Do you anjoy a class but hate its theme ?

david_m_18b16_ESO · March 2023

Myself I have a love hate relation with my magicka sorcerer.

It is the first class that I have created after the beta and it is probably the class that I have quitted playing the most out of all MMO's I've played.

I do anjoy most of its toolkit be it for soloing, farming, running dungeons and progress contant.

But its ugly purple lithning theme bugs me. That and they probably have the ugliest pets ever created.

So I often stop playing him and play some alts for 2-3 weeks then I'm back on my sorc.

Suddwrath · March 2023

StamDK.

Poison? Seriously? ZOS could have leaned into the magma, lava, earth, and ash theme…but POISON for the stam morphs?!

Come on.

Agenericname · March 2023

Hate is a strong word, much too strong, but, I enjoy Warden, but not its theme.

Mixing ice, animals, and plants seems like an odd mix.

Supreme_Atromancer · March 2023

Agenericname wrote: »

Hate is a strong word, much too strong, but, I enjoy Warden, but not its theme.

Mixing ice, animals, and plants seems like an odd mix.

Yeah, mechanically its great.

They are quite proficient with getting a lot out of the limited class kit, mechanically, but honestly they're sometimes quite lacking when it comes to delivering on a cohesive mythology. I think they could do better.

david_m_18b16_ESO wrote: »

Myself I have a love hate relation with my magicka sorcerer.

It is the first class that I have created after the beta and it is probably the class that I have quitted playing the most out of all MMO's I've played.

I do anjoy most of its toolkit be it for soloing, farming, running dungeons and progress contant.

But its ugly purple lithning theme bugs me. That and they probably have the ugliest pets ever created.

So I often stop playing him and play some alts for 2-3 weeks then I'm back on my sorc.

Yes, agree. I love my sorc. Been playing it since 2014. I play magicka sorcerer because it gets the closest to the archetype and power fantasy I'm looking for, coming from the single player titles. But I've always loathed the need to be locked into a power-rangers style theme. Why am I so locked into lightning? That's not a thing in TES. Why, if I want to be a firemage do I have to go DK?

Its like MMO-headspace sometimes struggles with the essence of Elder Scrolls.I get the impression that whenever the devs struggle with marrying the TES-power fantasy to the mechanics, the power fantasy is seen as expendable.

Credible_Joe · March 2023

I've always felt Storm Calling to be too focused for a class like Sorcerer. Shoehorns your playstyle thematically into a storm-mage archetype.

I would change it to Elementalism. All of the same effects, except the element changes based on your main-hand weapon enchantment. Fire, Frost, Shock, Poison, Disease, Oblivion, Entropy.

The only skill that would require a re-work would be bolt-escape. Probably keep it as a straight line rush with some sort of elemental effect. The lightning variant can remain instant.

All the others; the execute, the AOE, the self buff, the aura, they could all work more or less the same, just dealing different elemental damage & status effects based on the player's preference.

It would also encourage people to use weapon glyphs other than poison & disease. Thank you for coming to my TED talk.

Elsonso · March 2023

Suddwrath wrote: »

StamDK.

Poison? Seriously? ZOS could have leaned into the magma, lava, earth, and ash theme…but POISON for the stam morphs?!

Come on.

Same here. Retired my Stam DK main character from active duty when they rolled this out.

Tensar · March 2023

warden worst theme

NettleCarrier · March 2023

Warden = Best theme/Love the class (sorry to person above me), though could use more nature skills.
Sorc = Awesome theme, terrible execution. All the best looking lightning skills are not that great and all the good stuff is daedric and not lightning...

david_m_18b16_ESO · March 2023

Agenericname wrote: »

Hate is a strong word, much too strong, but, I enjoy Warden, but not its theme.

Mixing ice, animals, and plants seems like an odd mix.

I guess the ice could had been poison instead :-P

OBJnoob · March 2023

I wouldn't say warden is the best theme but I agree it's okay. One could get very specific and wonder why plants would be growing in snow... But more generally speaking, animals plants and snow are all clearly nature themed.

Araneae6537 · March 2023

I’ve gradually been playing my DK more and overall enjoy the feel of the play but wish there were fewer skills that altered my character’s appearance (and are the reason why my DK remained hardly played for so long). I hate things sprouting out of my character’s back (the warden wings are okay because they look like magic) and I’m not a fan of the glowy orbs that will appear in front of my character’s eyes.

Sorc I have mixed feelings about. I generally like playing an elementalist-type mage and some of the lightning/storm abilities are cool, but it seems these abilities are relatively underpowered and instead you have to run pets to maximize DPS, at least in PVE, and that feels very limiting to me.

Conversely, Warden I like the themes of (excepting the bear, but I like the otherwise Morrowind-themed creatures), although I’d rather have ice and nature magic on separate characters, but I have yet to get the feel of it.

Supreme_Atromancer · March 2023

OBJnoob wrote: »

One could get very specific and wonder why plants would be growing in snow... But more generally speaking, animals plants and snow are all clearly nature themed.

I don't think its a matter of people being "very specific", though.

