Returning player ~260CP Can I be viable in Pvp and if so, how?

Lenny · January 2023

Title.

Just curious, can I participate in PvP and if so, do I need to grind a bunch of gear to do so? I'm an argonian nightblade and I have the 5 piece set right now that spawns the creeper when you crit that barfs all over your enemies.

Janni · January 2023

I think the first thing you need to decide is how you want to play. Small group? Ganker? Solo zerg surfing? Ballgroup? The gear that you run largely depends on this factor.

But... all the gear and levels in the world mean nothing without experience though. So if you are nervous about it... don't be! Go out there and get your teeth kicked in over and over. We've all done it. It's the only way to really learn. You need to learn how to predict the movements of groups and build up the muscle memory to defend against certain types of onslaughts and all of the theorycrafting in the world won't help you with this part so just go out, relax, and try to have some fun. Even if you die fast and feel like you can't do damage there are ways to help. Make callouts. Hit groups with aoe stuns to innterupt them. Learn to siege properly. All the while just keep observing and learning and don't be afraid to bite off more than you can chew. Eventually you want to push yourself beyond what you know.

As for starter gear, many decent pvp sets can be purchased or even earned through pvp itself. Look into Mara's Balm and Rallying Cry for starters. Many craftable sets are perfect for pvp too. Don't worry about the cp. Grinding it out really just isn't worth the time. In that time you spent grinding levels you could get so much better at pvp just by engaging with it and learning the ebb and flow of combat

OBJnoob · January 2023

I agree with Janni. You won't be much good in duels until you get around 1k CP but you can still be an excellent group member in cyrodiil. Learn the ropes, the tactics, the timing, when to roll and when to block. You can have a lot of fun.

And if you reach a point where you feel like you've gotten good but can't "prove it" because of CP... Jump into battlegrounds where CP is disabled.

boi_anachronism_ · January 2023

Keep in mind that without passives you will definitely be at a significant disadvantage but experience is king so by the time you have enough you will be able to hold your own confidently. Pro tip: learn how to be unpredictable and block cast. Steer clear of tank trolls they will only waste your time and distract you while a teammate bombs you.

disintegr8 · January 2023

Anyone, at any level, can participate in PVP, being competitive against other players is a different matter altogether.

I believe I have the skill, characters and gear to be competitive in PVP, but because I live in Australia and my latency (ping rate) is in the hundreds of milliseconds, I cannot react in time to not get killed.

WaywardArgonian · January 2023

While it is true that you can participate in PVP at any level, you'll be playing with a handicap in CP-active environments until you approach the 1k mark. That's about the amount you need to get 4 CP slottables per tree + some assorted passives. Yes, there are players who do amazing at 500-600, but they are compensating for this 'handicap' with their skill.

Until then, you can either accept that you are a bit weaker than your opponents stat-wise, or you can restrict yourself to environments where CP is not activated. Concretely, this means the no-proc server of Cyrodiil, Ravenwatch (and the no-proc Imperial City server), and Battlegrounds. Mind that Ravenwatch comes with set restrictions, as most proc sets do not work there. But the advantage is that everyone with CP160 or more is on an equal playing field there.

Neoauspex · January 2023

Negate tank

Thecompton73 · January 2023

I just restarted over on PC a year ago and once I got up around 400 CP I was able to play as a ganker pretty successfully. If you want to play that way go full damage and use cloak+speed to survive.

Vevvev · January 2023

CP helps, but it means less now than it did back in the day. I'd recommend getting the active stars filled in before the passive yellow stars first as they offer the greatest power for the points put in.

A lot of the power CP had has been redistributed to the level 1-50 increases in power, and what I mean by that is the max magicka, stamina, and health boosts are no longer given by just slotting CP. However, some stars do give a little bit more of those pools, but they're inconsequential compared to the other stars.

It's more about gear, muscle memory when it comes to blocking and dodging, and the active and passive skills you have now.

Lenny · January 2023

Thecompton73 wrote: »

I just restarted over on PC a year ago and once I got up around 400 CP I was able to play as a ganker pretty successfully. If you want to play that way go full damage and use cloak+speed to survive.

Can you share a build/skill loadout to get me started?

I figure you're using a magblade build with light armor to be able to sustain cloak, is that right?

KingKayanto · January 2023

Use two 5pc sets, monster set helps a lot too.

On NB it's important to know how to pick your targets and look at their feet. When you see a swirly thing, hide. It means they are immune to stuns. Hide, burst, hide, etc... Don't stay for a "fair" fight if you play a ganker. Don't try to fight 1v1 against very tanky opponents.

DrNukenstein · January 2023

use rallying cry back bar, 2 piece trainee, a monster set, any damage set for sale on front bar. That's a full build (if scaling mag) that you can have for like 30k gold, 50+ transmutes (good trainee piece traits), and ~2 hours of pve.

Rallying cry is the GOAT set because it doesn't just function as a defensive set with offensive benefits for your front bar, but it will turn the potatoes you get matched with in low mmr into bona-fide sweat monstrosities.

Like this build is tested. I destroy with it in under 50s, I have fun with it in cp-a billion sweat fests, you can even beat 2k cp fully levelled toons on an under 50 toon with this kind of build in IC. Even a toddler can put it together and make it work.

Lenny · February 2023

DrNukenstein wrote: »

a monster set

I admit probably a stupid question but what makes a set a "monster" set and does that mean I just get it from random drops in the world?

