Medium vs light armor passives.

Somber97866 · February 2023

I don't know about you but shouldn't they have made the damage output match so there wasn't a power creep? They could leave all the roll dodge and recovery aspects the same but shouldn't the damage part match and leave the weapons were you get the extra damage from,?

Dr_Con · February 2023

Light armor - crit more and pen more, increased magicka recovery- good for soloing, random vet dungeons, and trials where pen is not covered through crimson oath/tremorscale or alkosh.

Medium armor - crit harder, more raw output, increased stam recovery - good for premade vet dungeons and trial groups where pen is covered through crimson oath/tremorscale or alkosh

it really boils down to this: If pen is not covered, you benefit more from light pieces. If pen is covered, you get more benefit from medium. You need to utilize any extra stamina/magicka recovery (depending on what you're building) that you get from what you are wearing (so consider running stuff like trap if you normally run channeled acceleration).

Crit chance is always nice to build after crit dmg cap is reached. Groups consist of a core of 4 supports/tanks who modify group dmg by at least 645 spell/weapon damage (major/minor courage) and at least 20% crit dmg on top through major force(warhorn). This is the meta for probably 90% of groups. Groups will also run other things to modify stats (spaulder, pearlescent ward, powerful assault, etc) and provide buffs like Major Slayer, or buffs to recover your ult faster, but another focus is on debuffing the target so your crit damage and raw output is higher. Penetration is covered by an additional support DPS or the main tank usually- when it isn't then the trial leader might instruct people to wear a few pieces of light armor to close the gap. The more support DPS your core has, the more stable and consistent your groups will wind up being.

Once you reach crit cap consistently through buffs, passives, and debuffs, you can work on crit chance- which is provided by light armor. In this respect you can start to balance your gear sets.

WrathOfInnos · February 2023

Dr_Con wrote: »

Light armor - crit more and pen more, increased magicka recovery- good for soloing, random vet dungeons, and trials where pen is not covered through crimson oath/tremorscale or alkosh.

Medium armor - crit harder, more raw output, increased stam recovery - good for premade vet dungeons and trial groups where pen is covered through crimson oath/tremorscale or alkosh

it really boils down to this: If pen is not covered, you benefit more from light pieces. If pen is covered, you get more benefit from medium. You need to utilize any extra stamina/magicka recovery (depending on what you're building) that you get from what you are wearing (so consider running stuff like trap if you normally run channeled acceleration).

Crit chance is always nice to build after crit dmg cap is reached. Groups consist of a core of 4 supports/tanks who modify group dmg by at least 645 spell/weapon damage (major/minor courage) and at least 20% crit dmg on top through major force(warhorn). This is the meta for probably 90% of groups. Groups will also run other things to modify stats (spaulder, pearlescent ward, powerful assault, etc) and provide buffs like Major Slayer, or buffs to recover your ult faster, but another focus is on debuffing the target so your crit damage and raw output is higher. Penetration is covered by an additional support DPS or the main tank usually- when it isn't then the trial leader might instruct people to wear a few pieces of light armor to close the gap. The more support DPS your core has, the more stable and consistent your groups will wind up being.

Once you reach crit cap consistently through buffs, passives, and debuffs, you can work on crit chance- which is provided by light armor. In this respect you can start to balance your gear sets.

Nice summary. My only complaint is that once you hit the Crit Damage and Pen caps the 2% Weapon Damage from each piece of Medium outweighs the 1% crit chance from each pice of Light. If they made Light Armor give 1.5% crit chance it would be near perfectly balanced.

Dr_Con · February 2023

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Light armor - crit more and pen more, increased magicka recovery- good for soloing, random vet dungeons, and trials where pen is not covered through crimson oath/tremorscale or alkosh.

Medium armor - crit harder, more raw output, increased stam recovery - good for premade vet dungeons and trial groups where pen is covered through crimson oath/tremorscale or alkosh

it really boils down to this: If pen is not covered, you benefit more from light pieces. If pen is covered, you get more benefit from medium. You need to utilize any extra stamina/magicka recovery (depending on what you're building) that you get from what you are wearing (so consider running stuff like trap if you normally run channeled acceleration).

Crit chance is always nice to build after crit dmg cap is reached. Groups consist of a core of 4 supports/tanks who modify group dmg by at least 645 spell/weapon damage (major/minor courage) and at least 20% crit dmg on top through major force(warhorn). This is the meta for probably 90% of groups. Groups will also run other things to modify stats (spaulder, pearlescent ward, powerful assault, etc) and provide buffs like Major Slayer, or buffs to recover your ult faster, but another focus is on debuffing the target so your crit damage and raw output is higher. Penetration is covered by an additional support DPS or the main tank usually- when it isn't then the trial leader might instruct people to wear a few pieces of light armor to close the gap. The more support DPS your core has, the more stable and consistent your groups will wind up being.