You can whack a bunch of disparate themes together and try to contrive it as somehow cohesive, but I think its clear that people are telling them they haven't done a very good job.

It probably needed a bit more thought and care, to be frank.

OBJnoob · March 2023

If your answer is Warden then I'm sure you have your reasons. I don't personally feel like I had to stretch my mind that hard to fit ice, animals, and plants together under a nature umbrella. But please just let my comment pass... I was only trying to be a part of the discussion, not start a debate. Warden is a fine answer.

Not sure what my answer is. I'm boring-- I just like fighting. StamDK was my original main and the skills and playstyle is so different now from what it was years ago I don't even want to play it. It isn't so much that I dislike the poison theme it's that I feel compelled to use fire instead to be competitive.

Supreme_Atromancer · March 2023

OBJnoob wrote: »

If your answer is Warden then I'm sure you have your reasons. I don't personally feel like I had to stretch my mind that hard to fit ice, animals, and plants together under a nature umbrella. But please just let my comment pass... I was only trying to be a part of the discussion, not start a debate. Warden is a fine answer.

Enough mind stretching could justify anything you want at the end of the day. Does it feel like a satisfying and cohesive power fantasy is the question. Also, not trying flame your thoughts or anything- what you say represents a legit criticism of what others feel, and its that which I'm trying to engage, not anything personal.

Caribou77 · March 2023

I once had a Necro whisper me that his blast bones was going to doing something unsavory to my mother. I think Necro's theme of dead rotting things suited him perfectly.

Honestly the animations of Arcanist holding a book while it casts its spells is pretty unappealing/unrealistic. Who's gonna flip open a big old tome in the middle of a fight? Looks stupid.

Bat · March 2023

Up until recently I loved magicka Dragonknight. Then they decided the class spammable should cost both magicka and stamina, and that's a theme that is both incomprehensible to me and makes me sad when I log onto my previous main character.

OBJnoob · March 2023

Supreme_Atromancer wrote: »

OBJnoob wrote: »

If your answer is Warden then I'm sure you have your reasons. I don't personally feel like I had to stretch my mind that hard to fit ice, animals, and plants together under a nature umbrella. But please just let my comment pass... I was only trying to be a part of the discussion, not start a debate. Warden is a fine answer.

Enough mind stretching could justify anything you want at the end of the day. Does it feel like a satisfying and cohesive power fantasy is the question. Also, not trying flame your thoughts or anything- what you say represents a legit criticism of what others feel, and its that which I'm trying to engage, not anything personal.

Don't worry I'm not offended at all-- quite the opposite-- I'm wishing I hadn't stepped on that other person's toes, and worry that if we have a little debate right here it'll detract from an otherwise pleasant discussion.

Again-- frost, animals, and plants are all parts of nature. Fire, lightning, poison, and disease are all parts of nature too but somehow more "natural disastery" in my mind versus like a simple change of seasons. One could suppose that the Wardens tap into the magical power of plants and animals during fair seasons and tap into frost during cold ones. Their magic must change, as does the earth. Or, y'know, Tamriel

But that's it. That's all I have to say. It makes perfect sense to me. But since we're talking about matters of art and symbolism it stands to reason that we may think very differently.

Michaelkeir · March 2023

Yes. Quite a few of them actually. Let me see…

-Sorcerer-
This was my 1st class. Been playing him since console launch. What bugs me is the purple color scheme, and the limited options of pets. We’ve had the same 2 ones for ever and a day. I want a flame and ice atronach. A Dremora Lord as well for starters. There are TONS of Daedra we can potentially summon, but we are stuck with basically 2 (3 if you count the ultimate).

-Necromancers-
This has been my favorite class to play in just about every Elderscrolls game I’ve ever played, so I am very passionate about this class. But they really dropped the ball. Where to begin.No real dots to speak of. No curses of any sort. No zombies, no melee skeletons, no REAL summons to speak of really. They tried to be different but it failed in my eyes.

-Wardens-
The ice skill line seems out of place for a “Druid”like class. Would have benefited from a Earth/Rock skill line. Most of the animal skill line seems Morrowind themed which is a letdown for none Dunmer races. Looks odd on my Breton warden to be throwing cliff racers. Seems kind of all over the place to me.

CardinalJack · March 2023

Warden. I love ice magic but I'm very uncomfortable with the insect companion's skill tree.

TaSheen · March 2023

I've never been a fan of "ice magic" - so my wardens ignore it. I'd rather have anything else besides the yuck Vvardenfell slant to the spells, but it is what it is, and warden really suits me - so I just don't pay much attention to what those spells do with regard to looks.

As long as they kill stuff I'm good.

None of the classes really trigger anything off for me as to theme. I just want to kill whatever's in the way of real fun and get it over with.

rabidmyers · March 2023

templar was fun but i don't like the whole light theme, it's hideous to my eyes

warden is my 2nd favorite aesthetic wise on here as their whole theme is gorgeous to me, really love nature especially mushrooms, ice is my 3rd favorite element behind water and wind/air, and of course animals! but insects scare tf outta me irl lol

if i didn't like nightblade so much then id be playing a warden for sure, i play a nightblade healer and i can't complain about their theme obviously

Sheezabeast · March 2023

I like the idea of Necro but absolutely hate the colors, theme, abilities, everything about it. It's so edgelord that it hurts. I cannot enjoy playing it, I have tried and deleted every max level Necro I have made because I would rather play a different class. I wish Necro wasn't so...tacky.

the1andonlyskwex · March 2023

Templar and Nightblade are both fun for me mechanically but graphically boring. Nightblade has a really cool concept with shadow and blood magic, but it's poorly executed (with lots of effects that are barely visible), while Templar's light theme is just too vanilla.

