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Battlegrounds Solo Group Finder [STILL] Broken

El_Borracho
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Maybe even worse than before. Queued up for one yesterday. Dropped me on a team with one other player for Capture the Relic. Figured with the 20 seconds left on the timer until the match began, 2 more players would be joining us. NOPE. They didn't show up until about a minute into the match.

This wasn't an issue of players dropping out after being queued or after the match beginning. This was the match starting with two 4 man teams and one 2 man team. Yiu can guess how that match went.

How is this even possible? They don't stick a tank and healer into a dungeon on Group Finder, start the dungeon, then maybe have a couple of DDs show up later. Ridiculous.
Edited by ZOS_Phoenix on April 4, 2023 4:43PM
  • Jierdanit
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    Maybe even worse than before. Queued up for one yesterday. Dropped me on a team with one other player for Capture the Relic. Figured with the 20 seconds left on the timer until the match began, 2 more players would be joining us. NOPE. They didn't show up until about a minute into the match.

    This wasn't an issue of players dropping out after being queued or after the match beginning. This was the match starting with two 4 man teams and one 2 man team. Yiu can guess how that match went.

    How is this even possible? They don't stick a tank and healer into a dungeon on Group Finder, start the dungeon, then maybe have a couple of DDs show up later. Ridiculous.

    It is obviously possible because a BG starts even if people decline the queue, so you have to wait until more ppl queue up to fill the empty spaces.
    PC/EU, StamSorc Main
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  • El_Borracho
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    Jierdanit wrote: »
    Maybe even worse than before. Queued up for one yesterday. Dropped me on a team with one other player for Capture the Relic. Figured with the 20 seconds left on the timer until the match began, 2 more players would be joining us. NOPE. They didn't show up until about a minute into the match.

    This wasn't an issue of players dropping out after being queued or after the match beginning. This was the match starting with two 4 man teams and one 2 man team. Yiu can guess how that match went.

    How is this even possible? They don't stick a tank and healer into a dungeon on Group Finder, start the dungeon, then maybe have a couple of DDs show up later. Ridiculous.

    It is obviously possible because a BG starts even if people decline the queue, so you have to wait until more ppl queue up to fill the empty spaces.

    I realize its possible, as it happened, it was more a question of why this is possible. I think everyone would prefer waiting a minute longer to get 12 players, just as you have to wait for 4 players to start a dungeon through GF.

    I get that you can't prevent people from leaving once they get dropped into BGs, but that is a different scenario. This is poor design that continues to be poor design despite all of the other updates. Yay, I can pick up my daily pledges the same time I get mount training, but we still start a BG without 3 full teams, even though nobody queued and left. Heck, they could have made two 3 man teams and it would have been an improvement, but no, one 2 man team. LOL
    Edited by El_Borracho on April 4, 2023 4:16PM
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  • ZOS_Phoenix
    ZOS_Phoenix
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    Greetings,

    After further review we have decided to move this thread to a category we think is more appropriate for this topic.

    Thank you for your understanding.
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    Staff Post
  • CGPsaint
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    That's not the only problem. The solo queue should not be dropping you in against pre-made 4-man groups, which is clearly does. I'm tired of going in and getting absolutely raked over the coals by a highly optimized ball group while my other three teammates either sit in the spawn or run in 3 different directions.
    "Some enjoy bringing grief to others. They remind M'aiq of mudcrabs—horrible creatures, with no redeeming qualities."
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  • kwinter
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    So with queue once player accept they are considered in group even if they have not ported in. It’s likely they got stuck loading screen while the match start. They could have even dc trying to be port in.
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  • El_Borracho
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    CGPsaint wrote: »
    That's not the only problem. The solo queue should not be dropping you in against pre-made 4-man groups, which is clearly does. I'm tired of going in and getting absolutely raked over the coals by a highly optimized ball group while my other three teammates either sit in the spawn or run in 3 different directions.

    I have wondered about this from time to time. Some teams are just too organized for what is supposed to be a group of 12 randoms. I think I figured out how to do it. You get a 3 man team and queue up under the solo, which worked for my friends and I yesterday.

    Even still, I've been on teams that routinely beat an obvious premade, and been on a premade that has lost. Its BGs after all.
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  • CGPsaint
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    CGPsaint wrote: »
    That's not the only problem. The solo queue should not be dropping you in against pre-made 4-man groups, which is clearly does. I'm tired of going in and getting absolutely raked over the coals by a highly optimized ball group while my other three teammates either sit in the spawn or run in 3 different directions.

    I have wondered about this from time to time. Some teams are just too organized for what is supposed to be a group of 12 randoms. I think I figured out how to do it. You get a 3 man team and queue up under the solo, which worked for my friends and I yesterday.

    Even still, I've been on teams that routinely beat an obvious premade, and been on a premade that has lost. Its BGs after all.

