Suggestion/Request: [Left] Handedness

moleculardrugs · September 2022

I have always wanted my character(s) to be left-handed, because I am left-handed IRL.

I think about 11-13% of the general population IRL is left-handed, so applying that to ESO which boasts 19 million players, that’s still a few million people (2 to 2.2 million by approximation).

So around 2 million players aren’t being represented because ESO is predominately a right-handed world.

I know this sounds ridiculous but it’s really something I think would make the game better. In terms of immersion or QoL, having left-handed characters wielding with their left-hand (or even ambidextrous characters) would be so cool. Just a thought…

Danikat · September 2022

I'd like to do this too. I've sort-of done it with one character because she's dual-wielding with a dagger in her right hand and a sword in her left so it looks like the left is her main hand. But it doesn't work for other weapons or other animations like opening doors or sorting through bags. Of course most people can do those things with either hand, but I know if both my hands are free I typically default to using my left, so seeing her always use her right makes it a little hard to imagine she's left-handed.

However I'm not sure how easy this would be. I don't know of any games which give players the option except some FPS games where all you see is the gun (and I've heard some of them don't do a good job of it). There are games with left-handed characters, including some with a mix of right and left handed characters, but they don't let players customise it, it's fixed for each character.

Which might be because the nearest equivalent I have heard of is Twilight Princess where in order to change the main character from left to right handed they mirror imaged the entire game. Apparently that was easier than changing just the player character. (They 'had to' do it because they were porting the game to the Wii which uses motion controls and apparently it would be too difficult for right-handed players to control a left-handed character...and if you're left-handed I guess they didn't care). They also looked at making it an option in Skyward Sword then took it out, apparently because it was too complicated to include.

I have no idea how the game engine and other systems used for ESO compares, but given that's the nearest example I know of to giving players a choice I'm inclined to believe it's not easy in any game.

Androrix · September 2022

If this were possible it would really add some great diversity to characters. I suspect it is not though.

LikiLoki · September 2022

Of course, our left-handed society should receive protection from discrimination. I remember the dark times when the right-handed beat the hands of children who started to write with the left, the church considered the left-handed children of the devil. The years of suffering of our community in the past should give us the right to be ourselves. Left-handed heroes should be added. We also need left-handed partners in the same ratio as statistics. I hope that ZOS will also make sure that there are enough left-handed people among employees and managers.

Jack-0 · September 2022

I think about this a lot! I'm left handed, and I'd love my tanks to hold their swords and shields as I would, shield in right hand and sword in the left.

DMuehlhausen · September 2022

No, every animation would have to be done twice. That would add is so many things that go wrong and look wrong and inflate the file size of the game which is already well over 100 GB I believe.

I'm sorry, but every group doesn't need representation in every last thing in the world real or otherwise.

leofryth · September 2022

I also am left-handed, and would love to play a left-handed character.

Also, Link from Legend of Zelda and Raphael from Soul Calibur are both left-handed. So it's a thing.

tomofhyrule · September 2022

I've wanted this for ages, but I doubt we'll ever see it. Pretty sad that the only lefties in the video game universe are villains, especially now that Nintendo has decided that Link in the console Zelda games is now retconned into righthandedness.

I remember I was unimaginably hyped when Skyrim announced that we could put a sword in either hand. I spent years trying to be a lefty there, but it was mechanically 'punching with a sword in the off hand.' I didn't even know there were killcams in Skyrim for the first few years I played since I was so adamantly trying to play a lefty.

Here's hoping that TES6 will at least let me finally put my shield in the right hand.

As for ESO, it'd take a massive remake of all weapon animations, so I'm not expecting to ever see it. I'll just have to keep imagining that my main's a lefty instead of actually seeing it.

RagnarSw · September 2022

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

No, every animation would have to be done twice. That would add is so many things that go wrong and look wrong and inflate the file size of the game which is already well over 100 GB I believe.

I'm sorry, but every group doesn't need representation in every last thing in the world real or otherwise.

You quite literally would only have to mirror the character. Quite a few games do just this.

Wolf_Eye · September 2022

Danikat wrote: »

I'd like to do this too. I've sort-of done it with one character because she's dual-wielding with a dagger in her right hand and a sword in her left so it looks like the left is her main hand. But it doesn't work for other weapons or other animations like opening doors or sorting through bags. Of course most people can do those things with either hand, but I know if both my hands are free I typically default to using my left, so seeing her always use her right makes it a little hard to imagine she's left-handed.

