage, heals, stuns and mobility is pretty ideal for solo play

Honestly not at all. I agree it's fun and I agree it's different. It makes some content easier and, perhaps, more accessible as you are demonstrating with your post. On the other hand, was this vet? You didn't say. Either way, Elden Hollow 2 is not the measure of a good solo build. The two vet solo arenas are to some degree, but I'd say vet Scalecaller, which has been soloed on a heavy attack build, is harder than those. So is vet Blackrose Prison. Go into even just the first arena on vet and you'll find out what your build is really made of. Elden Hollow 2 is a nice achievement, but it cannot measure whether Arcanist is ideal for solo play at higher levels.

I like the idea of using Pragmatic as a shield, but I dare say you're not doing a lot of damage if you're using it that way. EDIT: I take that back. I really like the idea of getting a cheap shield this way if the shield procs immediately and not just after one second. However, if it's after one second, then it's useless in harder content or in PvP. Judging by how often my Fatecarver has gotten interrupted before it even starts, I would say the damage and the shield take 1 second to proc, but I could be wrong.

Depending on content, I bet a heavy attack build will beat a Fatecarver build, because the heavy attack stays on target, restores resources, and takes less time than Fatecarver while you can also cast a shield. In other situations, such as Blackrose Prison, a Master's 2H Brawler build beats the crap out of everything I have tried. The main problem I have with Arcanist is that it requires active healing (if you don't just spam Flail). That is IMO not easy to play compared to a magplar, who heals from Sweeps, for higher amounts than Flail in my experience, or a Brawlersorc, who is best described as a magplar on steroids. The Arcanist channel is far too long. You are open during that time, you can't bash, you can't block, and NPCs will interrupt you. Can I play it? Yes. Is it comfortable in even just normal Blackrose Prison solo? Hell no.

Does this mean I actually think Arcanist needs buffs? No. It shines in AOE situations and it's nice it's so different. That is IMO good class design. It's also cool how it suits some people, like you, and enables you to solo content you couldn't before. On the other hand take it into vet Blackrose Prison or vet Scalecaller solo and report back. I think you will find that Arcanist has limits and I believe those limits are real and will have everything to do with the class and not so much with your skill. If you play a Fatecarver build that is. You could obviously make a Master's 2H Brawler build on any class, though I suspect sorc is still the best for that. It has semi-passive Crit Surge healing (on top of the Pale Order option) and Dark Deal sustain, even if I give Arcanist credit for it's regen passives. You could obviously also make an Arc heavy attack build, though again I suspect sorc has the best passives for that.

It was normal Elden Hollow II
I realize there are other builds that for a long time have soloed the hardest vet dungeons
But I'm not comparing arcanist with "a good solo build"
I'm comparing arcanist with my performance of my other characters and saying I find it easier to solo dungeons with my skill level
I've been playing four years and have 33 characters on two accounts and have tried about every build but am slow and clumsy, which somehow the arcanist lets me survive better )
PS - another post moved out of General Discussion. What's General Discussion supposed to be about then anyway??