    It seems like every game I get into has at least one 4-man pre-made group. Randoms don't roll around in a pixel stack with multiple HoTs/AoEs just nuking everything in it's path.

    "Some enjoy bringing grief to others. They remind M'aiq of mudcrabs—horrible creatures, with no redeeming qualities."
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  • DrNukenstein
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    I'm gonna be honest as a person who usually queues both but sometimes queues solo only when I recognize a four man in comms. I don't think the queues get crossed

    The ceiling is higher in group queue. Some night's you run into 4 people that you recognize as people that frequently play together. They do some stuff that is so micro coordinated you gotta queue solo only after. When you queue solo only, they go away.

    Now solo queue has it's own capacity for a massive diff. There is no real skill or role based match making. Sometimes one group gets a regular (death matcher) and 3 daily doers (objective only players), the second is split daily doers and regulars, and the last team is all people that pvp regularly and went in with kits for it. Of course the team with 3 regulars is going to be sticking together, cycling hots, and keeping their buffs up. It's their favorite hobby.

    Team comps and the lack of any class/role distribution is another problem contributing to the solo queue teamdiff. Some times one team will have 4 players on engage classes (warden, dragon knight) and they will be able to run around cc'ing and bursting anyone in their path by the shear tremendicity of their presence. We're talking like 3 dk's leaping in while a warden holds the fight down with snares and roots. Shotgun AOE, lockdown, and solid cross heals. It's gonna be a lot easier to do team fight's on that team than it is with the team that has 2 mag sorcs, a nightblade and a templar.
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  • OBJnoob
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    I tend to agree with Nukenstein. But that might only be because he used the word tremendicity. Which... Actually my phone just gave a red underline to... -sigh- so darn. Why isn't that a word? It sounds awesome and I'm going to start using it.

    But in seriousness. As someone who only solo ques I don't think I've ever been placed against a premade. Had good opponents, bad opponents, high mmr, low mmr, don't think I've ever even got that feeling. I have however been with some players (on my team,) that I played SO well with I can see why others mightve suspected.

    I think honestly once you've been playing the game long enough at a high level ( I do not claim to be one of the best, just simply to have a good understanding and reasonable ability, ) you can coordinate with teammates fairly well WITHOUT speaking.

    Also, the Bg population being fairly small depending on your mmr, I think it is possible sometimes teammates DO know eachother and even play together regularly but may not be grouped at the moment. I'm a member of a guild on Xbox NA that sometimes will have 10+ members solo queing intentionally at the same time. Not uncommon to get 6 into the same match... Some on your team and some not.

    I am however intrigued by whoever said that they have been in a 3-man group before and successfully solo qued like that. And I will bow down to evidence if any can be provided.

    Short of literal hard evidence though, I think some people just end up outmatched and are looking for excuses. I have simply never had this happen to me and though I know the game is full of crazy bugs I find this particular accusation to be hard to believe.

    Would we just be discovering it now? I doubt it. If this were true it seems to me the outcry would be loud and immediate.
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  • CGPsaint
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    OBJnoob wrote: »
    Short of literal hard evidence though, I think some people just end up outmatched and are looking for excuses.

    I have no qualms about admitting that I get my ass straight up handed to me by these groups, so I'm not looking for an excuse. It's just hard to believe that 4 people who are basically pixel stacking and moving in tandem so well while murdering the other 8 players over and over again can possibly be randoms. It's either people have figured out how to get pre-mades into solo queues or else I LITERALLY always get paired with 3 randoms who are all sharing a single brain cell who always want to run in separate directions.

    "Some enjoy bringing grief to others. They remind M'aiq of mudcrabs—horrible creatures, with no redeeming qualities."
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  • OBJnoob
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    That wasn't quite what I meant. I get my butt kicked sometimes too. And sometimes it definitely feels out of my control. I just find it hard to believe. But who knows? Someone said they'd solo qued as a 3man up above.
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  • El_Borracho
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    @OBJnoob 2 friends and I queued as a 3 man on the PS server this weekend. One of them queued so I'm taking his word for it, but don't see why he would lie. Got in and it matched us with a 4th, just like it would on the solo queue. I'll try it again from my console this week to confirm.

    But even in the "solo" group finder for BGs there are clear premades. Its not all the time, but frequent enough that its noticeable. Now that I've had the 3 man experience above, I'm starting to think I've been put on a 3 man premade as I've queued for the solo and been placed on some pretty strong teams where its clear they are working together. Is it enough to complain? No. Solo BGs is about playing more than winning or losing
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  • DrNukenstein
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    2 friends and I queued as a 3 man on the PS server this weekend. One of them queued so I'm taking his word for it, but don't see why he would lie. Got in and it matched us with a 4th, just like it would on the solo queue. I'll try it again from my console this week to confirm.