However I'm not sure how easy this would be. I don't know of any games which give players the option except some FPS games where all you see is the gun (and I've heard some of them don't do a good job of it). There are games with left-handed characters, including some with a mix of right and left handed characters, but they don't let players customise it, it's fixed for each character.

Which might be because the nearest equivalent I have heard of is Twilight Princess where in order to change the main character from left to right handed they mirror imaged the entire game. Apparently that was easier than changing just the player character. (They 'had to' do it because they were porting the game to the Wii which uses motion controls and apparently it would be too difficult for right-handed players to control a left-handed character...and if you're left-handed I guess they didn't care). They also looked at making it an option in Skyward Sword then took it out, apparently because it was too complicated to include.

I have no idea how the game engine and other systems used for ESO compares, but given that's the nearest example I know of to giving players a choice I'm inclined to believe it's not easy in any game.

I know this is a little off topic a bit, but I HATED what they did to Link in Twilight Princess! I actually REFUSED to buy it on the Wii because of it too! Link. Is. A. Left. Handed. Warrior.

And the fact that they inversed Hyrule itself! SERIOUSLY! LAKE. HYLIA. SHOULD. BE. ON. THE. WEST. SIDE. Gah! And what's WORSE is that they kept Link as a right handed hero for Breath of the Wild, even though there really aren't many motion controls (at least, not as much as the Wii games had). I say this as a right-hander; I feel like a lot of us could have adapted to a left handed play. Left-handed people have to adapt all the time, we could have adapted.

Anyways, rant over. Back on topic: I fully support bringing left handedness to our toons as an option.

Feljax · September 2022

I'll add my voice to this one too. I know it's a small thing but it can help the individual player feel more connected to their character. Also, I'd like the option to set your handedness based on one-handed weapons and two-handed weapons separately. As an example, I am right handed but whenever I hold a baseball bat or hockey stick, I hold them left handed.

More options are always better!

Danikat · September 2022

Wolf_Eye wrote: »

Danikat wrote: »

I'd like to do this too. I've sort-of done it with one character because she's dual-wielding with a dagger in her right hand and a sword in her left so it looks like the left is her main hand. But it doesn't work for other weapons or other animations like opening doors or sorting through bags. Of course most people can do those things with either hand, but I know if both my hands are free I typically default to using my left, so seeing her always use her right makes it a little hard to imagine she's left-handed.

However I'm not sure how easy this would be. I don't know of any games which give players the option except some FPS games where all you see is the gun (and I've heard some of them don't do a good job of it). There are games with left-handed characters, including some with a mix of right and left handed characters, but they don't let players customise it, it's fixed for each character.

Which might be because the nearest equivalent I have heard of is Twilight Princess where in order to change the main character from left to right handed they mirror imaged the entire game. Apparently that was easier than changing just the player character. (They 'had to' do it because they were porting the game to the Wii which uses motion controls and apparently it would be too difficult for right-handed players to control a left-handed character...and if you're left-handed I guess they didn't care). They also looked at making it an option in Skyward Sword then took it out, apparently because it was too complicated to include.

I have no idea how the game engine and other systems used for ESO compares, but given that's the nearest example I know of to giving players a choice I'm inclined to believe it's not easy in any game.

I know this is a little off topic a bit, but I HATED what they did to Link in Twilight Princess! I actually REFUSED to buy it on the Wii because of it too! Link. Is. A. Left. Handed. Warrior.

And the fact that they inversed Hyrule itself! SERIOUSLY! LAKE. HYLIA. SHOULD. BE. ON. THE. WEST. SIDE. Gah! And what's WORSE is that they kept Link as a right handed hero for Breath of the Wild, even though there really aren't many motion controls (at least, not as much as the Wii games had). I say this as a right-hander; I feel like a lot of us could have adapted to a left handed play. Left-handed people have to adapt all the time, we could have adapted.

Anyways, rant over. Back on topic: I fully support bringing left handedness to our toons as an option.

I think right-handed players could have adjusted to it as well. I'm left-handed and I've played both Twilight Princess on the Wii and Skyward Sword (where the motion controls are more precise) holding the controls left-handed and I don't think it was a big problem. It was a little weird at times, but mostly I wasn't thinking about which hand I was using any more than I would for anything else with a controller.

And yeah it annoyed me too. I much prefer the Gamecube version of Twilight Princess and I was disappointed they kept Link right-handed in Breath of the Wild when there's not really any need for it.

RagnarSw wrote: »

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

No, every animation would have to be done twice. That would add is so many things that go wrong and look wrong and inflate the file size of the game which is already well over 100 GB I believe.