Thecompton73 · February 2023

Lenny wrote: »

DrNukenstein wrote: »

a monster set

I admit probably a stupid question but what makes a set a "monster" set and does that mean I just get it from random drops in the world?

Monster sets are two piece sets consisting of shoulders and head. The head pieces are guaranteed drops from the last boss of Vet Dungeons. For example Balorghs comes from March of Sacrifices. You buy the shoulders from the undaunted mission givers in exchange for the keys you get when you complete their daily missions. The Golden Vendor in Cyrodiil also sells 2 different monster pieces each weekend for AP or gold but you might have to wait months before the set you want is being sold there.

Lenny wrote: »

Thecompton73 wrote: »

I just restarted over on PC a year ago and once I got up around 400 CP I was able to play as a ganker pretty successfully. If you want to play that way go full damage and use cloak+speed to survive.

Can you share a build/skill loadout to get me started?

I figure you're using a magblade build with light armor to be able to sustain cloak, is that right?

@Lenny I play as an off meta stam leaning Hybrid with 6 medium 1 light. I use Heartland Conqueror on body with Balorghs Monster, two pieces of Trainee, Ring of the Wild Hunt, Master DW front bar (axe/dagger though if I had the sword I'd switch out the dagger) and Vateshran Bow back bar (both just the normal non-perfect versions). I use Jewels of Misrule for max health and mag/stam recovery and weapon power pots to pre-buff for ganks. I use the lover mundus for penatration and 5 divines+2 impenatreble as body traits. I personally like Heartland but it could easily be replaced by a more meta set like Stygian, Rallying Cry or any other good damage set.
Overall it's a bit of grindy setup to complete but well worth it. First you've got to level Scrying and collect the leads for Wild Hunt and Pale order so you can excavate all the pieces. One you have those then you're ready to go after the weapon and monster sets. Vateshran Arena normal is solo and fairly quick and easy once you know the boss mechanics, especially if you use the Pale order ring in place of Wild Hunt. You'll also want to use Pale Order in Normal Dragon Star Arena, which is a lonnnnng slog to get through solo as it's really meant for 4 people. And you'll certainly need help with the last boss as he calls out all the bosses from previous stages as he loses health so in the end it's like 7v1. There were a few times I almost got him by myself but he enrages at 10% and it wiped me every time I got him to that point. As far as getting help it's usually pretty hard to find people that want to run it all the way through but if you make it to the last boss solo then put out a call for help in a guild chat people jump at the chance to get a Master Weapon for a minute of effort (once you've got full group or even one other good DPS it's super easy). March of Sacrifices is a DLC dungeon and you have to do it on Vet for the monster mask so it's a bit tough but I did in when it was the daily undaunted mission and got into a group-finder PUG group that pretty much carried me through when I was just barely over the minimum 300CP to get in. I helped quite a bit that I already knew the mechanics from having done it a bunch of times on my PS account so you'll probably want to watch a video walkthrough before joining a PUG or you risk getting kicked for wiping to often. Or join a PVE guild with people on discord/gamechat that don't mind teaching dungeon mechanics on the fly.

My character is a Bosmer for the extra pen and speed. Khajiit for the crit damage or Dark Elf for the max mag/stam with 259 wd/sd are more meta. Argonian isn't ideal for a ganker as it doesn't have any damage bonuses (recovery and healing are better for a brawler) but it should still work for you if you don't want to change the race. I'm a vamp and run stage 2 for the speed in stealth and extra 300 wd which are both essential (I'm so squishy I don't really feel stage 3 Undeath does much for me). My frontbar has 1 nirnhoned and 1 sharpened and I run double dot poisons (another essential) and the backbar bow is sharpened with a magic damage/return enchant. With everything fully buffed and Balroghs procced I hit nearly 7K weapon damage and 25K penetration front bar \ 6.4K weapon damage and 28K pen on my back bar. Those numbers are slightly inflated compared to when I had 400 CP but not by a whole lot.

My skill bars are:
Front: Rending slashes, Whirlwind, Resolving Vigor, Cloak, Concealed weapon (for the passives), Dawnbreaker,
Back: Lethal Arrow, Power extraction, Mass Hysteria, Merciless Resolve, Poison Injection, Toxic Barrage.
The non-bow skills on the back could all be flexed as they're more for buffing myself and debuffing enemies in larger keep fights. People hate on Mass Hysteria a lot nowadays but getting into the middle of a group of enemies and hitting them with it while they're under attack from allies is often a death sentence for them.

As for a gank rotation I'll get right up to within 3m of someone while cloaked (not just hidden) and do Lethal Arrow--LA--Poison Injection--barswap--Dawnbreaker--LA--Rending Slashes--whirlwind. If done right they get hit by the bow attacks and usually react by trying to dodgeroll but then you stun them with the DB, giving you time to get in the Rending and Whirlwind to finish. If someone has less than 27K health or is engaged with someone else and taking damage you can usually just skip the bow part of the rotation and get a kill with cloak-DB-LA-Rending slashes-Whirlwind.

I've got enough Mag recovery to hit cloak 6-7 times in a row before I run out so if I don't get the kill within the first few seconds I escape by roll dodging with bow equipped for major expedition then flip to the front bar that has minor expedition from Concealed weapon on top of the unnamed 15% speed boost from Wildhunt and just sprint until I get out of detection and gapcloser range, then I cloak and immediately change direction. Very few people realize how fast I'm still moving in cloak and can't even come close to finding me before I get to something to block line of sight.