Once you reach crit cap consistently through buffs, passives, and debuffs, you can work on crit chance- which is provided by light armor. In this respect you can start to balance your gear sets.

Nice summary. My only complaint is that once you hit the Crit Damage and Pen caps the 2% Weapon Damage from each piece of Medium outweighs the 1% crit chance from each pice of Light. If they made Light Armor give 1.5% crit chance it would be near perfectly balanced.

I understand the frustration, but the situation to wear light armor in is when the pen cap is not reached. It would make more sense to do the math assuming either no pen is covered or only around half the pen is covered if you want to compare light armor when it's at its best to medium armor. This is the situation where light armor can shine.

WrathOfInnos · February 2023

Dr_Con wrote: »

WrathOfInnos wrote: »

Dr_Con wrote: »

Light armor - crit more and pen more, increased magicka recovery- good for soloing, random vet dungeons, and trials where pen is not covered through crimson oath/tremorscale or alkosh.

Medium armor - crit harder, more raw output, increased stam recovery - good for premade vet dungeons and trial groups where pen is covered through crimson oath/tremorscale or alkosh

it really boils down to this: If pen is not covered, you benefit more from light pieces. If pen is covered, you get more benefit from medium. You need to utilize any extra stamina/magicka recovery (depending on what you're building) that you get from what you are wearing (so consider running stuff like trap if you normally run channeled acceleration).

Crit chance is always nice to build after crit dmg cap is reached. Groups consist of a core of 4 supports/tanks who modify group dmg by at least 645 spell/weapon damage (major/minor courage) and at least 20% crit dmg on top through major force(warhorn). This is the meta for probably 90% of groups. Groups will also run other things to modify stats (spaulder, pearlescent ward, powerful assault, etc) and provide buffs like Major Slayer, or buffs to recover your ult faster, but another focus is on debuffing the target so your crit damage and raw output is higher. Penetration is covered by an additional support DPS or the main tank usually- when it isn't then the trial leader might instruct people to wear a few pieces of light armor to close the gap. The more support DPS your core has, the more stable and consistent your groups will wind up being.

Once you reach crit cap consistently through buffs, passives, and debuffs, you can work on crit chance- which is provided by light armor. In this respect you can start to balance your gear sets.

Nice summary. My only complaint is that once you hit the Crit Damage and Pen caps the 2% Weapon Damage from each piece of Medium outweighs the 1% crit chance from each pice of Light. If they made Light Armor give 1.5% crit chance it would be near perfectly balanced.

I understand the frustration, but the situation to wear light armor in is when the pen cap is not reached. It would make more sense to do the math assuming either no pen is covered or only around half the pen is covered if you want to compare light armor when it's at its best to medium armor. This is the situation where light armor can shine.

That is a fair point as well. Before hitting caps the Crit Damage from each piece of medium should be balanced with the Penetration from Light Armor. The 939 Penetration from each piece is generally around 2% DPS in PVE (PvP could vary widely) before hitting the 18.2k cap. That is far greater than the ~0.7% DPS gained from 2% crit damage.

I wouldn't be opposed to making Light Armor give around 500 Penetration and Medium Armor giving 3% Crit Damage, both for just over 1% DPS.

Somber97866 · February 2023

Look, med armor is far superior for endgame trials. Fact.
This is what I consider to be the issue that currently upsets me and keeps me from enjoying game in endgame setting

WrathOfInnos · February 2023

Somber97866 wrote: »

Look, med armor is far superior for endgame trials. Fact.
This is what I consider to be the issue that currently upsets me and keeps me from enjoying game in endgame setting

@Somber97866 Have you tried Brittleden or Magplar (with shard spam and beam) this patch? Both do well with 4 to 6 light armor. They won't reach the peaks of full damage DK, but both can be useful in a group.

AndreNoir · February 2023

Dr_Con wrote: »

Light armor - crit more and pen more, increased magicka recovery- good for soloing, random vet dungeons, and trials where pen is not covered through crimson oath/tremorscale or alkosh.

Do you know that the whole armor rework fully serve only for PVP and named trials were made before you got named armor passives and sets ? And both heavy and light armor types were nerfed at the time medium got only buffs without downsides

madman65 · February 2023

From my opinion this is were the balance is at. 5 medium and 2 light helps with crit damage when your by yourself soloing but in a trial group you would have to much crit damage so you have a choice, more light armor or no minor force. 2 medium and 5 light will work great in a trial but not so good soloing. Hope this is helpful.

Somber97866 · February 2023

Isn't penetration really good for like four man content? But when it comes to like medium armor it's pretty much like all end-game wonderful! I mean really did not like foresee what was going to be the problem here?