I'm sorry, but every group doesn't need representation in every last thing in the world real or otherwise.

You quite literally would only have to mirror the character. Quite a few games do just this.

Do you know of any examples? The only ones I know of are FPS games where they just reverse the gun model, which I assume is simpler than changing animations for a 3rd person game.

tomofhyrule · September 2022

Wolf_Eye wrote: »

I know this is a little off topic a bit, but I HATED what they did to Link in Twilight Princess! I actually REFUSED to buy it on the Wii because of it too! Link. Is. A. Left. Handed. Warrior.

And the fact that they inversed Hyrule itself! SERIOUSLY! LAKE. HYLIA. SHOULD. BE. ON. THE. WEST. SIDE. Gah! And what's WORSE is that they kept Link as a right handed hero for Breath of the Wild, even though there really aren't many motion controls (at least, not as much as the Wii games had).

PREACH!

I only got the real version of Twilight Princess (still one of my favorite Zelda games) because of that blasphemy. I also never got Skyward because they swapped him for this exact reason.

Now I did play BotW, but I think they should have gone back to him being a lefty there. I don't know why they stuck to him as right-handed in that game when he's canonically been left-handed since the beginning. And then it just stuck... I am more than a little annoyed that it seems the 'older' Link is now permanently right-handed, even in the latest Smash Bros game...

RagnarSw wrote: »

DMuehlhausen wrote: »

No, every animation would have to be done twice. That would add is so many things that go wrong and look wrong and inflate the file size of the game which is already well over 100 GB I believe.

I'm sorry, but every group doesn't need representation in every last thing in the world real or otherwise.

You quite literally would only have to mirror the character. Quite a few games do just this.

I don't know much about animating, but I have done a little bit. Mirroring a character model is easy, there's usually just a button for it. Mirroring animations, however? Much more involved. You basically had to remake it from scratch.

I'd assume that they've since added that functionality since I did some modelling and animating myself, but I still don't know how easy that is to retrofit in - I assume that even if there is a 'mirror anim' functionality, it'd be in the animating software and not the game engine, so you would need double the animations in the files depending on what a given character uses. Even then, the reason that Twilight Princess was entirely mirrored was that the hitboxes were planned with a left-handed stance in mind so to keep the difficulty the same on the bosses, they just mirrored everything (making Zelda and Ganondorf lefties, which they are not).

You just know that there'll end up being some PvP complaints that "I can't tell what animation they're doing because it's on the wrong side!" or even some PvE "Everyone needs to convert their character to left-handed on this boss because we're all standing on a certain side, and tanks must stay right-handed so we can get out positions right!" threads going up if this was a possibility as well.

Ragnarok0130 · September 2022

Wolf_Eye wrote: »

Danikat wrote: »

I'd like to do this too. I've sort-of done it with one character because she's dual-wielding with a dagger in her right hand and a sword in her left so it looks like the left is her main hand. But it doesn't work for other weapons or other animations like opening doors or sorting through bags. Of course most people can do those things with either hand, but I know if both my hands are free I typically default to using my left, so seeing her always use her right makes it a little hard to imagine she's left-handed.

However I'm not sure how easy this would be. I don't know of any games which give players the option except some FPS games where all you see is the gun (and I've heard some of them don't do a good job of it). There are games with left-handed characters, including some with a mix of right and left handed characters, but they don't let players customise it, it's fixed for each character.

Which might be because the nearest equivalent I have heard of is Twilight Princess where in order to change the main character from left to right handed they mirror imaged the entire game. Apparently that was easier than changing just the player character. (They 'had to' do it because they were porting the game to the Wii which uses motion controls and apparently it would be too difficult for right-handed players to control a left-handed character...and if you're left-handed I guess they didn't care). They also looked at making it an option in Skyward Sword then took it out, apparently because it was too complicated to include.

I have no idea how the game engine and other systems used for ESO compares, but given that's the nearest example I know of to giving players a choice I'm inclined to believe it's not easy in any game.

I know this is a little off topic a bit, but I HATED what they did to Link in Twilight Princess! I actually REFUSED to buy it on the Wii because of it too! Link. Is. A. Left. Handed. Warrior.
.

Sorry, Link is not left handed, I've played since the very first Legend of Zelda where link held his sword IN THE MIDDLE and in Zelda II the Adventure of Link where he swapped his sword to whichever side was facing the screen...Link is clearly ambidextrous ;-)

Edited for spelling