    Is it possible that your 4th queued both? I mean, I'm not the only one who queues both for shorter queue times.
    Edited by DrNukenstein on May 9, 2023 4:11PM
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  • CGPsaint
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    2 friends and I queued as a 3 man on the PS server this weekend. One of them queued so I'm taking his word for it, but don't see why he would lie. Got in and it matched us with a 4th, just like it would on the solo queue. I'll try it again from my console this week to confirm.

    Is it possible that your 4th queued both? I mean, I'm not the only one who queues both for shorter queue times.

    I'd be interested to know how ZOS handles situations where less then 4 people queue for group BGs. Do those 2-3 people get matched up with solo peeps and then get dropped into the solo BG's queue???

    "Some enjoy bringing grief to others. They remind M'aiq of mudcrabs—horrible creatures, with no redeeming qualities."
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  • OBJnoob
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    CGPsaint wrote: »
    2 friends and I queued as a 3 man on the PS server this weekend. One of them queued so I'm taking his word for it, but don't see why he would lie. Got in and it matched us with a 4th, just like it would on the solo queue. I'll try it again from my console this week to confirm.

    Is it possible that your 4th queued both? I mean, I'm not the only one who queues both for shorter queue times.

    I'd be interested to know how ZOS handles situations where less then 4 people queue for group BGs. Do those 2-3 people get matched up with solo peeps and then get dropped into the solo BG's queue???

    Yes. At least, pending the results of this conversation, that is my understanding. That's how it works in every game I play. PubG, as one example. You can que for an all solo game. Or you can get 3 buddies and play squads. You can solo que for squads and get matched up with 3 others... And they are either in a 3-man or not, it doesn't matter. If you want to go solo in squads you can (in PubG, not ESO,) but you have to manually select that option.

    It is one reason why I think group que takes longer than solo que... Because the game has to match different sized groups to make 3 teams of 4. Similar (in a not super identical way,) to trying to do a dungeon but having to wait for a tank. Sure, there are 100 people waiting in line, but maybe not what YOU are waiting for.

    Honestly I understand the feeling that you might be against premades. But as I've said, short of hard evidence, I think feelings are just feelings. My gut tells me that if I log in right now, group with somebody, and try to solo que for a BG the game will say "NO." So it should be an easy thing to test. And again, if that wasn't true, would we just be having this conversation now? I don't think your friend lied to you... But he might've been mistaken. And if the process can't be repeated then I'm always going to assume the person was mistaken.
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  • OBJnoob
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    Wait I can't readm the answer isn't yes it's no.

    The 3 get matched with a solo who went for the group que.
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  • El_Borracho
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    2 friends and I queued as a 3 man on the PS server this weekend. One of them queued so I'm taking his word for it, but don't see why he would lie. Got in and it matched us with a 4th, just like it would on the solo queue. I'll try it again from my console this week to confirm.

    Is it possible that your 4th queued both? I mean, I'm not the only one who queues both for shorter queue times.

    Maybe, and after what happened this morning, that makes more sense.

    This morning, I queued for a solo, alone, and got put on a team with a Level 10 player. According to what it says on the group finder for solos, you have to be Level 50 to queue. Clearly, this was a player grouped with another player (or players) where they pulled someone (me) from the solo queue to make their 4th. So solo group finder for BGs is not 12 randoms, its putting randoms either with other randoms or on partially premade teams.

    Oh, and the Level 10 player in the NON-CP BATTLEGROUNDS, racked up zero kills and 12 deaths in the Deathmatch. Shocker.
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  • gariondavey
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    A friend of mine solo queued and the game put him in group queue against my premade. This bug sometimes happens. (There was mention in here by nukenstein saying this doesn't happen. It does.)
    PC NA @gariondavey, BG, IC & Cyrodiil Focused Since October 2017 Stamplar (main), Magplar, Magsorc, Stamsorc, StamDK, MagDK, Stamblade, Magblade, Magden, Stamden
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  • Dem_kitkats1
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    @OBJnoob 2 friends and I queued as a 3 man on the PS server this weekend. One of them queued so I'm taking his word for it, but don't see why he would lie. Got in and it matched us with a 4th, just like it would on the solo queue. I'll try it again from my console this week to confirm.

    But even in the "solo" group finder for BGs there are clear premades. Its not all the time, but frequent enough that its noticeable. Now that I've had the 3 man experience above, I'm starting to think I've been put on a 3 man premade as I've queued for the solo and been placed on some pretty strong teams where its clear they are working together. Is it enough to complain? No. Solo BGs is about playing more than winning or losing

    Yeah it does happen sometimes. I used to think it was just a matter of people in the same guilds or friends queueing solo, but ending up on the same team. That was until I actually watched a group streaming and ended up in a match with them, despite only queuing solo.

    Perhaps because of the long queue times maybe they're now combining the two when there aren't enough players to fill teams?Idk.
    Edited by Dem_kitkats1 on May 12, 2023 4:06PM
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