Necromancer is also thematically challenging for me because its theme-appropriate "Criminal Act" mechanic interferes with my mechanical enjoyment of the class (because one wrong button press or a fight in the wrong location can make you a fugitive for the next 20-30min).

aaisoaho · March 2023

Sheezabeast wrote: »

I like the idea of Necro but absolutely hate the colors, theme, abilities, everything about it. It's so edgelord that it hurts. I cannot enjoy playing it, I have tried and deleted every max level Necro I have made because I would rather play a different class. I wish Necro wasn't so...tacky.

In my opinion, cro rotation is the most fun out of all of the classes. But I agree, with its theme it is hard to come up anything other than a villain/anti-hero. Skulls, skeletons and death ain't really my jam.

Saint-Ange · March 2023

templar's yellow stuff never made it to my action bars, talk about gimping yourself. hence my poor luthor is relegated as my librarian, a desk job.

merpins · March 2023

Warden. The Animal and Plant themes are great, and follow the logic of a druid. Ice on the other hand... I mean sure, you could argue that plants grow during the spring and summer, and then the ice comes to reset they cycle in the winter. But if that was the theme they wanted to go with, then there shouldn't be an animal companion skill line because it doesn't follow that logic. Fire makes more sense than Ice, since in man-maintained nature, we tend to do selective burning to prevent more massive brush fires and to encourage growth with the ash.

Imo, there shouldn't be an Ice skill line in Warden. It should be in Sorcerer, and replace the Dark Magic skill line. Ice and Lightning are staples of the elder scrolls universe's Destruction tree of magic, and Conjuration covers Daedric Summoning for the most part. "Dark Magic" makes no sense. Just take crystal frags, reformat it to an ice skill along with Encase, and give some of those ice skills from Warden, and I mean... It just makes so much more sense, thematically! Dark Magic isn't even really a theme in the Elder Scrolls universe.

So those are my two pet peves. Dark Magic in Sorc makes no sense and the Ice skill line in Warden makes no sense for warden but too much sense for sorc. Then, replace Warden's skill line with something distinctly druid-y. More plants, maybe tree-based or something. Bark Skin rather than Frost Cloak. Spike Growth instead of Impaling Shards. Stuff like that. Either that, or integrate the ice into Animal Companions to make it more cohesive.

NeKryXe · March 2023

Sorcerer > I hate the intrusive combat pets. I avoid it in all builds.

Warden > Again... I hate the combat pet, but also all visual effects.

Anyway, from what we can see at the moment of Arcanist, it will be the most hideous theme on a class in all Elder Scrolls world. Those excessive green lights effects seem to be horrendous.

Darkstorne · March 2023

Yeah, another Warden vote for the animals.

What distresses me is they have a really good solution for this already implemented - the ability to change what your animals look like - but they barely use it. It's currently only used for changing the colour of your bear to grey.

They could sell animal cosmetic packs on the Crown Store. Instead of the default Morrowind themed animals they could sell Elsweyr themed animals (Senche-raht companion instead of a bear, dunerippers instead of shalks, small griffon rather than a cliff racer, etc) and I'm sure it would be popular. They could do that for so many different racial/province themes.

Kaelthorn_Nightbloom · March 2023

Sorcerer is my least favorite thematic class because it's based on the realm of Molag Bal which I generally can't stand.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magician_(fantasy)

The term sorcerer is more frequently used when the magician in question is evil.

I wish Sorcerer was a different type of dark magician. Maybe the Arcanist will be better.

Kite42 · March 2023

If Magplars specialise in magic damage, I feel that a StamDk would be physical damage.

Then shunt poison to Wardens (because rattlesnakes, blue-ringed octopuses, deadly nightshade, poison ivy etc. etc.)

Where frost ends up I'm not sure. I'd like Sorcs to maybe have ice and lightning options perhaps?

emilyhyoyeon · March 2023

Dragonknight is the worst for me because I don't like the skills that make wings, and chains is the, thematically, worst designed skill. I can't believe it exists, it's ridiculous. It's not even ''Akaviri'' or ''dragon'' themed. It could've just as easily been a normal telekinesis skill.

Warden is the second worst for me. It's more fun than DK for me by far and doesn't have any egregiously heinous skills like DK chains, but the theme feels a bit unnecessarily spread out with ice being in there, even though I like ice and think we need a mage class for each main element. I also think the animal skills being heavily Morrowind themed was a poor choice.

Arcanist will probably be the worst of all for me, but we haven't seen all the skills yet. If the strongly Hermaeus Mora themed skills can be decently replaced by weapon or guild skills, I'll be ok.